Gentlemen,

I've been tossing an idea around in my head about building a .357 Magnum rifle based off a Remington 700 short action.

I was thinking this gun could be used primarily for target shooting. I think you could get one to shoot sub-moa pretty easily and it would cost near nothing. The bullets are dirt cheap compared to a match .308 bullet or match .224 bullet. The savings in powder alone would be redecilous compared to any full size magnum case. I also plan to use the gun for varmit control (from the truck with a spotlight) and a close up small deer with the right bullet. Any thoughts on this?

I was wondering what I would need to open the bolt face to, and what chambering I would want the doner action to be to make this the easiest and least costly conversion?

Also, I doubt it's possible but do you think it would be feasible to adapt it to feed from the built in BDL box magazine?

Do they even make a .357 reamer long enough to pull through a 22-24 inch barrel?

I own a Marlin 1894 C and the ballistics must be seen to believe, there is a 500-600fps gain vs a pistol. It is very accurate.

Bolt would be nice esp. trigger, but you might get all you want in a TC contender carbine. There is always the 357 max that will give you a little more if you want it.

NICE accurate rifle with better trigger than lever if you can be happy with a single shot.

Just another option.

My wife ,some years ago, needed a rifle to shoot at 50 yds. that had low recoil and made a loud enough boom to compete with the other shooters at the range and was super accurate. Elmer Spurger, a really classy Grand Junction gunsmith made her a Ruger number 3 SS in 38 special with a 16 1/2" bull barrel. It met all of the criteria; a real tac driver.

My cousin has the rifle now and he is tickled shitless. roger

I expect reworking the bolt face, let alone getting it to feed from the magazine, would make for migraines. I'll second the idea of the single shot carbine. My T/C Contender 10 inch 357 magnum pistol shoots close to 2 inches at 100 yards with a 2x pistol scope; no telling how precise it might be with a stock and a conventional scope. Haven't shot the new G2 but the older models have superb triggers. I've long toyed with the idea of getting a 26 inch 357 magnum custom shop barrel for my Encore to serve as an off season plinker and quiet, close range, doe-popper. A couple years back Ruger made some No.1 rifles in 357 magnum for some state law enforcement commemorative; seemed silly at the time but for the task you describe it would be about perfect. As others have mentioned the 1894C makes for a very tidy little carbine and the triggers can be tuned up nicely by them as know how. Finally, a fella could rebarrel a Remington 600, Seven, or 700 SA in 358 Winchester and handload it with pistol bullets at most any velocity he wanted, and still have a full power game rifle when needed...

quote:

Originally posted by Waffen:
Gentlemen,

I've been tossing an idea around in my head about building a .357 Magnum rifle based off a Remington 700 short action.

I was thinking this gun could be used primarily for target shooting. I think you could get one to shoot sub-moa pretty easily and it would cost near nothing. The bullets are dirt cheap compared to a match .308 bullet or match .224 bullet. The savings in powder alone would be redecilous compared to any full size magnum case. I also plan to use the gun for varmit control (from the truck with a spotlight) and a close up small deer with the right bullet. Any thoughts on this?

I was wondering what I would need to open the bolt face to, and what chambering I would want the doner action to be to make this the easiest and least costly conversion?

Also, I doubt it's possible but do you think it would be feasible to adapt it to feed from the built in BDL box magazine?

Do they even make a .357 reamer long enough to pull through a 22-24 inch barrel?

any 35 (.358 dia) will shoot 357 pistol bullets.

get a good rifle in 358 win and you will have yer 357 tack driver

either that or rechamber a 22-250 to a 357-250!

i hereby name this cart the 357 tack driver x2

Gentlemen,

I appreciate the responses from all of you. This does answer a a few questions but I definatly have a few more.

I did spot a .357 Ruger #1 on GunBroker, I don't really want to pay what they were asking, and I'd have to install a new trigger in that gun anyway, and I hear it's hard to get the Moyers triggers down in the sub 1-lb area.

