.

I have a couple rifles that shoot patters with stuff they don't like but shoot really great with stuff they do. Before giving up on them you might try a few more brands and weights.

ALF,

That's been my experience with all of the Hornady Superformance, light magnum and whatever else they have made. You might try something else before writing the brand of rifle off. But I to admit I have never owned one of those Ruger "funny guns", too ugly for me.

I understand but in my experience each rifle is an entity unto itself. I have a 7-08 that only shoots two factory loads worth a darn. Tried 12 different factory combinations. I have a 6.5-300 that can't bullets on paper using 130 grain Sciroccos. Load 140 A-frames and it shoots under 1.25 inches. Load 127 grain TTSX and it regularly clover leafs.

I have other rifles that simply do not care what I load in them.

Good luck with the rifle.

Alf,
I bought a 338WM Ruger last year. The bedding was not right and the forearm was touching on one side so I re-bedded. But the gun wouldn't shoot.
Eventually, I cleaned out the bedding compound under the recoil lug. Apparently, the tape I put on the bottom of the lug allowed a grain or two of bedding compound to set-up and cause instability. It was easy to clean out.

The gun now shoots 0.75-1.00". I would expect that the action-barrel on your barrel is fine, maybe excellent, judging on my experience with Ruger.

yes, I like Tikka's, too. The Tikka's usually work out of the box, but the Ruger are even better for the reloader/epoxy-bedder. the Ruger provide Control-Feed and strike me as a stronger action for calibers from 338WM and more powerful. When I buy a Ruger Hwekeye, I plan on re-bedding from the beginning, and I even change the striker spring from the beginning. If someone doesn't want to do that, then I would recommend the Tikka or Ruger American, and that rules out a 375Ruger, 416Ruger, or any heavy wildcat on 3.4" magazine action.

I had a #1A that shotgunned 140 Hornadys and clover-leaved Federal 175s. That's a fact.

Yup! X2! I have found that, in the circumstances I have observed that Superformance ammo produces patterns, instead of groups. Yet when I reload my brother's 300 RCM with Superformance powder it groups very nicely.

quote:

Originally posted by Cougarz:
ALF,

That's been my experience with all of the Hornady Superformance, light magnum and whatever else they have made. You might try something else before writing the brand of rifle off. But I to admit I have never owned one of those Ruger "funny guns", too ugly for me.

As for the stock design, I found it clubby. It's not unlike a Lee-Enfield Jungle Carbine.
Ruger's original RCM design was spot on.

Personally I plan on bedding every factory rifle I buy and free floating the barrel.

Great if I don't have too.

I had a Remington 700 300wm that wouldn't group on a 8x11 paper at 50 yards new out of the box.

As I was checking it and tightening the action screws I noticed the barrel move up wards. There was so much material at the tip of the stock one could see the barrel move up wards.

I free floated the barrel then it was an inch and half rifle bedded it now it is a 3/4 rifle.

The worse Ruger bolt gun I have in the family is a 1.25 inch 338WM with the best loads. I have six or eight of them. Except the NO.1 they all have had the triggers replaced and have been bedded.

But so has all my other 15 or 20 bolt guns.

The only one that hasn't been bedded is the newest and I haven't got around to doing it yet.

Most factory firearms perform adequately out of the box. Some perform exceptionally out of the box. Some perform horribly out of the box.

But they are all made on an assembly line with what ever parts that the person has at hand.

Considering this the overall good record of massed produced fire arms is great.

From what I have seen of many so called custom and way higher priced firearms. Doesn't give me a lot of confidence in the performance of some of them ether.

Many times here we have seen complaints about some custom firearms.

I have a Ruger .338WM African model like the one above, except that it does not have a muzzle brake, and comes with a walnut stock. It is quite a nice looking rifle.

