My main coyote rifle is a 22-250, But I want to use a larger caliber for long range, 600 max. I already own a .270 and was thinking of useing the 110gr V-MAX. The question is: would I be better off with a 25-06, useing a 100gr BT?

Keep in mind that if I go with a 25-06 I will just rebarrel with a new factory take-off.

Thanks Matt

i think the best coyote cal is the 50cal bmg. you can never get enough practice with that round and its good to a mile and a half!

I think the 25/06 would make it easier to place shots recoil wise, another round that people use for long range is the 6.5-284 I think thats very impressive.

Some rifles don't shoot light weight bullets well. The lighter bullets don't seem to work well for me in my 30-06 or 300 Win mag. I would think that a typical barrel will give you better groups with 130 grain bullets.

You can get higher velocity from the 25-06 with less recoil. Energy really isn't that much of an issue with coyotes, but a higher BC bullet will give you less wind drift at the 600 yard range you want to shoot. A 25-06 with 90 grain bullets or a 2.43 with 87 grain bullets would be my choice.

Good point, B.S., but it is illegal in Washington to use non expanding bullets. The last I looked there were none available for the 50.
Elkhunter, I have tried the Speer 90gr .270 and the Sierra 110gr sp, and they both grouped excellent.

The problem is I just dont have the money for another rifle right now.

If they shoot well in your rifle then by all means use them. They should be effective on coyotes and the 270 is a better medium game rifle than the 25-06. If it aint broke don't fix it. The only thing you might be able to improve with the 25-06 would be wind drift. Practice doping the wind and you should be fine (or shoot when its calm ;-)).

quote:

Originally posted by MH WASH:
... I already own a .270 ...

Hey Matt, A lot of folks really like the 270Wins, as does one of my best buddies, Don. He will argue it's virtues with anyone in comparison to any other caliber.

One quote that ALWAYS winds Don up is one by Elmer Keith. He was asked what he thought about the 270Win as a Hunting cartridge. (I'll modify the response slightly due to the colorful language.) "It is a DARNED adequate Coyote cartridge."

Truth be, there is no difference between the two on coyotes except in theoretical conversations...

If I already had a 270 then I would get a 25-06, but thats the only justification I can come up with.....If you think your going to have any advantage, your sorely mistaken..

Also if Keith ever made an intelligent, I must have missed it..I knew him..when he told me he rode a bucking horse until blood was coming out his mouth, ears and nose, I walked off...

I think a .270Win. might just be a bit of overkill for a coyote.
He's not all that big or hard to drop. A .25-06 will do the job nicely as will most of the 6mms. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

Having killed one hell of a pile of coyotes in my day I cant imagine intentionally pursuing them with a caliber larger than .243 at any range. Ballistic coefficient is a much larger concern than bullet diameter here. The average coyote in winter prime wieghs in at around 25 pounds. Just how hard do you think you need to hit him?

Well, do you want the pelt? If your goal is just to "wack" a coyote at extreme range, a 270 with 140 Hornady SST's at 3000 fps+ works very well for me. If you're pelt hunting something under 243 with solids at more sedate velocities might be a better choise.

From what I read, the guy stated that he already had a 270, and didn't have the money for a new rifle, so if he goes with the 25.06, he will rebarrel his existing 270.

SOO, using a .243, 50 cal, weren't part of the question.

Cal, please define "overkill." How is a critter killed too much? Every time I have my .270 in hand with my deer load while deer hunting, I'll drop a yote if I see one. Seems to work just fine. I'd do the same thing if I was using a 338 WM while bear hunting, if I saw a yote.

The guy already said he uses a 22 cal primarily, so I'd say, stick with the 270 and shoot a 110 grain or 130 grain bullet. There's nothing at all wrong with dumping a yote at 500+ yards with a deer bullet.

I can post about 38 pictures of my dead coyotes that all fell to a 270 while deer hunting. Used 130, 140, 150 Nos btips or a 130 TSX. Nice clean holes, and no pelt damage.

Good Luck.

It always suprises me how they make heavy barrelled varmint guns in .308 but not in .270 winchester. I would have thought the .270 would be better suited to a heavy varmint gun than a .308.....just a thought

there fore being more suitable to stuff like foxes and the American coyote

Why don't you just see if the 110 gr. bullets will shoot well enough with your current twist rate? If they shoot weel enough you're o.k. If not you can go for a more specialized barrel in 25-06.

