Maybe I'm just getting old but;

would someone please tell me just what exactly a scout rifle is?...

besides a rifle with a scope on the barrel.....

Also, is a scout rifle the same if I lived in Iowa or if I lived in British Columbia....or if I lived in Zimbabwe.....?

In short.....what defines a scout rifle.....and why do I (or anyone for that matter) want one?

It's the brain child of Jeff Cooper. Years ago I remember he kept talking about the perfect rifle for everything. He called it the scout. I kept wondering what the hell it was until I finally read an article on it. It's basically a bolt action carbine with iron back up sights, a forward mounted scope and a DBM. I believe he had some special sling configuration for it.

I can't tell you why you should care because I don't.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
Maybe I'm just getting old but;

would someone please tell me just what exactly a scout rifle is?...

besides a rifle with a scope on the barrel.....

Also, is a scout rifle the same if I lived in Iowa or if I lived in British Columbia....or if I lived in Zimbabwe.....?

In short.....what defines a scout rifle.....and why do I (or anyone for that matter) want one?

The concept originated with Jeff Cooper and ended up with that ugly thing from Steyr. I always thought young Brent Clifton made the best version (Clifton Arms). Anyway Jeff conceived it to be a general purpose rifle for just about 99% of what you'd need a rifle for. Sort of a one gun does all if you will. Not a bad concept but Jeff's parameters were pretty rigid and to my mind, too rigid for most people for a general purpose gun. However, Jeff was a life long student of the gun and the scout was the culmination of that work, at least that's the way I perceive it.

quote:

Originally posted by cobra:

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
Maybe I'm just getting old but;

would someone please tell me just what exactly a scout rifle is?...

besides a rifle with a scope on the barrel.....

Also, is a scout rifle the same if I lived in Iowa or if I lived in British Columbia....or if I lived in Zimbabwe.....?

In short.....what defines a scout rifle.....and why do I (or anyone for that matter) want one?

The concept originated with Jeff Cooper and ended up with that ugly thing from Steyr. I always thought young Brent Clifton made the best version (Clifton Arms). Anyway Jeff conceived it to be a general purpose rifle for just about 99% of what you'd need a rifle for. Sort of a one gun does all if you will. Not a bad concept but Jeff's parameters were pretty rigid and to my mind, too rigid for most people for a general purpose gun. However, Jeff was a life long student of the gun and the scout was the culmination of that work, at least that's the way I perceive it.

Cobra is right on. Jeff Cooper basically created the Steyr Scout Rifle. Some don't like its look, but the overall response I get from my customers is awesome; they love it. The spare mag built into the stock, the double harness sling, the Leupold forward mounted scope, extreme light weight, and especially the fold out built in bi-pod. It looks very tactical for a hunting rifle.

Mike

I have fired 3 different Scout rifles made by the Gun Site Smithy, as well as several "clones". I have handled the Steyr Scout but not fired one.

Basically it is a short light 308, with the foward mounted telescope.

Since I am right handed, but left eye dominate the scout scope principle does not work for me.
But... It is a good concept for a fast handling hunting rifle.

So I have used the Remington Model 7, and now the Blaser R 93, in 308 with conventional scopes and red dots as my light weight general purpose hunting gun.

Actually the Steyr Scout is a very good rifle.
If I was not such a Blaser R 93 freek, I would have one...

Or most likely two.

I have three, had four, sporterized Mausers I call scout. Mainly cause they are light, have short barrels and a forward mounted pistol scope. Ideal if iron sights can't be used any more and they pick up the target FAST. Almost points like a shot gun. Great off hand rifles. roger

1 meter, 3 Kg, iron and glass. Major power and able to engage at 308 antes.

I'd never heard of the thing either and didn't have any interest at looking at that thread til you started this one.

I'm now sorry I had to look at that thread because I'm a little sick to my stomach.

Although Jeff Cooper probably had something to do with the advent of the Styer Scout the first scope forward rifles I'm familiar with are German Military mod. 98 sniper rifles and these possibly were not the first. Glenn , it really is better than a forward mounted bow sight. roger

You'd need to read the whole of Cooper's Gunsite Gossip and some of his other writings to see the beginnin and end of the whole project. He started out trying to define a rifle that could cover most of the normal uses for a personal rifle. The owner was then supposed to be the epitome of the old saying "Beware the man with one rifle, he probably knows how to shoot it".

