After spending way to much time handloading .45ACP with my single stage press, I am thinking of moving up to a progressive press.

Since cost is a big factor, my first thought was to go with the Lee press at about $150. I would prefer either the low end Dillion or the Hornady, but that might not be able to get passed my wife.

Is there anything wrong with the Lee progressive press? I would hate to buy it, only to replace it in a few years.

read the consumer reviews if each product
then make certain you understand the differences in the models and compare them head to head for features

i have a dillon SDB and hornady LnL AP ... i used a lee, a dillon 550, and these two ...i decided, for general purposes, i prefer the hornady LnL ap, and that will be the one i keep.

i think i have 5 presses, at the moment... i like to try new things

if 45acp is going to be all your going to load progressively got with a square deal. there isnt a press made the will crank out ammo any faster or better. If you need versatiliy go with a 550 as you can do .223 308 ect on them but being that its not a true progressive and it has about twice the lever stroke of a square deal its quite a bit slower, but still will load fast enough for about any shooter. The lnl is a good unit too. I have 3 of them but they take a bit more tinkering to keep running then a 550 does and the 550 can be used as a single stage press if you ever need that option.

ah, that feature.. i don't like manual indexing "semi" progressive presses, and that rules out the dillion 550 and some of the rcbs models. the lnl ap is about 380 bucks and uses STANDARD dies, which SOUNDS like the 550 except it compares to the 650 in features ... and theres a reason one bought the 550 vs the 650 .. about 200 of them...a.. for dillion fans, it compares to the 650, with the price of the 550, and dies bushings are 3.20 each ...

all in all, every feature of the 650, EXCEPT the power case trimmer, for 200 bucks less.

the LnL ap can also be used as single stage ...
i load everything from 7,62x25 to 458lott to 500 AR on mine

the weak link in the LnL is the priming systems .. which works GREAT, BUT you have to keep a can of air, as it hates powder grains

Have you ever heard this old adage?

quote:

The bitter taste of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.

If you bought the Lee progressive thinking you'll keep it forever, you'd be the exception rather than the rule. I think the only reason people buy a Lee progressive is because of the cheap price, not because of its superior design or innovation.

I have a close friend who has the Lee. It works well now, however, he had major headaches getting it to feed cases. The case feeder worked great with short cases (like the acp) but gave him fits on his 454 casull. I am watching with interest as I am still using a lyman spar-T from the early 80's and I have been dragging my feet to get a progressive for several years now. With the start of me taking up CAS the time is here now! 2 hours to load 150 rounds of light 44's is way too long.

I went with the Hornady LNL and haven't looked back. My buddy's Dillons are nice, but I took a chance and like it.

Another happy Lock 'n Load buyer here. I bought mine for ~$390 shipped and also received my 1000 44 cal bullets (worth a couple of hundred bucks on the street). Now I believe they offer 500 bullets with the press. Do the math, consider the quality and go with a Hornady. Also, look at Lloyd, a true handload junkie, he owns Hornady's 3:1 against a Dilliom. :-) My 2 bits anyway...

I just bought another Lee 1000 and I am perfectly happy with it. It came, pretty much ready to go. The only thing I had to do was adjust the seating die. This is my second one. I sold the first when I thought I would never bulk reload again. Now the wife shoots a LOT as well. I got this one in 9mm and I have an extra turret so I can do a quick change to 40S&W since they take the same carrier. They made some improvements over the old one I had that make it a lot nicer and easier to use.

I really like my LNL ap with the free bullets it a great deal!

Got a chance to look at the Dillon and LNL at Scheels a few weeks ago. I love the Hornady LNL system, but know that might be a bit of a hard sell to my bride.

How easy are the LNL presses to set up?

NEJack

If you only want to load handgun calibres take a look at a Star Progressive Loader.

They are no longer in production, but they can be found.

They are the best progressive loader I have ever used.

