The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Cape Buff Hunters using Pistols and 45-70's-INFO neededGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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You Big Bore Pistol and 45-70 Cape Buff Hunters. Pse provide info on Caliber, load, Bullet type and weight and distance for first shot. Other info will be greatly appreciated.-Rob Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers to do incredibly stupid things- AH (1941)- Harry Reid (aka Smeagle) 2012 Nothing Up my sleeves but never without a plan and never ever without a surprise! | ||
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S&W 500 440gr hard cast bullet from Grizzly Cartridge Co. at 50-60 yards in the swamps. 8 3/4" bbl with scope off of sticks. Mike ______________ DSC DRSS (again) SCI Life NRA Life Sables Life Mzuri IPHA "To be a Marine is enough." | |||
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Lionhunter- Tell me more. How many shots, Penetration, effect etc. Velocity etc. Any Pics?-Rob Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers to do incredibly stupid things- AH (1941)- Harry Reid (aka Smeagle) 2012 Nothing Up my sleeves but never without a plan and never ever without a surprise! | |||
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Rob, He was taken in the Mozambique swamps of Coutada 11, where I book clients. Very difficult to get in and out - about 3-4 hours each way via tracked Argo. Depart at first light and return to spike camp at dark. Only a couple hours of hunting time before you have to start out. Spot the herds by the white birds - Egrets?. Take best available from the herd. Overhead long grass - papyrus? Take pics and head only. I didn't need the head as I had plenty Buff, so just measured him and took pics. I do have pics but can't post. I am a big fan of Grizzly Ammunition for the S&W 500 and used his loads. Shot him once and got the standard PH "Don't shoot again, you got him". Unfortunately, it took another two hours track and another shot to "get him". I honestly think one should shoot until a Buff goes down, but there was another hunter (client) with me and I didn't want to spook the herds. Scope was a Bushnell 3200 in Warne QD rings and mount. Buff in the swamp is a challenging and different hunt and I'm glad I did it. Not for the physically challenged, but they can get a dry land Mozambique Buff - mine was 43". Mike ______________ DSC DRSS (again) SCI Life NRA Life Sables Life Mzuri IPHA "To be a Marine is enough." | |||
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I have had clients take buff with 45-70 from lever actioned rifles. Nothing startling about the performance and from frontal with hard cast bullets penetration was adequate, and from side on was more than adequate. Where the heart was hit, the buff went only 180m (bullet started out with a nice meplat), where the lung was hit, the buff went a couple of km and needed shooting again. Handgun - I have killed one buff with a .41 mag. S&W M58. One shot - hit the heart and he didn't go far. Had clients use .358 in an MOA and .444 Marlin in a contender. Both made good shots on broad side buff - so nothing interesting to report. | |||
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I think that many would say that it is interesting that you have nothing interesting to report about buff shot with a handgun, (or handgun wannabe)! Peter. Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong; | |||
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Rob Of my buffalo I took 1 back in 2002 with a Guide Gun in 45/70. At the time I was using a 420 gr Cast Performance at just a tad over 1900 fps. I knew it would be adequate, and would have adequate penetration, but I was so hot on the little gun I ignored things I should not have at the time. First I was not 100% satisfied with the particular bullet itself. I did some extensive tests before leaving, I knew if the bullet hit bone that the sides would shear off the wide meplat of this bullet. Leaving a slug that looked more like a wadcutter from a 45 colt. I was on a multiple hunt, mostly for elephant. I had the little Guide gun along, but had not really made a plan to do anything with it. My main rifle was one of my Win M70s in 458 Lott-which I had used the day before for elephant. I was on a late October hunt in the Matetsi with Scott Bailey. I am sure some of you know Scott. Scott and I got along well and I think he was more enthusiastic about the little rifle than I was. So we are riding along and there is a herd of buff, so we get out and start a stalk, with the Guide Gun. The herd settled down, and one good bull decided to lie down about 40 yds from us, but at an angle with the head away from us. Now we are on the side of a hill, about mid way to the top. Scott is to my left right beside me, but sitting about 2 maybe 3 ft higher than I am. He has a different view of the animal than I do, even though we are side by side. The bull is angled pretty sharp, I am looking at the right shoulder. I am looking thru a Leupold 1.5X5 cranked to 5x. Scot says shoot the bull right above the stick that is in front of the shoulder! I see a stick, but the shot is too high, and too much of an angle for a good shot! I tell Scott this, but he insists that I take the shot. Now I am the sort of chap that believes the PH is the boss! He is in charge, and I do as he