If you aren’t willing to listen to them describe something that you support??

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rImtkTImpXQ

Is this absolute insanity, or is there a good reason to refuse to listen to a doctor describing something that these lawmakers support.

If you flip the roles: would it be ok for those opposed to “gender affirming care” for minors, to refuse to watch a similar video that the advocates believe supports their position?

After watching the video, who here can state that they support what the doctor is doing?

This is how you spend your down time? I've heard enough about trannies, gender affirming care etc. to last me several lifetimes, I do not need to watch youtube videos about it. I couldn't care less what these people do, if they want identify as martians, so be it.

Why do you care so deeply about what someone else does? This is the mountain you are going to make your stand on? Whatever floats your boat I guess.

I could care less what they want to identify as as well.

The time and expense involved because they chose so is different.

And yes, there is quite a bit.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
I could care less what they want to identify as as well.

The time and expense involved because they chose so is different.

And yes, there is quite a bit.

None of my time being burnt that way.

Expense? Is this issue driving up the cost of healthcare for those of us not interested in transitioning? If so, I was not aware of it and do not support that. Otherwise, knock yourselves out.

watch the video - the Left WALKED OUT rather than hear a leftist surgeon talk about performing gender resignment on "adolescents" and how it is problematic.

It's KIDS, Steve - get over YOUSELF - watch the video, even at 2x, and listen---

or just stick your fingers in your ears and scream LALALALALALLA -

jerkwad

btw, adults? you want gender surgery -- great for you, hope it works out, and I totally support you in perusing your dream -

Do you think these videos just might be made with the intention of outraging the individual watching it?

Not my kids, not my problem. I have no interest whatsoever in instructing others how to raise children. I have less interest in watching videos designed to outrage me.

I do enjoy videos....Waymore Blues is currently entertaining me.

What do you call medical assistance?

And yes, a portion of my time is.

As I see it, preventably.

What a consenting adult does and is responsible is very different.

quote:

Originally posted by skb:

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
I could care less what they want to identify as as well.

The time and expense involved because they chose so is different.

And yes, there is quite a bit.

None of my time being burnt that way.

Expense? Is this issue driving up the cost of healthcare for those of us not interested in transitioning? If so, I was not aware of it and do not support that. Otherwise, knock yourselves out.

quote:

Originally posted by skb:
Do you think these videos just might be made with the intention of outraging the individual watching it?

Not my kids, not my problem. I have no interest whatsoever in instructing others how to raise children. I have less interest in watching videos designed to outrage me.

I do enjoy videos....Waymore Blues is currently entertaining me.

nah bruh - "adolescent patients" watch the video, superman

sorry, i guess i meant Übermensch - that your time is SOOOOOO precious that you can't watch a video before commenting ON the video

quote:

Originally posted by skb:
This is how you spend your down time? I've heard enough about trannies, gender affirming care etc. to last me several lifetimes, I do not need to watch youtube videos about it. I couldn't care less what these people do, if they want identify as martians, so be it.

Why do you care so deeply about what someone else does? This is the mountain you are going to make your stand on? Whatever floats your boat I guess.

X2. I don't understand all the hand wringing over such a small number of people having nothing to do with me or any part of my life. Get a life.

oh sorry -- no steve.. no never ever ever ever watch a video before spouting off -- never never never -- just don't do it -- your such a cool kid for spouting off without watching.. don't worry, no one will judge

quote:

Originally posted by wymple:
X2. I don't understand all the hand wringing over such a small number of people having nothing to do with me or any part of my life. Get a life.

so, you are cool with mutilating children? noted, forever

You misunderstand Jeffe.....I simply do not let that type of noise into my life.

No Tucker Carlson, No Rachel Maddow. No morning Joe, No Russel Brand. Any dickhead making a dollar off divisive content will not earn a dollar from me listening to him.

Additionally, my basic premise in this world is that I do not tell others what to do. It comes from not wanting to be told by others how to behave.

On pretty much every topic, I come down on the side of "mind your own damn business". That premise in my mind should apply to how others raise their children.

