The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Guns, Politics, Gunsmithing & Reloading The Political Forum spain-rules-out-buying-f-35-Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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for those that think trump actions are not affecting NATO or your allies: think two times before talking ... a new european alliance is coming for sure but the way usa treated her ex-allies might come to hard wake up for you guys ... https://www.reuters.com/busine...-or-fcas-2025-08-06/ Spain rules out buying F-35, choosing between Eurofighter or FCAS MADRID, Aug 6 (Reuters) - Spain is no longer considering the option of buying U.S.-made F-35 fighter jets and is choosing between European-made Eurofighter and the so-called Future Combat Air System (FCAS), a defence ministry spokesperson said on Wednesday. The spokesperson was confirming an earlier report by El Pais newspaper that the government had shelved plans to buy the F-35, which is manufactured by U.S. aerospace giant Lockheed Martin (LMT.N) Asked to comment on the matter, Lockheed Martin said in a statement: "Foreign military sales are government-to-government transactions, and this matter is best addressed by the U.S. or Spanish government." The government had earmarked 6.25 billion euros ($7.24 billion) in its 2023 budget to buy new fighter jets, El Pais said. But the Spanish government's plan to spend most of the additional 10.5 billion euros for defence this year in Europe made it impossible to acquire the U.S.-made fighter jets, the newspaper reported. Spain's Socialist Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez announced plans earlier this year to increase spending on defence to meet the current NATO target of 2% of gross domestic product in 2025. However he has refused to raise spending to 5% in the longer run despite U.S. pressure on all NATO allies to do so. Sanchez's position was heavily criticized by U.S. President Donald Trump, who threatened to impose additional tariffs on the country's goods. The U.S. embassy in Madrid did not immediately respond to a request for comment on the F-35 issue. Eurofighter is manufactured by Airbus (AIR.PA) , opens new tab, BAE systems (BAES.L), opens new tab and Leonardo (LDOF.MI), opens new tab, while FCAS is being developed by Dassault Aviation (AM.PA), opens new tab, Airbus and Indra Sistemas (IDR.MC) , opens new tab. ($1 = 0.8634 euros) Reporting by Inti Landauro Editing by Andrei Khalip and Gareth Jones | ||
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THE ORANGE MAGA ARSEHOLE is America's worst enemy! He is MAGA ENEMY to the country!  | |||
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One of Us |
Good for them It’s a free market Never been lost, just confused here and there for month or two | |||
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| Administrator |
Europe are developing their own air crafts. Just they did with Airbus! Boeing is utterly destroyed by the bean counters. They have absorbed all American competition, and look where they are. THE MIGHTY DOLLAR! Before any! That is exactly what THE IRANGE MAGA FUCKWIT is doing. Enriching himself against the country! | |||
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One of Us |
If I was in the market for fighter aircraft…I would probably look at the ones from folks who ALWAYS rule the skies. However, that’s just me.  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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| One of Us |
America alone..... My guess is that the Spanish place more value on planes bought from allies than they do planes from former allies. Can you blame them? look at how we have treated Canada and Switzerland regarding tariffs, just shameful. More winning. | |||
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In a fight…I usually place the most value on winning. But then again that’s just me. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Some folks understand what it means to be an allie, others embrace the their Russian "friends". You know who you are.  Shitty policy yielding shitty results...team MAGA at its finest. | |||
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| One of Us |
When intelligent business people struggle in today’s economy… Well, I just have to question the intelligent part. In conflict…the US dominates the skies. Second place is not even close. And actually Spain and Russia get along pretty well. The truth is that Spain has fighter aircraft pretty much for optics…they never intend to use them. Pretty much any old rag that flies and has the profile will do. They know if the shit hits the fan they can hide behind mother’s (USA) apron.  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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| One of Us |
It is not the fault of the business man when product increases over night in price between 15 and 39%, that is just plain old poor government policy, and an outrageous tax. The EU and the Europeans are not near as confused as you are as to who their allies are and who the enemy is. Russia is not their friend, or ours. The truth is, America Alone is a failed policy. | |||
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Who was it who contrived the business plan? Did Trump do that?  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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| One of Us |
My business plan was very successful, until the orange turd implemented outrageous taxes and his poor policy ran down the value of the dollar. I had my best years under Biden  Who set the policy that dramatically increased the overhead for business? That would be your boy, the orange turd. | |||
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One of Us |
. . . who would have thought you would have self-declared "conservatives" crowing about how much they love taxes . . . I think Rule No. 1 in becoming a MAGAt is to check your brain at the door. Mike | |||
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When was the time time you won a war?? Vietnam? You got your arse handed to you. Iraq? Same thing! Afghanistan? 20 years and you ran away leaving all you military equipment behind! Glutton for punishment! Wimps! Cowards. Lead by a draft dodging Cadet Bine Spur! I really feel sorry for all the brave American men and women who give their lives for a bunch of bloody useless politicians! | |||
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| One of Us |
for those that think that f35 is ruling the sky it might be a good idea to look for results of the previous red flags and NATO tiger meets ... it will be an eye opener ... some eurofighters and rafales got results that might surprise your little eyes ... and for the record even a m2000 got one kill on a f35 ... | |||
