Does anyone take a backup rifle on their plains game hunts? I am booked for RSA in 2011 and plan on using my Winchester 70 XTR in 300 Wby mag as my primary rifle. On all my other hunting trips I have always taken 2 guns with one serving as a backup. What do you guys do? The PH does offer rentals for those not wanting to bring their own rifles, so I am thinking the second rifle will be unnecessary. Of course I much prefer hunting with my own rifles. So what says the board, take just my primary rifle or include my 2nd rifle to use as a backup?

Craig

I like to take 2 rifles.

The onloy time I have not is when I was on a horse back hunt or a snowmobile hunt, where weight and bulk of another rifle is an issue.

The think is, those are the type of hunts that are hardest on rifles, where you might need a spare gun the most.

On those hunts I carry a spare scope for sure.

For your trip I would find out what kind of spare rifles the PH has for "loaners".

I took two, a 300WM and a 30.06.
Peter.

Take a back up...you will have fonder memories with your own rifle

I think taking a backup is a great idea. I usually do. I think most others do too.

I havent been to Africa yet, but on my AK Brown bear hunt & NWT Caribou hunt, a 2nd gun isnt real feasible, but I did take an extra scope/ ring & appropriate wrenches. That way if the scope/mounts bugger up, its an easy fix.
I would likely do the same; if like you I was going to RSA for a PG hunt.

I have taken back-up rifles, but never really needed them. I always take a back-up scope and I have needed it. I usually only take one rifle anymore. Two scopes and two range finders is more important IMO.....Tom

I've never taken a back up rifle as mine are all mauser 98's. But yours is a Weatherby so I'd take a second (Just mess'in with ya) Take one and save the weight.

I take my own rifles and I do take two rifles for plains game. If my primary was a .300 I'd probably take a .338 also. If my primary was the .338 then I would be happy with a .308 or 7x57 as back up.

I always take 2 rifles and a shotgun (I like waterfowl and upland birds). Because I'm usually hunting pygmy antelope or some small to medium plains game, Baboon and varmints, I take a .223 I see no need to take two of similar calibers. In a pinch, use one of your Outfitters rifles. If you take 2 guns, make sure they stay under 50 lbs in total weight, gun case included. Otherwise, the US airlines will charge you $150 or more...even for a fraction over 50.

I always take two rifles for piece of mind.

Never leave home without two rifles, either for DG or for PG.

Same P.I.T.A. for 2 rifles as for one. The only reason not to take two rifles is that you are taking a rifle and a shotgun.

Dean

I'm more afraid of the airlines losing my two rifles than I am of a breakdown of my rifle or scope.

I've made two hunts in Canada and one in Alaska. I only took one rifle on each of them. No problems.

My first African hunt was just for Plains Game. I only took one rifle, a 7mm Rem mag. No problems. Same with the three guys I went with. One rifle each, no problems.

My second African hunt was for Buffalo and PG. I took two rifles, a .375 RUM for DG and a 7mm RM for PG. Shot half of my PG animals with the .375 RUM. No problems with either rifle.

My last African hunt was again just for Plains Game, and I only took one rifle, my .375 RUM. I shot 13 PG animals varying from Steenbok to Eland with the .375. No problems, except the 270 gr TSX bullets at 3043 fps were a little hard on the smaller animals like Steenbok and Jackal, so I borrowed a .308 Win with FMJ bullets from my PH for my Cape Grysbok.

I also don't wear both suspenders and a belt at the same time.

Why not do what I do and that is take an extra firing pin, extractor, ejector and a pre sighted scope on their own mounts. You have a model 70 Winchester they are simple to maintain with just a couple of screwdrivers. Go to a gunsmith an let him teach you how to disassemble and put together your rifle, it's not hard. Most problems with rifles can be fixed in just a few minutes if you know what you are doing. And you will save in weight, extra ammo. Unfortunately in South Africa you can't have 2 rifles of the same caliber.

