I officially remove myself as Baptist.

What is IVF?

Send them a letter.

Come over to the dark side of humanism. It's the 21st century.

In old Japan, people believed tsunamis and earthquakes were caused by angry spirits.

Meanwhile in the West people thought an angry God was responsible for natural disasters.

Now we know better.

It's the next frontier for the pro-lifers after the demise of Roe. The busy-bodies need some new cause/right to stick their nose into.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
What is IVF?

Send them a letter.

https://www.yalemedicine.org/c...2520of%2520pregnancy

O have always consider myself a humanist. The two Christianity and humanism are not exclusive.

Mistake people trying to make others miserable.

I haven't been even inside a Baptist church since 1976

Why is a couple's wish to have a child any of the Baptists' interest?

Fucking busybodies. I used to think Christians were harmless.

Nope. Remember the abortion clinic bombings and murder of doctors performing abortions. The far “Christian” right is anything but peaceful. Sort of like the peaceful tourists on Jan 6

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
Come over to the dark side of humanism. It's the 21st century.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

https://www.yalemedicine.org/c...2520of%2520pregnancy

O have always consider myself a humanist. The two Christianity and humanism are not exclusive.

Mistake people trying to make others miserable.

First thought - there is no "dark side" to humanism. The only side to humanism is reality and light, by definition, and by deed, and by self-ID.

It's not humanism if it's dark, and especially by the definition attached by rightists and religious zealots.

Humanism is associated with secularism, agnosticism, realism, and rejection of religion as a basis for reality.

quote:

Originally posted by Magine Enigam:

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
Come over to the dark side of humanism. It's the 21st century.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

https://www.yalemedicine.org/c...2520of%2520pregnancy

O have always consider myself a humanist. The two Christianity and humanism are not exclusive.

Mistake people trying to make others miserable.

First thought - there is no "dark side" to humanism. The only side to humanism is reality and light, by definition, and by deed, and by self-ID.

It's not humanism if it's dark, and especially by the definition attached by rightists and religious zealots.

Humanism is associated with secularism, agnosticism, realism, and rejection of religion as a basis for reality.

The Satanic Temple agrees

quote:

The Satanic Temple has seven fundamental tenets:[45]

One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason.
The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions.
One's body is inviolable, subject to one's own will alone.
The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own.
Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs.
People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused.
Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Satanic_Temple

The Satanic Temple, founded in 2013.

Anyway, jeffe, your analogy is just weird.

Temple nor satan nor worship are a thing for humanists.

People make up shit all the time. I'm actually disappointed that you make such false equivalence.

For one thing, basically, agnosticism applies equally to God as it does to Satan. Satan, the concept, originates in religion. Humanism and agnosticism shuns religion.

There are only coincidental social values cross-over in comparison of Satanism and humanism. Fundamentally they are different. First, they can say whatever, but choosing Satan in the org name says it all, IMO. Satanism is actually the antithesis of humanism.

Satanism - Wikipedia
Satanism refers to a group of religious, ideological, and/or philosophical beliefs based on Satan – particularly his worship …

Well, I am not getting into all of that.

I will say this.

Given one accepts Christ has the only begotten son of God, who lived a life perfect according to the “ Law of Moses” only to be crucified. Yet, through the power of God and he bring one was resurrected. Thus, having provided a pure perfect sacrifice for the remission of sin, those who accept the invitation of this sacrifice and resurrection upon invitation by the Holy Ghost (Jesus confronting spirt that remains upon this Earth) by have their souls purified and made whole with God where the soul originated from.

Having established that predisposition to be Christian, Gid does not give a rain drop in the oven how many times one comes to church. What he cares about is how you treat people in his name.

These people with this vote have chosen to treat people un-Christ like.

That is what Christian means. To be Christ like. What do we see Christ do in our scripture treat those ignored, declared unholy by the controlling and competing sects as worthy, as humans.

No one will ever convince me this attack on folks using the powers of modern medicine made manifest by the tools God gave man to reason. The ability to reason being in part of the image of God. The ability to have children is a sin, and should be regulated against.

No, sir.

That's a pretty good display of sequential rationalization, not necessarily linear though.

Hummm.

quote:

sequential rationalization

We do the best we can.

We first had to dispel the central tenant to be Christian or define Christianity (broadly).

Otherwise, someone would object that (how we treat people) is not the central tenant, but to accept the Christ. Yes, acceptance of Christian predisposed/predicated. However, that does not address the activities, ethic of a Christian. An ethic this vote fails to uphold.

The Southern Baptist church is the single largest Christian evangelical group in the American conservative political canvas.

A few years ago they excommunicated 2 of their congregations including the very highly respected Saddleback church because they ordained women pastors.

About 30 years ago they walked out of the world Baptist confederation / association because Desmond Tutu spoke against any country that was supporting apartheid and not supporting the African struggle for freedom. Their justification was that Bishop tutu's speech was anti American! There is nothing in the Bible that says one has to be pro American to be a good Christian!

The Southern Baptist movement has a big history of bigotry and hate.