Since hunting in Alaska the weather can be hard to stocks and because I didn't want to scratch it, before I shot it I bought a MaCmillan Classic stock with a Decelerator recoil pad installed for a LOP of 12-1/2"

I took it to the range a couple of days ago, and took several shots around the target to finally print somewhere near the center and around +2 at 100 yards, then placed another target over the top of the first one. I cleaned the rifling and let it cool for a while, then took 2 shots using Federal 250-grain NOS Partition bullets. Got 2 holes next to each other. Then took two more shots using A Switft ammo 210-grain Scirocco, and got two shots right next to each other about 4" above the 250-grain holes on the target.

But I use a rifle rest where the rifle stock does not rest on my shoulder, and with a 20-pound bag of lead shot. I can shoot hard-recoiling rifles such as the .300 and .338WM and not worry about my shoulder, which helps to concentrate on sighting and figuring problems with the rifle or scope. Yes, I do pull the "rested" rifle toward my shoulder when firing it, but no recoil is felt on my shoulder.

Some are very expensive, but mine is cheap
https://www.midwayusa.com/prod...-rifle-shooting-rest

To each his own I guess. One of the most accurate rifles I've ever owned was a full up stock Ruger in 416 Rigby. Virtually anything I fed it, shot to POI.

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:
To each his own I guess. One of the most accurate rifles I've ever owned was a full up stock Ruger in 416 Rigby. Virtually anything I fed it, shot to POI.

I have another Ruger .338WM (stainless steel) that may not be the most accurate, but from a clean and cool barrel it always hits the target three times right in the center +3" high. The pattern is around 1" to maybe 1-1/2".

I have upmost confidence on this rifle when moose hunting in Alaska, because it never fails to shoot exactly the same as long as I do my part. But the other rifle I mentioned before surprised me in a very positive way (quite accurate with two different types of loads).

With rifles such as the .300WM and the .338WM, the easiest on my shoulder and most efficient way to sight is by using a solid rifle rest that absorbs the recoil. It takes the human element out of the picture, which in turn helps you concentrate on sighting the rifle and troubleshooting problems (if any) with the bedding, scope, and rifle.

By the way, I have found that the "3-shot at 25 yards rifle sight" at "youtube.com" is quite useful at 100 yards. Out to 100 yards I take at shot while aiming to the right spot on the target, then aiming at the same spot as before-without moving the rifle whatsoever-I reach over to the scope turret and move the reticle to the bullet hole. That action aligns the reticle with the rifle's barrel.

I am a Ruger fan but quickly admit their quality control has suffered with their explosive growth. Fortunately they do a good job of resolving the problems that never should have left the factory. I own presently own 6 Ruger Bolt action rifles. My most recent, a 7MM-08 Ultralight has not been fired yet. Going from top to bottom.

Hawkeye Predator 6.5 Creedmoor. Can shoot 3 shots Hornady factory GMX stuff under a half inch. My best handloads have yet to top that, but I haven't really rung it out yet.

Ruger Model 77 257 Roberts Ultralight. It didn't take much to find a load that would give me 1.5 inch groups. That is this guns load. I don't need any better out of it.

Ruger Hawkeye 7MM-08 ultralight is unfired.

Ruger Hawkeye 30-06. It is fairly new. My best load for it so far is about 1.5 inches. I am hoping to find better, though these Ruger Ultralights can be fussy. They aren't true ulralights either. To me they feel perfect in the hand.

Ruger 77/22LR at 50 yards it'll do 1/2 inch groups with several different brands of cheap factory.

Ruger 77/22MAG at 50 yards its best ammo is about a half inch. Most other stuff is closer to an inch.



It amazes me that Ruger's cheap American series rifles are generally much more accurate and much less fussy than their flagship Hawkeye. I have always loved the M77s and Hawkeyes though.

ALF, it sounds like Tikka is the gun for you. You'll likely love them, though if you are unfortunate enough to get one with a problem, TIKKA customer service has a reputation for being a PITA.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
PaulBarnard:

Yep I have Tikka T3 lite in 300 win mag

Plastic fantastic or otherwise known as simply my Tupperware gun

Tack driver if ever I saw one ! scary scary precise !

