The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting Hogs, Warthogs, Wild Boars, Javelinas Hunting .357 too small?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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One of Us |
Hi, folks- new to the forum in general, but especially to hogs- is .357 Mag to wimpy for hogs- if not, I do have other choices, but I just like the idea of punching one with my Blackhawk. I see guys like Whitworth blow the snot out of them with .480s and .500, don't have a handgun that big. Doug Wilhelmi NRA Life Member | ||
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Go for it. A .357 Jacketed hollowpoint put in the right place will kill the biggest pig that ever walked. As in all hunting bullet placement and then penetration are paramount. | |||
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A smaller pig inside of 25 yards in the earhole sure...otherwise it would not be my first choice at all. Why risk with a marginal caliber. Step up to at least a 41. Mike Legistine actu? Quid scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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50 yards or less, if you can shoot accurately, a good bullet in the ear should do the job. I would not advise a body shot. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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If the hog was bayed by dogs and you could " reach in" for a safe head shot w/ good hunting bullets, yes. Often done that way in the Florida swamps. | |||
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Don't think you've got to limit yourself to shooting them in the ear. If you're a good handgun shot there's plenty of options. Pigs aren't that tough..........if shot properly in the first place. But that applies to anything. If you're worried about their "shoulder pads" angle your bullet in behind the shoulder into the chest and "he's your's". Shots in the middle of the chest from the front will also result in a dead pig. Angling from behind the last rib into the chest cavity will also get it done. Even their shoulder pad won't resist a 158gn jhp that's got "some heat" behind it. Even on pigs of 100kg I believe a .357 mag to be adequate..........but of course more gun would be better. Crazyhorse. I'm sure that you wouldn't bet your pet pig against a good pistol shot at 50 yards if he was shooting a .357 mag. | |||
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One, I don't shoot pistols. Two, anything that will stop a 150 grain factory load from a .30-06 at less than 100 yards and not produce an exit wound, is not something I plan on chasing with a pistol, especially a .357 mag. My question for you, is why advise a person to not take the highest percentage shot available for the equipment being used? Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Absolutely. A hard cast lead bullet will work well too. I dunno where so many people get the idea that pigs are tough, they ain't, but like anything, shot placement needs to reflect the anatomy. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Crazyhorse, Of course you take the best shot avaiable to you. You owe it to the animal to kill them as quickly and cleanly as possible. The shots that I described are just suggestions of what is possible/doable in the case that they are the best shots available. They are suggestions of shots that will kill quickly. You shouldn't take the shot if you feel that the available shot, with the available gear, will not result in a quick humane death. You must also be capable of hitting what you're aiming at.......and in spite of what most people believe they're usually not good enough, with a handgun in hunting circumstances, to do it. When guns, especially pistols, start to "buck and beller" they prove very hard for most people to effectively shoot. I've found that the people who most passionately want to buy a .44 magnum can seldom shoot a .357 magnum with "pokey" factory loads. No offense intended to experienced pistol shooters meant........you've all witnessed this phenomena at the shooting range. | |||
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A properly placed bullet combined with enough penetration is fatal. A properly placed bullet that fails to penetrate not so much. _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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I hunt almost exclusively with revolvers and I can tell you with certainty, that I have plenty of revolver loads that will handily out-penetrate/perform many rifle rounds/loads. The .357 is up for the task -- loaded correctly, particularly with a wide meplat heavy hardcast bullet. Placement is everything no matter what you use, but the aforementioned cast bullet will give plenty of penetration. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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The basic point I was trying to make, was that taking the highest percentage shot with the equipment being used was/is the best option. The op leaves a lot of area open. What is the experience level of the person asking the question? Has the person ever hunted hogs before? Has the person hunted with a pistol that much? Whitworth, as you have seen on here, people will read about someone else's results with a particular caliber or type of firearm, and then run out and try to duplicate what the other person described, even though they do not have the same level of expertise/experience or equipment that was used. I think many or most of us are familiar with the type results that produces. I could be wrong, but from reading your hunt reports over the years, I really do not consider you a novice or even an average pistol shooter, and I seriously doubt that you consider yourself average. I tend to err on the side of caution when someone asks questions like the OP until after a little more information concerning their level of experience comes to light. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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CHC : + 1 on your response. | |||
