Warrior/Truvelloshooter/Chris,

You posted:

quote:

The recommended start load for the 230 gr HV bullet is 58 grains S335 per the GSC website, and a maximum velocity of ultimately 2,800 fps

quote:

I would pretty much regard the recommended "START LOAD" of GS Custom as the "MAXIMUM LOAD"

quote:

In this case the max velocity of 2,800 fps is too high for a 230 gr bullet from a 9,3x62 mm and I would regard it as an unsafe velocity limit.

quote:

Now yet again with the .366/230 gr HV bullet doing 2,800 fps, you say the pressure limit has been taken care of.

quote:

I am not talking about your bullet. I am talking about the load behind the bullet

Do you read what you write? Who else, other than GSC makes a 9.3mm / .366" 230gr HV bullet? You speak with a forked tongue and out of both sides of your mouth. You speak of the load behind the bullet as if the bullet has nothing to do with equation. What drivel is this? Been smoking your socks again?

quote:

We are discussing the 9,3x62 load here that I took the trouble to have it tested.

So publish your results of pressure tests with the 9.3 230gr HV bullet instead of raising a never ending merry go round of puffing and strutting and arguing, just to see yourself in print. You always demand evidence from everyone else and never produce any of your own.

quote:

In any event 2,634 fps is good enough for hunting plains game, as the 30-06 Spr at similar velocity has proven for more than a 100 years now.

Your problem precisely: You are mired in what was good a hundred years ago and refuse to recognise that technology on all fronts have advanced.

Gerard,

You are creating smoke again. You still did not tell us how you arrived at the safe max velocity of 2,800 fps.

At least I have done the testing and it will be published soon in one of our local gun magazines. I do have the evidence and that is exactly why it needs to be published. My pressure tests so far covered quite a few bullets:

Impala - Spitzer (180 gr)
Impala - RNFP(250 gr)
GS-HV - 230 gr
Barnes-X (250 gr)
Barnes TSX (286 gr)
Rhino Solid Shank (286 gr & 300 gr)
Rhino Solid (286 gr)

You are the one that needs to substantiate your max loads and not me. You have that duty to the public.

Warrior

Warrior,

You're making a fool of yourself, as usual!!!

You haven't heard lately of a guy shooting a .375H&H using GSCHV265 gr bullets launched at a MV of 2906fps who blown up his rifle due to excessive pressure, have you?

Jagter tells you that he has reloaded the same .308 brass cases 9 times without any pressure signs at all. (Refer his own post somewhere above).

As Gerard said, publish your results of pressure tests, that is to say if you have done it at all.

Stop being the AR village idiot.

quote:

The question what we have to ask then is ... what is this MAX safe position relative to CIP.

That is the question ... ???
Then the results can speak !!!

Warrior

Chris/Warrior/Truvelloshooter,

quote:

At least I have done the testing and it will be published soon in one of our local gun magazines.

If this is the same 9.3 test that you were going to publish in the middle of 2005, I will not hold my breath waiting.


You also have this huge credibility problem. You make so many mistakes and tell so many lies that, should you publish something eventually and it does not contain the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth (as they say), GSC will not only take you to the cleaners but the publication as well. Should not be difficult to find a whole raft of mistakes in anything you write. I can hardly wait. Pity it may be some time........

nominal, in the case of factory loads, is the bullet weight, pressure, and vel that you should expect, in the as tested barrel length and twist.

for example, a 375hh is a 300gr bullet at 2500 fps at 52kcup

can it be loaded faster? you betcha, and with different powders, even lower in pressure...

but remember, a cart's specifications include pressure, bullet, and vel.. and when you get outside of that, you really aren't shooting the same round

WOW, I had no idea that posting my chronograph results was going to engender so much controversy and such a spirited discussion.

I have a box of 250 grain TSX bullets on order just to test. However, for the most part, I prefer to shoot bullets that are heavy for caliber. Thus, for hunting purposes, I will probably stick with the 270 and 286 grain bullets.

