The local sports store has a box of 500gr RN Hornays that have been kicking around for a while so I can get a deal on them. The only thing in 458 I have is my 45-70 single shot. My question is, will 30-35,000 psi loads give me enough velocity for stabilization and just a bit of expantion. I was thinking of taking the rifle with me on a hog hunt in Feb and If I used it the ranges would be short.

The bullet may not expand at low velocity; it's designed for large game at 2000-2200fps.

What's the twist rate of your barrel? How far out can you seat those bullets before engaging the rifling? How long is the barrel?
What powder(s) do you plan to use?

George

With a .458 diameter bullet and good shot placement you shouldn't need much, if any, expansion.

JPK

I asked Hornady that exact question a year ago, there answer was that more than likely it wouldn't expand at normal 45-70 impact velocities, that it was designed for the .458 win mag. A better choice would be a gas checked lead bullet with a wide meplat like the Beartooth or Cast Performance bullets if ya want big.

As for powder and loads, I'm not sure what I'll use. I load 500gr. lead bullets that seem to shoot good from the 22" barrel but I know that jacketed bullets won't reach the same velocity and still stay within preassure limits. I may buy them anyway just to try. I know that full expantion would not happen but if it would open up enough to make a flat face it would be about perfect for a pig at 50 yards. My original plan was to cast some 500gr softnose solids and I may still go with that plan.

quote:

NBHunter: I may buy them anyway just to try.

Then you'll want a Winnie or Lott !

is this for hunting or shooting?

if hunting...what?

i am sure a deer would not say "hey...i need an expanding bullet if i am going to die"

in big bores here many conclude you are hunting big stuff so the purpose needs to be stated

quote:

Originally posted by NBHunter:
The local sports store has a box of 500gr RN Hornays that have been kicking around for a while so I can get a deal on them. The only thing in 458 I have is my 45-70 single shot. My question is, will 30-35,000 psi loads give me enough velocity for stabilization and just a bit of expantion. I was thinking of taking the rifle with me on a hog hunt in Feb and If I used it the ranges would be short.

What type of single shot rifle are you using ..

Please, gentlemen and others, not another friggin' 45/70 thread! jorge

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:
Please, gentlemen and others, not another friggin' 45/70 thread! jorge

ROTFLMAO ..

Ok.. i will drop it becouse you asked

That just means your going to have to start a thread about fly fishing then

Martin

P.S
Forgot to add jorge you have to also tell me what you think of the loaded ammo sold buy
CONLEY PRECISION CARTRIDGE CO
CONLEY PRECISION CARTRIDGE CO
Scroll down to the "Premium Rifle Ammunition"

Martin

NBHunter
I am a 45/70 fan/user. You will have better results on hogs with the 350 grain Hornady RN.
That is my favorite all round bullet for the 45/70.

NE 450 No.2,

I'm curious and you've got experience so please tell me if my original post has merit or is off the mark. Seems to me that a 45cal hole would do the trick, but we don't have pigs/hogs/boar around here.

For our whitetails a 45 cal hole works well. My original 45cal muzzleloader bullet choice produced a 45 cal hole and it worked fine. Since switched to a better expanding bullet and the damage is more but the end result seems the same.

Thanks,

JPK

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:
Please, gentlemen and others, not another friggin' 45/70 thread! jorge

Why would you say that, jorge...?

JPK
No doubt a .458 hole in the right place will kill a deer or a pig. I have killed deer with cast bullets in a 4" 44 mag revolver. However I have found that an expanding bullet does more damage and the game usually dies quicker, thus less tracking is required.

quote:

Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
JPK
No doubt a .458 hole in the right place will kill a deer or a pig. I have killed deer with cast bullets in a 4" 44 mag revolver. However I have found that an expanding bullet does more damage and the game usually dies quicker, thus less tracking is required.

A man after my own heart ..

Why do some folks think that poking a hole all the way through game is the "only" way

The picture below is one of my .510 diameter bullets recovered from a bear .it when through both sholders and neck bone before stopping on the other side in the skin


Bullet weight 470 Grain's after recovery bullet weight 458 Grain's .
.510 diameter PA recovered bullet Bear hunt/manatoba

I love a good flat nose

Martin

Is this the difference in the two schools of thought about putting the animal down?
Expanding bullet = more internal shock vs. non-expanding bullet = perforation/two blood holes?

BusMaster007

If you want to wander around the bush looking for wounded game poke a hole all the way through
your game fallow the blood trail .

