A question to you:

I have been offered the chance to go on a hunt with a friend in Mozambique for Buff and a few other species. Being young and married means my finances are not in a position to use savings for this hunt, as I really need to think about tomorrow, so to fund it, I would need to sell a few things and quickly. I have 6 firearms that cover a broad spectrum of uses, namely

243 Win - Target and Jackal Rifle
270 Win - Small to Medium Sized Plains Game
308 Win - Bushpig Rifle fitted with silencer
300 WM - Larger Plains Game
375 H&H - Eland, Blue Wildebeest etc in Bushveld
416 RM - Dangerous Game


My idea is to sell the 243, 270, 300 and 375. Leaving me with a 308 and 416 to hunt anything and everything under the sun. The 308 would essentially become my go-to rifle, with the 416 loaded with 330gr GSC HV being used for Eland and Dangerous Game. The 308, will have to cover the 270 and 300's ability of long range plains game, however with a 130gr GSC HV Bullet, I think I should be close to the ballistics of the 270 with ordinary 130gr Bullets, the 300 of course is a different proposition, and the first rifle I would look to buy in future again is a 300 Win Mag. The sale of these rifles, along with their scopes and Dies, Cases and Bullets etc, should be able to fund everything I need. This would be the hunt of a lifetime, as, being newly married and possible kids in the future, I don't know when I will be able to finance something like a dangerous game hunt, in a truly wild place again. Also, availability of hunting in 10 or 20 years time is never a given, hence my idea of selling everything now and then building up a hunting battery again over time as funds allow.

So my question to you is, would you keep the firearms and save up for a hunt in the future, or would you sell off everything, possibly compromising yourself on other plain games hunt with only a 308 at hand, and go on a dangerous game hunt now while I can.

Cheers and thanks for you input.

Your 308 is more than enough for all the game that walks around SA. I have used the GS 130gr on everything including Eland and got 3200 fps out of it.

You may battle to get fair value for your guns though as the used market in SA is rather poor.

What is the cost of the hunt in Moz?

R130K all inclusive.

I estimated very low with my expectations of what I could get for the rifles, scopes, dies, bullets cases, etc, to get to the R130K.

My 308 has an 18" Barrel with a silencer fitted, so velocity will be a bit less than yours. With the 140gr GS I was getting 2900fps. So with the 130gr I think I should be able to get 3000fps.

Eland - 416 Rem Mag with 330gr GSC at 2650fps

Life is short, and rifles can easily be replaced. The two you have chosen to keep will suffice for anything you want to do in all of Africa. Only thing I would suggest is research on area and PH you will be going with to make sure it is not a witch hunt. If all is good, I would go. Tommorow you may ne in a car wreck that disables you and such hunts are done, those rifles will do you no good then either, but you will have memories of a buff hunt that can not be taken away!
Just my two cents

You don't have enough guns yet, at least not enough to sell and go big time to Moz. Save up and do it smaller first.

2 cents

As hard as it is to obtain a license for a new firearm in SA, don't count on being able to easily replace what you sell...

Go now, you never know what life might throw at you. Do you want a bunch of toys that sit in a safe most of the time or a lifetime of experiences.

Go now. Population growth, political change, random life situations, all work against the kind of hunting we see today. Go while its good, hope that it doesn't end.

Who/ where are you going in Mozambique?

I agree with the "go now" folks. You could get sick, hit by a car, lose your job, etc some day sooner than you think. You can always replace guns if you want to; you can't fabricate memories you decided to forego.

Go now! then sell of stuff and hopefully go again.

You should not compromise your family's financial stability.

That being said, if there is any way you can afford it you should go now.

It will never be any cheaper than today and like others say you never know what tomorrow holds.

A warning to you, the african bush will likely cast a spell on you that will be hard to break.

Deon,

Im almost in the same situation........I would however not sell of my stuff to do this. Rather save up and do a nice buff hunt in Zim , Moz or RSA in future. There is always a opportunity somewhere, especially for us locals that can act quick when something pitches up. Also replacing guns and getting licenses in SA will become much more difficult in future, trust me !!

Deon,

Keep the 3-7-5 and let the others go. There is nothing you can't hunt with it. Solids for the little guys and ele, 250 gr softs to reach way out there and 300 gr softs for buffalo and eland etc. Hunt now. As others have said you never know what's around the corner.

Mark

130,000 ZAR is about $11,300 US. You don't say what the rifles you propose selling are, but they would have to be pretty nice pieces to average almost $3,000 each. Are you sure you've done your math right?

I think it boils down to whether you can afford the trip (which sounds pretty economical for a Mozambique hunt). By "afford", what I mean is that you will be trading part of your capital assets (decreasing your net worth) by selling your guns. Would your family's financial security, which always must come first, be significantly impacted by losing $11,000 of your net worth? If your answer to that question is "no", then you should go if it pleases you sufficiently. And as others have said, such hunting is not likely to get better and cheaper in the foreseeable future.

You are never promised anything tomorrow so if you can sell some guns and other things I would do it. You are young and can always make more money, time is something you can't make more of.