Since I got my 9.3, I have always seen it as a more nearly comparable to my .375 H&H and thus, more suited for heavier game. Perhaps that explains my preference for heavier bullets. For such animals, I prefer a heavier bullet at a more modest velocity rather than a lighter bullet at lightening speed.

Guys, think this through a bit. A 286 grain Woodleigh Protected Point has a BC of .381. Loaded to 2360 fps and zeroed about three inches high at 100 yards, it is dead on at 200 yards and has a max point blank range of 233 yards and this is all done at very modest pressure levels. Here in the USA, a shot beyond that distance is very rare, at least for me anyway. I must not be much of a marksmen because I just prefer to get closer and dangerous game is almost never shot at more than 100 yards.

The 9.3 was originally loaded at only 2175 fps and, in discussing this cartridge, the late, great John Taylor himself said "there is nothing to be gained by boosting velocities for the purpose of flattening trajectories, and thereby increasing chamber pressures, for the excellent reason that the increased flatness of the trajectory only begins to become noticeable beyond the range at which you would normally be using the rifle."

Hyper velocity is fun but if you want to kill something reliably, especially something dangerous, get as close as you can and then smack it in the right place with a big bullet with good sectional density.

Dave

quote:

get as close as you can and then smack it in the right place with a big bullet with good sectional density.

That is certainly one way of doing it. Here is another.
And another. All it takes is good design and the the will to do it right.

How easy for you guys to get off the reservation! Much to-do about not much of anything.

And Dave, most any bullet will do on PG but I would consider the 9.3x62 not much of a big DG cartridge no matter what its velocity, bullet, mojo, or mystical powers.

quote:

Originally posted by Will:
How easy for you guys to get off the reservation! Much to-do about not much of anything.

And Dave, most any bullet will do on PG but I would consider the 9.3x62 much of a big DG cartridge no matter what its velocity, bullet, mojo, or mystical powers.

Will, but isn't that the reason you come here? To learn new things?

quote:

You still did not tell us how you arrived at the safe max velocity of 2,800 fps.

Gerard,

You are still avoiding the question. What is the pressure level at 2,800 fps? The onus is on you and you have the duty of care for the public's safety. Companies that offer reloading data normally have their loads tested.

This is what Edward M Matunas has to say ... "Tests are run at ambient, suppressed and elevated temperatures. The lab also considers such things as loading density, ballistic uniformity and other factors before accepting a load for publication."

I know Somchem pressure tested their loads. Most private loads are never pressure tested and that is the concern, especially if they were to exceed the CIP spec, which is the industry standard. All ammo manufacturers excercise caution not to exceed P-Max levels in their ammo for exactly the reason of safety, and that users cannot take them to court as the court will uphold the industry standard.

Your avoidance to answer a simple question gives rise to serious doubt if this load at 2,800 fps was ever pressure tested. If so, just give us all (the public at large) the pressure level for comfort to know it is safe.

Warrior

Just for the record, here is the position of Ammo manufacturers loading 285/286 gr bullets.

1) The hottest factory load is by Norma (Sweden) with their 286 gr bullet at 2,360 fps with their own propellant.

2) Lapua's (Finland) comparable factory load yields 2,264 fps and I have spoken to them and they are not prepared to push the pressure level up any higher, as they want to stay inside CIP specification.

3) The PMP (South Africa) factory load gives exactly the same velocity with Somchem's propellant as Lapua's load.

4) The Swiss manufacturer that makes CDP ammo has been chronographed at 2,230 fps.

5) Let us go to Germany ... the RWS Wiederladen Handbuch 1998 states a maximum load with R903 at 2,297 fps.

Here we have 5 different manufacturers around the world that load according to the best information available to them, and none goes over 2,360 fps.

I know Privi and Highland ammo are also in this velocity range (2,230 to 2,360 fps), but more to the bottom end.

That makes 7 companies.

This bullet weight is for short-range hunting and maximization of velocity is thus a moot excercise.

