I think that the 338 with the bullets it can shoot that it is an all round gun for game in the lower 48 states. Any coments.

I think that the 338 is an ample rifle for all of the North American Continent. But since you mention bullet choice compare the bullet choices on let say a Sierra or Hornady Website against a 30 caliber. Still a very ample weapon and with much higher BC’s but in the end the final choice is yours.

quote:

Originally posted by jro45:
I think that the 338 with the bullets it can shoot that it is an all round gun for game in the lower 48 states. Any coments.

Not a lot of information to go on. A .338 WM will handle anything you want in the lower 48 and Alaska too for that matter. I've had one for thirty years and I can't imagine not having one. Is it necessary? No, having said that and assuming you are talking about an all purpose rifle, there isn't anything you can't hunt with a 180 gr. 30-06.

Bullets is an entirely different matter and it would take up more room than we've got here but it all comes down to your priorities. In my case, my main interest is terminal performance and is why I generally use Swift A-Frames and FailSafes.

Probably not entirely what you were looking for but that's my take on it.

quote:

Originally posted by jro45:
I think that the 338 with the bullets it can shoot that it is an all round gun for game in the lower 48 states. Any coments.

It is a bit on the large size for a varmint rifle, but for everything bigger than a coyote, I agree that a rifle firing .338" bullets is pretty versatile! And not just the .338 Win., either. The .338/'06, in its' various versions, has a lot to recommend it as well.

quote:

Originally posted by jro45:
I think that the 338 with the bullets it can shoot that it is a GREAT all round gun for game in North America and beyond . Any coments.

There I made a couple corrections for you!

I doubt anyone has a hard time figuring out how I feel about this one. Nate

A .338 is far more than necessary for the lower 48.

I have adopted the attitude that if I truly need more than a 30-06 then I want to step up to Hollands .375.

That said it's no secret that the 338 has become increasingly popular with the elk and moose hunters.

I think we've been over this before but ya the 338 is perfect for all around use. I shoot 250 Noslers at 2750 fps, have used this gun for many years and it always does its job. I hunt in B.C. and even my deer hunting areas you could bump into a grizzly so it never hurts to have a little extra gun. You've got 30-06 trajectory with a little more punch. Oh ya, it does less damage than 7mm/300 high speed stuff. Put it in a light rifle (mine's 8 1/4 scoped)and you're not hadicapped in any way.

I was just wondering too myself yesterday what I feel would be the best possible Elk round I could possibly imagine. 338/06 pushing 225 gn interlocks was my conclusion. Thats coming from a 35 Whelen owner. Unfortunatley Hornady doesnt make a 225 gn 35 cal, lots of other 35's to pick from though.

While it's true that a .30-06 can do it all anywhere in NA, .338 bore just makes me feel better. A bit much for antelope/deer size game, just about perfect for elk/moose. Whether you use a magnum persuasion or the great .338-06, you could do a lot worse.

If you're talking about the 338 Win Mag then it's probably more than a fella needs in the lower 48, and plenty for anything in Alaska, Canada, and all but maybe four or five of the spendier trophies in Africa.

.338 WM is great. I love mine. Yes, there are a lot more .30 cal bullets to choose from, personally, I'd rather puch a heavy bullet in my .338 than my .308. It's a little much for smaller game, but that's just a great reason for you to have more guns.

mike

Absolutely! The .338 Win. Mag. rivals the 30-06 in versatility and may even surpass it. It is an absolutely tremendous catridge.

I think with the introduction of the 338Federal cartridge that some new lighter bullets for the 338 are probably forthcomming from the various bullet makers.

currently the 338 is limited to 180gr bullets and the 160gr flat base from Barnes, or are there other's that I've missed?

Of one thing I'm certain, the 338Federal is probably better at tossing 180gr bullets than a 308 is, but that isn't exactly a recommendation for it...

If I were going to Alaska no question, I'd take a 338Mag.

For deer? it's gross overkill.
I can see a point on Elk, Moose or Grizzly, but that doesn't make it "All around"?

