Which would you want to hunt elk w/?

Interestin comparison. Let's add another.

30-06 launching a 200 gr bullet (.301 SD/.481 BC) at 2650 fps. Drops 8.9" @ 300 yards with a 200 yd zero and arrives with 2003 fp of energy.

I am sure this would out penetrate either of the others. This is using approximate figures for a 22 inch barrel. With my 24 inch it would be better by a bit.

Yeah, but you lose that 10% greater frontal area & that just might deflect off a tough ole bulls hide.

quote:

Originally posted by fredj338:
Now come on guys. Let's look @ some numbers: The darling of the rifle community, the .270, launches a 140gr bullet/.261SD/.432BC @ 2950fps. Drops 7" @ 300 w/ a 200yd zero & gets there w/ 1182fp.
The .338-06 gives a 210grNP/.263SD/.400BC, 2750fps, drops 8.5" & arrives w/ 2072fp. Which would you want to hunt elk w/? Same SD, for all practical purposes, same POI, more energy, more frontal area. You can have the same weight rifle w/ a bit more recoil, a no brainer.

270 with a 140grTSX/.261SD/.497BC, 3170fps, drops 5.3" @ 300 yds with a 200 yd zero and gets there with 2292fp. (@7000' altitude, 40 degrees).

30-06 with a 200gr Accubond/.301SD/.588BC, 2713fps, drops 7.5" @ 300 yds with a 200 yd zero and gets there with 2478fp.

300 with a 200gr TSX/.301SD/.550BC, 2963fps, drops 6.1" @300 yds with a 200 yd zero and gets there with 2929fp.

338 win mag with a 225gr Accubond /.281SD/.550BC, 2770 fps drops 7.1" @300 yds with a 200 yd zero and gets there with 2859fp.

All actual velocities chrony'd on actual loads.

The 338-06 has it's place and I wouldn't mind having one, but let's compare usable loads to usable loads.

I just got back from the range. Loads 24" barrel,185 TSX,IMR4064 57gr,CCI200 primer,3003 fps avg.chrono'd. 225 gr accubond,52 gr IMR4320 2713 fps,CCI 200 primer chrono'd. Loads are from the new Hornady manuel which also lists the 250 gr at 2600 fps but I haven't tried it out yet.

Well woods, if you are getting 3170fps w/ a 140gr bullet, you are really pushing the envelope, but regardless, you get a whopping 3" @ 300yds o/ the .338-06. No one is seriously trying to compare magnum rounds to std. rounds anyway. In the real world, non of this matters, 3" here, 300fp there. It's all just good fun because there is notheing to do until hunting season. I'll still take my big ole, slow .338-06 elk hunting, it just gets it done.

I gotta say... If your justification for eliminating a chambering is because it is close to another, more popular, chambering in velocity, muzzle energy, etc. than I would say we need to get out the ammo catalogs from the Big 3 and start hacking. Hopefully some of my favorite chamberings don't end up on the block, but I'm sure they will.

Bob

rob1sg,,,thanks for sharing!

Fred:

I don't know what barrel length Woods has on the 270, but my 26" Sendero in 270 Winchester gives me 3250fps with a 130 grain Ballistic Tip. IMR4831 is the powder.

Jerry

Yeah Jerry, I guess I am assuming (assofu&me) a factory 22"bbl. I could see that in a 26" maybe 24" w/o a problem.

God has yet to create a game animal that will know the difference between a .338 winnie or a .338-06 or a .35 Whelen or a 9.3x62or whatever medium bore you like. My .338-06 is built light...only 6lb. 12 oz. scoped and ready to hunt...and the recoil is managable. I don't know if a .338 Winchester would be manageable at this light weight and I refuse to shoot a gun with a "sissie break" on it...my hearing is too important to lose it. The difference in trajectory is irrelevent at normal hunting ranges. Just some sort of random thoughts. Sorry to ramble. Now if you really feel the need to bash something lets talk about the .325 WSM!

Of all the WSM's, the .325 appeals to me the most. I think it will be a success.

I used the 338-06 until the advent of the 338 Win magnum, and I changed over to the 338 Win., a decision I have never regretted....

I can shoot a 210 Nosler at 3005 FPS and that shoots as flat as I can handle...I can shoot a 250 gr. bullet at 2700 FPS, but best of all I can shoot a 300 gr. Woodliegh at 2500 FPS..Having shot and loaded for both, I know the 338-06 is out classed hands down by the .338 Magnum...that is simple basics...