Build/buy one and you'd have what you needed for 90% of all shooting needs. There were also heavy caliber Scout-ish rifles for shooting bigger game.

Jeffe is right with the specs. It was to be a user friendly, portable, reliable, accurate, durable rifle that could serve for hunting game up to 400 Kg with ammo that is available most everywhere. The forward mounted scope was to allow two eye open shooting and allow speed loading with stripper clips. Eric Ching's sling is supposed to be a huge aid to shooting.

Steyr came out with their Scout after some input with Cooper and IMHO it's a bit pricey for "Everyman" and the detachable magazine is a liability because if lost or damaged the rifle becomes a single shot.

I keep kicking around the idea of obtaining some flavor Scout, but for now I'm probably just going to build a full sized .308 to compliment my current .416Rem and shoot the dickens out of both of them.

bartche

You are correct I think the scope was called the ZFG 41, or something like that.

Just goes to show you that the Germans were ahead of the times...

A SCOUT RIFLE is one of "those things" that you need to use for a while and understand, before you make a judgement on it.

quote:

Originally posted by Rick R:
You'd need to read the whole of Cooper's Gunsite Gossip and some of his other writings to see the beginnin and end of the whole project. He started out trying to define a rifle that could cover most of the normal uses for a personal rifle. The owner was then supposed to be the epitome of the old saying "Beware the man with one rifle, he probably knows how to shoot it".

Build/buy one and you'd have what you needed for 90% of all shooting needs. There were also heavy caliber Scout-ish rifles for shooting bigger game.

Jeffe is right with the specs. It was to be a user friendly, portable, reliable, accurate, durable rifle that could serve for hunting game up to 400 Kg with ammo that is available most everywhere. The forward mounted scope was to allow two eye open shooting and allow speed loading with stripper clips. Eric Ching's sling is supposed to be a huge aid to shooting.

Steyr came out with their Scout after some input with Cooper and IMHO it's a bit pricey for "Everyman" and the detachable magazine is a liability because if lost or damaged the rifle becomes a single shot.

I keep kicking around the idea of obtaining one, but I'm probably just going for another full sized .308.

Rick R

Just like a 1911, you need to have several magazines for you rifle.

I get a "feeling" from your posts on AR, that IF you got a Steyr Scout, and shot it a bit, it would become a favorite for you...

And I say that as a complement.

quote:

A SCOUT RIFLE is one of "those things" that you need to use for a while and understand, before you make a judgement on it.

I'll take your word for that.....as Frankly, I just can't see it at all.

Every long relief scope I've ever looked through has drastically diminished field of view.....further, I've never had a need for more ammo in the magazine than the four or five normally carried in a common magazine...However....I sure like light and short!!!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

A SCOUT RIFLE is one of "those things" that you need to use for a while and understand, before you make a judgement on it.

I'll take your word for that.....as Frankly, I just can't see it at all.

Every long relief scope I've ever looked through has drastically diminished field of view.....further, I've never had a need for more ammo in the magazine than the four or five normally carried in a common magazine...However....I sure like light and short!!!

Vaodog

Since I am cross eye dominate I agree with the scope aspect. I have a Custom Tanker Garand with a scout scope. I have to close my left eye to use it. I can still shoot better with it than I can with iron sights, it is not as good as I could if I was rights eye dominate.

Since you appreciate light and short, you should try a red dot or a scout scope, or a low power variable conventionally mounted.

The theory of a Scout Rifle is, short, light, handy, and fast to acquire the target, and shoot getting hits.

If one keeps BOTH eyes open as one is supposed to with a correct scout scope the the field of view is as large as it will get for you. The cross eye dominant problem not withstanding.

I currently have 4 "scouts" and have used many others including the Steyr. A correct "scout" with a correct scout scope mounted correctly is a very quick rifle to use and hit with. High bases with pistol scopes are not correct BTW. I followed Cooper incantations regarding this from the begining and have built my own. I did not agree with the weight limitation or the barrel length limitation that the "committee" came up with and have built my own based on function instead of a prescribed set of parameters. My own with somewhat longer barrels and perhaps a little more weight are every bit as handy as scouts (the Steyr and Savage) that met the arbitrary requirements.

