I have a problem - after seeing me take two buffalo on the trip we just returned from, my wife wants a buffalo now. I offered prior to this trip, but she is recoil sensitive. She shoots a suppressed .308 w/165 gr Aframes that sits at about 18 lbs of recoil. Great for PG, took everything up to zebra with it on our trip (17 animals for her in total).

I figure I need a 15-18 lb rifle (someone else would carry). Here's what I've been thinking:

1) Aftermarket Rem 700 action with a 20-22" solid profile varmint barrel (want to target 6 lbs for the barrel). Rem 700 action is most flexible on stocks. Any recommendations? There are standard push feeds like Defiance, but Lawton 704 and American Rifle Company actions.
2) My 46M Suppressor
3) Magpul Hunter stock. They are 3.2 lbs and adjustable
4) Heavy 1-6x Scope (probably a Trijicon)

I was also looking at some 3.5 lb laminate, aluminum bedded stocks. I could add mercury recoil tubes to these, but might be able to retrofit the Magpul (not sure how the buttstock is configured, I need to email them).

Other ideas?

Thanks!

just found this Choate stock! 5 lbs 11 ounces! Perfect!

https://www.riflestock.com/sto...emington-700-la-bdl/

Good for your wife! It's nice to see a mutual interest in African hunting and you encouraging it.

I hate it when people do this on the forums, and I'm about to do it myself - what about a more sporter-weight rifle and simply downloading the ammo a bit? Try and mimic a 9.3 with the 375 loadings? 10lb rifle plus that combo would be pretty easy on the shoulder and still nimble enough to haul around.

9.3x62

As much as I hate them, a good, efficient muzzle brake might be the ticket for her, along with a bit of a downloaded 270 gr TSX offering as well.

9.3x62 in a 8 lb rifle with a brake..or just load your 375 down to a 270 or 300 gr bullet at 2000 fps and a brake, absolutly no need for 18 lb rifle.....

My wife is shooting a 8.6 lb 308 Win with a suppressor. My goal is the same level of recoil, maybe a bit more.

Her current rifle is about 17 lbs of recoil calculated, and of course the suppressor lowers this.

I'm thinking the most I will go down is a 300 gr 375 H&H at 2,400 to 2,450 fps.

Another vote for the 9.3x62. In a ten pound (scoped) rifle with a good muzzle brake, it will be a pussy cat, and won't be a heavy and unwieldy behemoth to carry around and shoot.

376 Steyr if you have to have a 375.

Youre welcome to try my Chapuis double in 9,3x74,,,

quote:

Originally posted by jimatcat:
Youre welcome to try my Chapuis double in 9,3x74,,,

A Heym double in 375 flanged was my first thought.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
9.3x62 in a 8 lb rifle with a brake..or just load your 375 down to a 270 or 300 gr bullet at 2000 fps and a brake, absolutly no need for 18 lb rifle.....

This ^^^

Just shows the foolishness' of minimum caliber laws.

Thanks for all the ideas. I'm going to stick with with the 375, some mercury recoil reducers, try suppressor vs brake, and an adjustable recoil pad.

I run the 375 H&H page on facebook. I got a lot of comments and ideas from there (I think only one 9.3x62 comment - it is a 375 page )

I suppose the other question here is - has your wife actually shot anything heavy? By that, I'm wondering if she's actually able to shoot a normal 375 without all the recoil reducing accouterments. Sometimes, the smaller-statured people handle recoil really well because they move with it instead of trying to fight it.

quote:

Originally posted by Austin Hunter:
I have a problem - after seeing me take two buffalo on the trip we just returned from, my wife wants a buffalo now. I offered prior to this trip, but she is recoil sensitive. She shoots a suppressed .308 w/165 gr Aframes that sits at about 18 lbs of recoil. Great for PG, took everything up to zebra with it on our trip (17 animals for her in total).

I figure I need a 15-18 lb rifle (someone else would carry). Here's what I've been thinking:

1) Aftermarket Rem 700 action with a 20-22" solid profile varmint barrel (want to target 6 lbs for the barrel). Rem 700 action is most flexible on stocks. Any recommendations? There are standard push feeds like Defiance, but Lawton 704 and American Rifle Company actions.
2) My 46M Suppressor
3) Magpul Hunter stock. They are 3.2 lbs and adjustable
4) Heavy 1-6x Scope (probably a Trijicon)

I was also looking at some 3.5 lb laminate, aluminum bedded stocks. I could add mercury recoil tubes to these, but might be able to retrofit the Magpul (not sure how the buttstock is configured, I need to email them).