With safes full of old guns I sometimes get distracted into the realm of new "funny guns"
I have a 6.5 Creed in one of those Ruger RPR renditions.... it shoots ok

Anyhow its off to the drawing board with that Ruger guide thing... load up and down the bullet weight scale and the likes then comes the bedding thing. A winter project for sure !

I wonder if shooting it 20 times, and bushing/cleaning the rifling every 5 rounds would make the groups tighter. I could be wrong, but the pattern on your target seems to be sort of round, which leads me to believe that the barrel would benefit from some breaking-in. I would think that if the action is tight against the stock and there was a bedding problem, there would be stringing. The same for a loose scope.

But please take what I say wth a grain of salt, since I am far from knowing what the problem is.

Meanwhile, maybe you can find something in here:
http://www.fieldandstream.com/...our-innacurate-rifle

http://www.range365.com/how-di...ure-inaccurate-rifle

This one will take you all night to read
http://www.ballisticstudies.co...+and+Ballistics.html

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
Ah there it is ! There is a fix ! always
But this brings me to the crux of the matter at hand.

If you buy a truck you expect the truck to do what trucks do, " Truck things " from get go out the showroom door !

You don't buy the truck then take it back have them redo, re wire refit and then you drive out !

Why is this necessary with these rifles ?

I live in a remote place where there are no gun smiths, no access to stuff to bed guns with , no access to Brownell's thanks to the last US Government regulations.

I expect a rifle to at least adhere to some semblance of precision, even if its group is 4 inches... not fricken spread across the north !

I really like the feel of the "funny gun" and that muzzle break, it works ! no recoil , yes it lifts your hair when it goes off but nothing on the shoulder. I have a short reach and the spacer thing is actually quite helpful in my case.

Overall I think having this short tube short in the stock works for me...... if only the fricken thing will group !

I don't want to sound arrogant when I say it but what you need is a blaser r-8. If you want a engineered bedding system - that is what you need.

I have had good luck with my Rugers.

I have 2 Alaskans and one Africa in 375 ruger.

30/06 with Wayne/ahr custom bedding

300 win mag getting bedded

30/06 ruger number 1 bought on ar that is super accurate

6.5 creedmoor I bought today

I think they are good value for money - not as good a money for value for accuracy as a tikka. But the new tikkas are a plastic gun and not a nice solid plastic gun like a blaser that costs 5x - again the trade off.

My complain is what is screwed up in America where we sell millions of guns - especially in Florida - but a finding a gunsmith to do basic bedding in the state in like winning the lottery.

Mike

I find this thread very interesting cause it raise the core issue - what makes an accurate rifle.

My most accurate rifle platform is the blaser and I think its core factors are - barrel quality, bedding quality and the trigger. The action - push, controlled, blaser etc. is kind of irrelevant.

The rugers have good barrels at least the new ones do (cold hammer forged), the action is well made, the trigger is good not great. The issue has to be bedding.

I have left out rings and scope.

i would like to bed my 375 rugers.

Mike

Having been involved in the manufacturing, maintenance, repair and training on aerospace structures for 30+ years I think I have somewhat of an idea of modern manufacturing techniques. Most manufactures now use some kind of CNC milling machines. People who buy products made from them like to rave about how great and accurate things are now and they can be. The real reason companies use this machining method is because without it they couldn't stay competitive. It's all about efficiency.

Quality though is still in hands of the programmer, operator and most of all in the philosophy of the companies quality management system. The most repeatable machining equipment in the world still depends on how a company verifies whether by machine (like CMM) or visually by physical inspection the product being produced and what the standards are that they set.

Thinking that a "smart" machine is somehow going to turn out great products all by itself is a common problem in today's manufacturing world. Adequate quality control costs money that eats into the bottom line more than shareholders like. But without it the results can be disastrous. Unfortunately too many companies and consumers seem to think that CNC machines can do no wrong.