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US and Indian air forces had maneuvers. The US won when using AIWACS. Once the AIWACS were turned off the Indians slaughtered the US!  | |||
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Mjines what I have learned from living w a Super Majority Republican legislature (that I voted for) is they love to tax and make new taxes. It is not taxes these new, fake conservatives disagree with. Look at the BBB. It is a major wealth redistribution scheme upward to the benefit of the 2nd Estate. While with tariffs, taxing the everyone else (3rd Estate) out their ears on their standard of living, goods and services. The whole irony of this mess is Trump won by saying. You are in danger. You can no longer afford the standard of living you need, work for. Your economic well being is being destroyed by economic policy of communist. What are those communities doing about it. They are trying to silence you by prosecuting me. They prosecute me because they really hate you, and I’m fighting for you. They are letting trans people join the military (gasp). They are devil and trying to destroy America. Vote for me. So, Trump gets elected. What does he do: 1) taxes their (our) standard of living, 2) destroys their buying power, 3) restricts their access to healthcare both in terms of payment source and providers, 4) uses EO to void citizenship as defined by the Constitution, 6) and lied about the facts of the conspiracy theories they stocked the mob with. You have folks like Dr. Easter who do not believe in any of this, but only care about welding political power. Thus, he comes here, their, and yonder to sell the indefensible. Here is another question Dr. Easter and the Texas Contingent never answered: During President Obama and Biden’s terms there was pressure upon them to use an executive order to void Heller and its lineage. This is what Trump did. He used an executive order to void controlling precedent that applying the 14th Amendment that held when a person is born here that person is a citizen. These precedents applying the Constitution thusly predate Heller by about 150 years. The 2nd Amendment was an incorporated right by the 14th Amendment. The two citizenship and firearms possession are federally protected rights by the Constitution through similar legal theories being applied. Presidents Obama and Biden understood this dynamic, and the limits morally and legally that come with it. Thus, both refused to violate the Constitution to obtain an end they agree with. However, President Trump and his ilk have no such understanding, no such respect, and no such morality. How would the fake conservatives act had Obama or Biden used an executive order to void Heller and its lineage? They would have been understandably speaking of impeachment. The only difference in their minds is they like Trump’s end vs dislike the other end. | |||
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While I am not a fan of Trump’s tariffs, I don’t recall you getting upset about the goalposts being moved by Biden/Obama on other businesses. It strikes me as you are a bit hypocritical when you get upset about taxes… that affect you, but not others.
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While the tariffs have hit me disproportionally hard, they will touch every American consumer, some more than others. I don't feel that moving the burden of funding the country on to the less fortunate is the correct way to move forward, while I don't struggle today, I have in the past and have empathy for those who do. The wealthy are not victims Dr. Butler, contrary to Grover Norquist tells you. | |||
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Umm. Who pays oil/gas taxes? (Everyone) Who can afford EV’s? (Wealthy) Yet you were all for that. No idea who this nordquist fellow is, and could care less. I agree the tariffs are a dumb idea, and will affect all of us to some extent, but your outrage is because it hits you disproportionately. You claim “I’m fine” but recurrently bring it up, so I doubt you really are fine. I didn’t hear your objecting to medicaid taxes on the medical providers (we pay a tax that you don’t…) and while it may be passed on somewhat, as our billing practices are highly regulated, we can’t add that tax to Medicare/Medicaid billing. As to Spain and the F35, we seem to be having issues with them crashing, so I can certainly understand others not being really keen on them. I don’t think it’s all a reaction to Trump and tariffs. | |||
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My position on EVs is we need to do first EVs what we did first the fossil fuel and by extension automobile industry and infrastructure. If we never start, we will never get there. | |||
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Did we pass laws requiring gas stations to be started? Did we provide direct subsidies and tax credits for ICE’s? Heck, we have laws against private (non business) residential area bulk gas storage in most nonrural places. Yes, we did subsidize research. No issue with that part of the EV equation. Yes we did provide a road network (which the EV’s will use.) We have also subsidized electric generation and subsidized the grid that is already there. Every tax benefit that exists for oil and gas (like depreciation) exists for electric uses as well. If it truly makes economic sense, it will happen. | |||
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We subsidized them and the gasoline production. Miles of roads and gas stations at every exit did not just happen. | |||
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The roads were subsidized, yes. Are we banning EV’s from them so that it’s a subsidy of ICE vehicles? Remember some of the earliest cars were electric, by the way, so the early road subsidies were also for horse and EV use… Oil and gas refining were private concerns all along. The subsidization that you are claiming is exactly what? Factory tax increment finance? Subsidizing loans? What? My family had been in the automotive business since the early 1900’s. My generation got out of it, aside from some stock ownership, and my dad’s generation sold the businesses we were in - automotive supply, lubricants, cleaning, and direct vehicle sales. We were never subsidized. Standard oil was not subsidized, yet they were the largest oil company in the world. The government actually broke them up. While they manipulated the government to get their monopoly, they didn’t get direct subsidy. They used prexisting railroads to ship oil, and built their own rails, ship line, and pipelines. I agree that the federal government subsidized research. I agree that depreciation can be considered a form of subsidy. I agree that they have done a lot of tax increment stuff at lower levels. I’m sure states have played games to woo businesses. The closest thing to a subsidy for ICE vehicles was the deliberate change of prexisting trolleys and rail to buses. All of these have been used by the EV companies as well along with things that were not done for ICE vehicles. The other point would be that the oil/ICE industry created the market so that heavy lifting has been done for the EV industry. Again, I have no issue with the government spending money on research to advance EV technology. That would have wide ranging benefits. Create a battery with less weight, more endurance, and a more stable recharge/discharge and chargeable EV’s become more useful. Fuel cell technology would be good. Putting in more nuclear plants for reduction of electricity cost. Those are options most would agree with. | |||