I don't bash the 338-06 it was and is a fine cartridge, but you would be better off comparing it to a 30-06 or 35 Whelen..Nor would I compare the 35 Whelen to a 350 Norma magnum...its just BS to do so....

I don't have a pony in this race BUT:

When comparing the 338-06 to a 338 Win Mag, its like comparing a 30-06 to a 30 Mag, not much of a comparison, the mag has more case capacity, and will always deliver more velocity.

When doing a comparison to a 30-06, the 30 cal is more versitle. With a bullet selection from around 100 grs to 220 grs, the 338 has much smaller range of projectiles.

Now don't interpret this as me dogging the 338-06 as I think its a fine game cartridge, and me personally I would rather have the 338-06 than the 35 Whelen ( oh no here it comes ). But if I could only have one or the other, give me the 30-06.
I admit my 30-06 doesn't get hunted much anymore, but thats cause I use my 30 mags, or my 7mm's.

And I have considered building a 338-06 a couple of times but I always weight it against the 9.3x62 which is a mean contender against this round.

I will give the guys who have built up a rifle on this caliber this point, the bullet selection is great for this round, and if I had one I would definately hunt it, and I wouldn't feel undergunned with this on elk or moose. Kind of like what they used to say in the Army if you got em smoke em, or in this case if ya got one shoot it.

quote:

Originally posted by JBabcock:
The 338-06 is still a waste of time, the 338 Win Mag does everything the 338-06 does, at a fraction of the cost, and it's not a wildcat.

The 338-06 might as well be a wildcat, no factory rifles chambered for it that I know of.

fooey

I would really much rather bash the .308 Win. as it doesn't get half the kicking around it deserves but I guess the .338-06 will do. Nice exercise in what can be done with a 30-06 case, but after that seems anything you might possibly need it for the .338 Win Mag can do better.

Uh Clem, you may notice that no one has said this exercise has to "make sense". Someone is certain to raise a spirited defense which will generate enlightenment or...maybe not.

Sigh - I have a 338 and a 338-06. I won't knock the 338 Mag just because I like the 338-06 better for most game.

For Bear I'll pick up the 375 and know that a 338 is plenty (and so is the 338-06)

I've got two 1 shot kills on nilgai and several on elk with the 338-06. I'm careful with my shots and will pass most - but I haven't used my 338 in 5 years - since Wiseman re-barreled a Sako AV - and it is the most accurate piece I have with 60 gr 414 and 225 accubond at 2600 fps.

338 will beat that 200fps but it just doesn'yt mean anything practically speaking.. and weatherby 338-06 factory will still get 1 1/4" in mine while the reloads are under 1/2.

Just humble opinion and I don't mind if yours is different

Vapodog,

Seems to me you have a certain rifle that needs a new barrel...

Of course then you would have to take a perfectly fine 30-06 and ruin it by rebarreling to 338-06...

I must be delusional! Every one of the 8 big game animals I shot with my .338-06 and 225's or 250's did the "Bang!....Flop" thing.
Oh! I'm sorry the half ton plus Eland DID go about 25 yds before crashing to the ground.

Like my .338-06 VERY much. Same for my .257 and .280 AI's. Riflemans cartridges. Takes a little time and expertise to load for them.

Your right Babcock. Wildcats are not for someone who buys his ammo off the shelf or is put off by a little handloading. So......Your point is??

FN in MT

Frank-I am with you on this one for sure. In my 23" 338/06 with IMR 4350 the 250 SAF does 2590. It will flat out rock and roll anything that gets in its way.

I'd be willing to bet that is not much at all behind the majority of the factory 338 wm's. HE being the exception.

For me and I am a 33 fan, if I want more than the 338/06 has to offer I am gonna go to my 340 and be done with it.

No flies on the 338 wm for sure, just my 2 cents worth. I just happen to feel that most people out there would never know if they used the 338/06 or the WM version.

Mark D

quote:

Originally posted by JBabcock:
Vapodog,

Seems to me you have a certain rifle that needs a new barrel...

Of course then you would have to take a perfectly fine 30-06 and ruin it by rebarreling to 338-06...