I would love to get a .358 mag as the doner action, however they are a long action and even if I can't get it to feed from the mag I would want it to be a short action.

I've also been thinking about how the feeding would work, I figure if I can't get it to feed correctly, I'll just sleve the action and make it a single shot. I would still prefer this over a Encore setup, as I can work on the gun myself much easier, and I can easily get the trigger down as light as I want, plus the aftermarket is there for parts.

I would also love to create some sort of wildcat based off a much bigger case, but honestly I dont' want to deal with case forming, and possible neck splitting on the 22-250 case.

Half the reason I plan on doing this is because I already load a ton of .357 for my blackhawk and would just like a bolt gun to compliment it.

I'm looking now and I could potentially just grab a really beatup reminton 700 short action, buy a 358 mag takeoff barrel from a remington 700 off ebay, have it setback and rechambered for .357 mag, then send the rifle off to be duracoated in matte black or something like that to make it at least look new.

It's looking to be something like this:
Used Rem700 SA: $300
.358 Win barrel: $150
HS Precision stock: $280
Setback and rechamber/install: $200
Shilen Trigger: $80
Midway Bedding kit: $20


So we are looking at 1030 for a "new" rifle.

I'm thinking that brass life would be around 10-40 rounds, bullets could be had for $60 per thousand (jacketed bullets) and powder would be around 20gr per load (H110/Win296).

Thoughts on this?

quote:

Thoughts on this?

Sounds like you're in business.

What twist rate would you use on a rifle such as this?

Waffen,
Build your rifle in 358Win (or 35Rem?). Get your 'smith to machine a chamber insert/cartridge adaptor to allow use of the 357Magnum ammunition. You get your single-shot rifle, plus a decent hunting firearm.
Cheers...
Con

the old remington 788 was made in 44 mag, possibly 357 mag; my books are in storage.

The 358 is based on the 308 necked up to 35, so it's a short action. (The 358 Norma Magnum is on an '06-lentgh action.) Few rifles were ever chambered for either cartridge and people who have them tend to hang on to them. Finding a take-off will be sporty, though stranger things have happened. You'd probably have better luck looking for a 358 blank.

Also, the 357 is a straight-wall case. Both 358's are bottlenecks, so you'd have to cut off the entire chamber and start from there, which won't leave enough diameter in the barrel to thread and fit the action.

So I'd just get a new barrel and start from there. I think Brownell's has something that would work.

You're on your own for making it feed.


Okie John

quote:

Originally posted by Waffen:
...I would love to get a .358 mag as the doner action, however they are a long action and even if I can't get it to feed from the mag I would want it to be a short action.

Hey Waffen, At one time Remington made a 35Rem M7KS. I saw one back around 1988 when they were $1200. A couple of years passed and I believe I saw it again on a Used Rifle rack for $800. Thought about it for awhile since I already had a 350RemMag M7KS and when I went back to ask about it, it had been sold.

If you had one of them, you could use the same 0.357" Bullets in it as well as the 0.358" Bullets. And you could down-load it to 357Mag levels if you wanted to very easily.

At one time there was a Pump Action 357Mag imported by IAI( I believe) and it might have been called the Lone Wolf. Anyone that remembers, jump in and correct me. It had an "Adjustable Angle" Rear Stock which turned out to be the weak point of the rifle. I kept waiting for them to make it in 357MAX and before I knew it, they were no longer being made. You occasionally see one at a Gun Show commanding obscene prices.

There are quite a few Lever Action rifles being made in 357Mag. I know Marlin does/did and Henry might still do also. Plus there are any number of imported Lever Actions that were/are available in the 357Mag.

And good old H&R makes a single shot in it. Obviously the H&R would not be nearly as expensive as what you are considring, but they do shoot quite well. Plus they will "Tune the Trigger" if you return it to them and tell them what you want.

quote:

I would also love to create some sort of wildcat based off a much bigger case, but honestly I dont' want to deal with case forming, and possible neck splitting on the 22-250 case.

