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Originally posted by vapodog:

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who set standards in the US for factory rifles?

Anyone that creates a new cartridge! They record it with SAAMI

Remington set the dimensions of the cartridge and the operating pressure. SAAMI is merely a recording house that holds the information for other manufacturers such as other reamer makers and ammo makers and other rifle makers.

SAAMI does not set dimensions or pressure......Further (as far as I know) the twist rate is not part of the SAAMI data....it is optional for every manufacturer.

There is no SAAMI specified twist rate for any cartridge.

Had Remington designed the .35 Whelen in a less strong rifle that required no more than 40,000 PSI pressure they would specify that to SAAMI and all ammo makers would be required to load their ammo to that pressure.....the .30-30 is such a round!

SAAMI designs nothing and specifies nothing.....It's simply a recording and holding house of information. The designer of any cartridge is the one that specifies it's dimensions and operating pressure! Again.....the twist rate is not a part of the specification!

Vapo, that isn't entirely true. Take this item about the 338 Magnum in it's beginning: Both the Commission Internationale Permanente pour l'Epreuve des Armes à Feu Portatives(CIP) and the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute (SAAMI) govern and regulate the specifications regarding the .338 Winchester Magnum.SAAMI and the CIP recommend a 6 groove barrel with a twist rate of one revolution in 10 in (250 mm) barrel with a bore Ø of .330 in (8.4 mm) and a grove diameter of Ø of .330 in (8.4 mm) with each groove having a width of .110 in (2.8 mm). The SAAMI recommended average peak pressure for the cartridge is 65,000 psi (4,500 bar). The CIP enforces a 4,300 bar (62,000 psi) pressure limit for the cartridge.

So they do review and discuss changes and what is best to regulate cartridges.

The primary work of SAAMI is done by its Technical Committee in the setting of industry standards. Product standards for firearms and ammunition are developed by two Product Standards Task Forces, one for ammunition and one for firearms. Recommendations of the task forces are submitted for review by the entire Technical Committee. The Technical Committee works with the Commission Internationale Permanente (CIP), an international association of proof houses. By working together, the CIP and SAAMI are working towards the development of internationally recognized standards. The SAAMI Technical committee frequently provides technical information to legislative and regulatory bodies across the US and around the world.

As an accredited standards developer, SAAMI's standards for industry test methods, definitive proof loads, and ammunition performance specifications are subject to ANSI review and various ANSI criteria.

According to the American National Standards Institute, "Approval of an American National Standard requires verification by ANSI that the requirements for due process, consensus, and other criteria for approval have been met by the standards developer."

"Consensus is established when, in the judgment of the ANSI Board of Standards Review, substantial agreement has been reached by directly and materially affected interests. Substantial agreement means much more than a simple majority, but not necessarily unanimity. Consensus requires that all views and objections be considered, and that a concerted effort be made toward their resolution."

Standards are developed when the governing body, SAAMI, proposes a new standard and circulates the draft to canvasses. Canvasses for each standard include government agencies (such as the Federal Bureau of Investigation and the U.S. Customs Service), non-SAAMI member companies, and interested parties (such as the National Institute of Standards and Technology). Once the draft standard has been reviewed and returned to SAAMI with comments or corrections, the canvass group votes on whether or not to accept the standard. If there is disagreement and a canvassee opposes the standard but the standard is accepted by the other members of the canvass group, there is an ANSI appeals process that decides the matter.

It is ANSI and SAAMI policy that standards be regularly revised or reaffirmed. Even if the standards remain the same, they must go through the approval process outlined above. Simply stated, the standards accepted by ANSI and promulgated by SAAMI are reviewed and accepted by outside experts, and the validity of the standards are re-affirmed.

I take it as if you submit a cartridge to SAAMI that is really way out there in it's standards, they review it and will suggest changes, or they won't accept it into SAAMI.

I have had a few nice 8x57 Sporters and a couple of Brno mod. 21s..I shot a few Mule Deer and Whitetail and some hogs with the caliber and many years ago I was invited to a cull shoot on Buffalo..I had no rifle with me and all my host had was a milsurp 8x57 in pretty nice condition and a sack of greenish bullets..I might add that about every 3 one fired..I shot 6 buffalo that day as they came out of the bush to escape the whirley bird over head, its was Omaha beech all over, and in my case it was click, click, bang, click, click bang 3 dead head on head shots and 3 off in the bush getting madder by the minute when the host and a few of the boys showed up surprised I wasn't up in the tree..We sorted out the 3 lung shot bulls...Those milsurp pointed armour piercing bullets seemed to work better with head shots and tended to anger the bulls with body hits!

All in all it was a fun day filled with excitment and meyham..God how I love those Africans when they been drinking.

Sako offers a factory rifle in 8x57IS:-

Model: Sako 85 Deluxe
Barrel length: 22.4"
Twist: 1 in 9.5"
LOP: 14"
Weight: 7.25 Lbs
Magazine: 5 rounds + 1 in chamber

And so does Tikka, that belongs to Sako.

Warrior

Bring back? I and others I know use mil surplus as their truck guns and foul weather guns.