says! This is why he is here. I am here to do the shooting--he says shoot, then I am supposed to do my job, he is the boss! This is the way it is supposed to work. One more time I tell Scott that I do not have a shot! For those of you that know Scott, you know he is a little short on patience too. He replied "trust me-take the shot". So Scott is the boss-I settle in to take the shot, just a tiny bit above the stick that is across the bulls right shoulder! Boom-bull jumps up, runs away with the rest of the herd to the top of the ridge like he had not been touched! Scott asks how was the shot--I hit right where you told me to! We get up to where the bull was bedded and sure enough THERE WAS TWO STICKS!!! The lower stick would have been a good shot from where we were--but from where I was sitting I could not see this STICK! There was a drop of blood, but I knew this was a bad shot--and now I had a damn rifle that I did not feel was fully capable of stopping a problem, which we now had! We followed to the top of the ridge and the herd had stopped on top, but it was thick, we could hear them about from 50-100 yds scattered, but could only get a glimpse of them from time to time. So we sit down to wait! For at least an hour it seemed we sit, I went over the shot a hundred times at least, over and over. I knew it was high-I knew the angle was too sharp! I should not have taken the shot--I knew not to take the damn shot, but did anyway! Scott and I had a completely different viewpoint even sitting that close! So here we were, I did not have enough gun, and this is a stupid stunt! For some reason Scott had plenty of patience now! We sit forever waiting for something to happen. Finally the herd started angling down the other side of the ridge, nearly single file! Scott watched, I watched, and after what seemed to be a 1000 buffalo (more like 50) Scott spotted our bull with a few drops of blood on the right side! By now he was about 75 yds out and with his ass to us! Scott whistled, the bull turned and gave me a perfect broadside lung shot port side. I hit him he goes 20 yds and piles up stone cold! What a relief! The first shot was exactly where I thought it went, high shoulder, glancing off the shoulder and going thru the meat of the neck where it was found on the far left side of the neck in a big bulge. The bullet had actually faired better than I suspected, with some damage on one side where it glanced off the shoulder. The second bullet passed thru both lungs and found on the far right side in near perfect condition. As good as I love the 45/70s, it was not impressive. And in my opinion while it did kill the buffalo, and it was adequate, it was not a good buffalo cartridge/bullet combination. Scott and I had long discussions about this. First of all I should have listened to myself and not taken the shot! But Scott was the boss--and my dumbass did the same thing some years later in 2007 with another PH! Nearly exactly the same, this time involving BRUSH and shooting thru it! I say no--PH Says yes--I say no again--PH Says trust me-I shoot-bullet deflects! Damn some of us never learn! Second thing--for buff use enough gun! All you 45/70 folks don't beat me too hard-I am a fan remember, but it really is not up to the job if you have to go "Full Circle" so to speak. Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Just couldn't pass this one up!! Wouldn't this be considered by some here as a "stunt", Buff with a handgun?? Just kidding of course, sounds like a cool adventure to me if your into handguns and all. Good luck. Larry Sellers SCI Life Member | |||
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Larry I can't pass it up either, in my opinion yes it is a "stunt hunt". I did it, so I can say so. I also consider it that myself. While any of the bigger handguns, 45/70 and like, have "adequate" power to do the job, adequate penetration to do the job, adequate bullets to do the job, none are the best all around to do the job. Can it be done? Of course it can. Is it the best tool to do the job? No, of course it is not! Why do we do it? I guess each has their reasons, prove a point either to themselves or others, using a firearm or cartridge we are particularly fond of, or a 1000 other reasons. Much the same as some like double rifles, others bolt guns! Also the word or phrase "stunt" hunt is used by many in a derogatory manner, including myself. Now I am going to piss all bow and stick guys off. I hate bow and stick--they are dangerous to me and I don't like them, end of story, so if you go bow and stick hunting for buffalo, that's a "stunt Hunt" to me in a derogatory manner! With a handgun or 45/70 like rifle, it's still a stunt hunt, but not as nearly a derogatory manner from me as the other! SO............. I did it--45/70 is not enough for this job, to be an all day every day do buff rifle or cartridge! Not in my opinion, and neither is any handgun! Buff are hard enough to impress with proper rifles and cartridges! Lionhunter above did a job with the 500 S&W! I have a little rifle called a 50 Super Short--basically a 500 S&W in a 16 inch bolt gun-using a 1.65 inch WSM case! Damn, if he can do it with the 500 S&W in a handgun--I can sure do it with my little 50 Super SHort, lets see........let me make a few calls??????? Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Great Info and thanks for the detailed description of your hunt. It basically sums up my analysis of the 45-70 and big bore pistol cartridges for Buff. They will work in the hands of a good shot under near perfect conditions. Howevere they leave no margin for Error in shot placement and anatomical estimation error.-Rob Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers to do incredibly stupid things- AH (1941)- Harry Reid (aka Smeagle) 2012 Nothing Up my sleeves but never without a plan and never ever without a surprise! | |||