We all like the look and feel of old well made guns but the hand fitting used to make them costs too much for the average mid priced guns of today. So a manufacturer has two choices, either maintain the old world feel and price it out of range of the average buyer or redesign the gun to simplify manufacturing. This is essentially what guns like Tikka have done. It's fairly easy to produce a Tikka compared to even a relatively simple design like a Remington model 700 and maintain quality. The other benefit is Tikka/Sako obviously has a great quality control system in place. Remington on the other hand has suffered after being taken over by a company the only seems to care about the profit margin so their quality has gone way down.

Nobody would ever call a Tikka T-3 or a Ruger American pretty but they are accurate, inexpensive with lower priced materials. That's what sells in today's market. Older designs look and feel nice plus they tend to function better if well made. But the cost to make them at a competitive price means something has to give and what generally does is unfortunately quality.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray Alaska:
I wonder if shooting it 20 times, and bushing/cleaning the rifling every 5 rounds would make the groups tighter. I could be wrong, but the pattern on your target seems to be sort of round, which leads me to believe that the barrel would benefit from some breaking-in.

My .308 RPR was good for 1.5" 5 shot groups at 100. I was not especially happy. After approx 60 rounds it commenced to behave; another 100 rds later and groups are in the 3/4" range - about as good as I can shoot with fixed 10X. Of note, fouling (carbon and Cu++) comes out much quicker vs the first couple times.

quote:

My complain is what is screwed up in America where we sell millions of guns - especially in Florida - but a finding a gunsmith to do basic bedding in the state in like winning the lottery.

Bedding is very easy do it your self. I bedded my first rifle when I was 14.

Read the instructions make sure you have every thing coated with release agent and bed them.

But after doing dozens it is still a relief when they pop out of the stock.

quote:

Originally posted by Samuel_Hoggson:

quote:

Originally posted by Ray Alaska:
I wonder if shooting it 20 times, and bushing/cleaning the rifling every 5 rounds would make the groups tighter. I could be wrong, but the pattern on your target seems to be sort of round, which leads me to believe that the barrel would benefit from some breaking-in.

My .308 RPR was good for 1.5" 5 shot groups at 100. I was not especially happy. After approx 60 rounds it commenced to behave; another 100 rds later and groups are in the 3/4" range - about as good as I can shoot with fixed 10X. Of note, fouling (carbon and Cu++) comes out much quicker vs the first couple times.

That's what I was thinking when I saw the photo of the target. And like you, I would just break-in the barrel by shooting and cleaning up to 20 rounds. If I see an improvement, then I know that the rifling needs further polishing (more firing). That's another reason for using a rest like the one in the link I posted above.

What concerns me most about Ruger M77s is their reliability. It seems the Zimbabwe PH trainers are not impressed with them in either push-feed or CRF iterations.

A hunting mate has a CRF model in 9.3x62 that missfires if the mainspring and firing pin are not well oiled. As another AR member noted, the spring seems to bunch up at the ends. Though the action is in most ways bigger than a 98 Mauser, the spring is narrower and looks a bit twee to me.

The mate asked Ruger to send him another spring but they replied that he had to send the bolt back to them for fitting. Knowing the legal hassles of sending firearm parts back and forth from the US and Australia, that would be a nightmare.

Would you take a rifle like that to Africa, ALF?

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
What concerns me most about Ruger M77s is their reliability. It seems the Zimbabwe PH trainers are not impressed with them in either push-feed or CRF iterations.

A hunting mate has a CRF model in 9.3x62 that missfires if the mainspring and firing pin are not well oiled. As another AR member noted, the spring seems to bunch up at the ends. Though the action is in most ways bigger than a 98 Mauser, the spring is narrower and looks a bit twee to me.

The mate asked Ruger to send him another spring but they replied that he had to send the bolt back to them for fitting. Knowing the legal hassles of sending firearm parts back and forth from the US and Australia, that would be a nightmare.

Would you take a rifle like that to Africa, ALF?

Last Zim ph I hunted with in July loved his ruger 458 Lott.