If you are newly married, I would either save the guns or, downgrade the hunt and save the $$$.

Yes, you may die, prices might go up etc. However, odds are that saving your money and planning for the future will net better results!

Good luck!

I wouldn't sell guns in SA if I was you, with your firearm ownership restrictions, just for one hunt.

Life is short I rather have memories that things you can always replace rifles

I am a fair bit older than you and planned a Zim buffalo hunt for 2 years.

In the end I could not get the cash sorted as business wet quieter than expected. So I just used the tickets & went on a holiday for 2 weeks. Shot some pigeons. Saw lots of game in Botswana & Vic Falls. Spent time with my brother.

I could have sold my guns for about $10k but I doubt they would have gone in time! I am currently trying to sell my Sako 280 Ack Imp & my CZ 416 Rigby to release cash for other priorities. Not a single bite for the last 2 months! This is in NZ where there is no limit on the number of guns you can own & licensing is not a problem!

By 2 bits worth - If you can sell your guns, just do it & go.

Go now. Dollar is good and many things can change quickly. You will never regret going to Africa to hunt. I would sell all and keep 375 h&h. I have used mine on many small antelope and damages less meat than most medium bores and is one gun that will do it all, anywhere.

The way I see it you could have your guns in your safe and get them out once in a while and think what could have been, or you can sell some stuff and have memories for a lifetime.
I also agree that the 375 will do it all so I would be inclined to keep that.
Hope it works out for you!

Just hunt all you can while you keep family fed, clothed and happy
That's what I did, but of course wife has to be on your page and that's the ticket

quote:

Originally posted by sdirks:
I agree with the "go now" folks. You could get sick, hit by a car, lose your job, etc some day sooner than you think. You can always replace guns if you want to; you can't fabricate memories you decided to forego.

What if he gets killed by a buff if he goes?

Your advice would sound pretty crappy, wouldn't it?



Asking here is just going to reinforce a decision to go now.

Good financial advice from strangers with no idea of your financial circumstances?

Riiiiiiiight.

But yeah, the eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die crowd here will be loud.

Whether it is right for you is another story.

Good luck whatever your decision.

I have opinions that seem ,most of the time, to be opposite most on these forums have. So I suppose that would mean you should ignore what I have to say. I have made 8 safaris to Africa,Zimbabwe in particular. Planned to go to Mozambique once but it did not happen. In those 8 Safari's I took most everything Zimbabwe had to offer except Lion and Hippo and Hippo never interested me. I shot everything from Duiker to Elephant with a 375H&H and did not ever at any time feel improperly gunned so to speak.I did believe that the 375H&H was maybe and I do mean maybe not the proper round for Elephant so switched to 470NE then to 416Rigby. Would quite comfortably try again for an Elephant with a 375H&H if the opportunity presented itself. I used 260 Nosler Partitions for everything but Elephant with total success in all cases. So keep the 375 and sell everything else and go. I have grave doubts hunting will get any less expensive in the future and more and more areas and game is being excluded everyyear. The choice ,of course, is yours to make and that depends on where you place your values. I can truthfully say hunting in Africa was the greatest adventure of my life and has been only equaled by my marriage. I am 81 and have not been to Africa since 2004 but I remember each and every hunt I made and every animal I took as vividly as if it were yesterday. I'm sitting here as I write this and looking at the 50lb tusks I took on my last hunt and a Zebra rug given to me by my PH friend after a couple of hunts. Incidentally I used to practice with the 375H&H here on ground squirrels and have to say it is really effective.

Years ago I was in the exact same situation as you and I opted to save my money. All of a sudden I was 50yrs old and had still not gone to Africa. So guess what I did, I sold a bunch of my guns, many of which had not seen the light of day in years. I took the cash and went on a buff and ele hunt that was the most amazing adventure of my life. My one regret? I should have done it THIRTY years earlier! I have thought about that hunt every single day since I got back and I honestly could not name half of the stuff that I sold to pay for it. GO NOW!

Go now.
Sell the lot except for the 375.
Enjoy !!

Jeepers, thanks for all the replies

I know asking here, I will probably always get the advice to go hunt, this is after all a hunting forum. As to financial advice, the reason I'm selling guns and scopes etc, is so that I don't need to look at touching investments and back up reserves. So after the Hunt, I will not be financially affected, in terms of back up reserves, other than having a few less guns. I would never compromise financial stability for a hunt, hence I'm giving up Guns for a Hunt, its almost a Like for Like swop really. My thinking is, I can always save up for a rifle, but a chance to go hunting in a wild place like Mozam, is not necessarily there all the time, also, with Kids in the foreseaable future, disposable income might be less, so the chance to hunt again realistically will only be in 20 Years time. If I didn't buy the guns', scopes etc over the last 8 Years, and took the same money and invested it into a 'Hunting Fund' I'd probably be at the same point, so its not as if I'm putting myself in a position where I'm spending money that I haven't put away so to say.