Yes I do like a fast handling scout and do find it meets 90% of my hunting needs for game. That doesn't mean I don't use a conventional type rifle because I do. The scout is not a panacea for everyone but it does fill a useful role for some, me included. The key is a correctly made scout with a proper scout scope mounted correctly.

The Ruger scout has 2 shortcomings to me; it should have a minimum 18.5" barrel, preferably a 20" and it should have an integral 5 round magazine that could be stripper clip loaded. If it was going to have a detachable magazine as such it should have been compatable with M14 Magazines and a 5 round magazine should have been standard. It also should be capable of strpper clip loading just like the M14. However, since it is probably not intended to be used in a military context the detachable high capacity magazine is superfluous. Just my thoughts.

Larry Gibson

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Gibson:
If one keeps BOTH eyes open as one is supposed to with a correct scout scope the the field of view is as large as it will get for you. The cross eye dominant problem not withstanding.

I currently have 4 "scouts" and have used many others including the Steyr. A correct "scout" with a correct scout scope mounted correctly is a very quick rifle to use and hit with. High bases with pistol scopes are not correct BTW. I followed Cooper incantations regarding this from the begining and have built my own. I did not agree with the weight limitation or the barrel length limitation that the "committee" came up with and have built my own based on function instead of a prescribed set of parameters. My own with somewhat longer barrels and perhaps a little more weight are every bit as handy as scouts (the Steyr and Savage) that met the arbitrary requirements.

Yes I do like a fast handling scout and do find it meets 90% of my hunting needs for game. That doesn't mean I don't use a conventional type rifle because I do. The scout is not a panacea for everyone but it does fill a useful role for some, me included. The key is a correctly made scout with a proper scout scope mounted correctly.

The Ruger scout has 2 shortcomings to me; it should have a minimum 18.5" barrel, preferably a 20" and it should have an integral 5 round magazine that could be stripper clip loaded. If it was going to have a detachable magazine as such it should have been compatable with M14 Magazines and a 5 round magazine should have been standard. It also should be capable of strpper clip loading just like the M14. However, since it is probably not intended to be used in a military context the detachable high capacity magazine is superfluous. Just my thoughts.Larry Gibson

Nicely written Larry and right on the money as far as field of view. Maybe Ill get a chance to loan VD one of mine.I also like the bolt handle straight out just in case some day I need a speedy second shoot. roger

There are so many things totally WRONG with the Col.s Scout concept, it makes me wonder if he only did it as an eternal joke.

Short, light, powerful, flip up irons, bipod built into the stock, extra ammo stored in the stock, CW or ching sling, forward scope for speed and ease of carrying and ease of loading and unloading, glass rod trigger, no drop in the stock, flared trigger guard to protect finger from the kick, magazine cut off or double detent magazine for single loading.

He got the idea from the Rem 600 and then he wanted to see how much better modern materials could make it. He also said it doesn't have to have a scope to be a "scout" you could just use irons. The idea for the flip up apertures they got from the Brno 600 series. The magazine cut off/double detent mag they got from the Krag and 1903. Flared trigger guard idea was from old side by side shotguns. CW sling was the old British 3 point system.

What is wrong with that?

How many rounds can you fit into the stock of your rifle? How many rifles have flip up apertures built into the receiver?

I thought they were silly until a friend of a friend brought his to the range and I shot it. I instantly "got it". They are very nice to spend a day in the field with. If you hunt from a stand the benefits may go unnoticed to you. I'm glad I discovered the concept. If you think it looks goofy just try shooting one and keep an open mind.

I have a Steyr Scout and a custom on a Win 70.

As others have said, if you read everything Cooper wrote about it you can see the idea evolve. I think Cooper put too much emphasis on weight at the expense of durability but in his own words "it is an exercise in excellence". If a Satterlee titanium was available in 1980's Cooper probably would have put a pedestal barrel on it, $$$$ didn't seem to be an object, he constantly criticised people with a safe full of medium quality rifles saying they should sell them and buy 1 quality piece.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim in MI:
Short, light, powerful, flip up irons, bipod built into the stock, extra ammo stored in the stock, CW or ching sling, forward scope for speed and ease of carrying and ease of loading and unloading, glass rod trigger, no drop in the stock, flared trigger guard to protect finger from the kick, magazine cut off or double detent magazine for single loading.