Not to be contrary here, but most SA outfits will rent rifles to visiting hunters. Maybe not your first choice, but fine for a backup and you can save the weight for other items. Besides, the most likely scenario where you find yourself without your primary rifle is airline loss and your backup gun will be in that case anyway.

I'll be bringing a backup to South Africa with me this fall (subsequently my first hunt in Africa!) for plains game. My Weatherby Vanguard .300 win mag and CZ550 .375 H&H, both scoped, will be coming with me.

For clients I always recommend 2 rifles. Having said that I've gambled and taken only one on several hunts. It's amazing how much crap you can put in a gun case when only carrying one rifle.

Mark

I got tired bringing home the second rifle unused. Unless I have a need for a light and a heavy I take just one rifle but have a backup scope. I took a Ruger 300 Win for a while with a spare firing pin assembly but even stopped doing that. Every outfitter unless extremely remote has a gun for you to use if necessary. I had my 300 and 375 pillar bedded and if I take one of them I disassemble it and put it together when I arrive. Almost always stays on zero and needs no tweaking when I get there. The smaller gun case is a pleasure. If you buy a Jarrett takedown, that is how he does it.

I have taken two rifles every time I hunted more than a couple hours from the house.
I leave for my PG hunt in RSA in ten days. This is a DR trip, so I'll have two with me.

I'd definitely take a 375 H&H with me if I were you. You will be much happier to take it and not need it than taking just one and having an issue with it.

Rich
DRSS

Take two, it's a PITA to take any guns into SA, but no more with two than one. Just make sure you double check the S/N's on both the 4457 and SA temp. forms. I never used my backup rifle but wish I had, just to say that I had used it in Africa in addition to the USA and Canada, maybe next time though.

I took my 338-06AI to Namibia for use on the bigger plains animals such as kudu, gemsbok and zebra. I took my 25-06 Rem for the smaller game such as springbok, steenbok and hyrax. My PH suggested a centerfire 22 but the 25-06 had been there before by a previous owner and I wanted to enjoy it myself so I loaded it with 85gr Barnes X. I was glad I did when the PH, who also happened to be the landowner, allowed me to shoot 6 springboks for the 1 trophy fee.

Toting 2 rifles along was no inconvenience at all.

i do 2. normally a 300 and a 338. i insure them for full value and just hold my breath that they make it there and back.

As others have already mentioned, two are no more trouble than one, so take two. I'm a lefty, so it is more critical for me, but I really do prefer usinf my own rifles, and ammo, if I've reloaded for the trip.

JPK

If I have checked and know my PH has a suitable extra rifle in camp I NEVER take more than one plains game rifle. Why risk losing two rifles to the airline pirates? Why take all that extra weight and bulk? Why subject your pets to undue stress and abuse, like in breakage?

I take one rifle, an extra scope in QD's that's sighted in, extra ammo for the camp rifle and call it good. The chance of having to use a "backup" rifle is so remote, don't want to take the unnecessary chances and hassels that go along with taking two.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

If you have a good two gun case and you KNOW its less than 50# with both rifles, I would take two. From a hassle standpoint, 2 is about the same as one as pointed out above. The ammo might be a bit of an issue, but honestly if you take a back up in a "common" caliber, in SA you should be able to find ammo (in 30-06, 308, 7x57) which you might not in .300 Wby., which may allow you to hunt with one of your guns if they loose the ammo and not the rifles.

You can't have two guns in the same caliber in SA (I have no idea why..)

The extra scope is a good idea as its the most common bolluxed up item, and don't forget the wrench for the mounts- an extra scope is worthless if you can't get it on the rifle.

Have fun is the most important thing!

I will second "crbutler" on his comments. Since your primary rifle is a 300 Weatherby, ammo may or may not be readily available if the airline misplaces yours. A second rifle in a common caliber that you get ammo for locally may save the day.

Even though I have not needed by backup rifle on either of my safaris, it was comforting to know it was there. My concern about a rental rifle is always familiarity. I know the capabilities of each of my rifles and practice with both the primary and backup extensively before departing.