And I have been using one since the late 1960's.

quote:

Originally posted by buckeyeshooter:
I have a close friend who has the Lee. It works well now, however, he had major headaches getting it to feed cases. The case feeder worked great with short cases (like the acp) but gave him fits on his 454 casull. I am watching with interest as I am still using a lyman spar-T from the early 80's and I have been dragging my feet to get a progressive for several years now. With the start of me taking up CAS the time is here now! 2 hours to load 150 rounds of light 44's is way too long.

I have two Lee Pro 1000 progressives, one set up for large primers and one for small primers.

Case Feeder:

I gave up on using the automatic case feeder altogether. I figured out that the time it takes to place cases on the ramp (to use that part of the case feeder)is about equal to the amount of time it takes to fill those plastic tubes with empty cases.

Primer Feed:

My problem with the press, however, is the primer feed. But I have not yet found any on-press primer feed system that cures the problem of feeding the last few primers at the end of a loading session. At least, not one that does not involve the time-consuming step of loading a tube full of primers.

I am actually thinking of switching to the Lee Classic Turret with Auto-Indexing, after seeing a video of one in operation. But I have heard that Lee's new priming system also has problems getting positive feeding on the final few primers.

Summary:

My reasons for thinking about switching? I shoot only a couple hundred rounds a week at most. I can watch a single operation at a time on the Classic Turret much easier than watching 2 to 4 operations per stroke on the progressive. The new primer feed system on the Classic does look as if it might be more positive than the primer feed on the progressive, and the Classic Turret lets me see the primer seating device more clearly, and might even allow fitting of a manual feed of my own design (if I can figure one out).

I am an incorrigible tinkerer.

Good luck.

Lost Sheep

I have an older Hornady Pro-jector progressive I bought used. It still cranks 'em out.

I bought 3 of the lnls when the 1000 bullet offer was out last year. Now the bullets are gone and the presses are still here. Is that good? Well yes and no. There basicaly a good press once you get them tweaked (timing can be a bugger) Like was said in previous posts you need to keep the primer slide spotless. The press standing alone isnt a bad deal but imo the case feeder system leaves alot to be desired. the 650 is designed right from the get go for a case feeder and if your not going to use one you might as well use a 550. But set up the case feeder on a dillon is very reliable. Now that my 1000 bullets are gone would i swap the three lnls for 3 650s? IN A HEARTBEAT!!!
I also dont see the big disadvantage to a 550 other then speed. Sure once your used to a lnl or 650 loading on a 550 is like loading in mud but if your not the type of loader that is in a big hurry theres absolutely nothing wrong with a 550. As a matter of fact i have one and could probably get by for the rest of my life with it as an only press. There more reliable because theres less parts to break and if you use the argument that you can double charge with a press that doesnt index ill say that your a real bubba if thats how little attention you pay when you load and if thats your style you will no doubt crank out a few without powder on a progressive in your lifetime and a squib can be just as dangerous as a double charges.
Bottom line is everyone has differnt needs. Some can get by with a single stage press and some cant get buy with anything less then a 1050. If you want good advice on buying a progressive the first thing you need to do is know your own need. If you shoot 500 rounds a week something like a 550 or square deal will work fine. I your shooting a couple thousand a lnl 650 or better yet a 1050 might be what you want. Listen to advice from guys that have a couple hundred thousand rounds loaded on there press not two or three as about any press will make it that long without the gremlins showing up (except for lee)

quote:

Originally posted by Lost Sheep:
But I have not yet found any on-press primer feed system that cures the problem of feeding the last few primers at the end of a loading session. At least, not one that does not involve the time-consuming step of loading a tube full of primers.

Then you obviously have not tested a Dillon. Both my SDB and 550 feed every primer from the 100th down to the last, PERFECTLY. And every single time, whether I totally fill the primer tube or only put in the last few stragglers from a certain primer lot. And no matter if large or small primer size.

There's only one drawback with a Dillon...the initial price. Once you get past that, you're set for life. And this goes without saying; if you ever need advise or service, Dillon is only a phone call away.

I wore out a Hornady Pro-7 (bought second hand) after 3 years of use and then switched to Dillon. I don't think I'll ever go back to anything else.

quote:

Originally posted by NEJack:
Got a chance to look at the Dillon and LNL at Scheels a few weeks ago. I love the Hornady LNL system, but know that might be a bit of a hard sell to my bride.

