quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
Interesting conversation. That leads me to ask then how do any of you feel the 9.3x57 fits into the scheme.

57 comes from 8mm Mauser - 8x57J with the neck opened up - and was ment to be used in Europe - it can be mainly found in Scandinavia still in surprising numbers - usualy in Husquarnas.

62 on the other hand was made for use in German Colonies from the very beginning.

Therefore 62 screams Africa while 57 Scandinavia.

The 9.3x57 is more close to the 9.3x62 then the 308 Win is to the 30-06. I think a 9.3x57 on the same action of the 9.3x62 would pretty much be kicking on it's heels. An analogy is the 8x57 Mauser gives the 30-06 a darn good run for it's money.

None of this is to say build a 9.3x57...just to say it's a pretty decent round and that it probably will do everything the 9.3x62 or 35 Whelen can.

mouse,

Good point.


And that the 62 is a factory chambering !

The writing has been on the wall for the rise of the 9.3x62 over the 35Whelen within the US for many years now. The below was from an article on this topic back in 2004. I think it sums up the answer to the OP’s original question fairly well:

“The 9.3x62's combination of moderate velocity with bullets of high sectional density and a large frontal area (diameter) has proven itself so well it is still one of the most popular cartridges outside the U.S. for any big game. So popular, it is offered by most all European rifle manufacturers today.”

Rifle
September - October 2004
Volume 36, Number 5
ISSN: 0162-3583
Number 215

S.D.

I love the 9.3 x 62 and own 2 of them...first ran into it living in Germany and shot it the first time when it was given me as a guest at a driven hunt. Has a reputation as a hog stopper and its is definitely the hammer for that. I think its catching on as a new toy..been relatively unknown here in the US. We don't really need it..doesn't fill any "hole" in the caliber lineup. Its another toy...bigger...no more complicated than that. I'm waiting for the AI version

quote:

9.3 a fad? I wouldn't take that thought to the bank since it's been around since 1905. Whelen started life in 1922.

Well, that's true about the ages but I don't think you draw the right conclusions. The Whelen being a wildcat for so much of than time sorta negates its head start in the American market. Even after it went legit there is so little need for that much "power" that relitively few get sold so the choices are still quite limited. I suspect the market for the Whelen has been reached for some time so it isn't likely to continue to become more popular.

The 9.3 on the other hand has an easy time showing a rapid increase in popularity; if they sold 10 in 2009 and 30 in 2010 they have incrased 300%...but it's still only 30! That's just for illustration of course, I have no idea of how many have been sold or what the rate of increase is, just want to show how such things can be deceptive unless you do know what it's based on.

I'm 70, been a gun enthusist since I shot my grandpa's single shot Rem .22 in '45. I've heard a LOT of praise and contemp for some cartridges but have never heard anyone disparage any cartridge because it was metric.

Rem's 7mm express and 6mm didn't fail because they were metric, they failed because they did't match what the majority market sought. By the time Rem corrected the .244 barrel twist rate the .243 was just too far ahead and the 7mm express being renamed .280 hasn't made it a popular round in spite of it's ballistic excellance. Rem's 6.5 mag didn't fail because it was metric, it failed because few people cared for the 600 series rifles it was put in; Rem's .350 mag failed for exactly the same reason in the same rifles. The Rem .257 Roberts has fizzled because it's not very helpful, ditto the .300 and .303 Savage.

Win's .220 Swift, .225, .284, .264 mag, .307,.375 have all failed and the .260 is flacid because they didn't offer what the public wants and the fact they were "American" calibers couldn't save 'em.

So,no, metric cartridge designations have no disadvantage because of the lable. Nothing can save 'em if they don't bring something to the table a large number of the public seeks. The 9.3?

The 9.3mm is ballistically excellant but it won't expand passed the "cartridge of the decade" crowd. Meaning, it's a "new cartridge" fad for rifle geeks like us, at least in the USA. But it will soon saturate its market and flat line the way the Whelen has.

I agree completely with the first post. The lack of a good bullet selection is the reason the Whelen stopped gaining ground. The 06 is best with 180-200 grain bullets, the 338-06 is best with 225 & 250 grain bullets so the Whelen should be best with 250 plus bullets but very few if any bullet makers offer any but the 9.3 does. The creation of a 275 grainer is long over due but bullet makers will tell you that the 1 in 16 twist won't stabilize a bullet. This is a true statement and The Whelen is essentially doomed because of the lack of foresight at it's conception.

quote:

why 35 Whelen fails and 9.3x62 is a winner ??

why 35 Whelen fails and 9.3x62 is a winner ??