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Oil production, gasoline, vehicles all subsidized. Not too mention Standard Oil was able to violate many Fed laws until President Rosevelt and the S. Ct. Again, do for EVs what we did for the fossil fuels and fossil fuel powered cars. There h https://www.eesi.org/papers/vi...s-and-societal-costs | |||
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except they weren't - ROADS were, see Ike's highways -- tax breaks, according to the anti-tariff folks, aren't material -- learn to live within your means cars? subsidized? what ARE you smoking? no, the exact blend, it's an interesting thought tax deductions for "dry holes" .. that's called a loss, which to anyone with a modicum of finance knowledge, are ALWAYS a tax deduction -- seriously, you'd cut off your own nose it if smelled a general policy being engaged on a specific -- stick to lawyering -- one day, you'll be the senior attorney, till then, you remain, well, since to take humbridge to being told the truth, not-the-senior ... leave matters of STEM to the qualified, k? likely results in less egg on your face from biased sources for fun https://youtu.be/d-lqZcO5KA4?t=87 opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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Who gives a shit? Since when has Spain played a pivotal role in anything? It would be a waste of exceptional aircraft anyway. Let them play with Eurofighters.
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| One of Us |
at least spain and other countries are re-evaluating their position but who gives a shit lol ... certainly not usa if they loose few billions of contracts you do not need them ... who gives a shit ... your tariffs will fix that lol
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It matters because it makes countries less cognizant of U.S. interests and allows nation states we isolate to rejoin global integration. | |||
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explain that to bobster lol ... | |||
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Explain what? Just had breakfast with a retired British General. Discussing Trump. He said "our cousins across the pond were always too stupid about world affairs. Now they have Trump, they have shot themselves in both feet!" | |||
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Frankly, cutting the US military/industrial complex is not that horrid of a thing. Eisenhower waned us about 70 years ago about it. India has a little problem with using Russian arms and they are not as effective as the ones that we sold to your cousins in Pakistan... which may have been a mistake on our part. But India has been violating intellectual property patents and selling substandard pharmaceuticals (as well as some that are quite good- you get what you pay for if you verify). They have been getting around restrictions on Russia by reselling Russian oil on the world market in contravention of various agreements... did they think that they would not have consequences? I would also tell your British General that he's probably right that we are too stupid about world affairs, and that Trump is upsetting a lot of people... but that we likely would not have elected Trump if the rest of the world had not been taking advantage of us for decades (building resentment) and that while we have shot ourselves in both feet, that may well heal. His service somehow took a world power and in about 80 years went to having more horses than tanks and more admirals than ships. That we learned how to run things from them... | |||
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| One of Us |
it is funny but playing the victim is not working very well lol ... i d like to know how realistically your country has been abused and taking advantage of by the rest of the world ... not what trump is saying but real numbers ... | |||
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| Administrator |
This is the whole sorry state we are in now. America has always thought they were doing the world a favor. By abusing them, invading them, installing puppet governments. Basically sticking their nose where it was not wanted. Take the three major trouble spots in the world today. Iran. They replaced a popularly elected government by having the CIA install a puppet they can control. They invaded Iraq for the second time to install their puppet. And now both Iraq and Iran are against America. Ukraine. An election was won by a popular man. They did not like it. They installed their puppet to start a war with Russia, by going back on agreements the Ukraine had with Russia. Palestine. Every time the ILLEGALLY CREATED New Nazis had a UN resolution against them, America vetoes it. The last step in their non stop genocide and the ORANGE TURD sides with them, and wants all the Palestinians in Gaza to leave their homes. So he can build condos on the beach! | |||
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| One of Us |
You make some good points about the Palestinians, but when you say things like the above, you lose all credibility. | |||
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Denying the genocide against the Palestinians is no different than denying the genocide against the Jews in Germany! | |||
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Then how are you supposed to handle terrorists that surround themselves with human shields?
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That's because his country westernized and revived the glory that was once the Middle East/Persia. Compared to other ME countries that prefer to exist as tribal death cults. All the while crying "woe is me". "Why is everybody picking on me?" If their leaders didn't steal all the wealth made from oil and keep their populations in perpetual victimhood there wouldn't be a need to cry "bully USA"; "Death to the USA". What a con.
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