Warrior

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
WOW, I had no idea that posting my chronograph results was going to engender so much controversy and such a spirited discussion.

I have a box of 250 grain TSX bullets on order just to test. However, for the most part, I prefer to shoot bullets that are heavy for caliber. Thus, for hunting purposes, I will probably stick with the 270 and 286 grain bullets.

Since I got my 9.3, I have always seen it as a more nearly comparable to my .375 H&H and thus, more suited for heavier game. Perhaps that explains my preference for heavier bullets. For such animals, I prefer a heavier bullet at a more modest velocity rather than a lighter bullet at lightening speed.

Guys, think this through a bit. A 286 grain Woodleigh Protected Point has a BC of .381. Loaded to 2360 fps and zeroed about three inches high at 100 yards, it is dead on at 200 yards and has a max point blank range of 233 yards and this is all done at very modest pressure levels. Here in the USA, a shot beyond that distance is very rare, at least for me anyway. I must not be much of a marksmen because I just prefer to get closer and dangerous game is almost never shot at more than 100 yards.

The 9.3 was originally loaded at only 2175 fps and, in discussing this cartridge, the late, great John Taylor himself said "there is nothing to be gained by boosting velocities for the purpose of flattening trajectories, and thereby increasing chamber pressures, for the excellent reason that the increased flatness of the trajectory only begins to become noticeable beyond the range at which you would normally be using the rifle."

Hyper velocity is fun but if you want to kill something reliably, especially something dangerous, get as close as you can and then smack it in the right place with a big bullet with good sectional density.

Dave

...................................................................................Dave ....I have thot this thru ALOT ..,,Then I took my ideas and tested them in different sort of bush Alaskan ways .............A 250 gr Barnes 9.3 cal TSX or X bullet will penetrate 2 times further than the 270 gr Speer bullet and still retain 70 % and usually 95 % of their weight ...they expand to more than 70 caliber and fly flat enough to make 400 yard shots practically doable , instead of hopeable ..........I am unwilling to go thru the hassles I used to or the missed opportunities of the past when I can have 1 rifle and bullet and sight in,, that will work on game and pests from 15 feet - 400 yrds .............I fully expect the 230 gr GSC HV bullets will be even better than the Barnes .......................My experience is what I will rely upon .........If someone doesn,t regularly encounter the extremely variable situations that are common up here ..............I don,t want to say that you don,t understand ,,,but perhaps you are just NOT trying to understand there are LOTS of reasons to have the best all around bullet and load available ......I can tell you that within the first 2 feet of penetration on a bear the 250 gr TSX and probably the 230 gr HV will weigh more than and be a larger diameter than the 286 gr Nosler Partition ,,,,,,,,,They will most likely penetrate deeper and in a straighter line than the Nosler and will produce less or not more than the 286 gr Nosler load chamber pressure ....They will ruin less edible meat on a moose of bou or deer ect...and when that pack of wolves makes the mistake of being seen a quarter mile away they not the Nosler Partition will fly flat enough to kill those moose eaters ....... If all you need is a 200 yrd rifle ,, great ,,., but with better bullets it can be alot better round ...........but then there are people who like to hunt with a bow and arrow .........

Gumboot:

If it works for you, I say stick with it. I see my 9.3 as a cabliber primarily for Africa and moose and elk here in the states. I had not considered Alaska. If I wanted to shoot longer, I think I would select a different caliber. I have an 8mm Magnum that clusters 220 grain Swifts into nice tiny little groups and, I think if I was up in your area where the ranges very so much, I would pick the 8 mag. instead.

Good hunting!

Dave

Gummy:

One other thing. I just now returned from a meeting with a PH from South Africa. I talked to him about a buffalo hunt. I asked him if I could use my 9.3. He said a guy in Denver had asked him the same question last week. He said "no problem... It's so close to the .375 that it doesn't make any difference."

