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I see the 185 grain Barnes (BC=432) listed by Hodgdon's with CFE223 (50 1/2 grains) yields 46,200 PSI and 2624 feet/second..... It is not listed as compressed so I assume one can try to load t to 62,000 PSI.....or there abouts. My question.....assuming this is chambered in a M-70 fully capable of handling 65,000 PSI.....what velocity can be achieved with the .338 Federal and 185 grain Barnes bullets? Good candidates for powder are Bl(C)-2, win 748, CFE223, H-380.....maybe even UMR-3031 /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | ||
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Would RL-16 work in the Federal? 65,000psi would probably achieve 2800fps. Better slayer out to 300 yards than the 30-06 imo. | |||
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Caliber to think about shooting when I get into elder years. | |||
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ar corey, with 1128 posts, I just wonder if any of them contained any substance? /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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Putting in for Saskatchewan draw moose with my brother. 338 Federal would make an excellent round for the 100 yard distances. | |||
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Barnes Vortex 185 | |||
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Almost as good as the 8X57 at 100, but the 8x57 would give you another 150yds. GOOGLE HOTLINK FIX FOR BLOCKED PHOTOBUCKET IMAGES https://chrome.google.com/webs...inkfix=1516144253810 | |||
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The lightest Speer bullet listed here, a 200 grainer, produces 2700+ at the muzzle, so I imagine that a 185-grainer would be much faster: https://www.speer-ammo.com/dow.../338_Federal_200.pdf | |||
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Thanks Ray.... It's beginning to look like 2,800 isn't out of the realm of possibilities. /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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Is there any reason for not trying the Barnes .33-caliber 160-grain TTSX? Is a much lighter bullet, but should fly fast enough. https://www.loaddata.com/Cartr...al-Hodgdon-Data/3527 | |||
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I think you can get close! I have data for 2750 fps X-terminator, 2770 fps TAC, and 2790 FPS AAC-2230. Send me a PM with email and I'll send some files. | |||
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PM sent /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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For a deer bullet it makes a lot of sense.....and even for cow elk which is my target, it's a fine selection.....that said the 185 retains a lot more energy with it's extra weight and higher BC...,but I'm a big Hodgdon's fan and their loadings don't show a lot of good results with the 185 grain....if it can reach 2800 or even close to it, t's a fair better bullet at the extended ranges.....and that's been my experience so far.....of the four elk I've killed, the closest one was 250 yards, the fartherest one was 375 yards. /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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h335/tac will be powders of choice you are finding the inherent limits, and why it wasn't done in 1959 - the 338 bullets arent designed for these low impact speeds ... now, a 311 (i built one.. on acccident) or a 328 make GREAT sense, as those bullets are designed for resulting impact vels ... how did i build a 311 on accident? sarco has "really, we swear" turned down 1917 barrels in 308 for dirt cheap (iirc, 35 bucks) and I have a mexican mauser action, stock, trigger, scope and mounts, and borrowed a 308 reamer... it came together as a really LIGHT and cute truck gun ... and shot 3" 5 shot groups at 50 yards .. now, groups is kind, as it looked more like diamond plate from EVERY bullet hitting keyholed ... which, btw, actually DID hit hogs REALLY hard (sight in on the WAY to a hunt) as i was thinking that it was clearly a case of oversized barrels, and i had some .311 nagant bullets (pulled from the 440 tin can 7.62x54r.. NOT hunting bullets) ... well, i made up 20 rounds, went to the range and it shot very well .. okay, .311/312 bullets it was, carried it for some time.. then replaced barrel with .358 .. it's light, it's tiny, and it shoots well jeffe opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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Vapor, email has been sent. Jeffe , the bullet being discussed was developed for the .338 Fed. I imagine it works well at the speeds the cartridge produces. I hear your argument a lot and while I don't think it's untrue, I don't think it's entirely factual. I don't have a .338 Fed, just a .338-06 and people often use the same argument when discussing bullets for it as well. In my limited testing I haven't found a bullet that I couldn't use. Probably the bullet with the least expansion I had was a 215 grain Sierra out of the light bullets. I finally settled on the 200 grain Hornady SP because it printed the smallest groups at nearly 2900 FPS. I also had a 2800 FPS load with the 210 NPT that was a close second, and would have been my elk load. As long as I stuck to pretty much cup-n-core bullets I found respectable expansion even up to 250 grain bullets in my .338-06. | |||
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I don't get using light for caliber bullets. If you want to shoot a 180 gr bullet or even a 165, get a .308. If I had a .338 Federal, I would shoot 225 grain bullets. It wouldn't be a long range rifle, but in a short bbl rifle like a Rem 7, hard to imagine a better whitetail rifle for northern MN. | |||
