YADA YADA YADA! Nonresidents can lick my nuts. Oh wait, I better not say that Spyro,Gatogordo,Gonhuntin,m16 etc; might do it!



It ain't broke so don't fix it. Whine and cry your hearts out, 25% NR tags in Wy is enough, and 8 times the going rate is fair price. If it changes I can live with it easier than you nonresidents can cope with the current situation.

quote:

YADA YADA YADA! Nonresidents can lick my nuts. Oh wait, I better not say that Spyro,Gatogordo,Gonhuntin,m16 etc; might do it!

You don't have any nuts. Most whinning little bitches don't.

quote:

The idea a state would get hard up and sell public land to individuals doesn't fly. We'd make a hell of a lot more money off natural resources if the Feds didn't meddle.

_____________
It does fly, Dempsey. States do swap properties to developers and retain mineral rights. It happened in your corner of the world around Flathead Lake.

Ewwwwww! Now I know you would want to lick them! Sorry your not my type, I prefer females!

It is the nonresidents that are the crybabies, they started this whole thing, along with George Taulman. "We want it our way"! To hell with every one else!

quote:

Originally posted by kudu56:
YADA YADA YADA! Nonresidents can lick my nuts. Oh wait, I better not say that Spyro,Gatogordo,Gonhuntin,m16 etc; might do it!

It ain't broke so don't fix it. Whine and cry your hearts out, 25% NR tags in Wy is enough, and 8 times the going rate is fair price. If it changes I can live with it easier than you nonresidents can cope with the current situation.

Kudu or whatever your handle is...

Maybe if you spent as much time worrying about your education, as you do hurling insults and name calling, you'd be able to debate a topic rather than launching into personal attacks because you are unable to intelligently support your position.

I think that your name-calling is pretty much your way of trying to get out of this thread and, in a way, which only you believe, save face.

Now you can spend the next several posting hours trying to figure out how save another $.57 on your next hunt.

SA

Spyro,
I told you what I think you can do! But I won't allow it!!!!


No you are wrong and I am right. No more conversation needs to be addressed. States have rights, the wildlife is the states to manage and use as seen fit. And no matter how much whining and sniveling and crying you and the rest of the nonresidents do, is going to change it. If you want resident status, move. But please stay in Kalifornia and don't come to Wy.

And like I said if they change the law, I can live with it, as killing and hanging a huge buck or bull on my wall isn't that important to me!!!! Oh yeah, lick my nuts!

quote:

Originally posted by kudu56:

I told you what I think you can do! But I won't allow it!!!!

Oh yeah, lick my nuts!

Kudu,

Go express your homoerotic fantasies on a more appropriate message board. There probably is something like www.queerwyomingtrash.com out there for you.

Leave this board to the big boys that can debate a subject w/o the name-calling and tantrums.

SA

You see Spyro, I deal with deviates like you and m16, gatorgado and the rest of the nonresident whiners every day.

You and the rest of the crybabies are pretty much the same as the ones that sue for any and everything that don't go their way.

"He used a gun to kill someone, sue the manufacturers, there was a fly in my soup, sue the resturuants, I broke a nail on your keyboard sue Dell,I can't have a nonresident tag the same as a resident, I will sue every western state, your son looked at my son with and evil eye, sue the parents. Grow up and cope with life, it isn't fair and a warm fuzzy place like you and M16, gatorgado, beleive and desire!

quote:

Leave this board to the big boys that can debate a subject w/o the name-calling and tantrums.

God you make me laugh! Thanks for the memories! You are the type that has to toot his own horn I am sure, go ahead and tell us how great of a hunter you are and how many big elk you have killed. Your a Kalifornian aren't you??????

Kudu.....is that REALLY the best that you can do???? I figured a guy like you could talk better trash than that......you really are a disappointment all the way around!

You are living proof that.......

You can drag an idiot to knowledge.......but you can't make him think!

Now, where was that ignore button....I know it's around here somewhere???

Here is a thought for you guys.

The elk in Utah were wiped out in the late 1800's by market hunters and settlers. In 1918, a group of Utahns paid to transplant a few elk into Utah. These people paid for more transplants over the next 2 decades.

Bighorn sheep were exterminated in Utah by the early 1900's. Utah DWR and private individuals paid to transplant bighorns back into Utah. More transplants are being performed now.

So who would "own" these animals. The federal government, who did not bring these animals back? Or the state and its residents who sacrificed to bring these animals back??

Like I said before, maybe we residents of each state should pay for "grazing" rights of the animals which live within our borders. That would be a lot better than having someone come into our states for a short 1-8 day hunt in which all the person does is take an animal. I hunt out of state 2-3 times a year. I doubt many nonresidents really care about the resource and animals as muchas the residents do.