I'd love to see you justifying using a 338Mag on an
Assateague Island Sika deer


AllanD

I think that is a pretty good statement. I have two 338-06's and I would not hesitate to hunt anything in N. America with it. There's probably 3-4 critters over in Africa that I wouldn't use it on.

IMO the 338-06 is better than the 30-06 because of bigger bore diameter and not as fast as the 338 WM.

You can use 180gr bullets for deer without overkill and Swift is making a 275gr A-Frame. Plus their are whole lot of choices in between.

Like Vapodog, if I really wanted to keep a bare bones rifle battery and a .30-06 wasn't enough, I wouldn't want a .300 Mag. or .338, I'd go straight up to a .375 H&H and feel good about it. That said, I like the .338-06 and the 9.3x62, always thought a .338 WM was a harder kicker than the .375's(built lighter), so I'd rather hunt with the H&H plus I have one that I just have always shot well.

Well, here goes. I use the .338 as my light rifle in Africa. It is much more effective on plains game than a .300 mag. If your PH will let you it will shoot through any lion. The difference to me and the .375H&H primarily is range. The .338RUM that I shoot with either the 250 or 225 bullet shoots much flatter than a 375. I really don't notice much difference in "killing power" between the .338 and the .375 at ranges over 150 yards. This is not to say that I don't like a .375 but I do think the .338 is just as good on everything up to buff.

This might evoke some argument, but here's my take on caliber selection:

1. Bullet diameter/weight/style chosen for animal size...it's no coincidence that big heavy solid bullets are used on buff/elephant, and small explosive bullets are used on little critters. I think bullet construction and weight are often overlooked as a huge variables. I'd never feel under-gunned using a Fail-Safe or similarly constructed .30 cal 200 grain bullet on a brown bear, but certainly wouldn't use a 150 grain polymer tipped bullet. There's a wide range of acceptable game taking performance available in any given caliber within reason.
2. I equate "magnum" with "range". If I never expect to take a shot past 300-350 yards, I feel that a magnum cartridge is not needed.

That said, there's nothing wrong with using a .338 or .350 mag or .340 Weatherby for anything in the lower 48 or the upper and over other 2, but I think most reasonable people would consider them a bit much for everything except elk, bison, or brown bear. Dead is dead. And I qualify "a bit much" as regards recoil, component expense, and gun weight to mitigate recoil. The only magnum I haven't given up is a .375 H&H, in the event that I do get to Africa some day. I'm considering it for an elk hunt this fall, but still leaning towards a .280 with stout bullets. Get a bullet where it needs to go and caliber is often a moot point unless you're shooting at something real close that can quickly turn you into toe cheese.

I'm reading back over the posts on the thread today and it seems when I said 30 Caliber a lot of people took it for granted I meant .308 or 30-06. jro45 was asking about a rifle .338 which delivers a fair little love tap when you pull the trigger. My statement should have been a little clearer. I was referring to something more along the lines of a .300 WM to a 300 RUM. The 338 will pretty much stay with them to 300 yards and after that the lower BC starts to take its toll. I’m kind of partial to the .300 Weatherby but not the long throated factory model.

Too much power for some game I’ll agree but I’m not the person you’re going to see posting often in the “If you could only have one gun threadâ€. I’ll hunt with different guns with the same game depending on the habitat. In heavy woods and brush you don’t need a 500 yard rifle. If your hunting in open country and the shots you’re going to be presented with are 350 to 500 yards you are not going to use a 35 Whelen which I might add is very hard to beat and a great choice in brush and in close to around 200 yards.

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:


I'd love to see you justifying using a 338Mag on an
Assateague Island Sika deer


AllanD

You need a magnum for penetration. A typical 20 yard shot entails penetrating 10 yards of mosquitos!

I've shot a 375 HH for elk the last 7 years. It has taken 8 total. None lost or run off. Elk are tough. We hunt in timber. I don't want to be tracking with no snow. It's a great round with 300 Noslers. I shot a raghorn bull last year in the front shoulder (head on). He ran about 30 feet and fell over. I don't think he would have gone down as quick with a 7mm/30, and I like them both. That being said, I just got done with by pass surgery and will do my elk hunting this year with a 7x57.

In November?

The Maryland Firearms season is last week of November first week of December.