Alaskan guides who put their guns thru use and abuse no African ph does like the rugers especially the Alaskan models.

Ruger cast their actions

https://www.americanrifleman.o...ment-casting-process

The new barrels are cold hammer forged.

https://gundigest.com/how-to/g...rs-cold-hammer-forge


Mike

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
What concerns me most about Ruger M77s is their reliability. It seems the Zimbabwe PH trainers are not impressed with them in either push-feed or CRF iterations.

A hunting mate has a CRF model in 9.3x62 that missfires if the mainspring and firing pin are not well oiled. As another AR member noted, the spring seems to bunch up at the ends. Though the action is in most ways bigger than a 98 Mauser, the spring is narrower and looks a bit twee to me.

The mate asked Ruger to send him another spring but they replied that he had to send the bolt back to them for fitting. Knowing the legal hassles of sending firearm parts back and forth from the US and Australia, that would be a nightmare.

Would you take a rifle like that to Africa, ALF?

You can buy a replacement spring 24 pounds. (I think wolfe markets them for Ruger M77 bolts. I'm away from home this month.) That should solve the problem, nicely. If you would like they have 27-28 pound springs available, too. I got one but have never used it because the 24 pound springs do the trick.

PS: replacing striker springs is pretty easy and you do not need to buy one of the kits. I got a kit and discovered that it did not work with a ruger lefty bolt. So a little research on the web and a trip to a hardware store for the correct size of tubes and pins (I forget what) and it was easy.

Too often Ruger sends out products in need of some kind of tinkering. You don't see that as much with other manufacturers. It's a damn shame that such a prominent US gun manufacturer has let QC go to hell. ALF has two of their higher end offerings that won't hit a grapefruit at 100 yards.

quote:

Mainsprings and bedding, sending it off for another grands worth of tweaking ! sage advice ! "Clean the gun" Seriously now ? this is a brand new out the factory, never been fired rifle !

The firing pin spring and some epoxy cost about $15. Not a huge investment, but it gives confidence and acquaintance with a new rifle. I find I like it. JI recommend mounting one's scope, too, and Ruger provides some of the strongest scope rings available.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
Would I take that 338 to Africa ? Hell no not in its current state !

But again it comes down the fact that everyone here has a "fix" for something else that's not right with the rifle.

The mere thought or idea that a hunting rifle is not field ready out the box and by this i'm not talking bench rest precision , just enough to actually hit a moose when you are pointing the gun at it is beyond my grasp !

Mainsprings and bedding, sending it off for another grands worth of tweaking ! sage advice ! "Clean the gun" Seriously now ? this is a brand new out the factory, never been fired rifle !

Yes I push a rod down its gullet and clean the factory shit out the barrel !

Someone suggested a Caldwell rest ? Hmm nope The rest you see on my pic is one I built in Metal shop when I was in grade 10 has served my very very well; thank you for offering

Lapping a barrel I get, shooting in a barrel I get but if "cleaning" a barrel 20 times or 30 times or however many times one comes up with is a fix for a pattern that is larger than a paper picnic plate then something is seriously amiss here.

ALF,

My intention was not to offend you in any way, in fact I don't think that anybody here means to do that. And yes, I understand that a new rifle should not shoot that way, but it often happens with production rifles. Otherwise writers would not be writing articles about how to clean and break-in the bore of new guns.

I would try some standard ammo in it first. If you handload, try a Barnes 225 grain TTSX fueled by 67.5 grains IMR4350, Win 215M or CCI 250 primer in Winchester cases. (Bump the charge weight up to 68.5 grains if using Norma cases) Seat the bullet fifty thousandths from the lands.

That load has shot submoa for me in five 338 Win Mags (Browning Abolt, Xbolt, Weatherby Vanguard, Remington 700x2). If that load won't shoot well in the rifle, you most likely have bedding or barrel problems. It's standard practice from my point of view to properly bed a bolt action rifle. I don't expect them to shoot their best without a stable bedded platform. One exception to that would be Browning Xbolts as they come bedded from the factory.