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
....Guys, think this through a bit. A 286 grain Woodleigh Protected Point has a BC of .381. Loaded to 2360 fps and zeroed about three inches high at 100 yards, it is dead on at 200 yards and has a max point blank range of 233 yards and this is all done at very modest pressure levels....
Dave

Dave,
Given a choice, Id much prefer 260hv 2500+fps(BC about .542)

a bullets first big battle is:
- overcoming inertia and excessive friction in the barrel thats detrimental to efficient safe combustion and velocity gains,The less bullet to barrel contact the better(whilst maintaining accurate alignment and a very effective gas seal) HV design adresses that,offering increased velocity/energy/momentum.
-next big battle is overcoming wind resistance for maximum retained momentum on target,(gsc high BC addresses that better than any super premium hunting bullet I know of)
-Next task is to best perform on target.

Intelligent bullet design can offer a most effective,efficient,versatile balance, of expansion/penetration/weight retention/momentum/trajectory, for a variety of game,circumstances&distances from the one cartridge load. GscHV addresses that better than any other bullet I know of.
we have gone from black powder to modern, nickel steels to Cromolly,weak bullets to premium bonded,
... why should it stop there?

Woodjack:

Of course, everyone is entitled to do as he or she believes and with respect to soft skinned game you may indeed be correct. However, with respect to heavy and/or dangerous game, I think the heavier bullets are better. I got the following quote from the Woodleigh web site:

"For .... heavy dangerous game, we recommend and have proven from much experience, the use of soft nose bullet for the first shot, followed by FMJ if needed. Use the heaviest bullets available for your chosen cartridges. Heavy bullets are much more reliable at moderate velocity than light bullets at high velocity"

All I can say is that I agree with the Woodleigh guys.

Dave

Dave, I think you are on the right track.

Ron

Dave,

While the 9.3 is a great round for larger African game and Elk and Moose here, please don't think that it cannot be extremely effective on smaller animals. I have taken everything from duiker to eland with the 9.3x62.

In Tanz I used the 286Partition for the big stuff, the 250 for medium stuff and long range. I carried 286 solids in case we had to use it in place of my son's 375HH for buffalo. With solids, it is very effective on very small animals producing very little damage.

I have stated elsewhere that the 9.3x62 is like the 30-06 on steroids. It is a very versatile cartridge. The excellent range and types of bullets available just add to its versatility. Kudude

PS: Please do a search on 9.3x62 in Reloading here and pull up the series of post I did about three years ago. I wrung out my Mark X on 250BT's, 270 Speers, and 286 Partitions using Varget. It is also interesting from the point of view testing pressure the "bubba" way. Kudude

quote:

I fully expect the 230 gr GSC HV bullets will be even better than the Barnes .......................My experience is what I will rely upon .........If someone doesn,t regularly encounter the extremely variable situations that are common up here ..............I don,t want to say that you don,t understand ,,,but perhaps you are just NOT trying to understand there are LOTS of reasons to have the best all around bullet and load available

gumboot458, you're on the right track!

The GSCHV230gr works excellent in the 9.3 x 62 all round, very much so here in RSA on all plains game. No pressure problems whatsoever at 2800fps.

The bullet's construction (far better than lead/copper jacketed bullets) combined with the higher velocity makes it an all round winner.

Use them and report back here on AR sometime.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
Woodjack:

Of course, everyone is entitled to do as he or she believes and with respect to soft skinned game you may indeed be correct. However, with respect to heavy and/or dangerous game, I think the heavier bullets are better. I got the following quote from the Woodleigh web site:

"For .... heavy dangerous game, we recommend and have proven from much experience, the use of soft nose bullet for the first shot, followed by FMJ if needed. Use the heaviest bullets available for your chosen cartridges. Heavy bullets are much more reliable at moderate velocity than light bullets at high velocity"

All I can say is that I agree with the Woodleigh guys.