He got the idea from the Rem 600 and then he wanted to see how much better modern materials could make it. He also said it doesn't have to have a scope to be a "scout" you could just use irons. The idea for the flip up apertures they got from the Brno 600 series. The magazine cut off/double detent mag they got from the Krag and 1903. Flared trigger guard idea was from old side by side shotguns. CW sling was the old British 3 point system.

What is wrong with that?

How many rounds can you fit into the stock of your rifle? How many rifles have flip up apertures built into the receiver?

I thought they were silly until a frind of a friend brought his to the range and I shot it. I instantly "got it". They are very nice to spend a day in the field with. If you hunt from a stand the benefits may go unnoticed to you. I'm glad I discovered the concept. If you think it looks goofy just try shooting one and keep an open mind.

I have a Steyr Scout and a custom on a Win 70.

As others have said, if you read everything Cooper wrote about it you can see the idea evolve. I think Cooper put too much emphasis on weight at the expense of durability but in his own words "it is an exercise in excellence". If a Satterlee titanium was available in 1980's Cooper probably would have put a pedestal barrel on it, $$$$ didn't seem to be an object, he constantly criticised people with a safe full of medium quality rifles saying they should sell them and buy 1 quality piece.

Sorry,

GO ARMY.

My daughter just got her appointment to West Point; and we have been pretty excited in the Stewart household. No more $$$ for education. We're going to let Uncle Sam foot the bill the next 4 years.

And I really like th Steyr Scout. I also agree with the premise to sell off the medium quality rifles and buy 1 great piece, and get real comfy with it.

Mike

When I went to my physical for my West Point application senior year of high school the doc said "you have a hernia" and I couldn't get a medical waiver, they tossed my application.

Ended up a Navy doc for a couple of years, about 13 years later.

Good for her, congrats.

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:
There are so many things totally WRONG with the Col.s Scout concept, it makes me wonder if he only did it as an eternal joke.

DO please enlighten us all with your wisdom.....

I'm surprised the title of that thread isn't something along the lines of "Blankety Blank redefines UGLY"

How is this rifle better than say a M7 with a 1.5x5 scope?? It makes as much sense as a rifle with see-thru mounts.
I think the concept comes from the various military rifles that would take elaborate efforts to mount a scope over the receiver. And they're trying to make a fault into a virtue.

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:
How is this rifle better than say a M7 with a 1.5x5 scope?? It makes as much sense as a rifle with see-thru mounts.
I think the concept comes from the various military rifles that would take elaborate efforts to mount a scope over the receiver. And they're trying to make a fault into a virtue.

An M7 in 7mm-08 is hard to beat.

The term "Scout Rifle" was no doubt of Jeff Cooper origin.

However the concept was around before Cooper.

The Winchester lever actions... and if you read old hunting books the 256/6,5 Mannlichers, were the scout Rifles of their day.

The Principle is a short light sufficiently powerful fast handling rifle.

In Coopers time, the forward mounted scope enabled more accurate shooting. It WORKS.
It does not work for me as I am left eye dominate, but it does work for "normal" people.

Fast foward to present day...
We now have Red Dot sights. Even a cross eye dominate guy like me cam use a red dot with both eyes open.

Most every SWAT team, every military SPEC Ops, most every 3 gun competetior, IPSC Unlimited shooter, uses some sort of red dot.

I use them on several of my hunting guns including Drillings, and I used them on work guns when my life was on the line...

The "Scout Rifle" concept is highly usable and valid when you need to shoot FAST AND ACCURATE.

Also since I am cross eye dominate, I have used short and light rifles with conventional rear mounted variable scopes, with excellent results.

IE a Mod 7 [I have used one quite a bit, and now use a Blaser R 93 in the same manner], is an excellent hunting gun...

When I put a Docter Optic on my Blaser R 93 Tracker in 308 or 375 H&H it enables me to use the "Scout Rifle Principle", even though I am cross eye dominate...

Think About It...

IT works.

I had no idea scout rifles were so popular. I've never seen one while I was hunting.

I dang near started the same thread! I've never had a desire to own a scout rife, to me it's just not what I want, though I would never criticize someone for owning or building something that works for them.

After I read this thread I started thinking about what could be a fun build with one of the m98 barreled actions that I have laying around...

quote:

The term "Scout Rifle" was no doubt of Jeff Cooper origin.

However the concept was around before Cooper.

The Winchester lever actions... and if you read old hunting books the 256/6,5 Mannlichers, were the scout Rifles of their day.

