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I am learning stuff here....and need to ask some questions... When using my 7mm08 FL die set, I neck the cases by screwing back the die one full turn. 1 Is this likely to push my case shoulder FORWARD? 2 Is this likely to case the ammo to be a tight fit in the chamber & hard to close the bolt? 3 What is reason for hard bolt closing on ammo that has brass fired 3 or 4 times only & cases trimmed? "When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick." | |||
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Hey Nakihunter 1. No, if you back your FL die back up a full turn, your die should not contact any part of the case body and thus will not balloon the shoulder forward. 2. No, it will not cause the case to be a tight fit in the chamber and have a crush fit. The case may have a crush fit but it will be for other reasons listed in #3 below. 3. Brass does not usually expand fully from one firing and it takes 3 or 4 firings for it to full expand and get a crush fit. For example these are some measurements taken on a 30-06 case with my Hornady Headspace Gauge "thingy" new case - 2.040" once fired - 2.0485" (neck size only) twice fired - 2.050" (neck size only) 3 times fired - 2.051" (slight crush fit, neck size only) 4 times fired - 2.0515" (crush fit) then it is time to push the shoulder back to 2.0505" or 2.051" for a slight crush fit, which is what we call (most of us) a Partial Full Length Resize. Then every time you fire that case you will need to push the shoulder back ever so slightly to the exact dimension that you did after the 4th firing. There is some variance in the process because of the load you use, the chamber in your gun, the internal dimensions on your die and the amount of springback in your brass, but the above sequence of events is typical and can be called a base line of events. ____________________________________ There are those who would misteach us that to stick in a rut is consistency - and a virtue, and that to climb out of the rut is inconsistency - and a vice. - Mark Twain | Chinese Proverb: When someone shares something of value with you and you benefit from it, you have a moral obligation to share it with others. ___________________________________ | |||
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simple way to check on how your dies are sizing... "paint" some FIRED cases with a sharpy ... mouth to rim .. and adjust your dies to your needs by reviewing what's scraped off .. easy, fast, simple opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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From Lees website > Neck Sizing with full length dies We do not recommend neck sizing with the full length sizing die because the head space dimension of the case may be adversely affected. When you back the full length sizing die out from contact with the shell holder, the die will still reduce the body diameter of the case, which in turn causes the base to shoulder dimension to increase. This can make it difficult or impossible to close the bolt, because of insufficient headspace. Info from Lee. | |||
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Very true. If you want your ammo to always chamber, FLRS. | |||
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IME if you back the die up 3/4 turn or more then it does not contact any part of the case body. If you back it up less than 3/4 turn then it will contact the case body and balloon the shoulder forward. Of course, if you have an oversize or large chamber and a die with a small interior dimension then the amount you have to back the die up will vary. Those instructions from Lee would apply to backing the die up but not enough to stop contact with the case body. My ammo will always chamber and I PFLR after the case has fully expanded and neck size for the first 3 or 4 firings. FLRS can lead to incremental thinning at the web and eventual case head separations depending upon your loads and how far you push the shoulder back. ____________________________________ There are those who would misteach us that to stick in a rut is consistency - and a virtue, and that to climb out of the rut is inconsistency - and a vice. - Mark Twain | Chinese Proverb: When someone shares something of value with you and you benefit from it, you have a moral obligation to share it with others. ___________________________________ | |||
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That explains it!, You were before the time of gages. You built your ships from wood. Hewn by hand, shaped by eye, fitted by method. Gages a new fangled unnecessary thing. Craftsmanship, method, that was the proper way, the way it always was, and the way it always should be.
Poor old lion, once your mighty roar filled the forest and now the young ones pull your tail and tease you. That full mane, now thin, claws dull, canines worn. The bravado, boasting, jumping and running of the young is tiresome and irritating. When you describe your heroes, your accomplishments, they laugh in your face, telling you those are “so yesterday”. Though the memory is fresh in your mind. The young have no respect. Then you hear the older one chastise the young one with the words “he used to be good”. Oh, those words, “used to be" grate harder than stones and cut sharper than knives. Do you remember the last Springfield? Can you still hear the pings of the Garands, remember the Campaign hats, and how hard the 5V was to see at 300 and 600 yards? And yet, mention shooting a four and the young will act astounded. “Shoot a four!, how can that be!? The lowest scoring ring is a five”. Ah, they just don’t know. And never will know. For it is all in the past. Bitter, bitter, the sweet wine of life has turned vinegar and sour.
You will never know it, but after they hammer the lid down, and lower into you the ground, the young will miss you. They will say, “Poor old lion, but at least he is in no more pain. He is at peace.” | |||
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Yes, all new-fangled rifles. And right fine shooters at that.  That would sure be nice of them. Quite an excellent thought - Thank you.  | |||
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Thanks for that info. I am glad I was able to confirm my understanding. Now, I size my cases P-FLS as above & try them in the chamber & they go in with no real resistance. But when I load the ammo and chamber it, the bolt is hard to close. OAL for the rifle is 0.030" off lands as advised by John Barsness. The case neck does not need turning as it is within speck - fired only 3 or 4 times. Why is the sized case easy to chamber but not the fired round? "When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick." | |||
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A Sharpy or MarksAlot is also the best way to get OAL of a loaded case for a particular rifle. In other words to see at what length your bullets are just off the lands. Much easier, cheaper and actually better than any of the OAL guages that are sold. "The right to bear arms" insures your right to freedom, free speech, religion, your choice of doctors, etc. ....etc. ....etc.... -----------------------------------one trillion seconds = 31,709 years------------------- | |||
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RAE, that's how i learned to do it, too. . with a marker.. the old man let me burn my fingers, then showed me the marker trick opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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