True sir.....that .30-06 shoots so fine that it 's a sin to change anything on it.....The FN action is equal to the old M-70 when it comes to functioning and the .30-06 barrel is so accurate that it's a crime to rebarrel it.....so it's going to stay "as-is" for a while....

quote:

The FN action is equal to the old M-70 when it comes to functioning and the .30-06 barrel is so accurate that it's a crime to rebarrel it.....so it's going to stay "as-is" for a while....

I have one of these in the works, its a 1938 with double set triggers though. Must is a cartridge of the period, not going through the effort of converting it to a mag, so a 06 case is a must, only two calibers I have really considered, a 9.3x62 and the 318 Westley Richards. The 318 is a very interesting caliber, short run down of specs:

virtually the same powder space as a 30-06 case
250 gr bullet, traveling originally @ 2400 fps, 2500 fps is possible with modern powders
.330 diameter bore
Introduced by WR in 1910

This round had a excellent reputation on non dangerous African game, like an old soldier it earned its strips.

Does anybody else see this obvious similarity?
250 grs @ 2500 in a 33 bore.

FN in Montana...

quote:

Your right Babcock. Wildcats are not for someone who buys his ammo off the shelf or is put off by a little handloading. So......Your point is??

I started this thread in July of this year as a "tongue in cheek" response to another thread that was like the "energizer bunny." It just went on and on and on and on...

It was titled "Stop bashing the 338-06." I finally couldn't help it and started a thread called "Let's bash the 338-06." I could care less what anybody shoots, including the 338-06. I love the .338 bore size, and I'm sure the 338-06 kills just as good as my beloved 338 Win Mags. I still wouldn't own one, but you can.

I handload all of my ammo. One of my 338's has never had factory ammo down the barrel.

Hello everyone, I'm new here. Just thought I'd chime in and say that even though I don't own a rifle chambered for a .338-06, I think it's a good cartridge. I wouldn't compare it to a .338 Win Mag but for distances out to 250 yards, it's pretty darn good. Velocities at the muzzle are in the 2500-2750 fps (depending on bullet weight) and that's just about perfect.

I think it's a good option for those who handload and want more punch than what a .30-06 might offer and for those who want a rifle with not as much recoil as a magnum.

Other options, of course, would be the .35 Whelen. Here in Europe, the 9.3X62 Mauser.

why didn't anyone mention the .400 Whelen?

Good God Panzer, this thread died 8 years ago, why bring it back? Hopefully the OP and the other bashers have come to their senses by now and realize that the 338-06 is great!

quote:

Originally posted by adamhunter:
Good God Panzer, this thread died 8 years ago,

and many of the posters are no longer posting here.

Hey,my interests change and this place is a great place to chase the occasional wild hare of my latest interest!!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by NBHunter:

quote:

Originally posted by JBabcock:
the 338 Win Mag does everything the 338-06 does

Makes it a good reason to own one of each

I fail to see your logic...perhaps it's because I don't have my glasses on.

Another essurected thread that proves ther is life after death. However, I was surprised at how long it took for the following to show up.

quote:

Originally posted by schromf:

quote:

The FN action is equal to the old M-70 when it comes to functioning and the .30-06 barrel is so accurate that it's a crime to rebarrel it.....so it's going to stay "as-is" for a while....

I have one of these in the works, its a 1938 with double set triggers though. Must is a cartridge of the period, not going through the effort of converting it to a mag, so a 06 case is a must, only two calibers I have really considered, a 9.3x62 and the 318 Westley Richards. The 318 is a very interesting caliber, short run down of specs:

virtually the same powder space as a 30-06 case
250 gr bullet, traveling originally @ 2400 fps, 2500 fps is possible with modern powders
.330 diameter bore
Introduced by WR in 1910

This round had a excellent reputation on non dangerous African game, like an old soldier it earned its strips.

Does anybody else see this obvious similarity?
250 grs @ 2500 in a 33 bore.

