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Hot Core: I wanted to hear the good and the bad, not useless posts that contribute neither good nor bad as in "I read articles and not writers" is,aside from contributing nothing, is rather stupid. Catboat: This post was and is intended to dove tail with the other thread I posted regarding Ross. Specifically, if the overwhelming majority of posters here (about 90%)think his advice is good, then logic follows that his recommended shot placement on game should be treated as a valid piece of advice. You are right though it's not a hard concept to grasp. jorge Edited by jorge. On reflection, I'm just not going to get into it by trying to explain the obvious. USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Hey jorge, I understand. Threads do have a way of going sideways on occasion, but occasionally when they do, I learn something I'd never considered. Like the 243Win for Elk Thread. It never crossed my mind that anyone would conside using a 243Win on Elk, but apparently some folks have and did OK. But, this is skewing your thread more, so I'll stop. | |||
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Hey jorge,if you need any advice on hunting ask me I'll tell ya.You won't have to pay man,it will be a pleasure. | |||
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I'm going to be fine, all I have to do is get some more exercise and loose some weight. I still can fly and well my Flight Surgeon caught it early so I am a few legs up on it. What I told my doc is that I will loose some weight and in three or four months get retested and go from there. What I have is what a lot of Americans have, Type2 Dietbetes. My blood sugar is high but not excessivly so. Diet and Exercise should do the trick, if not then there is other things that can be done. As Gilda Radner would say "Its always something" | |||
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** Ross is one of the best ** He was a personal friend and confidant of Elmer Keith , -- during a time when he , ( Ross ) , was already an established writer . The heaviest gun writer , that I've ever known personally , -- George Bredsten , ( used to be Lead Firearms Instructor w/ U.S. Custom' Training Facility ) -- Thought highly of him . He is not afraid to spend time and space on unpopular cartridges , -- if he thinks they have potential handloaded , etc . . I think , currently , he is the best . ------------ MMCOUGAR . NRA Benefactor Member ---- 2nd Amend. -- They could have said , " The Right of Such a Militia " ; ----- But they didn't , they said " . . . . . The right of the PEOPLE " . | |||
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Lost his credability with me with his barrel break-in article of around twenty years ago. After his feet were put to the fire by readers, many readers, by way of letters to the editor, Mr. Seyfried confessed the fact that his barrel break-in article was based on opinion and was not proven or scientific. Many still use the shoot and clean, shoot and clean method to break in a barrel thanks to Seyfried. Guess he thought that because he wrote it, shooters would take it as gospel. It was just BS to meet a deadline, he was caught and could not back up his clains. Pretty much just said it sounded good at the time. JMHO, GeoW | |||
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I am wary about getting in this as I know it is always unwise to get between a true believer and his beliefs but here goes. For many years I was an avid Ross reader but, like gsears' comments above, I also found many articles where Ross switched 180 degrees, sometimes in only a few months time. We all learn over time but anyone who preaches and claims to know all the secrets and then does an about face looses credability in my opinion. There were also many articles where he speculated on things but presented them as fact. Like one where he claimed the stress relief cuts on English rifles were there primarily in order to catch dirt. Ross can be a great source of knowledge on guns and I and all the other writers at Wolfe Publishing miss his knowledge and expertise but no one knows everything about guns and hunting. And as Forrest Gump said "that is all I have to say on the subject" Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Phil, coming from a gent with your reputation, it certainly gives one food for thought in that none of us are infallible. Having said that, this "poll" goes hand in glove with another post (probably on page 2 or 3 by now) concerning his recommendations on shoulder shots. Your opinion on that issue would be most welcome. jorge USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Ross is fairly knowledgable but he also doesn't mind telling you so. I've read other writers whose findings I consider to be more credible.  | |||
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*** TRUTH IS TRUTH *** --- Truth , facts , and scientific method , is all that counts . --- They ain't no respecters of a writers fame or personality . If I read bullshit , a time or two ; -- then , -- I don't know if half the stuff he writes is BS . -- So from then on , I take everything he writes with a grain of salt . Seems like most everything I've read by Ross I pretty much agree with , -- but then , I doubt I've read 3% of all he's laid pen too . Over years , I agreed with Elmer K. about 95% , I figure , and I read a lot of his stuff . I really liked Jack O'Conner too , and detected very little error . -- But most of all , I liked his writing style . A year or so ago , I read Boddington admit to screwing up TWICE , big-time , on a single hunt . That impressed me , -- I liked his honestly . But , no , -- I'm glad to hear of Phil Shoemaker's observations . Best Regards , ------- MMCOUGAR . NRA Benefactor Member ---- 2nd Amend. -- They could have said , " The Right of Such a Militia " ; ----- But they didn't , they said " . . . . . The right of the PEOPLE " . | |||