How easy are the LNL presses to set up?

Easy .. and timing adjustments are super easy ... buy at least a 10 pack of bushings, and never worry about them. ..

the thing you'll spend the most time on is getting the powder right .. which is what you spend time on any progressive ..

any easier than a dillon? no, about the same

i DO like the way the LnL handles spent primers ... you can attach a hose to a plastic bottle and never deal with them again.

like i said, to ME a progressive press means auto indexing, and for the same money as the 550, but the same features as the 650, its hard to beat.

Could you use the bushings from the Hornady LNL single stage press the the progressive? That would be great, and make going from one to the other a snap.

My main use would be .45 ACP, of which I shoot a few hundred a week. Not a high volume, but enough that using a single stage would be a pain. I would love to use it to load .223, but I'm a bit worried I couldn't duplicate my single stage powder loads.

quote:

Could you use the bushings from the Hornady LNL single stage press the the progressive? That would be great, and make going from one to the other a snap.

Yes, the bushings would fit, BUT you would need to re-adjust the dies between the two presses. The stroke is not the same. Imagine the problem of getting two reloaders of different configurations to have exactly the same stroke.

As far as I'm concerned the LNL bushing is a solution to a non-existent problem. Are we getting so lazy we can't screw dies in and out? Same goes for the Lee breech lock. The Hornady LNL STILL have to have the dies and bushings stored in something. With the Dillon, the tool head can be stored with ALL the dies in them, and change out is quicker than the LNL's

grizz,
the bushings are the same thing as the die plate ... you set and forget .. 2 seconds to change over .. it would be a PITA to change and reset every time

If you want a progressive, a Dillon 550B is hard to beat.

If price is your most important consideration, consider a 4-station, C-H '444' semi-progressive. With a primer feed, it is supposed to do 200-rounds an hour. It's sturdy, compact, and it will never break. I have had one for a couple months and it is now my favorite press.

www.ch4d.com

Dillon/Lee/Hornady comparison. long but worth the read before you go blue.

http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/...ornadyComparison.pdf

quote:

Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
NEJack

If you only want to load handgun calibres take a look at a Star Progressive Loader.

They are no longer in production, but they can be found.

They are the best progressive loader I have ever used.

And I have been using one since the late 1960's.

The Stars are great. I have one set up for 9X21 that I have used for years and it was used a longtime before I ever saw it. The biggest issue I see is the non-standard dies and that parts almost non-existent for it. (Not that it needs that many)

The best thing I added to mine was Dillon case feeder on top of the Hulme unit and an adjustable powder bar.

Oh and the fact that I haven' seen any for under $500 in the past few years.
Greg

quote:

Originally posted by Oddbod:
Dillon/Lee/Hornady comparison. long but worth the read before you go blue.

http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/...ornadyComparison.pdf

And please note, this is a comparisson from Hornady LnL AP and the Dillon 650 -- case feeders and all -- NOT a 550 ..

well jeff ive loaded well over a million rounds on dillons and at least a 100k on hornadys. I wonder how many he has and how good his presses would be after 50k. Anything usually works when its brand new its how it holds up for the long haul that matters. Most high volume loaders use dillons because they do hold up. When we get a couple lock and loads up over a million rounds we will see.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by Oddbod:
Dillon/Lee/Hornady comparison. long but worth the read before you go blue.

http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/...ornadyComparison.pdf

And please note, this is a comparisson from Hornady LnL AP and the Dillon 650 -- case feeders and all -- NOT a 550 ..

I wish but like was said they do need ajustment when going from the lock and load progressive to the single stage.

quote:

Originally posted by NEJack:
Could you use the bushings from the Hornady LNL single stage press the the progressive? That would be great, and make going from one to the other a snap.

My main use would be .45 ACP, of which I shoot a few hundred a week. Not a high volume, but enough that using a single stage would be a pain. I would love to use it to load .223, but I'm a bit worried I couldn't duplicate my single stage powder loads.