I certainly and did some time ago IIRC, John taylow considered it a fine general purpose rifle although he frowned on how some used it.
I certianly mulled over a decision on whether to build a 338-06 ot .35 Whelen for several years. I liked what taylor had said about the .318 WR and thought a nice 338-06 woud be a decent clone. I also liked what I read on the .35 Whelen as well so couldn't make up my mind.
One day, while looking over the stuff at a gun show, there was a man selling a few very nice customs as part of an estate sale. One rifle was on an Oberndorf Mauser, very nice honey colored stock with darker lined and of all things, real elephant ivory for the forearm tip and grip cap. Price seemed very reasonably and the damn thing fit me like it was made especially for me. One of the very very rare times I did not haggle the price and it came home with me. Caliber? .35 Whelen. I've never regretted buying it and any thoughs of a 338-06 went well back in the archives of my mind. Des that mean I'll never have a 338-06 built? One never do know, do one. Seriously, I have a very nice Husqvaran FN style Mauser action just laying around doing nothing. I've read the late Finn Aagaard's article where he compared the 338-06 vs the .35 Whelen and if I read it again I just might convince myself I need a 338-06.
Paul B.

The only real answer is to own both.

Both are damn good rounds. I'm no where near recoil sensitive; I can take some punishment from the bench. BUT I'm gonna be 40 this October and 20 years from now I may not have the shoulders I have now. So 338-06 may give me the relief I need and the bullets I want!

I love chasing velocity when I load caus it's fun and I wan't to know the limits of my rifles and the accuracy node each of em inherentily have. BUT as much as I love the velocity (I am a man!!) I don't suscribe to the beliefe that it's velocity alone that kills.

I have .338-06's, .35 Whelens, and 9,3x62's. I like em all. I can accessorize depending on what my outfit for the day is.

I have my favorite of course but in reality you could just flip a coin.

Wow, great discussion. I'm a 270 fan through and through with 140 gr's. Have a Husqvarna that is an absolute tack driver. And, as you all know the 270 is a pleasure to shoot and kills things dead. But I had a 338-06AI built a couple years ago. Couldn't resist the cartridge. Shot a big moose and elk with it so far. I'm using 210gr Scirocco's at 2865fps. If one looks at a ballistic table it doesn't take long to figure out that the two shoot almost identical out to 500yds in terms of drop. The energy isn't close, but with ballistics like that, how could anyone bash this under appreciated killing stick? Cheers.

quote:

Originally posted by Elkslayer:
.......he'd think we should get rid of all the other cartridges and just go with the 338mag.

Sounds like a pretty fair option.. , though I'd miss the extra toys.

Mothballs and all..... I still don't feel the need for a .338-06

quote:

Originally posted by BigNate:
I still don't feel the need for a .338-06

Anyone with one big game rifle rarely needs a 2nd.

The formula for need in rifle speak = desire + justification

and we can rationalize justification for just about anything

If the title of this thread had been "Let's bash the 270" this thread would have 5000 posts by now ...

This argument(excuse me...discussion)seems to refute and otherwise denigrate the whole Euro caliber tradition and pretty well point up a basic difference in cultures.

We seem to glorify in recoil and velocity while our Euro brethren take what will sensibly kill the quarry without blowing the backstraps into chopped meat.

At 250 yds or less, there is no advantage to any magnum over a 2600fps medium caliber. Everything will be just as dead. I have shot 7-10 hogs, red deer, fallow deer in a weekend with a Winnie...also done it with a 7x57. They both did the job and no game went very far.

You guys out west might worry about yards 300-500 but most folks don't and shouldn't.

quote:

Originally posted by JBabcock:
The 338-06 is still a waste of time, the 338 Win Mag does everything the 338-06 does, at a fraction of the cost, and it's not a wildcat.

One thing the 338 Win. Mag can't do is perform as well in shorter barrels.

I would have no hesitation building a 338-06 on a shorter 21" - 21.5" barrel and optimise it with a modern powder.

With the 338 Win. Mag., I wouldn't go shorter than 23"

quote:

Originally posted by markino:
Hello everyone, I'm new here. Just thought I'd chime in and say that even though I don't own a rifle chambered for a .338-06, I think it's a good cartridge. I wouldn't compare it to a .338 Win Mag but for distances out to 250 yards, it's pretty darn good. Velocities at the muzzle are in the 2500-2750 fps (depending on bullet weight) and that's just about perfect.

The 338-06 pushing the Barnes 185 TTSX gets better than that and with that bullet is a near perfect combination for everything from deer to moose shooting anywhere from 50-400 yards with mild recoil. Very impressive hunting caliber with that bullet.

I have a ruger hawkey in 338 win mag.
its a gtreat rifle.
I am thinking i might turn a jc higgins .270 i have into a .338 06. if i do it will be a great rifle too.
It seems some guys confuse more power with better cartridge.
If That were true we all would be shooting 50,bmgs...tj3006