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I've only read his articles in handloader and rifle and was unaware of his competition record. I like his writing about old stuff, obviously no advertising bias there. I quit buying those mags when he left them. I blame him for my .72 muzzleloader. His articles about 12 guage roundball rifles motivated me to put it together and it's become an obsession. | |||
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Ross Seyfried seems like a very bright guy who really knows his stuff. But like Phil Shoemaker I notice he makes these 180 degree changes in opinion almost overnight. That leads me to believe he does it either to create controversy or else to toy with both his editors and his readers to see what he can get away with. VBR, Ted Gorsline | |||
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It would be interesting to hear some of the "180 degree" shifts. I don't read the mags much lately and have not had the benifit of same. "The liberty enjoyed by the people of these states of worshiping Almighty God agreeably to their conscience, is not only among the choicest of their blessings, but also of their rights." ~George Washington - 1789 | |||
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Hello Not only is Ross very knowledgeable but he is an extremely helpful person. I have called him a couple of times to discuss loads for my Martini Henry 450-577, a .577 Snider and a .450 Black Power Express. He has taken my calls and was very helpful and gracious and gave me good advice. There is no one who knows everything about a particular caliber or firearm, we as intelligent consumers should know that and always confirm unusual data by using a number of sources. Regards Aziz  | |||
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Interesting that Mr. Shoemaker replied. Ross wrote something negative about bears and 458's shortly after you wrote your 458 article. Shortly after that, Ross was gone. I emailed John Barsness about it and he wouldn't come out directly and say anything (to his credit). I've talked to Ross a couple of times on the phone. The first time he was great. The second time not so much. That's fine. I miss some of his writing. As to barrel cleaning, I only remember him saying that you didn't need to break in barrels like that or spend a lot of time on load development. I do admire a guy that won the world championship before the space guns came into being...time as a PH...expert shot with pistol, revolver, shotgun, rifle and now blackpower. I give him a lot of credit for that. Pompous? Probably but he's earned his stripes too. _______________________________  | |||
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Lighten up Jorge. This reply to Hotcore is not like you at all. At all. Your post subject is not a mandate nor is it a 'directive', Hombre. Some good stuff has come from it. In the the spirit of the good and bad that you mention and want,,, your post was bad. I like Ross and dearly miss Finn. Sit back and enjoy. DB | |||
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The story I heard is that there is a gun witer at Rifle/Handloader who has stipulated in his contract that he will not be contradicted in print. Apparently something that Ross wrote contradicted a position that the other writer had taken previously. He made an issue out of it and Ross either quit or was sent packing. I can't recall the name of the other writer... Dick something. As a lover of old English black powder rifles, I appreciated Ross' interest, research, and writings. Regards, Brian  Meet "Beauty" - 66 cal., 417 grn patched roundball over 170 grns FFg = ~1950 fps of pure fun! "Scotch Whisky is made from barley and the morning dew on angel's nipples." - Warren Ellis NRA Life Member | |||
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Still waiting on some of those "180 degree shifts"??? "The liberty enjoyed by the people of these states of worshiping Almighty God agreeably to their conscience, is not only among the choicest of their blessings, but also of their rights." ~George Washington - 1789 | |||
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Not quite the story I heard... | |||
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Ross Seyfried is one of my favorites authors he and Boddington ,anh hes the most complete of all because he huned and used the 3 guns ,i still remember how excited i get when i read his article about hunting cape buffalo with a revolver ,hes a world ipsc champion ,aPH and a soprtman ,i adimre him and he contribuited a lot for my hunting career .Juan www.huntinginargentina.com.ar FULL PROFESSIONAL MEMBER OF IPHA INTERNATIONAL PROFESSIONAL HUNTERS ASOCIATION . DSC PROFESSIONAL MEMBER DRSS--SCI NRA IDPA IPSC-FAT -argentine shooting federation cred number2- | |||