I for one don't believe it to be true in North America. Neither one is a hot item when you consider the average hunter. If performance were the determining factor, factory and hand loaded ammo both contributors, there ain't no difference except in the eye of the contemporary sophisticate. Mox nix 10 years from now. roger

Others have commented about its' greater ME. For me, the fact that it has been used successfully in Africa for a hundred years on DG is the difference maker. The .375 Rule for DG allows for the 9,3x62 and 9,3x74R to be used.

It is a bigger hammer than the 35 Whelen, and you can get 320gr bullets if you wish.

Rich

What is wrong with the 35 Whelen's bullet selection, look around and you will find plenty of good bullets for uses at both ends of it's reasonable use spectrum. What kind of leftist logic allows a .366 to be used when the law says .375 is minimum? Look at it this way I wouldn't use a 9.3 on elephant, Rhino or Cape buffalo just as I wouldn't use a 35 Whelen on the same beasts. Now for Lion and leopard I can't see how either cartridge would outperform the other using good bullets.

quote:

Originally posted by Captain Finlander:
I agree completely with the first post. The lack of a good bullet selection is the reason the Whelen stopped gaining ground. The 06 is best with 180-200 grain bullets, the 338-06 is best with 225 & 250 grain bullets so the Whelen should be best with 250 plus bullets but very few if any bullet makers offer any but the 9.3 does. The creation of a 275 grainer is long over due but bullet makers will tell you that the 1 in 16 twist won't stabilize a bullet. This is a true statement and The Whelen is essentially doomed because of the lack of foresight at it's conception.

Just how necessary is a 250 gr. plus bullet? Woodleigh makes a 300 grain 35 caliber bullet anyway. Just what percent of American hunters shoot bullets that weigh more than 250 grains? What in America won't react properly to a well placed 250 gr. Nosler Partition?

quote:

What in America won't react properly to a well placed 250 gr. Nosler Partition?

and the same can be said for Africa except a few might prefer a 250 grain solid!

quote:

Just what percent of American hunters shoot bullets that weigh more than 250 grains?

quote:

the same can be said for Africa except a few might prefer a 250 grain solid!

This is the American mindset. Probably based on actual hunting experince. Short of brown bear, nobody "needs" 250 grains. Nobody "needs" either a 35 Whelen or 9.3 x anything for American hunting.

Vapo, you made a big joke about all the calibers. Well, to be practical nobody needs a safe full of guns and 30-06 is way over kill for 99% of all N. American hunting and fully adequate for the biggest and baddest. OK, granted its all BS anyway, my observation and question still stand.

When I checked midway for 35 Whelen ammo, although 11 loads were listed, few were available and none in 250 gr were in stock. Yet in 9.3x62 there were numerous 285 gr loads ready to ship.

If you look at 260, 270 and 280 loads and compare those to 6.5x55 and 7x57 loads. Note where the heavy bullets are - Worldwide.

An exception with the American shooter is the 223 and all the xyz Lapuas. Heavy bullets!

I am not saying there is a universal right or wrong. The lighter bullets seems favored here.

I lean toward heavy for caliber bullets. I dont need one, but I find my self liking the 9.3x62 - the history, the loads, the guns. At same time, I note the similarity to 35 Whelen and wonder .... what happened?

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
An analogy is the 8x57 Mauser gives the 30-06 a darn good run for it's money.

W/200gr bullets loaded to adult pressure levels the 8X57 equals or supasses the '06.

My 8X57 clocks 2700+ fps out of a 23 1/2" bbl W/200gr Nosler Partitions.

This last deer season we did a quick sight-in on a friends M70 FW in '06 W/a 22 bbl & 180gr factory "Powerpoint" loads it was clocking just a bit over 2600 fps over the same chrony I used to develope loads for the 8X57.

quote:

Originally posted by fourbore:

quote:

Just what percent of American hunters shoot bullets that weigh more than 250 grains?

quote:

the same can be said for Africa except a few might prefer a 250 grain solid!

This is the American mindset. Probably based on actual hunting experince. Short of brown bear, nobody "needs" 250 grains. Nobody "needs" either a 35 Whelen or 9.3 x anything for American hunting.

Vapo, you made a big joke about all the calibers. Well, to be practical nobody needs a safe full of guns and 30-06 is way over kill for 99% of all N. American hunting and fully adequate for the biggest and baddest. OK, granted its all BS anyway, my observation and question still stand.