I gave up on Ruger bolt action centerfire rifles in the early 1990s.

quote:

If you handload, try a Barnes 225 grain TTSX fueled by 67.5 grains IMR4350, Win 215M or CCI 250 primer in Winchester cases. (Bump the charge weight up to 68.5 grains if using Norma cases) Seat the bullet fifty thousandths from the lands.

Yes, good shooting details. My 338's have used 69.0 to 70.8 grains of Rel-17 behind the 225 TTSX, depending on the chamber size, etc., either 215FedM or WLRM primers, Hornady, Win, and Nosler brass, 2835fps.

That is a take-anything bullet load. Great ranging downrange against wind. Haven't recovered one yet, but good wound channels and bone-crunching integrity.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
"Moosegitter" perhaps

So out came the torque wrench thingy and all the action screws tightened and cinched down.

Ran the brush and patchy things through the bore a couple of times until squeaky clean

Then brewed a batch
68gr H4350 Fed 215 Match 225 STT's seated to the cannelure groove



So now it's going to be playing with seating depth, a grain or two more and we will see what this Ruger is made of.

Hah! Your' getting there. Was the velocity about the same across the 3 shots? Probably not, and that why it strings a little to the right/left?. But again, I don't know much about it since I was not there.

One thing for certain is that I would do the following next:

a. Take one shot as "I" aim exactly on the spot I was aiming before, then have someone moving the reticle to RIGHT, above the bullet hole (without looking at the LEFT or RIGH direction on the turret, just moving right on my direction as I carefully hold the rifle steady as a rock). All I want to do in this case is to move the reticle so that the center is aligned with an imaginary vertical line drawn across the bullet holes.

b. Now i would take two shots and see where they print.

c. UP/DOWN I can decide after.

And don't forget that we all are just trying to help.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
And don't forget that we all are just trying to help.



Off course just me being pissy !

But seriously what would it take for a company who builds the guns to take them through a short pathway of quality control ?

Cost.

What you did to get the gun to shoot right requires worksmanship.

Sadly today's gun manufacturing had machine produce the core components of a accurate rifle. Putting it together where there is a requirement of worksmanship is the weak link. A ruger American without the need to worksmanship to bed/assemble would probably have shot better out of the box.

$ value of ruger and other modern hunting rifles is impressive. $/worksmanship trade off. $25 per hour labor hinders companies to spend on worksmanship.

The hole in gunsmith service in America (especially Florida) is scary. Glad you can do this stuff yourself.

Mike

quote:

$ value of ruger and other modern hunting rifles is impressive. $/worksmanship trade off. $25 per hour labor hinders companies to spend on worksmanship.

The hole in gunsmith service in America (especially Florida) is scary. Glad you can do this stuff yourself.

Have to disagree a little here. Paying for workmanship doesn't by itself make a product more expensive. Attracting and keeping happy a skilled workforce which most companies don't seem to want to do anymore can be very expensive by constant turnovers and constant retraining. The current trend to pay low and get rid of employees when not needed has created many of the current problems. Unfortunately the general public has been duped to believe that employees make too much money in the skilled trades. A smaller, highly skilled, better payed group of employees that stay around will always produce better products and at a better price if for no other reason because the good ones will always leave to find a better (and higher paying) job. So your workforce is always walking out the door and so does their skill.

Regarding your Florida gunsmith woes, we see the same thing where I live. Just try to find a gunsmith who does general gunsmithing. I've asked several local gun shops and all you get are blank stares.

ALF,

You seem to have just plain bad luck with guns. Now granted the last New Haven Winchesters weren't very good but many people (including me) have found the FN Winchesters of very good quality. My Safari Express .375 is one of the smoothest and certainly most accurate rifles I've ever owned out of the box.

So your Ruger only need a little screw tightening?

My plastic fantastic is a blaser r-8.