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Dungbettel" My reply was not aimed at Hot Core at all, even though I've had soem donnybrooks with him. IT was aimed at another poster on the first page who calimed "he only read articles" or some such nonsense. I found the reply quite idiotic and felt compelled to reply. Take care, jorge USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Dear Fury01, You will have to wait until May. I have no American gun magazines but in May I go shooting with a German doctor. He has subscriptions to many. I was at his house last year skimming dozens of them when I noticed an article by Ross Seyfried saying one thing and the another story about the same subject in another magazine saying much the opposite. Even so I have to admit he is the most intertesting gun writer to read and likely the brightest and best in the field. In a field known for alot of double X chromosomes he likely has an X and a Y. I once took some safaris for TAWICO in the old days and ended up in the camp of Cotton Gordon who was a very helpful to me. He let me use his camp at Fort Ikoma. There I hunted with an African named Edwin "motormouth" Malecko from Tawico. He said he had been with Seyfried on a couple of safaris. I think he worked for Cotton Gordon. VBR, Ted Gorsline | |||
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Ted, Thanks for the reply. I will wait. I noticed the same comment from others and I will wait on them as well. I have not personally seen said 180's from Ross and I would be suprised to see such things but don't deny they certainly could exist. I just would like to see them myself you know how it is. I have seen Ross move from writing about mostly about medium bores and big bores to suggesting that most folks would be better off with a 270 or a 280 but that is not a 180 shift. It is a man getting older and wiser and calcium in his shoulder I would bet. I would also bet he can still shoot his 416 Rigby rather well. And his Pachmyer 1911, and his 4 bore, and his 340 Weatherby and his 475 Linbaugh you get my drift. Extremly doubful that there are many here or elsewhere that could hold forth either in performance of actual shooting or discourse on same with Ross. I certainly could not. regards, fury01 "The liberty enjoyed by the people of these states of worshiping Almighty God agreeably to their conscience, is not only among the choicest of their blessings, but also of their rights." ~George Washington - 1789 | |||
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Jorge, Jorge, Jorge! man you made laugh. Chik yur spellin, bro! F-16's are damnedddd complicated tools! Dont scramble or fly for 2 days! Thanks, Bud.  | |||
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As I recall when Ross decided that he longer believed that barrel break in was needed was after he shot a rifle with no break in and it shot beautifuly,and he no longer thought it to be nessacery. The smaller caliber trend is with the better bullet such as a failsafe ( his favorite ) made smaller calibers viable. I think that Ross provides a great source of information.Yes he had some problems with Wolfe so what.I know of no other writer that has more or as much useful information about hunting as wide of a variety of game with such a variety of firearms. _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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I have no strong opinions about Ross, one way or the other. As someone else mentioned, most of his subjects held no interest for me, so I paid him little attention. Of what I did read, I'd call his knowledge "good," and his writing "bad." I recall one article about the shortcomings of the 458 Win in which I could find no shortcomings at all. He assumed, I presume, his readers already knew what he had previously written. I read that article three times looking for something I missed. I, too, stopped buying Rifle and Handloader after he left, but it wasn't due to his departure. The magazines dumbed down significantly to broaden their appeal. I suspect plans to do so had something to do with the publisher's determination that they could dispense with his writing. Jaywalker | |||
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You assume too much Jorge. Ross is a good source of knowledge, but I reserve the right to disagree with any gunwriter. A couple of my favorites are Wayne VanZwoll and Ken Waters. I also get a kick out of Dave Scovill sometimes. I think that some gunwriters are scrutinized too heavily sometimes, placed under the microscope if you will. Their writs should be taken at face value, after all, they are just people like the rest of us. They get subconsiously compared to Elmer and Jack and lord knows thats a tough act to follow. Some are falsley revered as gun gods and others are unfairly compared to such a stigma. Some writers seem to get caught up in this cat and mouse game while others dont appear to be greatly bothered about it, Ross is one that does. Thats why I agree that the content is more important than the writer, take what is worthwhile and forget the rest. | |||
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I think you misunderstood my post that was in conjuction with a poll. The intent wasn't to take EVERYTHING Seyfried, or any author for that matter as gospel, but rather a specific tactic, that according to Ross and 90% of the folks polled here, agreed that the "shoulder" shot, which is also a misnomer, was the preferred shot to take. Nothing to do with taking Seyfried as the burning bush on everything. jorge USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Dear Jorge, If you asked 1,000 people 200 years ago, "what shape is the earth?" all 1,000 would have said it is flat as that was the fashion. But it doesn't mean that it is true. VBR, Ted Gorsline | |||