I can see the Mosquitos being a problem during the archery season, but after thankgiving?

AllanD

Actually, there are quite a lot of .338-caliber bullets. Here is a list I am working on, but it's missing a few bullet manufacturers. Even so, it's not bad at all:


.338-caliber (8.9mm)

Barnes
185-gr TSX
210-gr TSX
225-gr TSX
160-gr X FB
250-gr Solid

Woodleigh
225-gr PP SN
250-gr RN SN
250-gr PP SN
250-gr FMJ
300-gr RN SN
300-gr FMJ

Kodiak
200-gr PSP
200-gr FNSP
200-gr SP-HG
225-gr PSP
250-gr PP
275-gr PP

Swift
210-gr Scirocco II
225-gr A-Frame
250-gr A-Frame
275-gr A frame

Sierra
215-gr SBT GameKing
250-gr SBT GameKing
250-gr HPBT MatchKing
300-gr HPBT MatchKing

Nosler
180-gr BT
200-gr BT
210-gr Partition
225-gr Partition
250-gr Partition
180-gr Accubond
225-gr Accubond
230-gr FS

Hornady
200-gr Spire
225-gr SST
225g-gr Spire
250-gr Spire
250-gr Round
225-gr Interbond

GS
180-gr HV
200-gr HV
225-gr HV
250-gr FN

Northfork
225-gr SS
240-gr SS
200-gr SS

Speer
225-gr GS
225-gr GS
225-gr TB BC
200-gr SP
225-gr BT

Ray that's a pretty good list. Here's an old one for 30 Caliber that doesn't include the Interbonds, Accubonds or the SST's

30 Caliber choices.

I really like the 338 caliber and use it for my mule deer and elk hunting (338 Lapua Sako TRGS). Obviously one doesn't need a 338 for elk and especially deer, but it works for me very well. My buds shoot 7 Rem mags and 300 Win and they put the game down too.

I like hunting with something a little different and since I enjoy shooting bigger bores (416 Rigby and 458 Lott) the recoil of the Lapua is really not a concern. For those that don't shoot any/many bigger rounds the fast 338s might be a little too much. The 338 WM is a pretty easy shooting round and the 338/06 should be even nicer to shoot.

I have used with success the Nosler 250P and just this year tried the Barnes TSX 210s. Great accuracy and wonderful terminal performnce. IMHO game (especially elk with their greater mass) seem to react more to the 338s than the smaller calibers...but that could be just my small sample. Whatever, I like the way the 338s hit game.

As always. a good hit with a 7mm is WAY better than a gutshot 338 (or 375, etc). However if one can shoot a 338 well thats icing on the cake, especially with larger animals. Use what you like and one you can shoot well. Most of this stuff is just internet fodder but fun nontheless.

John

I like the 338 caliber alot better than the 308 so much that i dont use the 308 caliber anymore.I use the 338 win mag and the 338-378 weatherby for my long range rifle.I hardly use my 416 except for thickets and tent gun.

Ray thanks for the 338 bullet list as you said there a few that weren't listed.

bja105 The 338 may not be the best rifle for Sika deer but it sure could kill one.

Jay Johnson I know the 300's are great guns for some long shots but I think that the 338's are used for the 1000yd shoots sometimes.

My 338 is the Rem Ultra Mag that I can load down to the 338 Win loads.

I don't like shooting a 338 prone. Also they kick enough to eject me from my tree stand if I'm not careful. Otherwise I don't feel at a disadvantage with a 338 anywhere in NA. A few of my relatives have migrated to one 338 for everything, including a few buffalo.

the 338 wm has a few advantages over 375. 1) flatter shooting, 2) after 150-200 yards the energy level has enough to stop an elk to 500yds,3) same lenght action as a 30/06.

now im not sayin any thing negative about the 375 at all. but i personnally feel it is definatly excessive on any thing except the larger bears- ie browns,griz etc.
alot of you have great points,but if you handload for a 338 wm it becomes a great deer rifel as well. especially from the 180-210 grain bulletts.

all the deer and elk my friend and i have taken with a 338 wm have little blood shot, and it has enough energy to stop below the hide on an elk out to 300-400 yds.

i own both a ruger 77 and a tika in 338 wm and as long as i can shoot it, its my only choice, even though there are alot of great calibers out there.