I have posted the below link a few times over the last several years.

https://www.politicalorphans.c...icalism-is-so-cruel/

Logically, the position makes no sense. If you are pro-life, why wouldn't you be for IVF?

Good for them. I am fine with fewer baptists.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
Why is a couple's wish to have a child any of the Baptists' interest?

Fucking busybodies. I used to think Christians were harmless.

Exactly!

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
Logically, the position makes no sense. If you are pro-life, why wouldn't you be for IVF?

Because IVF requires assimilation of egg w sperm that will not become a child, but life begins at conception. It is a logically extremism.

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
Logically, the position makes no sense. If you are pro-life, why wouldn't you be for IVF?

Why would you expect sense from Bible thumpers, frauds, and hypocrites? Baptists have long been known to be anti-science. To this day, their schools teach that evolution is false as contrary to the Bible.

When I was a kid, Baptist kids weren't allowed to play with me because I was Catholic. Yeah, I haven't had a high opinion of those frauds since then.

Justice of the Texas Supreme Court has already attacked IVF invoking God.

Imagine if religious people concentrated on good things in life, instead of trying to ram their stupid convoluted ideas up people's throats!

As in Mitlauer? The lowest classification of Nazis engager requiring a civil penalty (fines) for one found as such by de-nazisfication tribunals after German surrender.

These tribunals were not the same as the courts set up for War Crimes.

Logically, it is non of your bloody business!

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I officially remove myself as Baptist.

I'm sure that will really hurt their feelings!

It is not for them.

I would love to see the average age of the membership.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
It is not for them.

I would love to see the average age of the membership.

i'd expect its more or less the same as any church, lots of "youngins" and oldins, not so much in the middle... and M shaped distribution, if you will

but the MORE interesting number would be total membership COUNT as a percentage. It'll show a trending down gliding slope, like most other churches

Senate kills a bill to protect IVF. God save us from the kook GOP.

Some Christians believe any sin they might commit is automatically forgiven just because they accept Jesus as their personal savior. Good works don't help save you. Baptists seem particularly prone to this thinking.

They can profess faith in the Ten Commandments on Sunday, then cheat their neighbor in a business deal on Monday and cheat on their wife with another parishioner on Saturday.

The lesson they teach the rest of us is simply this: Christians are the grossest of hypocrites.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
Some Christians believe any sin they might commit is automatically forgiven just because they accept Jesus as their personal savior. Good works don't help save you. Baptists seem particularly prone to this thinking.

They can profess faith in the Ten Commandments on Sunday, then cheat their neighbor in a business deal on Monday and cheat on their wife with another parishioner on Saturday.

The lesson they teach the rest of us is simply this: Christians are the grossest of hypocrites.

I am happy to report that the above is true of ALL RELIGIONS!

That's right, Frank. Let Trump and his worshippers alienate another class of voters--couples unable to conceive without science help.

I know a writer who is a Satanist. He doesn't worship or believe in a supernatural entity called Satan, but does subscribe to the seven tenets Jeffeosso posted.

According to him, he and his wife also practice polyamory.

Senate Republicans block bill to provide access to IVF.

Saeed nailed it. Most of us, Jews, Muslims and Christians believe in the same God and we should be able to figure out how to get along. Whatever you call him, Allah, Yahwh, or God, I think he would be sorely disappointed in us.

The problem is, or one is, when true believers believe know their religion is the exclusive access to god and heaven.

Yes, the problem in any negotiation is the first time someone says, "but", but that's when a good negotiator shines. There's always a "but", but there's no "but" that can't be overcome.

religious fanatics on all sides are an impediment for sure.

https://youtu.be/i9IFRO9eXNI?s...Ock3CkQdyFW68N&t=408

Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito doesn't agree with you.

His wife "Baby" is a vicious little white church gal too. Listen to the next segment of the video.

I was raised Protestant (albeit not one of the evangelical or Southern Baptist sects), but my mother wanted me to go to a Catholic school, because it was the best school there was in our town. My father was against it because he said I would become Catholic. I wasn't sure why that was a bad thing at the time, but they compromised and I went to Catholic school. I graduated and still hadn't become Catholic, although I went to a lot of masses and religion classes over the years. Interestingly, the religion classes included other religions, including Islam and Judaism. Then, I went to a Methodist college that also required a world religions course. Later, after I married I became a Catholic (although not a very good one especially if you ask my wife). My father learned to accept that and realize that there is not that much difference. There is certainly more in common than differences.

Currently sitting on my desk for reading is a copy of the Quran. I haven't read it yet, but the reason for my wanting to read it is to identify what we have in common. Too many people focus on differences. I think we need to identify what we all have in common and work from there. Fanatics, of all religions, are a problem for all of us. They always have been throughout history.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
Some Christians believe any sin they might commit is automatically forgiven just because they accept Jesus as their personal savior. Good works don't help save you. Baptists seem particularly prone to this thinking.

They can profess faith in the Ten Commandments on Sunday, then cheat their neighbor in a business deal on Monday and cheat on their wife with another parishioner on Saturday.

The lesson they teach the rest of us is simply this: Christians are the grossest of hypocrites.

You tell your son and his wife this opinion you have of them?