When I checked midway for 35 Whelen ammo, although 11 loads were listed, few were available and none in 250 gr were in stock. Yet in 9.3x62 there were numerous 285 gr loads ready to ship.

If you look at 260, 270 and 280 loads and compare those to 6.5x55 and 7x57 loads. Note where the heavy bullets are - Worldwide.

An exception with the American shooter is the 223 and all the xyz Lapuas. Heavy bullets!

I am not saying there is a universal right or wrong. The lighter bullets seems favored here.

I lean toward heavy for caliber bullets. I dont need one, but I find my self liking the 9.3x62 - the history, the loads, the guns. At same time, I note the similarity to 35 Whelen and wonder .... what happened?

I don't know. I heavy bullet in a not so powerful cartridge seems to whack deer better then the faster cartridges with smaller bores and light bullets. Talking short distances because the fast small bores do shoot much flatter. A good example of what I'm talking about is the 35 Remington. Even though the 30-30 is a great deer round the 35 Remington is better. Myself for short distance I prefer my 45-70 with cast bullets. So I think the 35 Whelen, 9.3 either x62 or 57 are great rounds that can be tailored for the purpose by hand loading.

I feel many of us get bored using the same same caliber, same rifle, same load year after year. I also feel it's great to experience all the different firearms and cartridges.

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
An analogy is the 8x57 Mauser gives the 30-06 a darn good run for it's money.

W/200gr bullets loaded to adult pressure levels the 8X57 equals or supasses the '06.

My 8X57 clocks 2700+ fps out of a 23 1/2" bbl W/200gr Nosler Partitions.

This last deer season we did a quick sight-in on a friends M70 FW in '06 W/a 22 bbl & 180gr factory "Powerpoint" loads it was clocking just a bit over 2600 fps over the same chrony I used to develope loads for the 8X57.

I didn't want to say it that way to avoid raising the hackles of 30-06 admirers. I too like the 06 very much.

If the 9.3x62 exceeds the sales of the 35 Whelen it will because of some marketing effort slanted at the unknowledgeable and not bare bones performance comparison. Even though the 9.3 is a bigger hammer it isn't significant enough to have any real meaning. Neither one is going to be a big seller for any meaningful performance. Just ain't there folks. roger

quote:

If the 9.3x62 exceeds the sales of the 35 Whelen it will because of some marketing effort slanted at the unknowledgeable

On a global basis, you are 100 years too late. The 9.3 already exceeds and will continue to exceed. I read somewhere 9.3 is popular in Canada as well.

Without marketing, Ruger, Remington FN and CZ could all close up shop. Becasue there is more than enough guns to satisify the basic needs of every hunter and future sons of hunters out there.

Both are way more than the "average" US hunter needs, and after shooting them, will want either. Look at all the .223 deer rifle shooters- most don't want the biggest gun, they want the least recoil that will do what they want.

The 9.3 will outsell the Whelen until someone starts a nostalgia kick on the Whelen, then it will reverse. In any case, they are fighting for what, 35th place in the cartridge world (a WAG)?

Honestly, I don't think the 9.3 is any less of a kicker (in my limited experience) than the .375 (which isn't bad anyhow), so I'm not sure why folks want a 9.3x62 over a .375 for African hunting, but some do. I still think the H&H is way more popular than the 9.3, so its obviously an individual thing, and as far as I can see, a nostalgia thing.

Not that the 9.3 isn't a perfectly fine caliber anyhow. In NA both will do anything you ask of them, same in Europe. In africa, because of gun laws the 9.3 will be legal for a bit more, although with heavy Woodleighs in a accurate rifle, the Whelen should perform just fine.

quote:

On a global basis, you are 100 years too late.

Per your original post, we were talking about the US market. No one is disputing that the 9.3x62 is more popular than the Whelen outside of the US.

The simple fact is that no one except the manufacturers knows the actual sales numbers of the 9.3x62 in the US. I think we would all agree that the big three US rifle manufacturers pay close attention to what sells in the marketplace. For many years, Remington and Ruger have sold the Whelen, whereas none of the big three have sold the 9.3x62. So it is very likely that there are far more Whelen rifles in the USA than the 9.3x62. Ruger has recently offered the 9.3x62 and I'm sure Remington and Winchester will pay close attention and offer it also if the sales are worthwhile. Sako, CZ, and other european manufacturers may offer the 9.3x62, but until Remington or Winchester get into the game, Whelen rifles will continue to far outnumber 9.3x62 rifles in the USA. Even if the 9.3x62 starts to outsell the Whelen on an annual basis, it will take many years for it catch up to accumulated Whelen sales in the US. So your original premise about the Whelen failure in the US and the 9.3x62 success would, at minimum, would be many years premature.

quote:

Originally posted by duckboat:

quote:

On a global basis, you are 100 years too late.