I have the hornady lnl ap it has been great the only problem i have had is the spring that goes around the shell plate getting kinked due to me pulling it off wrong but a 3 pack of them is 3.99 at natchez i dont own a dillion but have used them they are great too but for the price plus when i got mine hornady had a 1000 45 acp bullet rebate which was like getting the press for free . they are both great i think it just boils down to how much you wanna spend . both have excellent no question asked warranties .

The Lee is realy a PITA for most. If you are handy, likeo to fuss & tinker, then it's the press for you. If you just want to load ammo right out of the box, the Dillon 550B is tough to beat. The manual indexing makes it simple & almost fool proof. I have loaded on a pair of them for almost 20yrs now. I have loaded on a freinds LNL, except for being backwards to the Dillon, A good buy in an autoindexing press.
I recently sold one of the550B to help a friend get started then bought a 650. Great machine, but 90% of reloaders don't need the add'l. speed & complexity, including me. The 550B will easily do 450rds/hr & is easy to change calibers on. The 650 will do 650rds/hr w/o a case feeder but much more time involved in setting up for diff calibers. SO for me, it's a dedicated caliber machine, mine will load only 45acp. The 550B will handle the other 10 calibers.

Fred,
the hornady IS the 650, for the price of the 550, without anything harder than adjusting the powder thrower to change calibers .. adjusthing the timing is amazingly simple ... right out in front, available, and easy .. as for manual .. i have an rcbs supreme too ,,, though over-riding the hornady back to manual is, well, trival ... at mid stroke, turn the back whichever direction you want .. that's it.

i am one of the very few that have used, due to lack of brand loyality, dillon and hornady .. i like them both, but allow me to say it again ... the LnL AP offers indentical performance as the 650, with a 550 price .. and there's a REASON the 650 costs more than the 550 .... though i am stumped as to why Dillon would continue to offer the 550 at any price point

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
i am one of the very few that have used, due to lack of brand loyality , dillon and hornady ...

Oh please! You reek of Hornady and Rooger prejudice.

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
i am one of the very few that have used, due to lack of brand loyality , dillon and hornady ...

Oh please! You reek of Hornady and Rooger prejudice.

Oh, dave..
i "reek" of actually trying the things that i talk about .. i realize that might strike some as odd, but i actually like having, oh, first hand EXPERIENCE when i state facts, and if i present conjecture, I also acknowledge it ..

The presses *I* have or have used in my reloading studio
hornady-1, RCBS-3, Dillon-2, Ch4d - 2, corbin - 0.25 (crimping groove tool) and walnut hill swaging press, 1 .

Looks like tons of prejudice to me.. 1 of 9.25, .. yeah, that's super biased .....

So, Dave .. what's your first hand experience with progressive reloading tools, hornady or otherwise?

Just wondering, when was the last time you were in my shop and could actually SEE what i happen to own and use, or is your reply based of your extensive ruger experience?

My 'experience' is reading your posts pushing those brand products at every chance, even going off topic to do so. It's like you own stock in those companies and would derive a bigger dividend if AR members bought from them.

Excuse me if I don't go through your more than 24 thousand posts to find examples.

And then to say you lack brand loyalty (that's actually how it's spelled) is laughable. But thanks for the chuckle.

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:
My 'experience' is reading your posts pushing those brand products at every chance, even going off topic to do so. It's like you own stock in those companies and would derive a bigger dividend if AR members bought from them.

Excuse me if I don't go through your more than 24 thousand posts to find examples.

And then to say you lack brand loyalty (that's actually how it's spelled) is laughable. But thanks for the chuckle.

So, let's see ..
You took this off topic to take a silly swipe at me, without any experience in using progressive presses?

Do I have the correctly? You haven't worked with any progressive reloaders, at all, or am I incorrect in that assumption for you not answering the question.

Dave, what part of *I* own dillon and hornady progressive reloaders makes that not topical?

what part of have owned, used, and evaluated them, and kept the hornady, makes that unfounded?

Its not like I am talking smack about something i've never owned, used, or had direct first hand experience over, now, is it?

