Wstrnhuntr said,

quote:

The fact that a magnum crazed manufacturer like Wetherby found a place for it among their line of blunderbusses speaks volumes of its virtues.

Yeah, then they dropped it. I notice that they're still selling it in their overpriced ammo though.
Paul B.

maybe i should have named this thread bag on the 338-06 and tell me how much better whatever you have in your gunsafe is...maybe i should change religions and be convinced that unless it goes the speed of light and has a belt and you can only get 3 down below $3,000 mauser its crap, yes then and only then will there be wisdom in the world. hallelujah!

I was born and raised in CA. I couldn't see how I could ever afford a house there. If I had gotten into the crazy housing market and moved then the $ would be quite nice, but time spent living in AK was well worth the money I didn't make on CA real estate.

We can all choose to move, but it does take some sacrifices. It is well worth worth it

quote:

Originally posted by fredj338:
Ah Paul, some of us can't help that we live here. I have bought some property out of state & will hopefully be gone in 5-6 years. I like to shoot & hunt & Kalif. is just about the most inhospitable place to do either. Hey, but the weather is great! I hope the lefties keep moving here, especially the ones w/ money. My house will need a new owner.

You are right Paul, but when you have kids, mortgage, etc. it takes more planning. So now I've made the first step, bought the property. Next step, plan the move!

quote:

Originally posted by Wstrnhuntr:
My my, this is humorous.. ........ I like the "why bother with a 338 WM when you can load down an ultra" take.

Same reasoning that so many WM advocates find so usefull.

.

Glad to see someone finally noticed my sarcasm.

well i have a whelen & a 338wm..the whelen was my main hunting rifle last year..my hunting partner has my old whelen and loves it.he also has a Lewis 338wm. with that said he has a pre 64 at John Lewis being rebarreled to 338'06 & when midway marked their 338'06 barrels down to $199..I bought 1..there is really no reason for this stupidy, mine is just $600 less than his..

Gun World Magazine has an article on the .338-06. There is a picture of a box of Weatherby's ammo for the .338-06 marked.338-06 Weatherby Magnum. I think Weatherby is full of shit! Magnum? Yeah, right! Or is it a case of Weatherby thinks people are stupid?
Now I don't really have anything against the .338-06, I just don't need one. I have a perfectly good .35 Whelen and a very nice .338 Win. mag. I think all three rounds will do just what they were designed to do. Kill game efficiently.
Paul B.

I am with Paul,
I hunted Moose/Elk/Blackbear/deer in the eighties with a .35 Whelen. I used bitter root bonded core bullets of which I had 50 in total. It killed like the proverbial hammer of Thor. The bullets were 275 grain @ about 2200 fps. They actually under expanded at those velocities. After the bitter roots were finished I tried speer 250 grainers and found them to be way to soft on moose.Nosler did not have the .358 partitions at the time.
I sold the whelen and got a .338. It killed as well as the whelen on moose/elk/deer.
All shots were well below 150 yards with both the ,338 and .35 whelen. Except 1 moose at about 250 yards with the .338.
I imagine at the extremely rare occasion that I could shoot further then that, the .338 would have an advantage. To me its hypothetical almost.

Whack!!!

Just felt the need. Actually I considered building a 338-06 for a while, seemed to be a good compromise cartridge. However I got a good deal on a Mannlicher stocked Dumoulin in .338 Win so there was no more need.

I would "kill" to get a rifle such as that, I have only had one Dumoulin and the fullstock versions thereof are among my most favourite rifles, to say nothing of the fabulous .338 Win mag.

browningguy, you still have that old post hole digger?
Kutenay, he actually did get a good deal on that rifle...nearly stole it from me..

FWIW, Kutenay, I know you have some .338's but I have a pre 64 in a .338. Someone cut the barrel off to 23". It's sure handy, not that I'd cut one off but if you see one like that already cut..take a look at it.

.338-06

Any argument used to promote the 338wm over the 338-06 can also be used against it when compared to a larger cased 338. It's really a pointless debate. It seems to all boil down to the best cartridge being which ever one the particluar poster happens to own at the moment.

My Dakota 76 has a 23" bbl., I had five of those old Winchesters like yours, but, have only four now as a buddy did the same thing to me....BUT, mine are very nice and original and although I agree on the bbl length, I just can't cut them....maybe I should get a .338-06 to play with????

quote:

maybe I should get a .338-06 to play with????

In your part of the country I bet you stay with your .338 W.M.