Dave

Dave,
Beliefs are only that, they do not always reflect the truth. From the context of Jeffs(WL) statement, he may well just be comparing heavier lead core to lighter lead core,it does not really define if it refers to lighter monometals going faster.
Highly experienced Finn Aagaard, states that his 30-06 with original ungrooved barnes165x at a mild 2800mv, clearly out penetrates the 180np...not just some personal belief,but a cold hard reality....he also states fine success with 308win-150x on super tough 500+lb Naglai...,
225monometals in 338win,have clearly and extensively proven they will do any job a 250gn leadcore can.
I cannot fathom why it would be any different for a bigger more powerful cartridge applied to larger/dangerous game....as per previous example; 286wl Vs 260hv.
What would make a 286wl more reliable than 260hv?....both will mushroom and have similar momentum, but should any of the two meet serious resistance, id have my money on the monometal to best go the distance.

286wl(.381 Bc)2360mv/3537e....100yd: 2142v/2914e.....200yd:1939/2388.
260hv(.541 Bc)2500mv/3608e....100yd: 2340v/3161e.....200yd:2190/2769.

HV will do a buff no less than a WL, and for smacking NA biggame or APG further out,the Hv remains prefered.

/

quote:

There is of course no ruling that says a
person has to play to the CIP or SAAMI rules

On the other hand if you are a commercial manufacturer of bullets, powder even guns etc and you are selling to shooters in the USA, given their propensity and history to the law suit when it comes to things that has to do with arms and shooting safety I would have my insurance and legal ducks in a row. Officially promoting loads outside of any set industry standard could just cost a manufacturer their business if a lawsuit should arise from injury using such a load.

Quite so, the handloader can do whatever he likes with total disregard to any industry standard (Saami/CIP), but that is on his own choosing and resposibility. Well put Alf.

Warrior

Alf,

How come that you don't use the powders recommended by GSC when reloading 230gr GSCHV for your 9.3 x 62?

GSC recommends VV N135; H335 & H4895 (excluding the Somchem powders for RSA use.)

quote:

There is of course no ruling that says a person has to play to the CIP or SAAMI rules

Or for that matter 'stick to the manufacturers' recommendations'

I'm asking this simply because I don't know the difference between the powder types you've used and the ones recommended by GSC.

I have been getting 2520 FPS with a max load of RL-15 and the 286 gr. Noslers and Woodleighs in my long throated, 26" barrel 9.3x62 Mauser. A load I have used for the last 20 or so years in Africa and the USA..I get almost 2400 FPS with the 320 gr. Woodleigh...

I guess the long throat and long tube makes a difference although I see where one posted got almost 2500 FPS with his loads..I know these loads are fine in my gun, as I have shot over 2000 rounds of this stuff in it..

Ray, I was wondering, do you think you 9,3X62 is adequate for buffalo and, if so, would you prefer the Woodleigh or the Nosler bullet for such work?

Dave

quote:

Alf,

How come that you don't use the powders recommended by GSC when reloading 230gr GSCHV for your 9.3 x 62?

GSC recommends VV N135; H335 & H4895 (excluding the Somchem powders for RSA use.)

Whilst we are on this matter of recommending the right powders it obviously boils down to one's experience of a particular powder and how it compares to other powders. The people that have the most experience with Vithavori is none other than Lapua itself. I wrote to them some time back and this is what they had to say about their load with regard to the 285 gr Lapua Mega bullet:

"We have tested following charges:

N135 3.20 g/49.4 grs 660 mps/2165 fps 3838 bar/55665 psi
N135 3.45 g/53.2 grs 699 mps/2293 fps 4532 bar/65730 psi

CIP maximum pressure for the 9.3x62 3900 bar/56564 psi. ----------->

Factory load is tuned for each powder batch and 51.9 grs was only nominal value, yet the 9.3x62 factory loads are quite hot from pressure viewpoint. We have currently switched to N150 which gives better performance.