After my trip to Zambia where my hunting partner had the airlines lose his suitcase (but not his guncase), when possible I always try to take one gun in a double gun case and split my clothes and gear between the two. If both get lost them I'm SOL, but if only one does then I at least have some spare clothes, etc. A gun can be borrowed, but it's harder to find all new clothes in some of these remote spots. I hope this will prevent what happened to him, namely wearing the same clothes for 3 days.

JPK - Not to nitpick , but there is more trouble when taking two rifles as opposed to one. 2X the paperwork; 2X the checkin hassel when leaving; 2X the hassel when clearing Customs on arrival; 2X the weight; 2X the bulk; 2X the risk one or both will get broken; 2X the risk losing two guns if stolen.

So in my way of thinking it's 2X the trouble for two guns as opposed to one. Not saying it isn't worth the risk/trouble or imposing my thoughts on others, just not worth it to me.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by JPK:
As others have already mentioned, two are no more trouble than one, so take two. I'm a lefty, so it is more critical for me, but I really do prefer usinf my own rifles, and ammo, if I've reloaded for the trip.

JPK

Yet another reason:
I was at the range yesterday practicing with my 375 H&H. To cut a long story short, when cycling the bolt I sheared off the case head leaving the rest of the case in the chamber. I am not sure how readily this could be resolved "in the field". This stuff can and does happen.
Peter.

Peter, certainly Murphy's Law will strike anytime and any place, but didn't you admit the sheared off case head was from many-times reloaded practice brass? So, not saying it cannot happen, but sticking by the cardinal rule of using only new or once-fired brass that has been cycled through your action, that scenario should never happen in the bush.

A back up rifle? not really necessary today I think. As it is already written also all the risks are doubled, weight increase and costs can increase too. It can, eventually, works there where hunters are allowed to bring a fixed number of ammo for each rifle.

A spare scope? more usefull by my opinion. When possible, it should stay in the hand luggage, avoiding Heathrow Airport, with some personal spare item, like socks, underpants and a pair of shirts. Then the bag with the hygienic items. When possible I travel already dressed for hunting, boots included, less weight in the luggage. Of course I do not dress some extreme camo clothes :grin

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
JPK - Not to nitpick , but there is more trouble when taking two rifles as opposed to one. 2X the paperwork; 2X the checkin hassel when leaving; 2X the hassel when clearing Customs on arrival; 2X the weight; 2X the bulk; 2X the risk one or both will get broken; 2X the risk losing two guns if stolen.

So in my way of thinking it's 2X the trouble for two guns as opposed to one. Not saying it isn't worth the risk/trouble or imposing my thoughts on others, just not worth it to me.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by JPK:
As others have already mentioned, two are no more trouble than one, so take two. I'm a lefty, so it is more critical for me, but I really do prefer usinf my own rifles, and ammo, if I've reloaded for the trip.

JPK

First, as far a traveling with ammo in a cartridge for a rifle which you don't have with you, and clearing customs, good luck! It ain't going to happen in a lot of (most?) countries.

And the two gun "hassles", I don't see it that way.

Form 4457 is needed for any gun your take out of the country, so I them already, and have for years, fo all of my guns which may go out of the country. If you don't have them, it is insignificantly more trouble to take two rifles and get them than one rifle. Better yet, take any rifle or shotgun that might see travel and get it done all at once.

You need a case for one or two guns. One case with wheels. A two gun case isn't 2x the weight (for comparable cases the weight difference is about 25%) or bulk (for comparable cases width increases only about four to six inches, same length, same depth), and it rolls anyway.

Paperwork, its not 2x the paperwork since it is merely an another entry on the same form. And filling in say, "Winchester Model 70, serial No xxx, 30-06" is hardly significant additional work, especially when the serial number is always availble in memory or on the 4457 in your wallet.

Checking in, you have to open the case, whether it contains one or two rifles. Maybe open a second bolt if you must to show the ticket agent that the rifles are empty, in my experience opening the bolt is infrequently required anyway. Not a whole lot of additional burden, eh?