You know the .338-06 isn't a bad idea. I've shot few animals with a .338 Win. but one was a quartering shot on a Grant's gazelle at 125 yards. It was literally slammed to the ground! I chronographed my loads ..225gr Hornadys later and they were only going 2750fps.

I'd like to build one (338-06) on a featherweight Win. rifle. Just rebarrel..and a 1" pad. This would be a good rifle to use a 200gr.Barnes bullet? I mounted a 2.5X8 Leupold on redfield low mounts. This might not be a bad set up for the 338-06 (maybe 1.5X6)...the bc's are fairly good for the 200gr. bullets and longer range shots wouldn't be out of the question. I ended up shooting a hartebeest at over 300 yards with the slow 225's from the .338 mag.
I think it would make a nice lightweight .338...the Dumoulin was lighter weight (I've forgotten what it weighed) but not that bad to shoot.

quote:

Originally posted by dempsey:
Any argument used to promote the 338wm over the 338-06 can also be used against it when compared to a larger cased 338. It's really a pointless debate. It seems to all boil down to the best cartridge being which ever one the particluar poster happens to own at the moment.

No it can't, because the 338 win mag is a world standard hunting round, rifles and ammo available where large critters are hunted. The same doesn't apply for the larger cased 338's. That is also the reason for the 338 win mag over the 338-06.

Hey TerryP/Sendero, good to see you back on the board, thought you had gone missing for a while.

quote:

Originally posted by Paul H:

quote:

Originally posted by dempsey:
Any argument used to promote the 338wm over the 338-06 can also be used against it when compared to a larger cased 338. It's really a pointless debate. It seems to all boil down to the best cartridge being which ever one the particluar poster happens to own at the moment.

No it can't, because the 338 win mag is a world standard hunting round, rifles and ammo available where large critters are hunted. The same doesn't apply for the larger cased 338's. That is also the reason for the 338 win mag over the 338-06.

Don't buy that much. Most people here could care less if their cartridge is a world standard hunting round, I said most not all, if it matters to you than the .338wm is certainly right up your alley. And if that standard is truly important skip the .338wm and get a 375hh. I think the .338-06 folks are people who want things and perhaps the 338wm people must feel a logical connection for their choice. I suppose I've never understood the need to come to any conclusions as to what is the "best" cartridge.

answer this...

is a handloaded 338-06 better than the 30-06 at killing large game?

What is even more amazing is how anyone can get upset because someone else does not like the caliber they like....

When you ask for an opinnion and that opinnion does not agree with you, then its your fault for asking in the first place...Everyone sure has a right to an opinnion on any caliber.

My take on the 338-06 is it went defunk with the advent of the 338 Win..and I shot the 338-06 up to that point...I cannot justify one reason to use a 338-06 over a .338 Win. and I think all the excuses like less recoil, not valid, they kick the same.. The availability of 06 brass is a joke to me, it just never held much water IMO....338 bulk cases are cheap...and you can load a .338 down to 338-06 velocity but not the reverse..

Why one cannot see the advantage of the 338 Win over a 338-06 is beyond me, but to each his own, I don't really care what anyone else shoots.

This is not "bashing" the 338-06 its my opinnion on the caliber, I have an opinnion on most calibers....The 338-06, like the 30-06, the 338 Win., 35 Whelen and 9.3x62 is a good cartridge, and to point out advantages and disadvantages on calibers is one the options we have in these conversations, else we all shoot the 30-06 and have no need for any other caliber, and that just might be a good solution that I could live with, but thats just my opinnion!

If strking velocity, bullet type (exact) and SD are the same, the .338 would have a real world advantage in greater bullet momentum (greater mass) and a theoretical one in larger frontal area; therefore larger permanent wound channel.

That ought to start a bigger argument yet.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
answer this...

is a handloaded 338-06 better than the 30-06 at killing large game?

That's actually a very difficult question to honestly answer. First you have to define big game, are you talking 200-300 pound animals, or 700-1500 pounds?

The most important first step is divorcing oneself from the case, and looking at the bullet, as that is what does the work. If you take that step, then you'll undertand the 338 win mag, but that's an asside.

Are there situations where the larger heavier bullet does a better job than a smaller lighter bullet? Yes, but it not in every case, and it's likely a smaller percentage of cases vs larger. The real issue is what type of wound channel do you want, ie how large in dia, and how deep? A small bore, which I classify as 30 cal and under can either produce a large or a deep wound, but not both. A medium bore can achieve both.