Sorry to disappoint you Gonhuntin, but my oklahoma blood lines are pretty thin and texan is nonexistent.(thank the good lord) So that is the best trash I can talk. With some practice maybe I can try and do better. As soon as all of these guys get back from Michaels trial and his defense I will be practiced up!


It does not surprise me, as to where the most of the crying is coming from. Ya"all!

If I remember correctly, the crying started when AZ LOST in court.........

What's that I hear......USO headed for Wyoming????? Get ready, your worst nightmare is about to come true!!!

When it's all said and done, you will be lucky if you can still shoot rats while you drink cheap beer on the porch of your doublewide!!!

quote:

Like I said before, maybe we residents of each state should pay for "grazing" rights of the animals which live within our borders. That would be a lot better than having someone come into our states for a short 1-8 day hunt in which all the person does is take an animal. I hunt out of state 2-3 times a year. I doubt many nonresidents really care about the resource and animals as muchas the residents do.

MC, good post.

All of what you said is true and a good point. But it's not the 'whole truth and nothing but the truth' (which is why they ask you that in court ). I'm not knocking what you said and by this, I mean; Did not other organizations outside of the Utah F&G, like RMEF, SCI, Ducks Unlimited, NWTF, etc., etc. not play a part in the ongoing restoration of Utah's wildlife? As a larger picture, dont more Utah No-res' belong to those orgs than all of those that do in Utah? (Now the whole truth on my part is that I'm pissed at the RMEF/wolf issue and have dropped membership but they have done and still do a lot of good. I am rethinking my position).

Elk, turkeys, sheep, etc. have been reintroduced to many states where they were once devoid. Utah is no island in that regard.
Dungbeetle

quote:

If the states want to manage the game of federal land and profit from the game on that land, land that belongs to ALL Americans, then maybe they should have to make some concessions to the PEOPLE.

Gents,


Just as another point of discussion...

Denali National Park is Federal land 'ALL Americans' own yet they have a policy that bans us 'owners' from bringing guns into the Park.

Might point being again that the Feds don't care about sport-hunting. Any attempt to further involve the Feds is a sure way to get everyone screwed.

I've made it obvious as possible that the 'open season for all US citizens on Federal lands' is never going to happen. Also, Federal rules for hunting Federal lands follow State guidelines except that in most cases they are even more restrictive for anyone not living in the immediate area.

That by the way, is exactly the opposite of the pipedream some folks have about hunting Federal land anywhere in the counrty as a resident.

Let may say that again for those not paying attention...

The Feds impose even tighter restrictions on non-residents that the State of Alaska does.

Sure hope I made that clear enough.

Are any of you duck hunters? What do you think would happen if waterfowl management was not Federally regulated?

Canada would have a heck of a duck season and most of the continental U.S. would be screwed. Unfortunately, animals don't know what state borders are and to exclude some sort of coordinated effort is insane. Maybe the FEDs (I never advocated having the feds control management) should not be involved, but why not have a more coordinated effort?

IV

quote:

Canada would have a heck of a duck season and most of the continental U.S. would be screwed. Unfortunately, animals don't know what state borders are and to exclude some sort of coordinated effort is insane. Maybe the FEDs (I never advocated having the feds control management) should not be involved, but why not have a more coordinated effort?

IV, I think Canada and its territories do have a heck of a duck season. Are not our Fed agreements with Canada "understandings"? And if I'm not mistaken, the States set the seasons and limits, within Fed guidelines for species, e.g., Canvasbacks.

I dont think our Feds control anything in Canada, Argentina, etc. but maybe this changed, dunno.

You are correct in the sense that the U.S. feds do not "control" Canada's etc. But my point is that without the collective bargaining power of the feds, states would have far fewer options in how they manage, (not because of federal regulations or oversight, but because of fewer ducks in general.) I just believe that the whole "states rights" issue is often used in areas where it should not be used just because people feel if they "concede" anything to the FEDs that they are "losing" in some respect. Maybe that is a valid caution.....

IV

Kudu, this thread is a real eye opener... I guaran-damn-tee you every one of these whiner's consider's himslef a conservative Republican/Libertarian, yet this issue has them fussing, fuming and acting like a bunch of liberal's who are pro Federal control and for using the courts to get their way... it's all too familiar.

quote:

Kudu, this thread is a real eye opener... I guaran-damn-tee you every one of these whiner's consider's himslef a conservative Republican/Libertarian, yet this issue has them fussing, fuming and acting like a bunch of liberal's who are pro Federal control and for using the courts to get their way... it's all too familiar.