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This is one example, Rob. How can you say no margin of error if your .475 bullet punches a .475-sized hole through its intended target and exits? Seems to me it would be more than minimal with no margin for error. Not trying to ne contrary, but lots of people have reported on the inadequacy of .375 H&Hs on buff yet it is considered by many as more than adequate. JMHO. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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Most important task in killing a large unaware animal is driving a round through the vitals. the faster you push it the greater the temporary wound channel will be the sicker the animal will be and the quicker it will go down. If you throw a 1" spear through both lungs of a buff it will die. The important question is will it die quick enough and lose it ability to fight. Once the animal is aware or wounded you need a CNS hit or as close as you can get with every bit of energy you can bring to the fight. Thats were 45-70 and large pistols and arrows leave a lot to be desired. JD DRSS 9.3X74 tika 512 9.3X74 SXS Merkel 140 in 470 Nitro | |||
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No Cape Buffalo, but I've taken several Bison and an Asian buffalo with a handgun. This Bisson was taken with a 500 Linebaugh shooting a 525 grain WLFN hardcast at 1140 FPS the shot was about 40 yards 1 shot clipped the heart and exited. Bllood streamed out of both the entrrance and exit holes  This Bison was also taken with 1 shot from a 475 Linebaugh at 100 yards with a 420 grain LFN at 1380 FPS  This Asian Buffalo was also taken with Wide Flat Hard Cast bullet. The first shot broke the suport bone in the on side shouldr and penetrated through the scaulpular in the off shoulder and exited this was from a 500 JRH 435 grain at 1380 FPS Shot number 2 was a 475 Linebaugh 420 grain bullet through the on side shoulder that broke the off side support bone in that shopulder and also exited. Buff down and game over  _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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The temporary wound channel is irrealivant according to Dr. Martin Fackler, President Of The International Wound Ballistics Assn. Of course the bullet can be shot fast enough to stretch the tissue past it's ellasticity and tear the tissue adding to the perminate wound channel _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Whitworth You are correct that it is one example, either a poor one, or maybe a good one. There were a lot of issues with my example. First, should not have taken the shot-with any rifle or cartridge period! Too much of an angle, too high, everything. Second, a 420 in 45/70 was not quite enough bullet. At that time there either was nothing else available, heavier, or I could not find it. Later I went to a 460 Cast Performance, penetration was better, and the meplat design was not as sharp as the 420 and did not shear off. Had I been using a little more bullet, that poor first shot might have broke bone instead of glancing, and it would have been a different story-Maybe? There is no doubt that with the big flat meplat bullets available they penetrate, and give more than adequate penetration. Your 475 and the 500s will most certainly drill big holes, and anything hit in the vitals is not going far. But regardless thereof, they do not have the hitting power that a similar size and design bullet has at 2000-2300 fps on cape buffalo. It is damn hard to impress cape buffalo. As for the 375 anything--I would not give you 50 cents for every 375 that has ever been made! In fact about all I can figure a Win M70 in 375 is good for is to snatch the barrel off and chunk it, and put a 458 caliber barrel or larger on it! Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Actually, I have seen them (Bison) really react to these big pistol bullets. They seem to be impressed with diameter and weight. Michael, PM heading your way...... "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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Whitworth I will not disagree with you. As I see it TWO things begin to make a difference--Increase in bullet diameter and velocity to a point. For cape buffalo I see little reason to run big bullets past 2250 fps or there about! Diameter starts to make a big difference if the bullets are slower. When velocity drops below the 2000 fps mark, then 458 caliber is small bore stuff! Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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99% agree. except I like a bit more speed on the top end. Nothing proves Martin Fackler wrong than shooting cats. Velocity works! A 9,3x62 is a hell of alot better cat rifle than a ,458 win or ,470NE (with 500grn bullets). Some animals are less imprevious to "shock" than others. A buf is pretty much so until you reach .505 Gibbs or .500 J! Unlike Bison or wild cattle, Heart shot cape buffalo bleed out relatively slowly. Peter - If you shoot a buffalo in the right place with any adequate bullet, it is game over. It runs a short distance and it dies! What is interesting to report? If there is a well placed shot and it doesn't die- now that is of interest... My Father shot all of his buff with an 8mm Mauser. He usually took a high shoulder shot and usually the buff died where it stood - life only got interesting on those rare occasions when it wasnt "ususally"... | |||