Clearing customs, you need to point to an additional serial number on the second rifle. Big deal? No, not if you have thought for the mere moment it takes and have positioned the rifles so that the serial numbers show as they sit in the case. Might be required to take it out of the case occasioanlly. No big deal to replace it if you have made the simple generic foam cut outs to put them back in place.

Perhaps 2x the risk of a rifle being broken, but if your case is a good one to begin with, the risk of breaking a rifle is very, very, very small. Less if you remove bolts. (which I do not since I believe the risk is much greater of an inspector removing and not replacing a bolt than of rifle damage resulting from leaving the bolt in the rifle) And that is but one good reason to insure your rifles.

There isn't any increase in the chance that your rifle case may go missing in transit, lost or stolen. But, if it does and you are carrying two rifles, you will loose two rather than one. Another very small risk and another of those good reasons to insure your rifles, along with theft at home, fire loss, theft from your car on hunting trips, damage from droppping them or loosing them, and the plethora of other reasons, which happen more frequently than guns going missing on flights.

For the insignificant additional "hassle", as you put it, and the insignificant additional risk of loss or breakage, you get to spend you expensive as hell hunting time using a rifle you are familiar with, that you have confidence in, that you are confident going to function and is going to be accurate. And, if you handload, is going to shoot ammunition you have confidence in.

To travel thousands of miles on an expensive hunt without a second second familiar and capable rifleis foolish in my mind.

JPK

onefunzr2, you are correct, in this case I was using reloaded brass. I am considering how to avoid this problem in the field. I would not use new brass but perhaps use once fired, and obviously cycle it through the rifle. Would this guarantee that the failure I mentioned would not occur? I don't believe so. Would it reduce the likelihood? Yes I think so.
Still, my foot is firmly in the take two rifles camp.
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
...I am considering how to avoid this problem in the field. I would not use new brass but perhaps use once fired...

Why would you shy away from new brass?

Because "new" means "untried". Just me I guess. Incidentally I went to the range yesterday and cycled three rounds through my Blaser shooting and reloading without a hitch! I was trying to be smoother in my cycling, rather than yanking on the bolt handle. Same batch of brass!
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
Because "new" means "untried"..

By its very nature, factory ammo is 'untried.'
I don't see folks shying away from it.

Why would it be any different if you used new 'untried' brass and loaded your choice of primer, powder and bullet?

quote:

A spare scope? more usefull by my opinion. When possible, it should stay in the hand luggage,

I read once that U.S. airlines would not allow any firearms parts, including scopes, in carry on luggage. Is that not true?

quote:

Originally posted by buffybr:

quote:

A spare scope? more usefull by my opinion. When possible, it should stay in the hand luggage,

I read once that U.S. airlines would not allow any firearms parts, including scopes, in carry on luggage. Is that not true?

The term "gun Parts" is open to interpretation so you may have trouble with an extra scope in your carry-on depending on TSA's whims or the counter agent's attitude. An extra scope isn't going to do you any good if your firearm doesn't show up at your destination so I usually pack mine with my rifle. I never take a back up rifle but I always take Mrs Blacktailer and her rifle so we can share if necessary.

BT - That is the perfect and maybe the only solution/reason for the taking of two rifles on safari? But, then it's back to the old 2X game. 2X the luggage, 2X the cost, 2X the on and on. The taking of a wife, girlfriend, best friend or such really does justify the 2X syndrome however.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktailer:

quote:

Originally posted by buffybr:

quote:

A spare scope? more usefull by my opinion. When possible, it should stay in the hand luggage,

I read once that U.S. airlines would not allow any firearms parts, including scopes, in carry on luggage. Is that not true?

The term "gun Parts" is open to interpretation so you may have trouble with an extra scope in your carry-on depending on TSA's whims or the counter agent's attitude. An extra scope isn't going to do you any good if your firearm doesn't show up at your destination so I usually pack mine with my rifle. I never take a back up rifle but I always take Mrs Blacktailer and her rifle so we can share if necessary.