I picked up "Hunting the African Elephant, The Complete Guide" at the Charlton McCallum Safaris booth in Vegas and am watching it right now..

Hunting Elephant has always been my dream and this DVD is phenomenal! I've been looking at booking Croc & Hippo for Sept 2015 - I think it might end up being tuskless if my Croc / Hippo plans don't pan out - I don't think I can take it any more!!!

I just hope there is quota still available in two weeks.....

They are great videos. I study the instructional DVD repeatedly before I go every single time.

I was discussing the idea of hunting elephants with Blake, possibly instead of croc and hippo - he handed me the DVD and said - " This is the definitive resource for hunting elephants"

I believe him!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
They are great videos. I study the instructional DVD repeatedly before I go every single time.

Larry,

I've about worn mine out.

Cheers
Jim

Me three! Best instructional DVD I have seen.

I'm really curious, what SPECIAL training is required to hunt Elephants that does not apply to any other animal. In any hunting you must find the animal then shoot it and kill it. You must use an adequate weapon and know how to find the Elephant but you have to know this with any animal you hunt. I am just curious as to exactly WHAT is DIFFERENT.

I think Buzz's DVD on elephant should be a required viewing. Most excellent video and discussion. Certainly enhanced my hunt

Quite a bit. Check out the video

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
I'm really curious, what SPECIAL training is required to hunt Elephants that does not apply to any other animal. In any hunting you must find the animal then shoot it and kill it. You must use an adequate weapon and know how to find the Elephant but you have to know this with any animal you hunt. I am just curious as to exactly WHAT is DIFFERENT.

Definitively one of the best hunting DVD,s ever made

Agreed, a must watch.

Maybe a model for a Leopard one, to demistify points of aim, shooting with light and without, how to work in the blind d, etc...

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
I'm really curious, what SPECIAL training is required to hunt Elephants that does not apply to any other animal . In any hunting you must find the animal then shoot it and kill it. You must use an adequate weapon and know how to find the Elephant but you have to know this with any animal you hunt. I am just curious as to exactly WHAT is DIFFERENT.

Finding the brain from any angle or distance presented is what is different. Small target on a very large animal. Just shooting at the head will not do it. And with every movement of the elephant's head, or change of distance, finding that "football" of a brain hidden deep in the skull takes some instruction and practice in order to locate it with precision.

Buzz's first DVD on ele hunting is probably the greatest instructional video on how to find that brain shot from the side and from the front, regardless of the angle caused by head movement or distance from the target.

I bought the three Buzz's DVDs in 2013. They are excellents and I don't know how many times I have watched them. Maybe 10 times each DVD ? And it's not finish
All have wonderful footages and are very pedagogic. I've learnt a lot of things and now I dream to go hunting in Zimbabwe.. I think it will be good for 2016.
Thank you again Buzz

So the REAL question is.... Do DVDs wear out? Should I have a backup DVD :-)

Buzz covers much more than just shooting elephants.. Biology & physiology, aging elephants...

What is different? In theory nothing. You get on tracks, follow, then stalk and shoot an appropriately selected animal.
In practice, it is more thrilling than any hunt I have ever done. Just being in their presence is half of it, I suppose. bouncing around the edges of a big herd in close cover, not just hearing their rumbles, but feeling them in your feet. Facing a six ton animal at a few yards, it can be quite confrontational. Knowing that if things aren't handled properly, the situation can go pear shaped really fast.
The enormity of what you've done that sinks in after the shot.
I probably would have retired several years ago if I hadn't decided I needed to experience it once and hunted tuskless in 2009. At this rate, I'll probably put at least one of Buzz's girls through school.

I'd suggest reading Richard Harland's book as well as watching Buzz's fine DVD's. Add Ian Nyschen's "Months of the Sun."

If you go, you will know what is different. At least on a properly conducted tracking hunt.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by zimbabwe:
I'm really curious, what SPECIAL training is required to hunt Elephants that does not apply to any other animal . In any hunting you must find the animal then shoot it and kill it. You must use an adequate weapon and know how to find the Elephant but you have to know this with any animal you hunt. I am just curious as to exactly WHAT is DIFFERENT.[/QUOTE ]

Finding the brain from any angle or distance presented is what is different. Small target on a very large animal. Just shooting at the head will not do it. And with every movement of the elephant's head, or change of distance, finding that "football" of a brain hidden deep in the skull takes some instruction and practice in order to locate it with precision.