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The small .308 case works very well with bullets under 185 grains. The .338-06 works as well with bullets up to the 210-grainer. However, it does not mean that one could not load the heavier .33-caliber bullets on both for shorter-range distances. For my .338WM rifles I have settle on a lighter bullet, the .225-grain TTSX, for all my hunting in Alaska. Yes, the .338WM does quite well with 250-grain Partition or A-Frame bullets, even a 275-grainer, but the 225-grain TTSX works for me. Lets say that I want to hunt smaller animals such as deer and pronghorn. In this case there is nothing wrong with a 180-grain Partition for long shots. A wide range of bullet weights gives you more options without having to switch to another rifle. Not too long ago we didn't have such options. That said, a .338-Federal factory load with a 210-grain bullet (look at the federal website for details) does over 2600 fps at the muscle, and still 2000fps at 200 yards. | |||
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The Barnes 185 TTSX IS 1.349" and a Hornady 225 grain Interlock is 1.405" and are very close in BC. So that means the 185 that'll average 300+ FPS faster will hit with almost identical energy as the Hornady bullet out to 400 yards. It'll also get there with a flatter trajectory and a lot less felt recoil. I don't think you'll gain any advantage using a 225 grain bullet on your MN deer. | |||
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I agree with the light bullets comment. And... If you want a toned down .338, why not just buy a 338 Win Mag and load it slower. At least then, you can get more velocity out of it when you want. | |||
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For a lot of people it is not that simple. For many years shooters and hunters had been experimenting with wildcats, in this case the former .338-08, now .338 Federal. The same for the .338-06, and a great number of other wildcats. I like the .375H&H, but my all around cartridge is the .338WM. That said, I would not mind at all having a .338 Federal or .338-06, and this has nothing to do with recoil. Federal used to load a .338-caliber 180-grain Partition bullet. The load produced around 3100fps, and was designed for long range shots on smaller animals such as deer and pronghorn. Out at 500 yards the bullet would drop perhaps 1-1/2" below the same bullet shot out of a .300WM. In this case I could use my favorite .338. The greater number of bullet weights of today just broadens the ballistics horizon of your favorite gun. Bullet construction technology has improved quite fast in recent years, and it seems that monolithic bullets of lighter weights still perform quite well at longer ranges. You still have the choice to use one load for your gun, of course. | |||
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I don't.....I have a M-70 standard short action, that's the base line.....it would be a different story If I had nothing to start with but my choices are 7-08, .308 win, and .338 Federal.....after reading many posts on this cartridge, I'm becoming quite impressed with it. It's a fairly good big game round /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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It isn't all that efficient to load down a .338 WM either, to get down to .338 Fed velocities you still have to use 10-15 more grains of powder on average.
You got more choices than that, we can get creative! There is .300 Savage .358 Win, and .284 Win that'll fit in that action easily as well. If you go with a wildcat you have a lot more options as well if you want. | |||
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Never thought of that one.....hhhhhmmmmmmmmmmm /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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The idea of "heavy for caliber".....or even "light for caliber" made good sense when we used standard cup and core bullets or even bonded bullets containing lead. Much of the bullet was lost in the process of penetration of the tissues so we use heavier bullets to assure enough penetration to provide for quick and humane klls. However, to some degree this changes when we decide to use monometal bullets.....a lighter bullet now will achieve the desired penetraton of a previously used bullet composed mostly of lead and heavier weight.....this is a positive for such things as the .338 Federal and also for the even larger .338-06. This positive also applies to the .308 Winchester as 180 grain bullets (and larger) in that case must be seated in such a manner as to rob it of case capacity. I have been advised by a great many users of the Barnes bullets to use a lighter bullet as equivalent to the heavier leaded bullets I normally would use. Last year, a 180 grain accubond (.308 caliber)that I removed from my elk actually weighed 61 grains less than it's original weight.....this is not expected to be the case wth monometals. Again.....a decided boost for smaller case cartridges. /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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338 Federal can reach out. Bryan Litz tested the 200 Accubond at .461 BC. It can be driven 2600-2650 from my 22" barrel. I would say it's probably the optimal bullet for the 338 Federal if you don't mind using lead bullets. I know Vapodog likes lead free so the 185 TSX is a solid choice. | |||
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More than that....it's required on the ranch I hunt for elk....it's not a choice...but as long as I'm going that direction, I've decided to go that way with all my big game hunts. /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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I only bought one box of 185 TTSX but I did use it on a 170lb boar. It was quartering too and I drilled him on the shoulder at 50 yards. Shocker, he dropped dead immediately and the bullet exited. I killed a nice low fenced Axis and Blackbuck using .338 Nosler Ballistic Tips. The last 2 years, I've been hunting with a 308 Tikka CTR I bought so the 338 hasn't seen much action. | |||
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hell man, at that distance you could have klled hm with a Red Ryder BB gun.....or at least poked his eye out.....  /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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Wellll your trying to make a 338 Win. out of a 338 FEderal, why is that? It would be practical to put less powder in a 338 win. case to duplicate a 338 Federal..Todays wildcatters at work!  Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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