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The OP asked if the .357 was adequate. In a word, yes, it is. All firearms must be mastered to some level for the hunter to be successful. This goes double for the guy/gal who decides to pick up a handgun to hunt. Yes, it is more difficult -- hands-down it is. Lighter calibers, like the .357 are actually easier to master for the lack of recoil produced. If you are reasonably confident in your ability, at ranges that actually suit you, there is no reason not to use the .357 -- as long as it is loaded correctly (and this applies to ALL calibers both rifle and revolver). I use a lot of different calibers -- I test a lot of different platforms, bullets, etc. It's what I do. However, don't think that because I use a .500 fill-in-the-blank that it is necessary. Hogs aren't bulletproof, but even a large caliber won't work well if loaded incorrectly. Good bullets, good placement, and the .357 will pile them up. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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I have killed pigs with my 357 blackhawk many times, usually i have them in a trap and it is a close easy shot, If I am stand hunting them I use my Blackhawk in 44 mag,,,,that certainly will get it done. My buddies had a big one in a trap and one of them had his 380 in his pocket, he shot it in the top of the head and he went out like a light, they dragged him out of the trap and then he "woke up" and tried to eat them alive,,, it was funny later but real dicey for 30 seconds,,,, use enough gun you can make more money, you can not make more time | |||
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Thanks, guys- didn't think I'd get so many thoughtful responses so quickly. Yep- definitely have to weigh my capability with the Blackhawk against the desire to use it. A wounded, pissed tusker wouldn't be my idea of fun, never mind the ethics of making a clean kill. Never shot hogs, so might just start with my 270, 06 or even my 7.65 mauser. Then again, if I get seriously moving on building my 9.3 x 62, I'm darn sure that's enough gun. Thanks again. Doug Doug Wilhelmi NRA Life Member | |||
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Based on my experience with deer, I would love to be sitting on a stand with my S&W Model 57 (.41 mag) and have a pig walk inside 75 yards. It's scope mounted, and I normally load 210 gr. jacketed soft-points, or hollow points. I don't think the pig would walk away. I've never shot wild game with a pistol lighter than the .41; but I think I would pass on the .357 in a field situation. I've shot a ton of javelina with a light-loaded .308; 120 gr. | |||
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Dulltool, Practice, Practice, Practice with your Blackhawk until you are confident in your abilities with it. I don't mean shoot a box of factories and then go hunting. I mean get your reloading press working and shoot thousands of shots through it. Better still take up shooting a match that requires accuracy and a time limit.....preferably using field type positions. Then practice with your hunting load to familiarise yourself with the increased recoil. Learn your quary's anatomy and restrict yourself to distances that you're comfortable with. Load your .357 with projectiles that will penetrate, and preferably expand, and then be prepared to stalk in as closely as you can. I don't consider feral hogs (to use the vernacular) to be tough..........but I endeavour to shoot them right the first time. Most of the "attacks" I've witnessed are from pigs harassed by dogs or who are unable to retreat. But I don't say that they won't "have a go" if pressed. If feral hogs were as "ferocious" as the forums would have you believe then we wouldn't have to go to Africa "looking for trouble". Yes the .357 is adequate to shoot feral hogs.....the question should be is your abilitiy with a pistol, in a hunting circumstance, adequate?? | |||
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I've killed, and seen killed, a boat load of them with the .357. If you hit them in the head, using good ammo, it's fine. All of the business about needing a "super stomper magnum" is mostly non-sense. The Hunt goes on forever, the season never ends. I didn't learn this by reading about it or seeing it on TV. I learned it by doing it. | |||
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A 357 is not too small. Use good bullets, a solid rest if possible and place a good shot on them. People used to carry the 357 in brown bear country before the 44 mag came out. Now they carry the 454 Casull and poo poo the 44 mag as not being enough. BS! Yes, the 460 S&W, the 454 Casull and the 500 S&W have a lot of HP. Not needed if you place your shot well with a good bullet. I carry a few different choices here in AK: 44 mag, 44 special, 45 LC, and 10 mm. I also have a 454 Casull but it is very heavy to carry at the end of a day slogging through mud and willows. Matt | |||
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I suggest you buy some buffalo bore,grizzly or Federal heavy, hard cast ammo and see how well you can shoot it and if you like it. If it works for you, then work up some (much cheaper) hand loads that are similar, or even better. Is the 357 mag enough ? Yes, but only w/ the right bullets. I would not use A Win, Rem, Sierra, Nosler , Speer, magtech or herters HP or anything similar. I believe you will be disappointed w/ their performance. You will not be disappointed w / the hard cast and Speer gold dot. | |||
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Thank you all for the well-considered advice. This is exactly why I joined. While I hang out mostly on the gunsmithing section, I love shooting and seriously need to get back to hunting. I load 158g JHP (I use Rainier for practice- good accuracy, but I have no real idea of terminal ballisticss) on top of 14.3g of 2400. Definitely need a different (hardcast as TK says) for hunting. That said, honing the skill level is first, bullet selection next. Doug Doug Wilhelmi NRA Life Member | |||
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Just want to ad my .02. I shot a big sow with 158gr xtp Hornaday. Did not work out well. One hit the shoulder and did not enter the chest. I asked a sporting good store person about the bullet an he said it was not designed for that much penetration. He told me to try 180 gr. xtp and I have not turned back since. You get more controlled shots than a 44 Mag and I think it kills just as good on hogs. | |||
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Would I use my .357 on hogs, yes. Would I use a 158 HP, probably not. I would prefer a good 180 grain cast or JFP, but I know it can be done with the 158. Larry "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading" -- Thomas Jefferson | |||
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I would use a .357 if I was in a ladder stand or a shooting house. There is no way I would be on the ground with a .357 hunting a hog. I shot another hog wed. 200lb sow with my .270. That makes 10 since last summer all total. All except 1 were one shot kills with the .270 using Hornady 140gr Super Performance. Then there was the hog that took (2) .270's & (3) 44mags. BTW I lived in WNC. If you've ever been to Marcum's I built all the gun & ammo cabinets Cats have nine lives. Which makes them ideal for experimentation... | |||