Here the 35Rem would fill that nitch quite well and avoid the pitfalls of a Wildcat.

quote:

Half the reason I plan on doing this is because I already load a ton of .357 for my blackhawk and would just like a bolt gun to compliment it.

Here the Marlin Lever Action would be quite a nice companion piece.

The trick is to remember that if you stick with the 357Mag, the actual useful "distance" of the cartridge is more of a limitation, than the Action style. Putting a 357Mag in a Bolt Action still won't increase it's useful distance over a Lever Action or a Single Shot.

quote:

I'm looking now and I could potentially just grab a really beatup reminton 700 short action, buy a 358 mag takeoff barrel from a remington 700 off ebay, have it setback and rechambered for .357 mag, then send the rifle off to be duracoated in matte black or something like that to make it at least look new.

Maybe you can, but I'm not sure this is possible. I believe by the time you "shorten" the Chamber end of the barrel enough to "clean-up" a 35Rem, 358Win, etc., with a 357Mag Reamer that the "Outside Diameter" will have gone past the normal beginning of the Taper so the barrel shank is no longer wide enough to cut Threads on - to screw it into the Receiver. But you could get a "New Barrel" from one of the Barrel Makers though, just the way you want it.

If you get a Remington, there is no better Factory Trigger in existance. And you can either adjust it yourself, or have a GunSmith polish the Sear, install a new Spring and set it to your liking for about $25-$30.

quote:

I'm thinking that brass life would be around 10-40 rounds, bullets could be had for $60 per thousand (jacketed bullets) and powder would be around 20gr per load (H110/Win296). Thoughts on this?

I'd say that Case Life depends on how well your Chamber Dimensions match the Full Length Die Dimensions. And your range(10-40) is well within reason for a 357Mag.

If you were to P-FLR a 35Rem and used Reduced Loads or even Normal Loads, that range is also fairly close. If you throttle them up and Anneal the Necks, you could still get long Case Life - depending on how well the Chamber/Full Length Die Dimensions match.
---

Best of luck with your project.

quote:

Originally posted by orlop:
the old remington 788 was made in 44 mag, possibly 357 mag; my books are in storage.

44 Mag and 30-30, either of which might be modified to 357 Mag with cash. The Ruger 77/44 might be a candidate, too. The only 357 long gun I know of besides lever and single shots is the old Timberwolf pump.

Maybe a Spanish Destroyer 9MM Largo carbine would work?

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:
...the old Timberwolf pump...

That is what I was trying to think of.

I was thinking along the same lines, a bolt 357 mag. I emailed CZ and asked them if they would ever consider making their 527 action into a 357 bolt. Got back a fast and hard "Never."

I hope they reconsider. Since they make it for the 222/223 rim, as well as for the 7.62x39, I thought it may have some potential (still need to modify the magazine to handle a rimmed case, but that shouldn't be too tough, just shim a wedge-shape on both the interio fore and aft section of the mag, shorten the follower, and be done with it.

The cheaper route is to look for a NEF handi rifle in 357 Mag, but that's a single shot. You could also get a Marlin 1894 in 357 or a 336 in 35 Rem and load it down. My Marlin 336 / 35 Rem can keep 5 shots inside an inch with pistol bullets and a dose of Unique. Very fun to shoot.

"Do they even make a 357 reamer long enough to pull through a 22-24" barrel?".
Why would you need that? Opening , or bushing down, the boltface is no biggie but, getting rimmed cartridges to feed from a box mag is a trick. This was my biggest challenge on my Siamese mauser conversion to 45-70.

The rim size of the .357 cartridge is .440", so if you had a bolt face made for the .222-family of cartridges, you'd have to open it to .442" or so. If you have one made for the 6.8 SPC, it might accept a .357 case rim as is-but it might need a little opening up as well. If your bolt face is for a .308-size casehead, it is too big, and will need to have a shim soldered on.