A .375 is a tremendous killer but my .338 carries better and is almost as good.

338 is my favorite as well, I own 4 338WM and one Lapua. I had rather shoot my 338wm rather than a 300wm as I feel less recoil.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray:
Actually, there are quite a lot of .338-caliber bullets. Here is a list I am working on, but it's missing a few bullet manufacturers. Even so, it's not bad at all:

Uhhh Ray? I was talking about LIGHTER bullets to use on Deer, as anyone who thinks they need 225's or 250's from a 338WM on a whitetail should have a padded room all to themselves......
I know people who do think that way, and have told them that they are Ill

AllanD

Allan, why the vitriol with almost every one of your posts. You seem bent on trying to one-up anyone who makes a simple post. Ray took the time to post a list of available bullet wieghts for the 338 and you diss him for his effort.

As to your padded room comment... one of my favorite hunting partners hunted everything from Western Oregon Blacktail Deer to Elk & Moose with a 338 Win Mag using 250 grn bullets.
He never felt over gunned. He owned one gun, a pre-64 Model 70 in 338 Win Mag... beware the man with one gun.

As to your signature line... methinks you provoke me to thinking you're alot of hot air.

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:

quote:

Originally posted by Ray:
Actually, there are quite a lot of .338-caliber bullets. Here is a list I am working on, but it's missing a few bullet manufacturers. Even so, it's not bad at all:

Uhhh Ray? I was talking about LIGHTER bullets to use on Deer, as anyone who thinks they need 225's or 250's from a 338WM on a whitetail should have a padded room all to themselves......
I know people who do think that way, and have told them that they are Ill

AllanD

There are 160-grain bullets on the list (Barnes), all the way to 200-grain bullets one can use for deer. I use from 225-grain to 275-grain bullets for all my hunting in Alaska. I only have and use one big game rifle.

There is nothing wrong with using heavy bullets for deer. For example, a 300-grain Partition out of a .375 H&H, and perhaps around 150 yards (through the lungs), passes right through and damages little meat. A .45-70 with a heavy bullet can do a good job, too.

A light-for-caliber and relatively soft bullet, lets say a 160-grain one, out of a .300WM or a .338WM a full speed, can expand so fast when it hits the target that more meat damage is encountered. Heavy-for-caliber bullets (of the same design as lighter ones), expand slower, and penetrate deeper, leaving behind a smaller hole.

quote:

Originally posted by brianbo:
Allan, why the vitriol with almost every one of your posts. You seem bent on trying to one-up anyone who makes a simple post. Ray took the time to post a list of available bullet wieghts for the 338 and you diss him for his effort.

As to your padded room comment... one of my favorite hunting partners hunted everything from Western Oregon Blacktail Deer to Elk & Moose with a 338 Win Mag using 250 grn bullets.
He never felt over gunned. He owned one gun, a pre-64 Model 70 in 338 Win Mag... beware the man with one gun.

As to your signature line... methinks you provoke me to thinking you're alot of hot air.

brianbo, why are you projecting vitrol into my reply (much less all my posts) where NOBODY other than someone who is REAL uptight would think I was being vitrolic?

As for my "vitrol" I don't have any. All the Vitrol I have is sent to me by Mark and Brad who seem to have a supply, I take their vitrol and refine it into a more purified form, sarchasm, and send it back to them...


Geez, many people here are WAY TOO SERIOUS
you among them....Why don't you try lightening up?

I said if they think they NEED a 338Mag, "WANT"
is another thing entirely and implies someone who is merely "eccentric" rather than stark raving bonkers (a technical term)

My remarks in this thread were OBVIOUSLY IN HUMOR to anyone other than a.... well...
a complete tightass. if you aren't a complete tightass, but are just temporarily pretending to be one I'll forgive you now

And what the is wrong with being "chatty"
there is nothing "One up man" about my comments in this thread..... and if you are reading that into QUOTE: "All my posts" then examine your own attitude. CLOSE QUOTE

Anything you see about my "attitude" is more likely an illusion, a product, of your own bad day, or a problem far worse, a complete lack of sense of humor. or you've been PM'ing with Mark...