THANK YOU Brad! Finally some one sees the light! You see, I am as fair of a person as there is on the face of the earth. And I honestly have no problem with a 50/50, equal cost for tags on federal land. But these moron cry babies have no clue. IT IS NOT THAT SIMPLE! So in order to have thier way and for USO to fill it's pocket "THEY file a SUIT"!

I am speaking only in Wy. In many,maybe not all but many elk and deer areas, the hunting unit, the land is some forest, some BLM, some private, some county, and some private. Now how in the hell do you manage the game????

These guys have no clue, I gave a true scenario above, you can only issue a certain number of deer, elk and antelope tags in one area, and you can only have a certain kill. The numbers are set so that in a normal year you only kill what the herd can with stand. Like 100 tags, they are already split and set for the entire area not split for private, county, state, and federal. In some areas you would actually see fewer tags and in some you would see more tags availible to NR. DOES ANY ONE UNDERSTAND?? I doubt the Oklatexans do, they just want big horns and antlers and to kill. I see the truck loads of does and fawns they haul home every fall. Then they can go thump on there chest and brag about killing 5 deer with their .338-09 with the 4x16x50 scope. I see it EVERY FALL!

So in closing, again, this change will be easier for me to accept than it is for them to accept the current situation.

And I really don't think it will happen here anyway. And if it does, then when gatorgado, M16, Spyro, Gonhuntin get back from tesitifying on Michaels behalf they can go hunt in a western state the same as a resident!

Dempsey,

Dungbeetle is right. I am watching some great sheep hunting habitat sell where the BLM turned over management to a county here in Colorado. That county will take your bid or mine, don't have to advertise it, can negotiate directly with us, and is doing that as we argue.

Deke.

quote:

Originally posted by Brad:

I guaran-damn-tee you every one of these whiner's consider's himslef a conservative Republican/Libertarian, yet this issue has them fussing, fuming and acting like a bunch of liberal's who are pro Federal control and for using the courts to get their way... it's all too familiar.

What is amusing is how all the Montanans were whining, crying and complaining about all the outfitters locking up all the private propety in SE Montana over the last few years.

Waaa Waaa Big Business is buying all the hunting rights Waaa

What is even MORE AMUSING is how you completely are oblivious to the fact that BIG BUSINESS COMES FIRST is the true Republican way. Taulman is the biggest business in the outfitter world.

Lastly, what makes me giggle even more is how so many alleged republicans are so interested in protecting their state hunting welfare. The Republican way would be to take all the tags and put them on ebay. Not to subsidize the hunting of residents with nonresident money.

SA

quote:

Originally posted by kudu56:

And I really don't think it will happen here anyway. And if it does, then when gatorgado, M16, Spyro, Gonhuntin get back from tesitifying on Michaels behalf they can go hunt in a western state the same as a resident!

Wow with such wit and humor, you must just be just amazingly successful in life.

Anyway, you must be stoked... Its the 15th so you get your government check and cheese today.

SA

quote:

he Republican way would be to take all the tags and put them on ebay. Not to subsidize the hunting of residents with nonresident money.

Spyro,

I'm not sure if either political party meets the needs of hunters. At least neither major party.

Anyhow, I like to think along the lines of the writers of the Constitution and give nearly all power to the States, not the Federal government. So any effort to reverse that proccess tends to make me cringe.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Spyro Andes:

When the non-resident stops footing the bill for these states' wildlife management... Who is going to be the next sucker to keep them wallowing in cash.

Spyro Andes, I let you in on alittle secret you really must think your dollar is all than important it's not to the fish and game. The money that the non resident brings into the state thats what counts and that is where the pull comes in. There isn't too many resident who wouldn't gladly pay a higher fee which includes me to hunt in my home and do away with the non resident tag. It's funny how concerned you get to hunt in other states when you have elk in Calif do you consider that draw unfair? Calif charges a non resident appr 10x more than a resident. You have a draw suystem in Calif on deer limited hunting in certain zones may not get drawn every year let us all know how you feel about Calif system? Does a non resident get treated any different on those draws?
Calif has alot of national forest land I think alot more than we do here. What is the percentage of non resident fee's that support Calif fish and game? Is it fair that a resident in Calif can hunt elk and I cann't as a non resident. I guess Calif figures they own the elk in the state. Seems to me your home state has more restriction on non resident hunting then we do here but you call us unfair. That a pot calling the kettle black in my book!

