quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I am not going to argue with anyone here. Tempers have flared, therefore some are having issues seeing the point of the other.

Let me pose a question. If the speed limit was 70 MPH on a highway and it was raining insanely hard with a 60 MPH wind blowing, is it a good idea to drive 70 MPH? It is legal to drive 70 MPH. It is legal to drive when raining. It is legal to drive in high wind. Is it a good idea to do so?

Personally, I am not bothered (individually) by :

1- Hunting bordering a park or

2- Hunting lions at night

3- Shooting a collared lion

I am bothered by:

1- Palmer's past history.

2- Hunting on seized lands.

3- Likely hunting with people on the banned list.

4- Cutting off the collar and leaving it.

5- Hunting the lion with a bow.

6- The reported price of the hunt.

Add the first 3 items and collectively, something sure seems fishy. It sure as hell didn't do us any good.

I can't wait for a good Mark Sullivan thread after this one.

I basically agree with you Larry. Except I see nothing wrong with hunting lion with a bow.

,

At night?

Agreed! Bow at night not good! Thought you meant bow hunting lion in general.

Poorly written on my part Lane.

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron Neilson:
Mike - Come on bro, be nice for awhile will ya?

Funny Aaron.

I for one hoped the main players in this pissing match would keep their animosity towards each other in this thread only. Unfortunately I see that is already not the case.

Cheers
Jim

Yup.

Scientists Finally Disclose Cecil Not Lured from Park
Written By John J. Jackson III, Conservation Force Chairman & President
(posted June 2016)

WILDCRU, The Wildlife Conservation Research Unit based at Oxford University that collared and satellite tracked Cecil has just published an article revealing that Cecil was not lured out of the Hwange National Park by Dr. Palmer and/or his PH. It also discloses that Cecil was in a core area he occupied outside of the park when hunted. The lion's home range was far outside of the park.

To quote the article by David W. Macdonald, et al. Cecil: A Moment or a Movement? Analysis of Media Coverage of the Death of a Lion, Panthera Leo. Animals 2016, 6, 26; doc: 10.3392, the lion had been collared and satellite tracked since 2009. Cecil was one of "65 lions that were hunted on the land surrounding the Protected Area, 45 of them were equipped with tracking devices."

"It was reported (incorrectly) to have been lured by bait out of the park..." The lion was hunted on bait out of the park. The lion was hunted on a bait, but not lured from the park as some media accounts have implied; the area was part of the lion's normal range. The ranch where the hunt took place was within the "home range" of the lion during the prior months (April, May, June) until arrowed July 1st at approximately 22:00. The hunt finished "approximately 250 cm from where he was initially wounded." That was 9 am the next morning.

Analysis: The lion's "home range" from April until hunted on July 1 was as much outside of the park as in the park. He was not "lured out of the park by dragging bait from the park..." That was wholly fabricated in the early reports and continues to be misrepresented today. That inflammatory fabrication was heightened by other false reports that are not noted in the article. One media source was threatened with government sanctions for misrepresentations. Another story about the killing of Jericho, "Cecil's Brother" by another hunter within the park was also wholly concocted. Jericho was not the brother of Cecil. Jericho was not killed at all, and therefore not "killed by a hunter in the park."

The false report that one of Cecil's cubs had been killed was also alarming. The cub was not likely to have been Cecil's and still survives today.

There was the suggestion by all that the killing of a collared lion was in itself illegal. Not so; most lion taken for over a decade in the area were collared, 45 of the 65. One of the purposes of the collaring research was to determine the causes of the morality of the pride lion.

Editorial and social media both carried the message that lion were in danger of extinction. Not true by any stretch of the imagination. The lion quota was extremely low, cautionary, and scientifically based. The local communities and hunting operators had been incentivized by the safari hunting revenue to shepherd the lion as potential trophies instead of livestock-eating vermin. Yours truly had made an in-person appeal to the conservancy land owners adjoining the park to take down the livestock fences, eliminate the cattle, and let the lions grow to be more valuable trophies. But for that approach Cecil may have never been born, and surely would not have lived to a scruffy old 13 years of age. Following the suggested changes, the lion population in the park increased from 300-400 to 800 with a growing "resident population" outside of the park boundaries at the time Cecil was taken.

There should no longer be any doubt that fabrications, apparent illegality, and ignorance made "a perfect storm" that otherwise would not have been a rational reaction. Let's hope that lion conservation and the good people that must tolerate lion don't bear the costs of the fabricated storytelling.

LINK

It's interesting to read the actual facts finally given here and go back and read the thread. Lots of folks jumping to conclusions and believing "facts" from left leaning news sources.

Thank you for posting this!

You'll never hear or see a news correction!!!!!

To perhaps finish with this great post I paste one from the very first page from Opus1,that a few of us could learn something from...quote

posted 13 November 2015 23:34 Hide Post

Larry, that is exactly why I carefully consider who I share a campfire with. I've met a handful of the over-stressed, overly critical, anally retentive types who couldn't have a good time regardless of the circumstances. They make everything more complicated and less enjoyable. Life is too dang short for all that noise.

I don't know if I would like the dentist or not, but at least I am not going to engage in character assassination from afar without knowing. One thing for sure is most of the accusations leveled at him turned out to be utter nonsense. The guy maybe an egotistical putz or a genuinely nice guy. No one around here knows.

Anywho, to each his own, but maybe a good lesson for all is to get the facts before jumping to conclusions - or in the hunting vernacular, aim before shooting.

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