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Well, I'll toss in a little food for thought. I've shot pigs with my .500 BFR, and it does the job, no doubt. I've also tried to finish off two or three downed pigs with my .45 Colt loaded with 250 grain Hornady XTP bullets @ about 900 fps, and been somewhat surprised by the lack of definitive results. Don't get me wrong, my shot placement was obviously imperfect and the pigs are dead, but three shots to the head or neck were two more than I expected. My takeaway is that shot placement is **critical** when you drop down in power. analog_peninsula ----------------------- It takes character to withstand the rigors of indolence. | |||
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I have killed a bunch of hogs with the 357 mag using the Speer 160 grain 1/2 jacket semi wad cutter with body shots. That combo put them down pronto when the bullet was properly placed. The bullet/load and shot placement is key with any cartridge in my experience. Yes big bores are bigger hammers no question. _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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i personally havent tried past 75 yards.. but the 357 with good bullets kills deer, rabbits, and piggies pretty must without any drama opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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I fooled around with a 10 inch barreled and scoped contender in 357 magnum for a while using a 200 grain cast bullet from a Lyman mold designed for the 35 Remington round. With a top load of H110 I was getting somewhere between 1400 and 1500 fps. This load had plenty of penetration, was very accurate and with spine or head hits killed hogs as good as anything out to 75 yards. You probably can't get those ballistics from a revolver. I occasionally still play with this combination, in fact will take it in the next week and go sneaking up on feeders and bait piles. | |||
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neighbor and I just shot 2 hogs yesterday with an old 3 screw Blackhawk with the 22 mag cylinder in it. we scalded and butchered them as they were Yorkshires but a pig is a pig when shot between the eyes. | |||
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USE CAST OR SOLIDS tray to shoot lug heart area dont go for the brain ,when i was a well trained ipsc competitor tried this and sometimes i missed and broke the jaw ,causing longs pursues with dogs . www.huntinginargentina.com.ar FULL PROFESSIONAL MEMBER OF IPHA INTERNATIONAL PROFESSIONAL HUNTERS ASOCIATION . DSC PROFESSIONAL MEMBER DRSS--SCI NRA IDPA IPSC-FAT -argentine shooting federation cred number2- | |||
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My son-in-law does well with my reloads for his .38. I do use a stout load with a hard cast bullet. We hunt with dogs and the range is short. He is also an excellent shot, and we have dogs for back-up. If I were hunting with a handgun without dogs and using a .357 I would aim for the head or neck area. As someone else said, hogs are not all that tough and die quickly with any decent shot. That said they often do not leave a good blood trail if there is no exit, and many times this is true even with an exit wound. So for tracking purposes, I'd want at least a .41 for body shots. If you hunt in open country the above does not apply. | |||
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WAY too small for me. In the field, especially at moving/running pigs, you can't be sure of perfect shot placement. Which is why I like big calibers and heavy bullets which will penetrate into the vitals from ANY angle; I like 9.3s, 45-70s and bigger. I can punch through a hog from stem to stern and not think about it. I see guys using such varmint guns as 223s and that ilk; I cringe. I have killed a lot of pigs with 22 LR too, but that was with them eating corn right in front of me. Time to read some more Elmer. | |||
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You can kill 'em just fine with what you got. It's just too bad you are dyslexic. Go back and read it again; I'm sure you mean to say it reads .375...H&H. Knocks 'em for six every time!  H. Cole Stage III, FRGS ISC(PJ), USN (Ret) "You do not have a right to an opinion. An opinion should be the result of careful thought, not an excuse for it." Harlan Ellison " War is God's way to teach Americans geography." Ambrose Bierce | |||
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I have several ,357s and have shot a couple of hogs with them. I much prefer my 44s one does not always get a perfect shot. | |||
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This has to be the biggest reason hogs have their reputation for bullet proof. A lot of people unfamiliar with the hogs anatomy try a classic double lung like on a deer and shoot too far back. | |||
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And based on your nonsensical post, I suspect that's your actual "experience:" reading. If you can't run with the big dogs and piss in the tall grass, stay on the porch with the pups. | |||
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A hog is a lot more compactly built animal and they don't bleed out like deer either. I try and focus on the shoulder forward. Even the lowly .223 has managed to "amazingly" kill lung-shot hogs; they just ran a hell of a lot further before expiring. | |||
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| Moderator |
Penetration is a function of bullet type. If you choose a light expanding bullet, no matter the caliber, penetration will suffer. If one chooses a heavy for caliber bullet designed for deep, straight-line penetration, like a flat-nosed hardcast bullet, you can reach and destroy the vitals as long as your placement is true. This isn't caliber dependent. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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Miles, I like using big rifles for hunting. Such things as 450-400s and the like will penetrate through anything from any angle and reach the vitals. A 357 mag won't. It is simple. My hunting experience does not include shooting anything with a 357 mag. Sorry you didn't understand what I was saying. To clarify, I said a 357 was way too small "for me". If you like using the small weak calibers to hunt with, fine. I don't. | |||
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