Nothing at all to do with being important or too busy. I'm not sure how you might of gotten that idea.

^^ Amen.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
What do you call medical assistance?

And yes, a portion of my time is.

As I see it, preventably.

What a consenting adult does and is responsible is very different.

quote:

Originally posted by skb:

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
I could care less what they want to identify as as well.

The time and expense involved because they chose so is different.

And yes, there is quite a bit.

None of my time being burnt that way.

Expense? Is this issue driving up the cost of healthcare for those of us not interested in transitioning? If so, I was not aware of it and do not support that. Otherwise, knock yourselves out.

A very fair point on insurance coverage. On further reflection, Gender Dysphoria is a recognized condition now, I would imagine it is eligible for coverage. Something I had not considered. I'm not sure how much it really drives premiums up, but still a valid point for discussion.

We work in very different fields, I can see how your professional time could be taken up with this issue. Not that way for most of us Joe the Plumber types.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
watch the video - the Left WALKED OUT rather than hear a leftist surgeon talk about performing gender resignment on "adolescents" and how it is problematic.

It's KIDS, Steve - get over YOUSELF - watch the video, even at 2x, and listen---

or just stick your fingers in your ears and scream LALALALALALLA -


btw, adults? you want gender surgery -- great for you, hope it works out, and I totally support you in perusing your dream -

I began this thread because I hoped that someone would explain to me why the politicians felt the need to leave the meeting.

But this thread turned out to be hilarious. The three “advocates” that showed up to voice their mock-support for transgenders proved themselves to be exactly like the politicians: they claim to be so supportive of transgender people, but they couldn’t even watch a video of a doctor who specializes in gender reassignment surgery for minors, explain the process that he uses to perform gender reassignment on minors, and the associated complications that he are unique to minors.

Why in the world would you refuse to watch an expert explain something that you profess to support? That is the same type of garbage that I saw from the MAGA crowd when they didn’t want to admit what Trump proved himself to be: stick your fingers in your ears and wallow in you ignorance.

Honestly, how is what you are doing any different?

And you are “too busy” to watch the video, but not too busy to jump on this thread with a bunch of virtue signaling?

quote:

you are “too busy” to watch the video, but not too busy to jump on this thread with a bunch of virtue signaling?

. . . you seem to be incapable of understanding the distinction between support of an issue and indifference to an issue.

In case you want to skip the politics and get right to the doctor, skip ahead to 4:38 in the video.

It is just over 2 minutes long. The doctor is an expert in working with trans minors.

-There are no pictures, no diagrams
-nothing graphic
-nothing anti trans
-nothing mean or discriminatory
-nothing shocking
-nothing racist
-nothing political
-nothing that will cause distress
-nothing offensive
-nothing religious
The only person shown in the video is the doctor himself.

It is simply educational. Why would you refuse to listen to it?



How can you claim to “not care” enough to watch the video, yet you care enough to post here about how supportive you are? Are you afraid that you are going to learn something that makes you realize that you are blot as secure in your position as you like to believe??

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
. . . you seem to be incapable of understanding the distinction between support of an issue and indifference to an issue.

Mike, if you are indifferent, then I owe you an apology.

I mistook you for someone who supports minors undergoing gender reassignment procedures, since that is what the video that is up for discussion was about.

Look out. Jason's got his cross-examination hat on.

I support letting adults make their own decisions regarding their sexuality and letting parents raise their children (including dealing with issues pertaining to sexuality) the way they feel is appropriate . . . in other words, I support minding my own business. I commend that approach to you.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
Look out. Jason's got his cross-examination hat on.

That made me smile.

Ok, maybe I even chuckled.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
I support letting adults make their own decisions regarding their sexuality and letting parents raise their children (including dealing with issues pertaining to sexuality) the way they feel is appropriate . . . in other words, I support minding my own business. I commend that approach to you.

Mike, I mostly agree with you.

Unfortunately, I don’t have the luxury of getting to “mind my own business”. You see, as a teacher I am now I’m in the middle of this.