Per your original post, we were talking about the US market. No one is disputing that the 9.3x62 is more popular than the Whelen outside of the US.

The simple fact is that no one except the manufacturers knows the actual sales numbers of the 9.3x62 in the US. I think we would all agree that the big three US rifle manufacturers pay close attention to what sells in the marketplace. For many years, Remington and Ruger have sold the Whelen, whereas none of the big three have sold the 9.3x62. So it is very likely that there are far more Whelen rifles in the USA than the 9.3x62. Ruger has recently gotten into the 9.3x62 US market and I'm sure Remington and Winchester will pay close attention and offer it also if the sales are worthwhile. Sako, CZ, and other european manufacturers may offer the 9.3x62, but until Remington or Winchester get into the game, Whelen rifles will continue to far outnumber 9.3x62 rifles in the USA. Even if the 9.3x62 starts to outsell the 9.3x62 on an annual basis, it will take many years for it catch up to accumulated Whelen sales in the US. So your original premise about the Whelen failure in the US and the 9.3x62 success would, at minimum, would be many years premature.

Duckboat,

I am always amicable when questions of this matter come up, but there's no way that the .35 Whelen out sells, is chambered in more factory guns, or is superior to the 9.3x62 ballistically. It just ain't so.

The data and facts will prove otherwise many times over.

However, as I said before, the difference is minimal between the two, and real differences are merely personal preference.

The .35 Whelen will never out sell the 9.3x62 because of several reasons: 1)worldwide acceptance 2)ballistics 3 history.

Mike

quote:

there's no way that the .35 Whelen out sells, is chambered in more factory guns, or is superior to the 9.3x62 ballistically. It just ain't so.

Maybe I'm dead wrong here but it seems to me that more of both of these chamberings are custom rather than by factory sales. Since the .35 Whelen was conceived the only rifles so chambered was all custom until Remington standardized it. I suspect that given the twist rate Remington chose, a lot of .35 Whelens still today are totally custom.....mine certainly is as is my 9.3 X 62....just a thought!

This discussion isn't about whether the 9.3 or the Whelen is better ballistically. It's also not about the total number of manufacturers that chamber the Whelen vs. 9.3x62. You can site CZ, Sako, and a number of other european companies, but the meat of the US rifle market is owned by Winchester, Remington, and Ruger. The best sign for the popularity in the USA of the 9.3x62 is that Ruger offered it. Ruger wouldn't have offered it unless it expected the rifle to sell. However, Ruger has also offered the Whelen for years. To top it off, Remington has sold the Whelen for years and you must acknowledge that Remington will not offer a rifle year after year unless the sales numbers are significant.

Keep your eye on the big three US manufacturers and they will indicate by their offerings what is actually selling in the USA.

"The .35 Whelen will never out sell the 9.3x62 because of several reasons: 1)worldwide acceptance 2)ballistics 3 history."

1) Worldwide acceptance isn't definitive in making something successful in the USA.

2) The difference in ballistics is meaningless on any north american game.

3) You are correct on history being important, except that it actually favors the Whelen in the USA. The roots of the Whelen go very deep in the USA.

Lot's of good posts here.

Whilst I'm in South Africa, looking at US publications it seems that the 35 Whelen was almost abandoned by the US rifle and ammo manufacturer. At the time it happened probably because of the high velocity craze.

The 9.3 is experiencing a revival due to it's perceived "classical" status - in terms of Mausers and Africa - not an American Classical sense obviously.

There are rifles available in 9.3 and good European components.

It is extremely popular in Europe. I was there on a driven hunt and four of the guns were 9.3x62 and one a 9.3x74R. I think we were about nine guns in total.

The fact that it is legal for African DG in quite a number of jurisdictions does it no harm and adds to the charm and appeal!