Other ideas?

Thanks!

As a gun dealer, I have found people will shoot much better (even higher recoil levels) with a suppressor. Yes it is large, unwieldy and ugly but it does help a lot. Along with recoil, muzzle blast can also cause a flinch.

Unfortunately, she can't tolerate much recoil due to an old hand injury and a shoulder injury. Sorry I didn't make that clear at the start. So it really is a 375 w/the recoil of a suppressed 308 Win I am targeting. She is really good with the 308 Win - no fleas here.

Our youngest daughter is small stature and hands and handles her 35 Whelen like a boss. Doesn't even react when she shoots.

Ive seen buffalo and elephant culled with the 308, and Im sure the 308 will kill a buffalo with the right 200 or 180 gr bullet..I used a military 7x57 and old milsurp bullets on a buff cull and got by. and todays Africa has a PH to back her up, and you also...I would be glad to use a 06 or 308 with or without backup, its still where you put the bullet.

Look over on 24hr Campfire in the Africa section, there is a post titled Buffalo bullets and he has been using the 250 gr. TTSX with total satisfaction on at least 1/2 dozen buff. An effective lighter weight bullet is a big step in the right direction to help achieve your goal.
Midway shows them in stock.

A bullet with about a .3 SD and velocity of 2000-2200 will penetrate.

They used to use solids extensively on buffalo.

If she has hand/shoulder problems, a vastly overweight rifle is going to create its own set of issues.

My experience with a 7x57 this last hunt I did I’d try a 300 grain and a 350 grain bullet in a standard rifle loaded to right around 2000, and go from there. The 7 was using 175’s at around 2300. It went through an eland. Just a bit longer to fall over…

Yes, it limits long range effectiveness- but this is buffalo you are talking about.

It will penetrate, but expansion may be iffy. Put it in the right spot, and she will get her buff, it just might run a bit.

Notice that slower velocity rounds do recoil more as a push than a slap… same effect that a heavier gun gives as well.

AH: Have you considered a .375 Whelen? With handloads this can be dialed up or down to match recoil with needed performance -- with a suppressor of course. I am another believer that the auditory inputs from a rifle shot are a significant factor in perceived recoil.

I built a 577 NE out of a cheap single shot 10 ga. shotgun, for cape buffalo hunting. Of course at 8-9 lbs it was unshootable for me.

I experimented with it and here is where I am at with it now. This stuff is pretty obvious and some of it is not for everybody, but I will just mention it, some of it may be helpful.

1. Installed a 26" heavy barrel.

2. Made a buttstock that is very straight with a high comb that is parallel to the bore.

3. Installed a high sight base to match the high comb.

4. Installed a very wide "grind to fit" Limbsaver Nitro Recoil Pad. (The wider the better)

5. Put 6 oz of lead shot epoxy mix in a routered out cavity in the forend. ( Adding weight in from of the action holds the barrel down during recoil, makes the rifle easier to hold steady and having the weight forward is a thing that the International Sporting Clays champions like for a smooth swing.)

6. Cut and applied some of that sticky backed grip tape, used by the hand-gunners for their race guns, on the forend and pistol grip areas my buffalo gun.

The rifle now weighs 12 lbs soaking wet and is nice to shoot. I am an old guy so now a use a gun bearer for any long walks. Brian

A few years ago we visited Namibia and we stayed on a friend of a friend’s ranch. He had a Ruger with laminated stock in 375 Ruger fitted with a suppressor. It was easy to shoot with minimal recoil. My 15 year old daughter had several shots with it - she reckoned her 20 bore kicked more.