Cooper says the same in his writings, almost verbatum. He did not take credit for the concept but most sought to refine it.

I also have an Eotech on my own AR. I got it after testing most available such sights prior to my own deployment to Iraq. I mounted it forward of the carrying handle of my M16A2 and the dot is coaxial with the zeroed iron sights. With the dot just sitting on top of the front sight post it gives a perfect 250 meter zero (iron sights are at a 300 meter zero). I can either look through the sights or simply over the top of the rear sight and put the dot on target and pull the trigger. With the 1 moa dot it is very accurate. In QCB I always fired first and had all hits regardless of the range and most often you could cover my group (most often 90 rounds) with your hand in the middle of the E target. I find it the best of the "scout" concept for the AR and entirely practical in the military concept.

In a civilian application my M94 with a Burris 1.5X scout scope or my M38 Swede with the Leupold 2X scout in a lighter weight composite stock are very easy, fast and accurate. However, the FR8 with a 1.5X Burris scout scope, an M14 flash suppressor w/front sight repalcing the G3 facsimile, a Lyman SME reciever sight makes for the best "scout" of all. It is stripper clip reloadable, hell for stout and quite accurate.

Larry Gibson

I think the idea of the scout rifle is sound, and the guys I know that have them like them, but for me personally, I can get by without one.

quote:

Originally posted by Rub Line:
After I read this thread I started thinking about what could be a fun build with one of the m98 barreled actions that I have laying around...

Here's a thought for you

This is an original VZ-24 complete with original stock and barrel

Attach a scope to the barrel and a place in the stock for a few stripper clips and you're off and running

This one is in 7 X 57 but there's no reason you couldn't do an 8 X 57 as well.

Just something to mull over.

The basic principle of a "SCOUT RIFLE" IS high speed low drag, fast hits, easy to carry, use and manipulate...

The one area I disagree with Jeff Cooper, is, that for a soldier, in the field I wouold want either an AR, or an M1/A/M14 or a H&K 91...
Set up like a "Scout"...

Having been in "harms way", in remote areas, I want a semiauto, with extra mags...

Even a Garand is pretty handy.... I was happy nto have one....

I like the concept. Hadels like an M1 carbine yet hits like an M1 Garand. My every day rifle is essentaially a scout. Light (7lbs) detachanble box mag (carry 4 spare) and forward mounted red dot With appeture sights for back up. Since I normally am hunting dangerous game I want the action clear of obstruction (like a scope)

My old 9,3 had stripper clip loading and I used the feature in two firefights. My current one just has quick change mags. Prefer the stripper clips actually but that is what I grew up with. Pitty Styer got the .376 wrong- a little fatter case or a couple mils longer and it would have been a great 'every day' round for dangerous game hunting but the pressures were just too high for a hot day in Africa with that quality of brass.

Think of the scout as a light rifle for dangerous game (2 or 4 legs) that is equally at home at close quaters or able to reach out if you need it to. Just where I am the game is big enough to demand more cartridge than any 30!

quote:

Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
Having been in "harms way", in remote areas, I want a semiauto, with extra mags......

And just one of the HUGE Design Flaws of the Scout is having Magazines stuck into the stock. Obviously trying to Balance Out the forward mounted scope fiasco, but..., once you crawl through the sand or mud with it and CAN'T remove those Magazines without "standing up"(exposing your position) and smashing the Scout against a tree(wall, rock, tank, etc.) to loosen them up, the reality of the ignorance sets in. Even a Grunt with 1-month Combat experience would have told the Col. to try it in Combat himself and then see what he thought.

Same-E-Same with the "built-in-Bipod".

I agree with those of you who like them that they do fine - in the Safe.

The scout is a general purpose rifle, not a combat rifle. I would bet Hot Core doesn't think militaries should field bull pup rifles, as they also have the magazine in the stock.

Scout 1 was a Rem 600 with a pistol scope mounted on the plastic rib, he also added an aperture sight (I don't know the make) to it. Scout 2 was a Sako action, custom barrel, custom 1 off scope mount, McMillan stock. Scout 3 was Ruger Ultralight with Ruger rib attached to barrel, Scout 4 was a Brno with aperture sight built into the receiver, and it used a pedestal barrel with scope mounts machined into the barrel. They machined the front sight into the front scope base, so they didn't need a front sight at the end of the barrel. There are a few pictures of Scout II in Art of the Rifle, but 90% of the pictures has Giles Stock holding Lion Scout, the Brno 350 Rem mag with custom magazine and Clifton stock.