My sako 85 which is guaranteed for shoot Moa - even after custom work and bedding does not shoot any where close to Moa. But is shoots close enough to hunt with - 2 Moa.

Sako are know for their accuracy. My rugers out shot my for 1\3 the cost.

Sometimes we just get bad or sloppy put together products.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:
...
You can buy a replacement spring 24 pounds. (I think wolfe markets them for Ruger M77 bolts. I'm away from home this month.) That should solve the problem, nicely. If you would like they have 27-28 pound springs available, too. I got one but have never used it because the 24 pound springs do the trick.

PS: replacing striker springs is pretty easy and you do not need to buy one of the kits. I got a kit and discovered that it did not work with a ruger lefty bolt. So a little research on the web and a trip to a hardware store for the correct size of tubes and pins (I forget what) and it was easy.

Thanks for that. I will pass the info on to my hunting mate.

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:
My plastic fantastic is a blaser r-8.

My sako 85 which is guaranteed for shoot Moa - even after custom work and bedding does not shoot any where close to Moa. But is shoots close enough to hunt with - 2 Moa.

Sako are know for their accuracy. My rugers out shot my for 1\3 the cost.

Sometimes we just get bad or sloppy put together products.

Mike

I have a SAKO .375 that won't group better than 2 inches.

In my experience, the most accurate out of the box guns are Savages, followed by Browning X bolts. It is easy to get a Rem 700 to shoot well but I always bed them. I have not shot Tikkas. I have not been impressed with Ruger 77s, but the new Precision Rifle is pretty impressive based on what I see during my Friday morning 500 yard gong shooting sessions.

and I can't get a Remington to shoot under 1-1/2"s on it's best day.

I like the new truck analogy.
yep you buy one expecting it to do truck stuff.
but I don't think your new F-150 with the eco-boost package is gonna run too well on number-2 diesel, or on E-87.

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:
My plastic fantastic is a blaser r-8.

My sako 85 which is guaranteed for shoot Moa - even after custom work and bedding does not shoot any where close to Moa. But is shoots close enough to hunt with - 2 Moa.

Sako are know for their accuracy. My rugers out shot my for 1\3 the cost.

Sometimes we just get bad or sloppy put together products.

Mike

I have a SAKO .375 that won't group better than 2 inches.

In my experience, the most accurate out of the box guns are Savages, followed by Browning X bolts. It is easy to get a Rem 700 to shoot well but I always bed them. I have not shot Tikkas. I have not been impressed with Ruger 77s, but the new Precision Rifle is pretty impressive based on what I see during my Friday morning 500 yard gong shooting sessions.

Which 77 were you not impressed with ?? After ruger started making its own barrels ?

Ruger actions as they are forged are not well suited to custom modifications.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
This is what I am referring to:



Factory 300 WSM from a factory Winchester Rifle
all 20 rounds from the box look like this

Could you tell me how old the cartridges were when they were fired? Might have something to do with the neck cracking.

A couple of years ago I shot a bunch of 338WM loads with Nosler brass. About eight of them split their necks and I decided not to use any more of those brass cases. Fortunately, I only had one box (50).

Nosler is usually excellent brass and can be loaded with minimal prep, but that batch was something else.

quote:

Ruger actions as they are forged are not well suited to custom modifications.

I thought Rugers were investment cast.

There are custom Rugers out.

I always thought smiths don't like Rugers because they don't have to do a lot of expensive modifications to them.

One can spend a lot of money brining a old 98 up to modern standards. Reheat treating, drilling tapping, or adding square bridges, replacing/bending the bolt handle, replacing the safety.

All things that do not need to be done to a Ruger. thus a smith does not get to charge for them.

I have several extremely accurate Rutgers. I do not reload. I have found that they usually group better with non boattail ammo. There is a lot of very good factory ammo out there so I let the rifle tell me what it likes.
I am blessed with a gunsmith that is well trained and 35 years experience and can sort problems out quickly.
I have not found superformance to shoot well in my firearms (many brands and calibers).