I teach at a kindergarten-5th grade building. Last year a kid(4th grader) decided that they wanted to switch genders and go by a new name at school.

The classroom teacher asked our principal how she should handle it, expecting the principal to want her to meet with the parents.

Our principal told her that it was not the teacher’s place to tell the student’s parents. So basically she was expected to lie, or at the very least to hide information from the parents. Is this right? I honestly don’t know.

Now I am hearing that some schools districts want to have teachers trained to used one set of names/genders for a kid at school, but to use another set of names/genders when talking to the parents.

And I have heard of laws/rules being put into place to remove trans children from their homes if their parents don’t support their transitioning. Is that right? Is refusing to allow a child to transition to another gender really a form of abuse? I have seen some here on AR say as much.

I am a mandated reporter. Every year I have to report parents for suspected abuse. Will I soon be mandated to call child protective services if a student tells me that their parents won’t all them to transition? I’m hoping that we don’t reach that point, which is why I keep posting about it.

Anyway, no cross examination, just some food for thought.



*like most all of you I have no problem with adults doing what they want, and I am respectful of people, including trans people. I done support the push to normalize this stuff among kids, and I don’t think I am going to be willing to lie to parents.

…… (I’m wondering which one of you is going to tell me to stop being such a busy body, and not to be concerned until I actually have a transgender kid in my own classroom.)

quote:

Originally posted by skb:

For someone who professes to “not care” you sure don’t hesitate to wade into the discussion.

I do wonder, if you really don’t care, why complain about me posting about it? Why not just scroll past.

Honest question: do you post on these threads because you want me to shut up because it is something that you are conflicted about, or is it a knee jerk reaction because you feel like you should defend any progressive cause? Or is there some other reason?

Food for thought, no need to answer.

I will point out that if you want a thread to die, responding to it is self defeating.

Anyway, I do appreciate that you(along with Jines and ME) are someone who I often disagree with, but who is able to discuss your thoughts in a constructive manner. I won’t say that you change my mind very often, but you do a good job of helping me to understand your perspective.

And I have to admit that I walk away much less upset when I can understand why those who I disagree with believe what they believe.

quote:

Originally posted by JBrown:

quote:

Originally posted by skb:

For someone who professes to “not care” you sure don’t hesitate to wade into the discussion.

I do wonder, if you really don’t care, why complain about me posting about it? Why not just scroll past.

Honest question: do you post on these threads because you want me to shut up because it is something that you are conflicted about, or is it a knee jerk reaction because you feel like you should defend any progressive cause? Or is there some other reason?

Food for thought, no need to answer.

I will point out that if you want a thread to die, responding to it is self defeating.

Anyway, I do appreciate that you(along with Jines and ME) are someone who I often disagree with, but who is able to discuss your thoughts in a constructive manner. I won’t say that you change my mind very often, but you do a good job of helping me to understand your perspective.

And I have to admit that I walk away much less upset when I can understand why those who I disagree with believe what they believe.

Jason,
I think we would get along just fine in person, we have many things in common.

I do find it strange that you embrace the positions held by the MAGA crew though. Gender affirmation surgery is not at all common for minors in America. Why would you obsess about such an obscure procedure if it is not an issue in your home? Can you not see that you are being played by these people making this divisive content? I have no need to be constantly outraged. I am in no way defending the progressive position, I simply feel if it is not my family then it is not my business.

It seems like you are willfully heading down the rabbit hole of conspiracy theories, why I do not know. You seem like a rational guy in many respects. It does puzzle me why people embrace this sort of media. My best friend from high school has taken a similar path, from moderate to full blown MAGA supporter. I just don't get it. I certainly do not understand the resentment towards others who are different.

I do not want you to shut up. I do try to interject what I feel is a more moderate viewpoint into many of the outrage threads.

Steve

quote:

Originally posted by skb:
You misunderstand Jeffe.....I simply do not let that type of noise into my life.