Best regards,

Janne Pohjoispaa
Nammo Lapua R & D "

Like wise I have found that S355 works better with the 230 gr HV bullet than S335 - it gives a better trade-off between velocity & pressure and still staying inside P-Max. You will also notice in Lapua's reply to me that they want to stay inside the CIP specification at all costs. I think it is better advice to stay inside the specification than to overstepping it by say 10 to 20%.

Warrior

quote:

In Pierre's book there is reference of someone getting 2593 on 58 gr S335, plotting that to the empirical values on ballistics calculator the values are again within the same window and also at CIP maximum. So according to the calculator an empirical load of 58 to 59 gr of powder in this burn rate range should get about 2600 fps which seems to be the velocity limit for the CIP standard maximum.

Alf,

Brilliant the way your calculator checks out quite apart from the actual velocity you obrained from your own rifle. Here is the actual result with a test barrel:

Ave. velocity achieved = 2,634 fps
Ave Peak Pressure = 98% of CIP max

It was quite hilarious to see how my figures were attacked, how I was accused of sucking it out of my thumb and best of all that they (Jagter, Gerard & Springtrap) suspected that I have never done the testing at all. Also the threats and bravado !!! Not to mention the tap-dancing around the question if the 2800 fps was actually pressure tested. Instead, personal insults were thrown to derail a good discussion.


Warrior

/

................As I don,t have any GSC HV bullets to show Dave But I do have 250 gr TSX These were recovered from the silty shale of the pit wall behind the target.. ............I have lost the peices of the 270 gr Speer bullets which I also recovered ...The heaviest one was 90 grains weight and a flattish rectangle about .4 " x 1"...None were in one piece and none really resembled a bullet .........................This is why I use Monometal bullets ,,,and why I use the 9.3x64 Brenneke .............,,,,,,,,,,,Shoot some 286 Noslers @ 2650 fps into simular media and distances and post the results .....Then every one can see the superiority of medium to light for caliber monometal expanding bullets ................................Now , while sticking to my guns I am going to politely appologise for getting on a rant ....No personal attacks ment ...

/

Alf wrote:

quote:

It's interesting that your quoted velocity was as I recall is 58 gr IMR 4895 @ 2800 fps.

GSC's website quotes 58gr H4895 as a start load and 2800fps as a maximum velocity to upload towards.

Also please note the following as stated by GSC in one of my earlier posts on this thread:

quote:

GSC's logical and proven reply:
"I have taken same caliber rifles to the range for load development and testing, more times than I care to mention. Invariably, identical start loads on three to five rifles of the same caliber, will result in different speeds. As you work up the scale, such a set of rifles will show pressure at different powder levels, but at similar speed levels, if barrel lengths are the same.
It is quite clear to me that the relationship between maximum pressure and muzzle velocity, is closer than the relationship between maximum pressure and powder charge.
A load that is safe in one rifle may blow a primer in another and will always result in more speed as well.
However, if you bring the two rifles to the same muzzle velocity with different powder charges, pressure levels between the two will also be closer. Once a powder charge has been decided on, check it by loading and firing the same case with it until the primer pocket loosens. If you get more than five or six loads from a case, pressure is not over the top."

"Load data that specify a maximum powder charge always carry the caution that the loads are only applicable to the test barrel used. It makes more sense to me to specify a known safe start load and a maximum speed that should not be exceeded.
Such a maximum speed will occur at differing powder levels from rifle to rifle but will be closer to the correct maximum pressure for that rifle than blindly following a stated maximum powder charge."

Makes sense to me!

/

Why one should not exceed P-Max and focus on other variables:

Rule 1 - The same propellants may vary from lot to lot.

Rule 2 - Bullet thickness may vary from brand to brand or within a brand.

Rule 3 - Case capacity varies between brands of cases and that bullet seating depth also changes case capacity.

Rule 4 - Temperature affects chamber pressure. (direct exposure to the sun, especially in the hunting vehicle).

Rule 5 - Within the normal band, a 3 percent rise in velocity translates into a 6 percent rise in chamber pressure (rule of thumb).