I hope your not hunting sometime that can or will eat you .. Its a sure fire way to wind up as trail Dung.. if you get my drift.

If .. your like some folks here that take hind shots up the back to front .. dont ask me to share that meat

Martin

Martin.

I used only solids on the three buff I shot in Zim. I also hunted leopard and lion, but did not see the right lion and no leopards. My PH wanted all solids on buff, and off course elephants but wants softs when we were either sitting for lion or leopards or tracking lions. And softs in my double, if I shot either, for the follow up. The PH though only ever carried solids.

FYI

JPK

First shot ...what every you think might work.
Every other round what will work.. soild's.
Is that about what he told you.

Martin

I shot three deer last year with my .458WM.

I used a reduced load that consisted of a 525gr hard cast (RNFP = small meplat) at about 1500fps.

Penetration was excessive. One bullet when end-to-end and then burried itself 3+ feet in the dirt on the far side. There was zero bullet upset, so this was like using a jacketed solid.

Two of the three deer made an impressive run before dieing. They were just as dead, but they were hard to find. Honestly, a 30-30 would have put them down quicker.

On the plus side, I lost almost no meat.

This year I'm using the same gun but with two different loads (that shoot to the same POI).

The first is the same as the original load but with a cast soft nose (putty soft lead in the front 1/2 of the bullet.

The second is a 375gr WFN at about 1650.

I'm hoping for a little more "slap down" with the same minimal meat damage.

(can you tell I hunt for meat more than antlers?)

RangerBob
No fair bob .. using a 458 on whitetail deer that weigh out at about 150 Lb.. You could have be more humain if you would have just rolled a bolder on the deer

Bob .. you can still us a 30/30 if you change over to a "very" flat pointed bullet..

Something with a 25 cal melpat
Do you know what the Ogive<- Sounds like O Jive on your .458 525gr hard cast you say its a round nosr or is it a semi round nose flat tipped ? is it a moulded bullet ? is there a link to a picture of it ?

No Martin,

Buff, solids only for both client and PH, too mant failures with softs, especially on any quartering angle or frontal shot.

Lions, softs only, for the client. Solids for the PH in case the shot needs to be a head shot.

Leopard, softs for the client, doesn't matter to the PH.

Of course solids only for the elephant.

JPK

quote:

RangerBob
No fair bob .. using a 458 on whitetail deer that weigh out at about 150 Lb.. You could have be more humain if you would have just rolled a bolder on the deer

Bob .. you can still us a 30/30 if you change over to a "very" flat pointed bullet..

Something with a 25 cal melpat
Do you know what the Ogive<- Sounds like O Jive on your .458 525gr hard cast you say its a round nosr or is it a semi round nose flat tipped ? is it a moulded bullet ? is there a link to a picture of it ?

Owner/PA Bullet's

It has a small flat tip. It's not a pure round nose. But I've noticed that large flat meplats do more damage (more splash) in various mediums.

The larger flat meplats also penetrate straighter . . . not that I had a problem on deer.

quote:

Originally posted by RangerBob:

quote:

RangerBob
No fair bob .. using a 458 on whitetail deer that weigh out at about 150 Lb.. You could have be more humain if you would have just rolled a bolder on the deer

Bob .. you can still us a 30/30 if you change over to a "very" flat pointed bullet..

Something with a 25 cal melpat
Do you know what the Ogive<- Sounds like O Jive on your .458 525gr hard cast you say its a round nosr or is it a semi round nose flat tipped ? is it a moulded bullet ? is there a link to a picture of it ?

Owner/PA Bullet's

It has a small flat tip. It's not a pure round nose. But I've noticed that large flat meplats do more damage (more splash) in various mediums.

The larger flat meplats also penetrate straighter . . . not that I had a problem on deer.

And flap points do dig in on side shots better

1973 was the first time anyone used one of my bullets in Africa ..That may not be a good thing to post up here becouse thay didnt do so well ..One clean kill and one "Big screw up"
but thats a long time ago and Bob Rays been gone for sometime now ..

Swing by the web site sometime guys ..

Martin

Martin,

How bout posting a link?

JPK

Bulletsmiths.Info Forums Promoting the Art of Bullet Making


Martin

oh no!!! the cats out of the bag...now everyone will be empowered to make their own bullets!!!

shhhh! keep this a secret we cant have all these people knowing the joy and pride of shooting their own bullets

Boom Stick

Ya i had a brain fart sniff sniff ewwwww