If the 270 will shoot the 110 V-Max with enough accuracy for your proposed use and ranges then I'd just go with it.

The coyote sure won't notice the difference.

If your regular big game rifle is the 270 it doesn't hurt to get more field practice either.

IMO, either will work just as well, but I prefer the 25-06 with 100 gr. or lighter bullets. To my mind the 25-06 is a varmint/medium game rifle (though ay friend uses his for elk); the 270 is a medium/big game rifle that can work just dandy on coyotes or varmints and will handle much heavier bullets for the bigger stuff. Nevertheless, both shoot plenty flat for what you want to do.

All of the VMax bullets that I have tried were very accurate and that includes the 110/270.

If that 270 barrel does not group well don't just slap on another barrel as the variables affecting accuracy include bedding the crown and many others.

quote:

Originally posted by MH WASH:
My main coyote rifle is a 22-250, But I want to use a larger caliber for long range, 600 max. I already own a .270 and was thinking of useing the 110gr V-MAX. The question is: would I be better off with a 25-06, useing a 100gr BT? ...

Hey Matt, Just dawned on me I really didn't give you a useful response.

This is the kind of situation where comparing the two calibers on External Ballistics Software might help you decide or mislead you entirely. So, if you do any "What if I...?", kind of questions on them, be cautious of the results.

To me the key portion of your question deals with the 600yd requirement. In order to make "consistent" kills at that distance on the Coyote size target, you will have to have a lot of good things going for you. A higher weight and higher Ballistic Coefficient bullet will make achieving your goal much, MUCH easier.

I believe you should consider the "other end" of the weight chart for your 270Win and even use some Match Grade bullets to develop your very best accuracy potential. Use all the accuracy tricks you can find as you develop the Loads and be fair to your rifle. Maybe it is accurate enough and then again maybe it isn't.

If you decide it is accurate enough, then turn to the Hunting Style bullets and redevelop the loads. During this time, you will come to understand how a light wind, mirage, parallex, breathing, etc. can have a considerable effect on your final groups.

If you determine it is not accurate enough, then you will be faced with a new barrel, action work and or a swap for a different rifle. Here having a rifle "Tuned" by a good GunSmith has the potential to get you a bit better accuracy over a stock factory Remington. And again you have to decide if the cost is worth the "potential" 20%-50% additional accuracy "IF" the factory rifle is already shooting 1/2MOA. And of course, the Tuned rifle might not be as accurate, you just don't know until you shoot them.

But, between a 25-06 and a 270Win at 600yds, I'd go for the 270Win and heavier bullets.

I will give the .270 a go. If I dont like the results, sounds like I have a lot of options. I dont plan on going out and shooting at 600 yards overnight, but that is where I would like to end up.

I am with Hot Core on this one. I think the 600yd range is the point we need to focus on. If you go with the heavier 270 bullets you will have less drift you can easily use a range finder for yardage but wind drift is a little tricky.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Never used a 25-06, but from a lot of experince the .270 is a fine round for song dogs. I never took enough intrest in it to buy a purpose built coyote rifle. If I did a .257WBY would be my choice.

Terry

Ray
Old elmer set of my bs meter pretty good when he told his tale of being bucked from a horse. While he was being drug by a stirrup he pulled out his 45 and shot his horse dead.

I kind of wonder why you are not continuing to use the 22-250 even for the longer shots?
My personal preference would be the .270 with the 140's. At that distance you won't be damaging skins as much as with the v- bullets but you don't say if you are gathering skins or varminting.
If the .270 is a tight rifle I doubt I would take a chance of putting another barrel on it that may or may not be as tight a shooter. Why take the chance?
If you are looking to experiment with another rifle for fun then that is a different story.
I have a model 70 classic in 25-06 and other than the fact that it uses the same bullets as many of my other 25's I don't find it to be advantageous to prefer it over others.
Frank

Ray, tell us more about Elmer. I have to say he is why I started playing with handguns and now big bore rifles.
Frank

I use both 270 and 25-06 and don't really see any difference. They both now are using my deer bullets Barnes TSX 130 and 100 grain with good results, two holes and not much hide damage. Hides are not a concern of mine, I just like using the deer set up as the practice makes shooting our little coues deer, in a stiff wind, at long ranges much easier. Was loading 140 Nosler Balistic Tips and buying factory Win Supreme 115 grain Combined Tech (a coated Balistic Tip that shot 1/2" in my rifle) and they were more bang flop for sure.
My experience is that judging wind speed at that range is 100 times more important than any difference in those two fine cartridges.