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Michael458, et al. I like a bit more velocity, closer to 2400fps with my 450 Dakota. My PH let me shoot my Buffalo at an est 165 yards with it. Of course, he had seen me shoot at the indicated 200 yards I had it zeroed for. I would have preferred to get close, but we had followed this herd of 45-50 animals for several days. Must have been lions, we saw them a couple times. At any rate, it put him down, and he never moved ten feet after impact. This was a lower shot, about 1/3rd of the way up just behind the shoulder. Rich Buff Killer | |||
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Ganyana I wish I had more experience than what I have on the big cats-lion. I have 3 of them and all with a 400 Swift at 2325 fps in a 458 Win Mag. All three were hammered pretty good with that, penetration was good and I too would rather hit them either with this velocity or more-or with a bigger-softer bullet such as the 500 Woodleigh. This in a WIn Mag of course. For thin skinned we could get into bullet selection and velocity being most important. However, this is buff. More velocity won't hurt as long as the bullets are good--Swift-Barnes X and such. With the various rifles I have used I find that 2100-2270 has worked pretty good for me from .458 caliber to .500 caliber. Also depending on the bullet selection and type of bullet (very important factor). Idaho As stated above-2400 fps is ok too-good bullet for that sort of work. However at 165 yds that bullet has slowed down a good bit by then. While I have never done any long range buff hunting, I understand in that situation. Good Shot! Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Witworth- I'm sorry but it seems to be the opinioin of a great number of experienced hunters, that the 45-70 is a marginal caliber for Cape Buffalo as are the 500S&W class pistols( approximately the same KE). Assuming no bones are hit and the shot hits the heart/lung area and the bullet nose is not deformed, penetration is adequate. Not impressive, just adequate! I'm not denighing it will work. Close range is required also. Propably not more than 25 yrds optimally and certainly NMT 75 yrds. The hunter needs to have the BRAINS and Nerve to not take anything other than THE PERFECT SHOT. Otherwise its a huge CF. Its been my experience that the PERFECT SHOT doesnt happen all that often and most hunters dont have the trigger discipline necessary to wait! I'm with the vast majority of Cape Buff Hunters from the poll who realize a .375H&H or .416 class gun is a far far better tool for Cape Buff than a .45-70. -Rob Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers to do incredibly stupid things- AH (1941)- Harry Reid (aka Smeagle) 2012 Nothing Up my sleeves but never without a plan and never ever without a surprise! | |||
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Rob - have said this before , but will say it again anyway... If a client brings out a "marginal" weapon - be it a bow, underpowered rifle or handgun - he must accept that his chances of going home empty handed are probably twice that of a man armed with a suitably chambered rifle (make that 3x if he has a bow). Also he must accept that his chance of getting a great trophy is down. In most decent areas of Zim I can just about guarantee a buffalo bull...but the trophy bull has a nasty habit of ALWAYS being the one on the other side of the group, or only presenting awkward angle shots or...being in some way off limits unless you have a decent rifle. | |||
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKTeEmNUkjw _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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man, that handgun's more effective than a 20mm gatling gun! I'm selling all my big bores and buying one- they are all outclassed and outmoded!  | |||
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So the shock of a fast bullet messes with the cats system a lot more than a larger slower bullet... I can see this. Is it partly that you need a softer bullet for the larger caliber for cats? if you use a tough heavy 470 bullet it might not do the damage you want on a cat like a fast moving pistol bullet that will hold together like the Speer gold dots. So is a fast 300 like a WBY better than a moderate 375 with a impact speed of under 2400 for cats? What velocity for caliber do you recomend for cats? OK so it is in your opinion that the 1/5" and above class trucking at 2300 fps is ideal for buff? better go with a 577 or 600 to be sure  Seems a 470 Mbogo/470AR/Capstick is a great compromise for both cats and buff. Speer 400 grain gold dots do a lot of damage @ 2400 and I would think a cat would be shocked by the energy dump. A fast moving 470 would be decent on recoil and damage for the larger critters. Michael458... Maybe when you get tiered of the 500 MDM you will move on to the 500 Rigby  Shoot them 550 solids out at 2400! 577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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very good job of editing, you only hear the rifle in two or three sequences. Always wondered what Spanky looked like when he grew up. Rich Buff Killer | |||