Steve, there is literally nothing sensational in this video clip - it's a recording of congressional procedure and a JUMP CUT of the dems walking out -- it doesn't even show but like 3 people standing up - then testimony from a surgeon who does things to kids -

might watch it - it'll open your eyes without all the drama - in fact, this thread is several times more dramatic than this video ..

I watched it. I am on record numerous times that GRS should not be permitted until age 18.

However, I also do not agree that state legislatures should tell parents, children, and doctors that Gender Dysphoria is not real and should not be treated w hormone blockers under physician supervision, and HRT which are reversible.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I watched it. I am on record numerous times that GRS should not be permitted until age 18.

However, I also do not agree that state legislatures should tell parents, children, and doctors that Gender Dysphoria is not real and should not be treated w hormone blockers under physician supervision, and HRT which are reversible.

LHeym,

Who has ever said that gender dysphoria is not real? It is an accepted medical condition that has been on the books for ages.



You and SKB have similar stances on this. He has stated that he would not oppose a law restricting GRS to adults(18+).

You are possibly more extreme on this than I am. I am not calling for a law banning procedures by age group, I would simply like to see some sanity introduced to the conversation.

For example: I don’t believe that society has “decided” this issue to the point that we can charge parents with abuse and remove a minor form their home just because the parents oppose their child transitioning.

I don’t believe that as a teacher I should be expected or required to lie to parents.

I don’t believe that biological men should be allowed into women’s spaces(restrooms, sports, prisons, etc. Maybe we need a third option?)

I don’t believe that “biological woman” is a discriminatory term.

But other than that, I think that all people should be treated with respect, including calling them
what they want to be called.

quote:

National Review has reached out to the school district and the education board for comment.

Under the policies, teachers must refer to students by their preferred pronouns or gender-specific names during school hours but revert to biological pronouns and legal names when speaking with parents, the complaint states.

https://www.nationalreview.com...om%20their%20parents.

I really do question why you guys feel the need to “interject a moderate point of view” into a discussion about something that you obviously don’t have strong feelings about. It’s not like I have posted or said anything extreme or outlandish.

It seems to be that what you guys are really trying to do is minimize an issue that “your party/people(progressives)” are shoving down our throats.

You do everything that you can to minimize it by claiming that it is “too rare” to bother with.

When we have teachers teaching about it in school at the youngest ages, including preschool, and teachers being directed to lie to parents, teachers being fired for refusing to play along, it is not an “insignificant issue”.

But you guys prefer that we stick our heads in the sand?



This isn’t a MAGA conspiracy. This is a push from the most radical left. The fact that you guys deny this is astonishing.

Jason,
I think you were looking for this?

quote:

Originally posted by JBrown:

quote:

National Review has reached out to the school district and the education board for comment.

Under the policies, teachers must refer to students by their preferred pronouns or gender-specific names during school hours but revert to biological pronouns and legal names when speaking with parents, the complaint states.

https://www.nationalreview.com...om%20their%20parents.

I really do question why you guys feel the need to “interject a moderate point of view” into a discussion about something that you obviously don’t have strong feelings about. It’s not like I have posted or said anything extreme or outlandish.

It seems to be that what you guys are really trying to do is minimize an issue that “your party/people(progressives)” are shoving down our throats.

You do everything that you can to minimize it by claiming that it is “too rare” to bother with.

When we have teachers teaching about it in school at the youngest ages, including preschool, and teachers being directed to lie to parents, teachers being fired for refusing to play along, it is not an “insignificant issue”.

But you guys prefer that we stick our heads in the sand?



This isn’t a MAGA conspiracy. This is a push from the most radical left. The fact that you guys deny this is astonishing.

So you do not think the MAGA movement is blowing this rarely occurring issue out of proportion for political gain?

If that is your position then I firmly disagree with you. It ties right into the other thread on the child trafficking movie. As I said there, it is not a conspiracy, rather a strategy to win votes. Not much different from Nixon's Southern Strategy by using hot button social issues to divide America and at the same time gain political control.

quote:

Originally posted by skb:

So you do not think the MAGA movement is blowing this rarely occurring issue out of proportion for political gain?