In addition, your gadget might need to be a single-shot since the .357 is rimmed, and will not work in a magazine made for rimless rounds of a larger or smaller diameter. Making the magazine work with the .357 case might be pretty expensive, but it probably COULD be done.

It would probably be easier and less expensive to use a CZ 527 action, which is about the right length and has a detachable box magazine that one might be able to rework with less trouble. Since the CZ 527 actions are being made in 7.62X39mm, one of these could be used without any alteration to the bolt face, since the 7.62X39mm has a rim diameter of 0.445", just right for your .357 at 0.440"!

Easiest of all would be to buy one of those Ruger No.1's that were made in .357 Magnum to begin with. Several versions were made......


I would personally prefer the smaller, neater CZ action to a Rem. M700 for this.....

But the simplest solution would be to hunt down one of the Ruger No. 1 single-shots that is already chambered for the .357 Magnum. There are such things!

After much reading and thought, I think it might be cheaper to commision a double rifle in 357. Maybe you can get Jim DuBell to rebore a 30-06 Spartan if they ever come out.

I think if Ruger would start doing limited production runs in 'niche' rifles we might see a #1 mannlicher or 1A in say 357 or 357Max. Would that not be neat? Also, we need some 6.5 bores, in my opinion.

Those previous 357's are collectable and priced accordingly. Marlin's lever 1894 is hard to beat, light, handy, accurate, reliable, holds 9 rounds if you needed more than 1. If you shot one you would understand how fun it is, and if you did not like it, could sell it 'yesterday!' Used one's don't last long, so you could for $400 range pick one up, highly recommend it. A rem short action or gun would trade in for a good part of the cost.

Peep sighted mine, offhand, had a cluster of shots about 1-1.5" at 50 yds.....plenty accurate. Scoped they should do that at 75-100. It drops fast after 150, but you should see what it does to 2 liter water filled coke bottles to that distance!

The cheapest route is an NEF handirifle. Pick up a used one cheap, send it in and get a 357 mag barrel for $85.

I'm planning on doing just that with my kids handi rifle, and then I'll poke it out to 357 maximum. I had a 10" contender in 357 max and know what it'll do, with an extra 12" of barrel it'll be nice

A couple of comments:

1. If you can find a Mk. X "Mini" action in 7.62x39 cheaply enough, it should be easily adaptable (easy, compared to say a Remington 600 action). I have a Rem 722 sleeved as you suggest, but not for that cartridge, and it works fine for the purpose you describe.

2. How about making yourself a .35-BR? Just open the neck of the 7 BR case and go for it....put a block in the back of Rem 700 series short action .308 magazine and it shouldn't be too tough to make it feed. You can always load it to .38 Special levels or anywhere in between.

Straight 7BR is sweet as is, I own one! JDJ at SSK made a 338 JDJ on the BR case. Rich at Sierra used a 35 Rem case necked down to 25cal for light recoil =wife's gun-in a Mini action I believe.

Lots of choices but anything on a 250 savage case, BR case, and the 357/max are all options.

I think if you want the 35 bullets, and to feed in a Rem, then a 358 'BR' would be ideal, but you would just do a 358 Win and 'download'

A mini mauser in a 35 br would be neat! As much as I love the 357 mag and max, with the rim it really is a single shot or lever gun round. For a compact bolt action the 35 rem and 35 br are the way to go. There is also a 35 ppc type varient that would be an easy job in a 7.62X39 action.

http://www.reloadersnest.com/frontpage.asp?CaliberID=389

338 Whisper, uses 7BR cases, uses more powder than a 357, but perhaps blue dot loads could be used to duplicate 357 mag performance, but I would not know where to start.

A 338 Whisper would be RARELY seen if you want something even more different than a 357 mag/max

quote:

Maybe you can get Jim DuBell to rebore a 30-06 Spartan if they ever come out.

You mean you guys havent got these yet? Took a look at a SxS 30/06 a few weeks back ... they're okay with a bit of work. Personally I'm waiting to see if the 9.3x74R comes through, that might tempt me.
Cheers...
Con