This is good! Again, all I can speak for is Alaska and like BW said, the feds are tough on AK. residents hunting on federal land, let alone non-residents. I hope this mess that was started by USO stays in the lower 48. We have a big enough mess with our subsistence laws. I must agree with whoever said that most residents would probably deal with much larger costs than having non-residents hunt. We live in a state that protects subsistence rights first. If the population drops, guess who is the first to go? Non-residents-that is the way it should be. I live in a rural town, so I have "special" rights to hunt on federal land. There are other places in Alaska that I can't hunt on federal land. It is dictated by where you live and if your town/village qualifies to hunt subsistencely. That is the way it is. I can bitch and moan all I want, but it isn't going to change. Subsistence is what rules Alaska.

As for non-resident moose hunters, I have seen them come and go. I am sure there are many that do a good job, but the majority of the ones I have seen are up here for a set of antlers and nothing more. Most Alaskans are out there for the meat. Don't get me wrong, I love big moose and shoot plenty of them, but I work my ass off to get them. I think many non-residents come up and really have no idea how large a moose is and can't get all the meat out or even leave the meat on purpose. That is my primary reason for requiring them to have a guide. I also hate having to compete with them, when I am out to secure meat. Call me selfish or whatever you like, but that is how I feel. I shouldn't be able to walk into someone elses state and have the same opportunity as they do. It just isn't right. I guess when you all figure out the federal land thing, let me know. It NEVER see Alaska changing its rules on federal land. We can thank (NOT) Jimmy Carter for that. I hope that all states fight to the 10% non-resident to 90% resident.

Kudu 56-what a hoot man!

I won't hunt with a guide, as I like to discover and explore on my own. A guide ruins the fun for me. The harvest is important, but not nearly the most important part of the hunt. I like to hunt federal land in most cases, and without a guide. I don't hunt in Wyoming anymore because of that. Canada either. Non-res tags are expensive, but usually only a small part of the hunt, so that's not a big deal for me.
In Minnesota, black bear tags and doe deer tags are by drawing (buck tags are unlimited) and residents and non-res are all put in the "pot", with equal chances for all. Moose are reserved for residents and the once-in-a-lifetime hunts are hard to draw to. I've been applying since 1975 and never have drawn a moose tag (its a conspiracy, I tell ya ).
In general, the states do a good job of dividing up tags.
States should make those decisions and manage the game within their borders. Of course, we sometimes run into the Endangered Species Act.

Kudu=

Northway, why not just say you don't like non-resident hunters. Quit beating around the bush.

I hunted Alaska and donated the meat to the locals in Bettles, and they appreciated it. They did not have to pay for a plain ride to the Arctic Circle to hunt the Caribou themselves. It is a two way street there. I got what I went for and they got the meat.

You talk about competing with non-resident hunters, hell I did not see another hunter for 10 days, how is that competing?

I meet a lot of Alaskan hunters and they do not share your views what so ever. I plan another hunt in Alaska next year. Hopefully I don't encounter people that share your point of view. I am sure I won't.

I just wish the resident vs non-resident bull shit stops. It is a cancer in our sport that needs to be removed.

quote:

Originally posted by Redhawk1:

I just wish the resident vs non-resident bull shit stops. It is a cancer in our sport that needs to be removed.

Damn straight!

Idaho "The liberal federalist because he dares not follow the herd in every single instance" Vandal

quote:

Originally posted by Redhawk1:
Northway, why not just say you don't like non-resident hunters. Quit beating around the bush.

I hunted Alaska and donated the meat to the locals in Bettles, and they appreciated it. They did not have to pay for a plain ride to the Arctic Circle to hunt the Caribou themselves. It is a two way street there. I got what I went for and they got the meat.

You talk about competing with non-resident hunters, hell I did not see another hunter for 10 days, how is that competing?

I meet a lot of Alaskan hunters and they do not share your views what so ever. I plan another hunt in Alaska next year. Hopefully I don't encounter people that share your point of view. I am sure I won't.

I just wish the resident vs non-resident bull shit stops. It is a cancer in our sport that needs to be removed.

Your right this has got to stop but on who's term. You support the state of Alaska and their laws your home state plus I think you said another state that you buy tags in to hunt deer. You don't want to hunt the western states because of the cost of tags and the draw I can understand that. You could of just saved alot of time and just said that.

quote:

I am watching some great sheep hunting habitat sell where the BLM turned over management to a county here in Colorado. That county will take your bid or mine, don't have to advertise it, can negotiate directly with us, and is doing that as we argue.