Frank,
Although I have shot fewer than 50 coyotes, It is my opinion that past 300 yards I want a little bigger hole and lots more energy. The 22-250 can be absetutly devistating we have fairly stiff winds around here, and I think a larger caliber will do better.
As far as pelts, I do keep what I can, But the area I plan on using this rifle in is usually warm enough that the pelts are worth nothing.

Yeah, the wind would be the difference.
I still think the .270 is the right ticket.
Frank

I've shot a hell of a lot of them and I'd just use the .22-250 or a .220 Swift. There's not much difference in wind drift in a 120 grain .257 bullet at 3050 and a 55 .22 at 3800 fps. In practical terms if you're shooting in a 20 mph crosswind at 600 yards with either one, better bring a lot of ammo.

MH WASH: Where did you see that non-expanding bullets are illegal for coyotes in Washington? Is this something in the new regs? I have taken a few coyotes just outside of Colfax and not that I would admit to anything illegal...but....

let me know!

IV

I have owned and shoot both the 270 and the 25-06, both are great rounds. Niether is a 600 yard varmit or yote gun. Fair exceptations is slightly over 400 yards with either.

Bottom line save your money, not enough gain for the $ comitted.

If I was looking for a 600 yd rifle, look to bullets first, best choices are 6.5, 7mm, 30, and 338 ( if you could consider it for a varmit rifle? )

There are some fabulous bullets in these calibers, super BC's, good match grade stuff. These calibers have better selection for what I like in a long distance bullet: Heavy for caliber, real high BC's. The 23, 24, 25, and 27 cal don't really have these bullets. an example is a Sierra or Lapua 155 gr. 6.5mm or a 220 gr. 308 ( 240 gr is even better if you have the engine to drive it ) these have really high BC's in the .7's or real close. Another is the 300 gr. 338 great bullet.

This is what I like in repeatability in long range rifles, the case behind it well that is another discussion, there are several, with a whole lot different recoil levels. On the light end try a 6.5x284 with that heavy 155 gr bullet above. Moving to 30's even a 308 will work, but its edge I think is more in all the calibrated scopes for the round ( Milspec) and it is a really accurate round. I would shoot the above 220 gr in my 30-338 with confidence.

Anyway my opinion is long range shooting takes some specialised stuff to work right always, and good bullets that don't suffer from wind drift is part of the equation, the rifle is another matter but I would want a very heavy stiff tube.

Keep your 270 if your shooting regularly at yotes at 350 meters, your doing great, moving to a 25 isn't going to get you much.

If money is tight then save your barrel money for bullets and powder. You said you're getting good groups and that's all it takes.

Second choice would be a new primo 270 barrel since you already have set up to reload that caliber.

Going 25-06 is the most expensive choice but when did I ever let financial logic rule my choice?

Vandal, I looked and cannot find a reference for non expanding bullets. Guess I pulled it out of my @@@. Looks like lots and lots of practice is in order. Only then will I know if my .270 is capable or if I am just dreaming.

Thanks to all.

Whew!....you were makin' me nervous.....

These two were from my .270 at about 340 and 380 yards (got the male right away and the female was running balls out----> 2nd shot on the run folded her too.)

Just above the Palouse River about 2 miles east of Colfax.

IV, congrats on those long shots, I have yet to break the 300 yard mark. It's nice to get out on one of the few days we have snow around here.

bwest,
Where the hell are you hunting coyotes at??? 25 lbs?? I've seen coyotes bigger than rottweilers. Even passed up a shot on an incredible albino coyote 3 years ago that probably weighed in at least 150 or so. Still regret that decision. It was a really beautiful animal. Sure would love to have it mounted in my living room.

As for the main topic, I agree with Atkinson... The .270 is fine, but if you just HAVE to get a new rifle, then it's an excuse to get the .25-06

Hey Steel, do you think that the 150 pound yotes might be crossing with something domestic?

I've seen some very large yotes here in Ohio that might tip the scale at 50-65 pounds and they appeared enormous.

A local warden dropped one awhile back that was even bigger but they had crossed with some domestic strains. He said that was how they achieved the size, but they still looked mostly like coyotes. He called it a coydog.

The .270 will work just fine on coyotes -- give it a try before you do anything else.

loved my 25-06 so much I gave it to my wife, but 75 gr hp's at 450 yds do a real number on coyotes and have used 117 grs out to 800 with a spotter