The 9.3 beats the Whelen because its manufacturers didn't spend 50 years trying to bill it as something it wasn't. Like what was stated earlier, the bullet weights were all to light forcing the Whelen to compete with the 06 which was a costly mistake. This forced gun makers to use a 1 in 16 twist which doomed the gun to short bullets forever so, even though some forward thinking bullet makers offer a 300 grain 35 caliber bullet, there are few guns that can stabilize it.

Yes, there is the frontal area argument but my thoughts on that are this: What makes the 160 grain 6.5x55 swede so successful? It's not fast or big but it is long and has over a century of moose to its credit. This high sectional density phenomenon has proved itself over and over again throughout the caliber chart so why wouldn't it not apply to the Whelen? Considering the fact that all bullets can kill isn't it possible that some may kill more efficiently than others?

The Whelen could perform better than the 9.3 provided the criteria was adjusted to do so.

The argument will rage on because all guns and bullets are capable of killing so all we have is paper charts to prove that one could or should perform better than another.

The Whelen has a far greater bullet selection when it comes to being used on the smaller big game species. I seldom fail to see a 35 Whelen at the gun shows but rarely see a 9.3x62 anywhere. This is like a 270x280 argument with aan even smaller market share than the 280 has.

quote:

Originally posted by Palidun:

quote:

Originally posted by Captain Finlander:
I agree completely with the first post. The lack of a good bullet selection is the reason the Whelen stopped gaining ground. The 06 is best with 180-200 grain bullets, the 338-06 is best with 225 & 250 grain bullets so the Whelen should be best with 250 plus bullets but very few if any bullet makers offer any but the 9.3 does. The creation of a 275 grainer is long over due but bullet makers will tell you that the 1 in 16 twist won't stabilize a bullet. This is a true statement and The Whelen is essentially doomed because of the lack of foresight at it's conception.

Just how necessary is a 250 gr. plus bullet? Woodleigh makes a 300 grain 35 caliber bullet anyway. Just what percent of American hunters shoot bullets that weigh more than 250 grains? What in America won't react properly to a well placed 250 gr. Nosler Partition?

I believe this is why the AB only comes in 225gr. Need for bigger n heavier just isn't there for tooo many shooters using the 35Wheelen.

quote:

I believe this is why the AB only comes in 225gr. Need for bigger n heavier just isn't there

If one looks closely the 225 grain accubond does not have a better BC than the 225 partition....(a mistake by Nosler?) and if that is to follow with the 250 grain bullet then the accubond offers nothing over the partition! IMO the only thing the accubond has over the partition is BC.....and at least here it offers nothing at all.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

I believe this is why the AB only comes in 225gr. Need for bigger n heavier just isn't there

If one looks closely the 225 grain accubond does not have a better BC than the 225 partition....(a mistake by Nosler?) and if that is to follow with the 250 grain bullet then the accubond offers nothing over the partition! IMO the only thing the accubond has over the partition is BC.....and at least here it offers nothing at all.

I've seen similar data in other calibers.

I suspect maybe they were a bit overly exuberant when calculating the Partition BCs?

quote:

When I checked midway for 35 Whelen ammo, although 11 loads were listed, few were available and none in 250 gr were in stock. Yet in 9.3x62 there were numerous 285 gr loads ready to ship.

Is that an indicator that the 9.3 has more or less sales than the .35 W?

Reason the .35 W has low market appeal is that VERY few of the American "comman man" hunters need that much power, not that it isn't sufficent in any way. IF the 9.3 were to be twice as "powerful", all it would mean is that even fewer hunters would need or care for it.

African safari dreams aside, neither cartridge will EVER be a major player in the American hunter's big game arsenal.

I am sorry guys but statements like this:

"I would bet that 9.3x62 rifles out number .35 Whelens by 5:1." ..... are simply not supportable by any evidence.

The far majority of 35 Whelens in the US originated during its 65 years as a wildcat, and most of those Whelens were built with a 1:10 or 1:12 twist barrel that could handle heavy bullets.

The fact that Remington screwed the pooch when they decided to go SAMI with the Whelen did not help matters. Nobody can obviously find any hard data on the number of Whelen wildcats built, and most of those rifles were obviously built for reloaders...which means that ammunition sales are also not a valid means to track 35 Whelen popularity.

With "hard data" on the number of 35 Whelen wildcats out there simply not available, the fact is noone knows how many 35 Whelens are in use. However in my experience I have seen far more old wildcat semi custom Whelens than I have ever seen Remingtons or Rugers.