No, I absolutely not believe that. Talk about a conspiracy theory…

There is more than ample proof that this is being played out in schools. I’m a teacher way out in the Bering Sea and I am seeing it within our own schools.

Here is some proof, which I’m guessing most will ignore because you would rather continue with your MAGA conspiracy theories shielding you from the truth.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...IgaW4gc2Nob29scyA%3D

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...IgaW4gc2Nob29scyA%3D

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...OBK0&pp=QAFIAQ%3D%3D

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/axwOo-_H-Cg

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...cgdHJhbnNnZW5kZXI%3D

https://www.hernandosun.com/20...-fdoe-gets-involved/

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...dGVuIHRyYW5zZ2VuZGVy

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/p6vakW4znIs

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=...IHByZXNjaG9vbA%3D%3D

As I said, I do see this as any type of a conspiracy....It is a strategy.

Same as Nixon's Southern Strategy, divide and conquer.

Looks pretty rare to me, at least those surgeries that are covered by insurance. Do you have any links showing the frequency of these surgeries? This was the best I can find, 56 claims for insurance on minors related to GAS between 2019 and 2021. Pretty damn rare I think.

https://www.reuters.com/invest...usa-transyouth-data/

You and I have been over this in the past and you and I both agreed that the numbers should be higher if they included those that weren’t covered by insurance. Honestly, how many insurance companies cover GRS for minors?

Rules/laws are being put in place to force teachers to lie to parents. Isn’t that enough to open your eyes to the fact that this isn’t just a MAGA strategy?

And why would the progressives be playing into Trumps hands like that? Are they also part of the “strategy”.

Did you watch the video from the first post in this thread? What was your reaction?

Show me some data that this is a widespread problem. There is none.....

I'm not saying that the Left is not off base on this issue, but just like the right, the Left is not a monolith. You are pointing out a few examples from the fringes.

I think you are blowing a very few cases of surgery WAY out of proportion, just the way the Right wanted you to see things.

As I mentioned earlier, I do not watch videos designed to agitate me. Not my gig. Poking myself in the eye with a hot rod sounds more appealing.

So maybe articles instead of videos?

Transequality.org explaining that FERPA prohibits teachers from informing parents about a student’s gender identity issues. This is interesting when you consider that we would never send a kid to the hospital for a broke arm without notifying the parents. Kids can’t be given a aspirin without parental consent either…

https://transequality.org/site...CL-Fact-Sheet.pdfBut

Schools hiding students gender identity:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/0...tudents-parents.html

Teachers suing school district over being forced to lie to parents:
https://www.nationalreview.com...om%20their%20parents.

Teachers union pushing to allow confidential medical care for transgender students at school without parental consent or notification:
https://brenda4kids.com/index....rs-union-has-its-way

California has a law on the books, and a teacher was fired for breaking it:

https://abc7.com/amp/jurupa-va...r-identity/12950847/

At least 6 states have laws requiring teachers to lie to parents. There may be more, as the information that I found was a couple of years old. School districts also have rules, but I have no data.

SKB, I believe that you and I are in agreement on more or less everything. The only exception is whether this is wide spread enough to be worth consideration.

But I do hope that you are correct and that this is much ado about nothing.

And I sure as hell hope that this doesn’t help trump get re-elected. I see this as a direct response to Trumpism and the sooner Trump is gone, the sooner we can get back to normal.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
I support letting adults make their own decisions regarding their sexuality and letting parents raise their children (including dealing with issues pertaining to sexuality) the way they feel is appropriate . . . in other words, I support minding my own business. I commend that approach to you.

So you’re a Christian Scientist? If parents feel the best way to treat a sick child is to pray more and avoid doctors? After all, parents are always right Got it……

That is almost the status of the law.

I remember we were reading a case on law school along those lines. Thx Professor a graduate of Georgetown, but from Boyd County, KY told me, “ Mr. Lowe, your religious beliefs would not survive this scrutiny.”

That is when I started thinking. It is not any crazier than believing a virgin gave birth to a Demi hid, but pure God.