If you want to poke a reasonable hole through both shoulders of a brown bear, and everything in between, a 250 gr or heavier, and .338 or larger bullet will reliably do the job, for 30 cal and under, you can poke the deep hole but it will be a smaller hole. If you're going for a double lung shot on a deer or similar sized animal, I don't think you'll see any difference in performance.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
What is even more amazing is how anyone can get upset because someone else does not like the caliber they like....

When you ask for an opinnion and that opinnion does not agree with you, then its your fault for asking in the first place...Everyone sure has a right to an opinnion on any caliber.

My take on the 338-06 is it went defunk with the advent of the 338 Win..and I shot the 338-06 up to that point...I cannot justify one reason to use a 338-06 over a .338 Win. and I think all the excuses like less recoil, not valid, they kick the same.. The availability of 06 brass is a joke to me, it just never held much water IMO....338 bulk cases are cheap...and you can load a .338 down to 338-06 velocity but not the reverse..

Why one cannot see the advantage of the 338 Win over a 338-06 is beyond me, but to each his own, I don't really care what anyone else shoots.

This is not "bashing" the 338-06 its my opinnion on the caliber, I have an opinnion on most calibers....The 338-06, like the 30-06, the 338 Win., 35 Whelen and 9.3x62 is a good cartridge, and to point out advantages and disadvantages on calibers is one the options we have in these conversations, else we all shoot the 30-06 and have no need for any other caliber, and that just might be a good solution that I could live with, but thats just my opinnion!

That's all well & good Ray, but it makes too much sense.

We can't keep 'em all riled up if you're gonna start making sense....

Ray is right of course but if a .338-06 floats your canoe, then use it, I do. I also like the .338mags but see no reason to down load anything, just change rifles. Really, if downloading was the key, then why not a .338rum?
Paul H, you are also exactly right. The .30-06 is a good round. As the size of game goes up, the .338-06 is slightly better w/ bigger bullets making bigger holes.

I am new to this site, but I can't believe the argument going on over the 338-06 vs the 338 Win.Mag. Both are excellent cartridges and in real world hunting situations I don't know if anyone could honestly tell the difference in a critter shot with either.

To me it's kind of like argueing a 25-06 vs 257 Weatherby, 280 vs 7 mag or 30-06 vs 300 Win. Mag.

They all do the job, the magnums shoot a little flatter and and retain more energy. The million dollar question: Is burning the extra powder, enduring more recoil and muzzle blast worth the the gains? To some people it is well worth it, to others they can get by just fine with standard cartridges.

In my personal experiences with the 338 WM and the 338-06, I have not been able to tell much difference in field results. I don't think the elk, deer, antelope or bears have been able to tell the difference either. The only place I could tell the difference is with the chronograph and felt recoil. A 338 Win. Mag. does recoil more, it is a simple matter of physics.

But, a very strong argument could be made for the 338-06 if the major firearms manufacturers and ammunition companies would start chambering and producing ammo.
I really wish that the major gun companies would come out with the 338-06 rifles that are affordable. It is a very good cartridge. But, the 338 Win. Mag is more powerful. For someone who wants an off the shelf rifle and ammo, the 338 Win. Mag is the way to go.

Now, should we start a discussion on what is the best cartridge for deer? Or better yet elk?

quote:

, else we all shoot the 30-06 and have no need for any other caliber, and that just might be a good solution that I could live with, but thats just my opinnion!

Ray, you can have the 30-06. I know it is a great cartridge, but to say--as some do--that its killing power meets or exceeds the 338-06 and .35 Whelen is pure BS. If I never see another article on the '06 it will be too soon. I'll take the .308 over any of the other .30 calibers. Now it is time for the '06 worshipers to jump in and flame me.

It's just like you said Ray--everyone is entitled to their opinion, but some people just can't stand it when you post it.

SDHunter, that's just what we do around here.

The avatar shown by tiggertate is enough to make any healthy man kinda forget about .338s, .338-06s. .30-06s and most everything else. It makes me want to visit Texas....and I hate hot places!

quote:

Originally posted by Paul H:

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
answer this...

is a handloaded 338-06 better than the 30-06 at killing large game?

That's actually a very difficult question to honestly answer. First you have to define big game, are you talking 200-300 pound animals, or 700-1500 pounds?

The most important first step is divorcing oneself from the case, and looking at the bullet, as that is what does the work. If you take that step, then you'll undertand the 338 win mag, but that's an asside.

Are there situations where the larger heavier bullet does a better job than a smaller lighter bullet? Yes, but it not in every case, and it's likely a smaller percentage of cases vs larger. The real issue is what type of wound channel do you want, ie how large in dia, and how deep? A small bore, which I classify as 30 cal and under can either produce a large or a deep wound, but not both. A medium bore can achieve both.