The reason I'm keen to sell the 375 is due to its weight. If I'm going to be slugging something heavy around, it might as well start with a .4something. My plan is to load 245gr GSC Bullets in the 416RM as a all round load, which should recoil the same as a 375 and 250gr Bullets and make the 416RM as much of an All rounder as the 375H&H is. The 308 should cover everything the 243 and 270 do, with only the 300 WM being a bit difficult to stretch with the 308 and with the 416. I think I'll sell it last. As to licensing in SA, currently its actually quite efficient, for here at least, and licenses aren't taking longer than 3 Months. So that isn't to problematic.

Anyways, thanks for the advice guys. I think I might just start advertising

A good friend got hit with a major health issue at age thirty. Go now. You can always buy more rifles but circumstances could prevent you being able to have a great adventure. Life is for living, not collecting.

quote:

As to financial advice, the reason I'm selling guns and scopes etc, is so that I don't need to look at touching investments and back up reserves. So after the Hunt, I will not be financially affected, in terms of back up reserves, other than having a few less guns.

Sounds like you're in sound enough financial condition that "spending" the guns won't impact you, in which case I say "full steam ahead"!

But will four rifles really bring $11,000?

When you're young you usually have no money.
When you get a little older and finally get some money, you have no time.
When you finally get some money and time, you may not have your health.

Go when/while you can, assuming normal head of the household duties aren't neglected. You won't regret it.

quote:

Originally posted by Deon:
Jeepers, thanks for all the replies

If I didn't buy the guns', scopes etc over the last 8 Years, and took the same money and invested it into a 'Hunting Fund' I'd probably be at the same point, so its not as if I'm putting myself in a position where I'm spending money that I haven't put away so to say.

I have said this several times and some are probably sick of it, but I bought a new 4 wheel drive when I was 24 - my ticket to the world of hunting. Once I had it paid off, I saved the car payment and went on my first African hunt. I then thought it would be nice to be able to do that every year. That was back when stocks were going up 10 percent every year or so it seemed. I started something called the "hunt fund." I invested money and then tracked it in an Excel spreadsheet. I figured when I got to 100K I could go hunting every year off the earnings. I made my next big hunt to Mongolia four years after Africa but before amassing my 100K goal in the hunt fund; my Excel plan gave me confidence I could spend the money.

The hunt fund still exists today and the Excel file is called NHunt6.1. It has a history of our net worth by month going back to 2000, the return on all of our investments by month, etc. It tracks the real estate investments we have as well as mortgages we carry (own), stocks, PE, MsAZW's stock options, etc. It forecasts our net worth out into the future, has a retirement planner (you plug in retirement age and expected lifespan and it returns how much we are worth at death). It has a tab listing all of my planned hunts, including the year and month I go/pay for them and adjusts our net worth accordingly (at this point it is a non issue - stock market volatility is a much bigger deal). It showed me long ago no matter how hard I saved, the best way to go on the hunts I wanted was to make more money. I knew if I worked for the man I would never go on a 21 day, so I pondered my wants and needs and decided to strike off on my own. I knew if I failed I would never do a 21 day, but that was exactly the same outcome as if I did nothing, so my answer was obvious - I started a software company. The most I ever made working for someone I eclipsed early in my second year in business.

So I would say go on the hunt and if you like it, start a hunt fund and figure out what your plan is and how you are going to get there. As my uncle told me once, "one day you are 20; the next day you wake up and you are 60 and you wonder 'where has my life gone?'" Don't lie on your death bed wishing you had done things differently.

I too would keep the 375 H&H.

But I'm probably the wrong guy to ask.

I spend half of my money on Hunting and Harley Davidsons... the rest I just waste!

quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Graves:
I too would keep the 375 H&H.

But I'm probably the wrong guy to ask.

I spend half of my money on Hunting and Harley Davidsons... the rest I just waste!

Three classic quotes.

The .375 is extremely versatile and I have seen more Buffalo drop to this calibre than any other.

Unless one is very wealthy, life invariably presents you with the choice of "having stuff" or "doing stuff". Sure, there are limits to how low you can take your physical stock of "stuff", but for me and my family, we generally prefer to DO rather than HAVE.

You could sell the 243, 270, 308, and 300 WM, and replace all of them with a 30-06.

go now!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by JGRaider:
When you're young you usually have no money.
When you get a little older and finally get some money, you have no time.
When you finally get some money and time, you may not have your health.

Sounds exactly like what my dad told me many years ago..

"Go will the goin's good".

The exchange rate this morning was R14.591 to $1, so your R130,000 hunt in Mozambique would be $8,909U.S.

I suspect more than a few AR members would like to know how to get that price for a buffalo hunt in Mozambique.

As for which rifle/s to keep, your choice would work nicely for that hunt. The .375 is a great all-around caliber, but I personally do not enjoy shooting anything with more recoil than a .300 Win Mag, and I do not shoot anything larger than that well.

My suggestion is keep your .308. You will miss it when hunting in South Africa. You also might want to bring your wife into the decision.

Bill Quimby