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I'm in the Seyfried fan club. Ross has taken the time to send written responses to questions I posted to him by letter. We've discussed the .256 Mannlicher, and the .450 NE. I have enjoyed most of his writing, and especially some of the pieces he wrote for Blackpowder Hunting magazine. I think he is about the only really warm-blooded gun writer out there, as he truly has a passion for fine old arms that he is able to share with readers. As far as the BS meter goes, I don't pay much attention to it, and if someone's changed their minds about things a few times, no sweat either. If you had asked me what firearms I thought important and intriguing when I was 25 years old, compared to today at age 53, the lists wouldn't match. I'll certainly cut such an experienced hunt, shooter and collector as Ross the same slack. Can someone actually hold a strong opinion about a guy because of an article on barrel break in written during the Carter administration? Geez! There is hope, even when your brain tells you there isn’t. – John Green, author | |||
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TEd: Actually you are about 200 years off your mark. By 1800 (200 years ago) the "flat earth" theory was pretty much out of vogue. Having said that, what in the Sam Hill is your point? Ross' point about shot placement is by all accounts and in my personal experience the way to go. So again I ask, what are you trying to say? jorge USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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I think the good(s) have it. It was interesting to see that 5% of voters were contrary. You can't please all of ........ Copula ergo sum | |||
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Dear Jorge, I am saying a consensus does not mean something is true. I have already given my opinion on the shoulder shot and will stick to it. I have to confess I am not up on the exact date round earthists began to outnumber flat earthists. You may be correct on that point. Its not a subject that haunts me. I think from your photo you must fly a fighter plane or be interested in the subject. If so punch Hans Ulrich Rudel into Yahoo and see what you come up with. VBR, Ted Gorsline | |||
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Oh, ok, got it. Well, the concensus here happens to be right. Don't remember what you said about it, but if it wasn't the shoulder, we're at odds. What on earth do I need to "punch up" Rudel for? I know exactly who he was and flew. Put him in the "attack pilot" crowd and the best one at that. The Fuhrere gave him a "one of a kind" Iron Cross with diamonds. Over 500 tank kills. Lost a leg and survived the war. He was also an avowed Nazi to the very end. On my photo, it's a T-2 Jet trainer when I was Chief Of Staff for Training Air Wing Six (Navy) back in 01. We trained Luftwaffe guys there too. jorge USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Dear Jorge, My father's cousin Sam Gorsline was a US Navy pilot and in 1969 he was captain of the Coral Sea for about a year. I haven't seen him since I was about five years old and don't even know if he is still alive. VBR, Ted Gorsline | |||
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Ted: If you want to "PM" me with more particulars (like if he was a Naval Academy Graduate fo example) I can find out some info for you. jorge USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Dear Fury 01, As promised. I visited my friend who collects American gun magazines. He only had two magazines left with articles in them by Ross Seyfried. One was about paper patch bullets and the other was a 458 bashing story. They were not comparable so I could not find an example of a 180 degree turn in argument as I mentioned earlier because I had apples (paper patch bullets) to compare to oranges (458 ballistics). But I am familiar with the 458. So I read the story and found gross inaccuracies. I quote Seyfried "...if you are going to Africa a 458 is an equally bad idea. If you are hunting elephant, it might be viable, but there are better choices......You might be interested to know that again "polls" aside (here is he is bashing Craig Boddington's poll of rifles used by PHs most of whom used 458s) most elephants killed on control, in Africa are not killed with .458s or 416s or even 375s. They are shot with 7.62 NATO ball. It is ladies and gentleman, a question of precision." In fact, ladies and gentlemen, it is not at all a question of precision at all. Ross Seyfried's information is dead wrong. The reason the 7.62 NATO ball was used, was because of of magazine capacity of the FN FAL rifle and it abuility to penetrate the skulls on cow and baby elephants. I once had lunch with Clem Coetsee, who has shot more elephant on culls than anyone else. He explained that he used the FN FAL 308 on cow and calves because it would penetrate through their small heads (many elephants killed on culls are confused little babies weighing just a few hundred pounds) And the FN rifle he used had the magazine capacity to kill many in a hurry. Clem told me he used an FN 458 on bulls because their skulls were too big and thick and the pointed 308 BALL ammo gave unreliable penetration on bulls. Since then I see where Ganyana says Clem now favours another big bore for bulls and another semi-auto military calibre for cows and calves. But for the same reasons. Ross Seyfried is one of the best gun writers there is but he is not perfect. He has his off days too. Deadlines make you punchy. This is a good example of wrong information. | |||
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I'm just hard headed enough that I have never found anyone I couldn't find some point to argue about. Well except for Clem Coetsee, when he spoke I listened and kept my mouth shut. As far as Ross goes, I have found a very few things he and I differ on but I do admit there is a small possibility he could be right on them.  465H&H | |||
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I am trying to figure out what was the inaccuracy of Ross's statements?? _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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