I do like that if i dont' like something or have a question that I can call a maker and get a resolution, regardless if its the desired resolution.

Oh, and yeah, i paid MY money to own these things, like the $393.xx plus shellplates and bushings, for my hornady reloading press .. after evaulating the rest ....

it made the grade, son, it delivered the goods, and its a darn good product.

What, based of your ACTUAL experience, is your suggestion for a progressive reloading press? If you have no experience, just go ahead and say so. Or is this just another one of your doggin me, without expereince in the matter?
again ... (sigh)

quote:

Fred,
the hornady IS the 650, for the price of the 550, without anything harder than adjusting the powder thrower to change calibers .. adjusthing the timing is amazingly simple ... right out in front, available, and easy .. as for manual .. i have an rcbs supreme too ,,, though over-riding the hornady back to manual is, well, trival ... at mid stroke, turn the back whichever direction you want .. that's it

I pretty much agree. I would have gone red but the basakwards LNL would clash w/ me using the 550B, so I went blue for the extra $100. I still recommend the 550B for newer reloaders to progressives because it is so easy to get up & running smoothly, easily produces 450rds/hr,

Does the 550 load rifle rounds as well as handgun? I'm kinda picky about my rifle shells.

WOW Jeff, are you sure you're not getting a little senile? I posted a response to Lost Sheep's sweeping generality (see above) about primer feeding problems. For your convenience, here it is again:

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by Lost Sheep:
But I have not yet found any on-press primer feed system that cures the problem of feeding the last few primers at the end of a loading session. At least, not one that does not involve the time-consuming step of loading a tube full of primers.



Then you obviously have not tested a Dillon. Both my SDB and 550 feed every primer from the 100th down to the last, PERFECTLY. And every single time, whether I totally fill the primer tube or only put in the last few stragglers from a certain primer lot. And no matter if large or small primer size.

There's only one drawback with a Dillon...the initial price. Once you get past that, you're set for life. And this goes without saying; if you ever need advise or service, Dillon is only a phone call away.

So NO, you didn't get it correctly.

If you care to go back to NEJack's original question you will see that he asked about a Lee progressive. I gave my opinion but didn't try to cram an expensive Dillon down his throat, even though I have more than 12 years' uneventful experience with both of mine. Or in his case, his wife's throat as she is the one balking at such an expensive purchase. Even though I decided to tough it out with my RCBS Reloader 3 single stage for many years until I could afford the Dillon SDB, I know some folks just can't wait and will buy something inferior for the short term. No skin off my ass either way.

I don't know why you're denying your obvious proclivity towards Hornady and Rooger. But somehow me pointing that out, irks you in the worst way. Just admit you're biased and be done with it.

Just to kill 2 birds with one stone, and I do apologize in advance if bringing something you brought up in a PM is off limits to you, I have never

quote:

...or, another example, you asking what a trailgun is, then making fun of it, when you don't act as if you know what one is.

isn't me. You're mixed up my friend. I encourage every AR member to post up where I ever said such a thing.

Jeff, your memory cells are deserting you in this time of need. Take your meds.

As for me 'dogging you around' I just click active topics and damn if you're not in most of them. Not my fault. Don't be so paranoid.

quote:

Originally posted by ACRecurve:
Does the 550 load rifle rounds as well as handgun? I'm kinda picky about my rifle shells.

In a word, yes.

First and foremost, I actually tried to take this discussion to a PM, which dave has chosen to bring even the contents of the PM public. I do NOT give him permission to share the contents of the PM, where I wished to have this discussion, in private. Dave obviously has no regard for any standards of actions that he feels its expident to ignore.

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:

Just to kill 2 birds with one stone, and I do apologize in advance if bringing something you brought up in a PM is off limits to you, I have never

quote:

...or, another example, you asking what a trailgun is, then making fun of it, when you don't act as if you know what one is.

isn't me. You're mixed up my friend. I encourage every AR member to post up where I ever said such a thing.

Dave...it is very bad form to bring up PMs...that's why they are called PRIVATE.....

But you knew that or you wouldn't have apologised in advance, would you?



Don