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 He actually had a rile in one of the "frames"... I wonder what the "Ultimate Hunting Machine" would need a rifle for? ______________________ Sometimes there is no spring... Just the wind that smells fresh before the storm... | |||
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Hey Boomy Welcome to our little buff talk here. As for myself, limited experience with the cats (try not to get too far off base) First I think "transfer of energy-trauma-damage to tissue" for cats is important. I aint' talking muzzle energy-useless number that is. I like big bullets for cats--If I were taking a 416 anything I would want the 340 Woodleigh at 2350-2500 fps-expands to 1/2 the length of bullet-expands large, has good velocity to "transfer energy, cause trauma, lot's of damage to tissue" In fact I used one of these on leopard-it hammered him. 458 anything 350 Barnes X-400 Swift-or similar bullet that will expand, but penetrate-at or from 2300 to 2500 fps does all the same. With 470 I would be concerned about the pistol bullets coming apart--However thanks to Doug Turnbull one might use one of his lighter barnes X bullets for this. For my 50s and .500s I would opt for the 470 HP that I was talking about--which broke over 2300 today in the 500 MDM. Also broke 2300 today with the 510 gr Solid. This is what I would say would do fine for kitty. I used a 458 400 Swift at 2325 fps for the ones I took. Of course there are many other things that will work just as well as long as penetration is not sacrificed to too much velocity or bullet breakup. There are lot's of ideal things for buff--for me I like 416-.500 caliber, and of course have the big one for .500 right now. 1st round good tough soft point up front-Barnes-Swift-Woodleigh -NorthFork followed by good Flat Nose Solids-I like Barnes. Anything from 2100-up as long as the bullet works at given velocity. I am taking the 500 to Australia and hammer some of those buff there with it. Nope-500 MDM does it for me--biggest reason is that it keeps me in a Winchester M70. Which while I have not reached upper limits of pressure on some bullets as of today, I reached my own upper limits of what I want. Remember this gun has 21 inch barrel and weighs 8.5 lbs. I find a 550 at 2225 a damn plenty, and the 510s at 2325 plenty. That should do well for my solids. I have that 510 Wells and can do 550s at 2400--but it is stuck in that 11 lb Ruger and the barrel is about as long as from my place to yours so it seems! Too big. I would have to start lifting weights to carry that thing all day, and probably could not do it then. Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Rich, that's absurd. If y'all haven't hunted with a handgun, this doesn't mean that they aren't effective on big game. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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And of course all of the rifle hunters make the PH's leave thier rifles in camp, right?  _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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I am bothered by the title of this thread. It specifies "Pistol" and all these handgun stunt shooters think their revolvers are pistols! I should hope the 454 Casull revolver would suffice for any handgun stunt I might attempt, even though it is not a "pistol." | |||
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...par for course here ... | |||
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You are correct revolvers aren't pistols _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Glad we cleared that up. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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Well,I guess I am going to get Wayne to make me a .600OK Encore! That should do it ....Hmmm,12" Fluted Bull,Aimpoint with 4 Rings and maybe some Surgical tubing attached to a barrel swivel to my boot! ....Robo,what will be velocity in that 12" barrel(no brake-Of course!)?  "That's not a knife..THIS is a KNIFE" ! | |||
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Yep, that's a pistol.  | |||
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I am... I'm going to show my PH this video and hopefully he'll realize what a superior fight stopper a handgun is!!! I'm sure all the PHs on this forum will now be throwing their rifles in the trash and begin to wondering why they even bothered with long guns in the first place!!! ______________________ Sometimes there is no spring... Just the wind that smells fresh before the storm... | |||
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SAFARIKID A 600-577/450 would be much better! A rimmed case 2.3" long here on the right is a 600 but a shorter version. Spit out 900 grain 600 bullets @ 1200 fps for a "reasonable" load to as fast as you can take it! 577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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Sounds real "reasonable" to me Boomy!  "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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