Likewise you can look at factory gun sales after 1988 but the argument cuts both ways. Yes the 9.3 is gaining, but a knowledgable reloader intent on acquiring a Whelen with a decent twist rate will likely go a semi custom route and rebarrel a mauser type action vs. buying a Remington. I have two friends who recently went that route. Just as likely, I have other friends who built semi custom 9.3s because they did not want to pony up the price for a CZ or Sako, and did not want the push-feed, clips, and plastic associated with a Tikka.

The 9.3 club here on the forum can bask in the sunlight about the popularity of the 9.3 (while it lasts). That is their perogative, and they can argue about the marginal differences in performance over their 9.3 shooting a bullet that a 35 Whelen can shoot (with the proper twist). They can also argue the DG route, but for the average North American hunter who never intends to set foot in Africa (like me...or if I did, I sure as hell would not be going after DG with either a 35 Whelen or a 9.3), it just does not matter. I don't buy or build rifles based on "popularity." Neither caliber will ever be truely popular in the US, and any bear or elk shot by either with the proper bullet will still be just as dead.

As I have stated several times on this forum, the whole argument comparing the two for North American big game is the equivalent of two bald men fighting over a comb.

Barstooler

quote:

Originally posted by Barstooler:
As I have stated several times on this forum, the whole argument comparing the two for North American big game is the equivalent of two bald men fighting over a comb.

Barstooler

I said it just a bit differently:

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
And now the moral of the story..... sooner or later we just grab a gun and go hunting and quit picking the fly shit out of the pepper!

Pretty much the same thing...just different words!

I was at the Steyr / Merkel distribution center in Trussville yesterday, and their director of sales told me the 9.3x62 was their hottest selling caliber over past year.

Out West, I know you folks see alot of Whelens, but they are rare in the Northeast and Southeast. I think it's definitely a regional thing for the Whelen, and that's OK, it's a nice cartridge with a long history.

We'll just have to wait and see if the popularity of the 9.3 is a phase or becomes a dominant choice.

Mike

It's all because the 9.3x62 case is 8grs larger. Everyone knows if they had built the 35 Brwon Whelen which is only .5grs smaller (actually larger adjusted for caliber) it would have won.

Probably 10 years ago the answer would have been the the other way. There wasn't much following of the 9.3 on the west side of the pond until the recent years.

My whole point in the above post is that for large, moderate velocity, medium bores, the two calibers have a hell of lot more in common than they do in differences.

We should be cooperating and trying to convince others to go with either -- which it is, I don't care because that is a personal choice.

Yet on this forum there is rarely something posted on the 35 Whelen or 338-06 that a 9.3 advocate does not jump onto the thread and do an off-topic post that starts preaching to everyone about the 9.3. It seems like any reference on this forum with a heading that includes "35 Whelen" is like catnip to the 9.3 crowd. (I note that this thread is an exception because the very topic is about the two). However, I don't even read 9.3 threads, let alone tell them how messed up they are for not buying a Whelen. Maybe I am just wired different, but that is my observation.

In essence, we are argueing about how many angels can dance on the head of a 35 caliber vs a 366 caliber bullet, when we should be advocating the merits of each.

To each his own, and if I ever post on a "9.3 only" thread, you all are authorized to shoot me in the head. Any of you 9.3'ers willing to step up to that about 35 Whelen only posts?

Barstooler

The difference is that the 9.3x62 was designed to get the optimum efficiency out of a standard Mauser 98 action.

The .35 Whelen wasn't designed at all. Someone simply opened the neck of cheap .30-06 brass and put .35 caliber bullets in it. Had someone actually designed it with performance in mind, it would have had the shoulder further forward, sort of like the AI version, but with a more gentle angle.

Like or not, design beats improvisation.

quote:

Originally posted by KurtC:
The difference is that the 9.3x62 was designed to get the optimum efficiency out of a standard Mauser 98 action.

The .35 Whelen wasn't designed at all. Someone simply opened the neck of cheap .30-06 brass and put .35 caliber bullets in it. Had someone actually designed it with performance in mind, it would have had the shoulder further forward, sort of like the AI version, but with a more gentle angle.

Like or not, design beats improvisation.

A somewhat interesting point of view.Hmmm roger

quote:

Originally posted by fourbore:
You can and perhaps should dispute my premise:

Why is Whelen going no place and 9.3 on the rise? .

I just looked among my rifles. There I saw a 35 Whelen, and your right, it was just sitting there, for now. But as I continued to observe, I noticed no rising 9.3!! In fact I never saw one at all!! Hmmm..