Heym SR20,

I just remembered, I have heard the same thing a few years ago, from a reliable source, about that rifle/cartridge with a suppressor. As I remember they said it was about like shooting a 30-06. Brian

Under the circumstances with your wife's injuries and thus intolerance to too much recoil, why not just stay with her .308 which by all accounts she is a very good shot with.
With all due respect I would think she would like to go someway in 'earning' her buffalo i.e. doing the stalk carrying her own rifle.
An overly heavy rifle as you first proposed carried by someone else seems to me a bit of a cope out. Might as well just rest the rifle over the truck hood and shoot or rest the juggernaut on a fence post and take a buffalo behind wire.
I'm being a bit tongue in cheek here and mean no disrespect to your wife but if your PH would allow a buff to be taken with a .308, and plenty have been, just let her use her own rifle and take a buff like all the plains game she has.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
AH: Have you considered a .375 Whelen? With handloads this can be dialed up or down to match recoil with needed performance -- with a suppressor of course. I am another believer that the auditory inputs from a rifle shot are a significant factor in perceived recoil.

I could download the 375 H&H. Or use my daughter's 35 whelen. It's a very heavy rifle. While she shoots a 225 gr TSX load, I did make up a 275 gr Woodleigh load at 2,500 fps! That alone would be sufficient, but could easily get 2,300-2,400 fps with Woodleighs 310 gr bullet. and they make a FMJ as well.

After using my 35 Whelen with 250 gr. North Fork SP on a variety of plains game up to eland and a frontal one shot drop on wildebeest, I would be very comfortable shooting a buff with it.

A manageable weight suppressed .375 that fits her, with a Barnes tsx 250 at 2400 fps. She will be fine. I would use the Whelen case to reduce powder thus recoil. Same stock as her 308, barrel length etc.
No need for a 15 lb rifle.

375 Raptor would be an interesting one to look into for an 08 based round. I run a 22" bolt action suppressed here in TX for pig control. Can push 250-270 gr bullets at 2300-2500fps and thumps game.

just load a big bore down to 2000 fps WITH a brake..its just not complicated unless you make it so. My pick would be the 9,3x62 and the 300 gr. Swift bullet..recoil is about like my fwt 270 or less.. but having used the 7x57 on one buffalo because of circumstances Im sure a 308 with a 180 gr Barnes TTX would expand and do the trick is stuck in the right spot..Lots of local Africans use the 06 on buff..

Keep in mind a buffalo is some old cows calf raised on milk!! and no kin to a Sherman tank!

Well, taking into account charge weight in recoil makes a big difference. I've settled on one of the two below, almost the exact same recoil. The 35 Whelen has 10% more energy at 100 yards than the 9.3x62.

35 Whelen: 275 gr Woodleigh PP @ 2,500
9.3x62: 300 gr Aframe @ 2,350

Thoughts? Both will be Varget in the 56-57 gr range.

My hunting partner passed away a couple of months ago and I am liquidating his inventory, full disclosure.
He has a brand new at the time Winchester m70 SS Classic bought around 2005. Unfired, he sent it to Christiansen Arms in Utah and had the action trued and a carbon fiber wrapped barrel in .375H&H installed with a removable brake. Jewel trigger, Mcmillan stock fully bedded and teflon coated the barreled action. The rifle is smooth and balanced. He shot it less than two boxes and realized the recoil was too much for him. So he loaded some reduced loads 220grain Hornady’s at 2,300fps with SR4759 and 42.0 gr, fed 215M, 3.355 OAL. It became tolerable and enjoyable. He proceeded to hammer a few hogs. Instant lights out. He has 42 loaded rounds, if interested. I’ll sell them. Give it a go.

quote:

Originally posted by mlfguns:
My hunting partner passed away a couple of months ago and I am liquidating his inventory, full disclosure.
He has a brand new at the time Winchester m70 SS Classic bought around 2005. Unfired, he sent it to Christiansen Arms in Utah and had the action trued and a carbon fiber wrapped barrel in .375H&H installed with a removable brake. Jewel trigger, Mcmillan stock fully bedded and teflon coated the barreled action. The rifle is smooth and balanced. He shot it less than two boxes and realized the recoil was too much for him. So he loaded some reduced loads 220grain Hornady’s at 2,300fps with SR4759 and 42.0 gr, fed 215M, 3.355 OAL. It became tolerable and enjoyable. He proceeded to hammer a few hogs. Instant lights out. He has 42 loaded rounds, if interested. I’ll sell them. Give it a go.

THanks for the offer! I have the build planned out to get her a 13-14 lb rifle.