And, Deke? Dont that just give you the F'n red ass all the way up to the back of your neck? It does to me. This "movement" you just mentioned is a little like cancer in that you dont see or notice it until it's all too late. Many hunters and outdoors sports persons are totally unaware that this is a work in progress and it is nationwide. But, that's a whole nuther subject and thread.

quote:

I like to hunt federal land in most cases, and without a guide. I don't hunt in Wyoming anymore because of that. Canada either. Non-res tags are expensive, but usually only

Uhhh, boreal?
I think you're missing something here. Possibly something big. There's a gazillion acres in Wy that you can hunt as a non-res and it's Federal Land I'm speaking of. You only need a Guide for hunting declared "wilderness areas". You can backpack, hike, birdwatch, fish, have sex with your girlfriend, etc. in a "wilderness area" but you do need a guide to hunt there.

All other Federal lands are open provided you draw a tag. So, you might want to reconsider, possibly? Just look what you've been missing for all of this time with that assumption you made.
Dungbeetle

quote:

Wow with such wit and humor, you must just be just amazingly successful in life.


Anyway, you must be stoked... Its the 15th so you get your government check and cheese today.



SA

Is that all the better you can do?



Spyro:
I have done well and won't have to work past my 55th birthday, but not due to your social programs that you support. It is due to a four letter word that you are unfamilair with, it's called W-O-R-K! But I might take a look at them and take advatage of them just to piss dip shits like you off!

I don't like the wilderness law either, it is discriminatory as far as I am concerned, just like Dunbeetle says! That law is involved in a law suit also.

quote:

That law is involved in a law suit also.

Is that the one that's outstanding and filed by the lawyer/hunter from Florida? Previous challenges on this issue failed and Wyoming's law on it was upheld but I think he (like Taulman did) may have found another angle of approach.

Yes that is the one, I am not sure of what angle he is using. I hope he wins that one, it is pretty much protection for the outfitters and I can not believe it still stands,.

And believe it or not the guy is from Wyoming and lives in Florida. That is what I have heard.

"You can backpack, hike, birdwatch, fish, have sex with your girlfriend, etc. in a "wilderness area" but you do need a guide to hunt there."

Actually, you can hunt there without a guide as well, Just as you can be a nonresident in any state and hunt anything you want without a guide, as I sometimes do. the only restiction is that you don't shoot something, which, to me, as time goes on, has become a very very small part of the hunt anyway as compared to locating animals and watching them and enjoying them for what they are.

Yea, I will shoot my deer in my home state. But I will also go back to both Montana and Wyoming to hunt Bighorns whenever I want to, and also maybe take a trip up to Alaska and hunt sheep and goats and maybe even a brown bear without the need for a guide, and probably enjoy it just as much (and maybe even more) than if I were shooting something.

quote:

I am not sure of what angle he is using

I seem to recall that was filed on a "discrimination" basis (compared to, say, Montana, Idaho, etc. not having such a law) but not totally sure. In Wyoming, Outfitters rule and have for a long time.

“As for non-resident moose hunters, I have seen them come and go. I am sure there are many that do a good job, but the majority of the ones I have seen are up here for a set of antlers and nothing more.â€

Northway: You need to check out your state hunting regulations as they apply to non-residents. I do not know if it true for the area you hunt but in the areas I have checked out non-residents are required by State Regulation to take a moose with either four brow-tines on one side or have a spread of I think 54â€. It is also state law that all editable meat must be removed from the kill site before the trophy is removed from the kill site. It is also a serious infraction to waste any editable meat.

I do not desire to have a large moose rack as Moose antlers just do not do anything for me. I will take a nice Elk rack any time. My buddy is trying to talk me into going Moose hunting sometime. If I go I would prefer to shoot a good meat bull but I don’t think that I legally can under current regulations. I am not complaining as I am a firm believer of the old adage of if you don’t like their rules then don’t play in their court.

Just my 2 cents worth.

quote:

Actually, you can hunt there without a guide as well, Just as you can be a nonresident in any state and hunt anything you want without a guide, as I sometimes do. the only restiction is that you don't shoot something, which, to me, as time goes on, has become a very very small part of the hunt anyway as compared to locating animals and watching them and enjoying them for what they are.

Yea, I will shoot my deer in my home state. But I will also go back to both Montana and Wyoming to hunt Bighorns whenever I want to, and also maybe take a trip up to Alaska and hunt sheep and goats and maybe even a brown bear without the need for a guide, and probably enjoy it just as much (and maybe even more) than if I were shooting something

You're correct and you are legal in all that you say and for the states that you mention as you fall under the "birdwatcher/hiker" categories.

Now, wandering around alone (as a non-res) in Dall Ram country and carrying a .257 Whtby mag with you might cause you some problems were you stopped, checked and questioned. Camera and spotting scope, w/handgun or shotgun - no problems.