Rule 6 - Changing any component (bullet, case, primer) can drastically effect chamber pressure even though you use the same propellant.

Rule 7 - Higher pressure translates to more back thrust on the locking lugs.

Rule 8 - Hot loads create more recoil.

Rule 9 - You do not need to wring the last possible drop of velocity out of your ammo - rather find the "sweet spot" in your rifle.

Rule 10 - Instead of relying on velocity to flatten the trajectory, rather focus on zeroing your rifle for the terrain, using the PBR method.

Warrior

quote:

Rule 8 - Hot loads create more recoil.

Since I have started using GSCHV's about 2 years ago, recoil in both my 375H&H and 416Rigby have decreased quite noticably!!!

Can that be ascribed to lower pressure irrespective of the higher velocities with the 265gr and 330gr HV's in these rifles respectively?

Secondly, I get more reloads out of my brass cases, especially on the 375H&H. Rigby not used that often.

The flatter trajectories due to higher velocity is not the only gain with GSCHV's, far better straight line penetration is the more important benefit - better killing ability.

Should have changed over to GSC long ago.

Gecko,

My comments do not refer to HV bullets particularly, but rather as a general comment, assuming that one stays with the same bullet type and same weight. The term hot-load here simply refers to upping the load and not changing the components, ie reducing bullet weight. Reducing bullet weight is a mechanical property and will as a matter of cource reduce recoil no matter which bullet.

I have also noticed with hot loads particularly that light bullets create more muzzle flash than otherwise so much so that it destroys your chronograph reading vis-a-vis other heavier loads. The reason being that one has to switch to a faster burning powder when bullet weight is reduced.

Picking bullets for better terminal performance is always a good thing and the expanding monolithics are stacks better than conventional lead-core bullets. However, expanding premium bullets also known as controlled expansion bullets such as Nortfork, just to mention one of this genre of bullet, is also a cut above the conventional. But this decision stands seperate from the hot-load issue.

Lower pressure applied to a cartridge case by virtue of reducing the load or the bullet weight or a combination of the two will have a better effect on case life.

Warrior

Dave,
I had really good luck with the Woodleigh 320 gr. on buffalo, but I had a long throated, long barreled 9.3x62..I have not used the Nosler but I know a guy in Africa that swears by in in his 9.3x62...

Today, I would probably opt for a mid weitht GS Customs bullet of about 270 to 286 grs. for buffalo..The GS customs bullets always work to perfection it seems to me...

If you could latch on to some Northfork cup points that would also be a sho nuff winner.

Whilst we check for visual signs of pressure indication it is not a guarantee that we are not over the max CIP level. Ammo can be too hot and never give a single clue until the damage has been done. There is no such thing as just a little too much pressure and that is why adhering to not exceeding P-Max is the prudent thing to do and take heed of max loads advocated by Reloading Manuals. Too much pressure can slowly or catastrophically wreck a gun. The danger is when it happens slowly over a long period of time and complacency sets in. Then one day suddenly without notice due to a concealed headspacing problem that developed slowly over time with the continued use of a load that was "just slightly" too hot, you experience incipient case separation (even with a new lot of brass). A simple gas leak from a case can instantly blow an action to pieces and that happens close to your eyes.

Warrior

Message from Gerard:

Gerard and Gina are at present on a product promotion roadshow in Gauteng, Mpumalanga and small part of Limpopo, provinces.

They will be back again at their factory at 11 February 2008.

Meanwhile the rest of the family are keeping things going in Port Elizabeth.

Not many, if any at all, bullet manufacturers take the trouble to visit their products' end users to assist them in whatever way may be required and also to get feedback right out of the horse's mouth!

quote:

I have also noticed with hot loads particularly that light bullets create more muzzle flash than otherwise ...

You're probably referring to 'little bit undersized bullets' when saying "light bullets" above.

Very litlle, if any, gas blow by takes place with GSCHV bullets and what you have noticed above was certainly not while shooting GSC's bullets.