The modern scout rifle is about synergy, it isn't just a light rifle with a low power scope. The features work together.

There is a reason people spend $1000 to get the scope low right on top of the receiver, vs just putting a rib on the barrel, that 1/4 of an inch makes a difference.

You can set your stock up to align your eye with the sights or the scope, but not both. A low scout scope lets your eye line up with both. A forward scope negates the bolt handle hitting the scope.

If you haven't used a ching sling you just don't know what you are missing.

A few weeks ago here on AR there was a thread about the tang mounted safety Ruger 77, well, Steyr put a tang safety on the Scout for SPEED.

How many factory rifles beside the Stery use Pacymayr flush swivels?Millet hammerheads?? There is a reason the scout rifle has these.

Again, it's synergy. A low forward scope, flip up irons out of the way, flush swivels, Ching sling, tang safety, glass rod trigger, double detent magazine, light fluted barrel, flared trigger guard,all off the shelf in 1 rifle.

Imagine standing at the ready and seeing your target and shooting 1 second later, that is the purpose of all of the features on the Scout design. Ching sling is fast, tang safety is fast, low scope or aperture is fast.

Gun is light so they recoil a bit. Forward scope won't hit your eye. Flared trigger guard won't hit your finger. Straight stock (because the scope is low)absorbs recoil like on your heavy rifle. Scope over the barrel puts a forward balance on the rifle also changing recoil impulse.

It all works together.

The concept is interesting, and for a long time I'd wanted to build a scout, well before they were commercially available. Then I got a chance to shoot a few variations, and was turned off on the design.

You can shoot a conventially mounted scope with both eyes open just as easily as a forward mounted scope. Hence the only advantage of the forwared mounted scope is the ability to load the magazine from stripper clips. I don't know anyone who has a scout that loads from stripper clips, and if I needed a gun that could be quickly reloaded, I'd go with detachable magazines.

The downside of the forward mounted scope is limited magnification, limited field of view, and the guns balance is thrown off. Also with the scope so far forward, if the sun is at your back you can get glare off the lens.

Now if you eliminate the forward mounted scope and need to load from stripper clips, and spec out a light weight reasonably powerful rifle, you'll find that that concept has been extremely popular. The Remington gen one titanium, Kimber montanna, and custom lightweight rem 700's in 7-08 have been hugely popular as hunting rifles because they meet the core specs of the scout rifle.

I know for for me, and my eyes, a small red dot, is superior to the forward mounted scout scope.

And then I like a regular scope for when I need to shoot at longer ranges.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim in MI:
The scout is a general purpose rifle, not a combat rifle. ...

Hey Jim, I might have this confused, but I believe the Col.s original intent was to design the rifle for a MARINE CORPS Scout. Meaning a person moving ahead of a MARINE CORPS Squad or Platoon. In that reguard, it is a multiple disaster design, all waiting to happen.

Paul hit on another Design Flaw created by the forward mounted Scope fiasco - Rear Lens Flare(Glare, Reflection, what ever you want to call it) when the sun is behind the user. In a Combat situation, it is another of the Design Disasters. For a Civilian, it might only mean not being able to shoot the Trophy of a Lifetime - because you can't see it.

It is not a rifle that I would ever want. But for those of you who like them and enjoy them:

"More Power to ya!" - Brisco Darling

Hot Core

In all faireness, you did touch upon one element of a scout rifle that I do disagree with Jeff Cooper on...

One, I am left eye Dominate... The Scout Scope Principle does not work for ME.
But I do understand a short, light, sufficently powerful, fast on target, quick to hit rifle...

As a person that has carried rifles in harms way, I would not want to be saddled with a bolt rifle if I was operating alone or in a small group... I have used a bot rifle as a work gun and I have had to use a single shot in harms way, and survived, so I know of where I speak.

An AR 15, AR 10, M1 Garand [used one, saved my bacon...], M1/A, or H&K 91, set up, to be fast on target, like a Scout would be, [has been] my pick.. [The H&K is my favorite...]

If a person has not used a "real Scout Rifle" then you should, as it has a lot to recomend it, and there is nothing wrong in modifying it to suit your specific needs.

Jim in MI good post.