If you want to poke a reasonable hole through both shoulders of a brown bear, and everything in between, a 250 gr or heavier, and .338 or larger bullet will reliably do the job, for 30 cal and under, you can poke the deep hole but it will be a smaller hole. If you're going for a double lung shot on a deer or similar sized animal, I don't think you'll see any difference in performance.

elk, moose and big bears in a pinch

Buying a Magnum knowing you're going to load it down is like marrying a big-tittied woman knowing you're going to talk her into breast reduction surgery. It just ain't right.

Those critters are what the medium bores are made for. The smaller bore is usually up to the task, but not always.

Another analogy to the downloaded magnum is someone buying a vet, and intending to always drive the speed limit

I'm kind of amazed that anyone would claim the 338-06 recoils with same force as the 338. Run the numbers; you'll find that the 338 has 15% to 30% more recoil than the 338-06. When dealing with big bullets, it doesn't take much velocity increase to create a big difference in recoil. And of course, the 338 generally wants more gun weight and a longer barrel. Oh, and it's quite a bit louder, too.

Next take a look at the trajectory tables. The Hornady book was the closest to hand so using their numbers with the 338" 250 grain spire point, let's say the 06 can drive it 2600 fps and the 338 2800 fps. So the extra powder, barrel length, gun weight, recoil, and noise gets you... 1.2 inches less drop at 300 yards.

Yeah, the .338 is one of the world's greatest cartridges and the .338-06 is worthless.

Very good, Noel H.

It`s amazing how a hole of .338dia can create such a long thread where emotions gets high!. But I guess there`s alot of good personallity in the 338-0 6!

I second Noel H.

The gun safe at my house is missing the 338 Win. Mag. But, I have two 338-06's with plans for a third.

I will repeat my wish for the big manufacturers to start producing off the shelf 338-06's and ammunition. I think a lot of hunters could benefit from using it.

Weatherby had the right idea, just not in a $1300 gun and $40 dollar a box ammo.

The 338-06 will do everything the mag will do, just not as fast, with as much energy, powder or recoil.

I am a big fan of the 338-06, I have been converted. But I will not bad mouth the 338 Win. Mag. it is a great over the counter combination.

I keep coming back to the 30-06 vs 300 Win. Mag. Both tremendous cartridges. Is one better? Depends. Same theory applies to this topic.

Glad to see I'm not alone in my good feelings for the 338-06. Of course, I've also considered having a perfectly good 30-06 rechambered to 318 Westley Richards, so you might want to take that into consideration before agreeing too strongly with anything I write.

Oh, and BTW, I really don't have anything against the 338 either, other than my usual misgivings about the kind of people who think the only good cartridge has to "have a belt and raise a welt" .

If a 338-06 floats your boat use it.
If there is no need for it then there is no need for a lot of other cartridges.
what the need for a .223 when there is now the .220 Swift, why buy a 6.5x55 when you can get a 264 win mag, you don't need a 280 you can get a 7mm ultra mag, throw away all of your 30-06's just get a 300 ultra or a 30-378, why have a 338win when you can just get a 338-378 and load like a 338 win. etc. etc.

Heck with all of them just take a 375 H&H and hunt everything and sell all the rest of your rifles for scrap metal, oh wait a minute though I can buy a 375 ultra or a 378 weatherby mag and load it down to 375 H&H so I guess I dont need it either.
If I didn't reload then the only pratical choice would be the 338 win.
I am going to shoot what I want to shoot regardless. I've never owned, not shot a 338-06, don't know if I ever will but if that is what is someone else wants i am all for it.

Why own a 338 Wm when the 340 Wby clearly renders it totally usless? After all the 340 can be loaded down. There is really no point in a 338 WM because thwere is something else that can do all it can do and more. You guys need to give up your futile attachment to this inadequate cartridge.

Steve and I were talking after our day at the range,I said I got 2750+ from my 338-06,he answered you know that's awefully close to my 2850 I get with my 338WM.I agreed,but pointed out the load was too hot.That about sums it up doesn't it.

I have 30-06s a 338-06, 338wm and bunch of others.

They all have killed the game I have shot with them.

Use a good bullet and they all work about the same.

The bullet goes in messes the lungs up ect and kills what ever it hits.

If one wants a increase in power ones has to step to something over 40 cal.

OK I get it!! some of us like the 30-06, some like the 338-06 and some like the .338 Win. but none of us like Kalifornia! right?