Being humorless is the most tragic disease of all, excluding some childhood cancers of course...

I was making a comment about light bullets above and in reply someone (Ray) takes that out of context and posts a lengthy list of ALL the 338bullets they can find...
proving that their reading comprehension of my post was... well... less than optimal....?

As for my using Caps? (mabey your mistaking attitude) Italics are beyond my feeble computer ability and I find different colored words extreemly annoying to read so
I ASSume others feel the same way about clored lettering and I don't use them.

If you want to ascribe any "attitude" to my posting most of the time you will be reasonably safe assuming a dry deadpan delivery, about 50/50 John Cleese (Of Monty Python fame) and Mr Spock (If I've gotta explain who he is please kill yourself

In this subject Think more "Howie Mandel" (when he first started) complete with the rubber glove on my head


Doesn't ANYONE pay attention to the appropriately placed smiley faces?

Read bja105's reply to my first comment, HE GOT IT, he understood my "attitude" perfectly AND replied to it in perfect form. you didn't.

as for my signature line? Obviously you need to ponder further on it's meanings both overt and subtle, as you've just proved you don't get it.

I think you had a bad day and translated that into misunderstanding my "attitude"

Oh well...

But I really do wonder about the judgement and or mental health of anyone who thinks theyNEED (I'll make an exception to the colored lettering here) a 338Mag to kill deer.

if you WANT? Hey, it's your shoulder... but "need" it isn't.

It's like using a 44MAg to kill mice from ambush
because you are afraid a wounded mouse might charge

AllanD

I have a .338, I like it,
But even though I take it on most every elk hunt I go on, it rarly come out of its case. I like my 45/70 and my 35 whelen.
Somebody mentiond the balistic coefficent, the .338 has better BC,s than you think. and besides It it,ll kill farther than most of us should shoot !
I don't see why anyone has to justify using a paricular cartridge for hunting any game animal, unless it is to light, Don't really grasp the concept of overkill, after all dead is dead...tj3006

Thomas,

I didn't ask anyone to "justify" anything, Except in jest
(Anyone who can't see shooting a 50lb animal with a 338Mag as either humorous or excessive, likely both must have something wrong inside their noggin)

I do ask for people to explain "why".
I want to understand their logic in making that choice.

Why is it that many people get all defensive and hostile
when you ask "why?".

I just wonder why the Belt-fed, fully-automatic hostility,
when you ask someone to explain.
Almost like they think I want them to type their answers with bamboo slivers driven under their fingernails

A reasonable person would think that if people were secure in their choices they'd be brimming over with willingness to explain to anyone willing to take the time to listen to their list of reasons.... wouldn't you?

Even if that reason is only; "I just like it, I don't know why"

Of course a better reason is "I hunt in grizzly country"
inwhich case I'd question why they weren't hunting those
tiny deer while packing a 416Rigby...



AllanD

Allan DeGroot:

I have no idea of what you are talking about. If you go back and read my posts, then you will understand that I haven't said anything against you.

Ray

quote:

Originally posted by Ray:
Allan DeGroot:

I have no idea of what you are talking about. If you go back and read my posts, then you will understand that I haven't said anything against you.

Ray

Ray, My sincerest apology to you!
I was thinking "brianbo" (I even quote his entire post) and still my fingers type "Ray"...

Sorry...

I have corrected that.

Something in the brain to fingertip interface
wasn't working right...

I guess I should also take the glove off of my head now (Makes my hair itch anyway

AD

So Allan, lets here all about your experience with the 338 WM on game and particualrly why a person using 225's or 250's on deer-sized game needs a padded cell... I'm all ears to hear your actual, hands-on experience (as usual) that woud lead you to make such a statement.

You seem to be so well versed in all things "gunny" and have such strong opinions formed I can't help but think you've hunted the world over with a variety of armament and we'd all benefit from hearing about it...

I probably belong in a padded cell, but the 250 grain Hornady round nose makes a splendid deer load for those that don't need 300+ yard performance. In fact this same load has worked for quite a few different animals from small to big without a problem.