To each his own but what am I missing here? Why is a 13-14 lb 375 needed when a 9.3x62 does the same thing at 8.5 lbs? Toss a break on it and Bob's your Uncle.

quote:

Unfortunately, she can't tolerate much recoil due to an old hand injury and a shoulder injury. Sorry I didn't make that clear at the start. So it really is a 375 w/the recoil of a suppressed 308 Win I am targeting. She is really good with the 308 Win - no fleas here.

From above: Unfortunately, she can't tolerate much recoil due to an old hand injury and a shoulder injury. Sorry I didn't make that clear at the start. So it really is a 375 w/the recoil of a suppressed 308 Win I am targeting. She is really good with the 308 Win - no fleas here.

quote:

Originally posted by Austin Hunter:
I have a problem - after seeing me take two buffalo on the trip we just returned from, my wife wants a buffalo now. I offered prior to this trip, but she is recoil sensitive. She shoots a suppressed .308 w/165 gr Aframes that sits at about 18 lbs of recoil. Great for PG, took everything up to zebra with it on our trip (17 animals for her in total).

I figure I need a 15-18 lb rifle (someone else would carry). Here's what I've been thinking:

1) Aftermarket Rem 700 action with a 20-22" solid profile varmint barrel (want to target 6 lbs for the barrel). Rem 700 action is most flexible on stocks. Any recommendations? There are standard push feeds like Defiance, but Lawton 704 and American Rifle Company actions.
2) My 46M Suppressor
3) Magpul Hunter stock. They are 3.2 lbs and adjustable
4) Heavy 1-6x Scope (probably a Trijicon)

I was also looking at some 3.5 lb laminate, aluminum bedded stocks. I could add mercury recoil tubes to these, but might be able to retrofit the Magpul (not sure how the buttstock is configured, I need to email them).

Other ideas?

Thanks!

A rifle this heavy is really not very practical.

And your wife wants a buffalo should be no problems with a reduced load.

Main point is get her to shoot a buffalo broadside, and use a good bullet.

2000 fps is with a 270 grain Barnes X would be perfect.

UNIQUE is a very good powder for this.

You might need to use a small amount of Kapoc over the powder.

I did this all the time in reduced charges in large cases, including the 577 T.Rex.

This load shouldn’t be too much for her to try.

15-18# rifle? i had a 20# benchrifle, and it was about as handy as 3 cinder blocks

I would suggest first, making it a 376 steyr - less powder, less recoil

some form of muzzle brake/silencer

maybe merc tubes --

aim for 11#, load 235 tsx bullets, and be ready for a followup

Or what I did, 375 taylor (aka 375-338 win mag). Smaller case, less powder, less recoil. Just a rebore away if you start with a 338 win mag rifle.

ruger guide gun in 375 ruger

1st: You mention that your daughter has a 35 Whelen? Look up the 360 #2 Nitro Express. You could recreate this caliber's ballistics with the 35 Whelen, 310gr Woodleigh bullet. With a SD at .346, load it a little north of 2,000 fps and start whackin' buffalo.

2nd: Has already been stated above, but I'd do initial shots on a buffalo with a good 220gr 30 Cal.

3rd: Seems like suppressors knock vast majority of the recoil off of standard calibers... I shot a jackal in Botswana with Tholo's suppressed 338 Win Mag, didn't seem to kick any more than my .308 at home... Suppress a standard-weight 375, load high-quality 300gr bullets down around 2100fps.

A 15-18lb rifle sounds unwieldy at best... My opinion this idea es muy malo. She still needs to be able to move the rifle around on the sticks to get set up for the shot and when the bull changes position. The PH can't line it up perfectly for her eye to be looking right through the scope at the target. She'll need to be able to move it up/back for basic adjustment and PICK IT UP OFF THE STICKS when the sticks need to be moved a bit.

Dudes.

And Dudettes.

As I have suggested, I would recommend a 9.3x62 over any other caliber mentioned above.

If I ever have to step down to the lowest level of power that is generally legal and reliably works on DG and is factory loaded, it would be the 9.3x62.

Don Heath, a/k/a Ganyana, after suffering an injury to his shooting shoulder, swore by the 9.3x62 for many years and for good reason.

It punches way above its weight.

Or, as The Greatest once said, it "floats like a butterfly and stings like a bee!"