Buzz's first DVD on ele hunting is probably the greatest instructional video on how to find that brain shot from the side and from the front, regardless of the angle caused by head movement or distance from the target.

Just Perfect what is all about !

Morten

First you assume the brain shot is the only shot used to take an elephant and second a killing shot on ANY animal requires the marksman to place his shot in the proper place. So far I have heard nothing special about the taking of an Elephant. I will admit they are big dangerous animals but so are Lions,Kodiak Bears and Cape Buffalo. It all requires skill and knowledge of your adversary.

Buzz's video allowed me to place my brain shot with confidence at 18yds this October in Zimbabwe. Very low shot through the trunk. I've never met you Buzz, but thank you so much!

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
First you assume the brain shot is the only shot used to take an elephant and second a killing shot on ANY animal requires the marksman to place his shot in the proper place. So far I have heard nothing special about the taking of an Elephant. I will admit they are big dangerous animals but so are Lions,Kodiak Bears and Cape Buffalo. It all requires skill and knowledge of your adversary.

Well, I think you can take the discussion of eles a bit further in comparison to other game, even dangerous game. Ele are typically hunted in very close proximity. Often inside their flight or fight window. This is often required due to the thickness of the bush you find them in. Not always, but depending on the location you're hunting them in, very often the case. For instance in the Zambezi Valley, it's usually VERY close!

Buffalo don't tend to charge unless wounded, and then not that often, but if they do, hitting the CNS is pretty much required to stop them. Lion and Leopard will slink away, again unless wounded and pressed. Ele are the exception in that they will often take great offense to finding you in their close proximity ... especially if you're speaking of hunting tuskless cows in herds!! Should you take a charge from an ele a close range, your best opportunity to stop that charge is to hit the brain. I doubt you'd take a heart shot to try and stop an ele charge at a few yards!!

While the heart shot on ele is a viable option, and even preferred at times, it's less challenging, especially compared to the frontal brain shot which would be the presentation in the event of a charge. Of course, one could simply fall back on hoping the PH takes care of any touchy scenarios that may develop, but then they are human and using mechanical firearms, both being subject to the occasional error or malfunction. Personally, I prefer to be prepared to handle my own issues to the best of my abilities before going into the thick jesse after Jumbos, and rely on the PH only in the event I screw it up!!

Typically, that requires lots of range time practicing with my big bore weapon until operating its action, reloading under pressure, etc is second nature. It also requires being able to find that brain shot. In other words, I'd hate to find myself in a charge situation without a clue of how to stop it. And a heart shot won't get the job done when we are talking 10 yards or less.

There are other considerations as well, such as elephant today sometimes being hunted near boundaries, either National Parks or adjacent hunting blocks. In certain areas, one searches for evidence of eles crossing into your block and take up the track from that point. Taking a heart / lung shot near one of these boundaries could easily result in the animal crossing out of your area before it expires and losing it unnecessarily. A brain shot, when properly executed, will anchor the animal on the spot, eliminating that possibility. The same could be said for a buffalo or Kudu, but then again, although any lost animal is a tragedy, forking over the trophy fee on a lost elephant is a check I'd hate to have to write!

I have very little experience in hunting Elephant only having shot 3 so I don't qualify as an 'expert'. The first I shot at pointblank range (less that 15 yards) with the Elephant facing me and waving his trunk around searching. I have read all the books and used the good Vet DR PH from Zimbabwe's shot placement guide to be as sure as I could of the location of the shot. Rifle was a Model 70 375H&H witha 300gr Woodleigh solid. Placing the shot as perfectly as I could being lower than his head considerably as I was slightly down hill from him I took the shot. He immediately sat down on his rear and just as immediately sprang back up and whirled away from me. I placed another shot in the heart/lung area and the PH who was backing me up took a shot with a 458Win Mag. The Elephant proceeded to run into long grass (over his head) and we followed. We found where he stopped and there was probably a gallon of red blood indicating to the PH he was hit. He took off and as I am no longer young and mobile the PH and scout followed him. He crossed a boundary where they could not follow so I lost him. My next 2 I shot with a 470 Double and a 416Rigby. Both were heart /lung shots and both ran a ways but in all 3 circumstances (I stress the brain shot one also) immediately whirled away from the shooter and took off. Never was I presented with a charge,not that it could not happen. If a DVD or instructions can do magic I fail to see any difference in hunting Elephant than any other game animal except for their size. I might add I immensely enjoyed hunting Elephant and as I write this I am looking at the only trophy I have ever brought home - a pair of 47lbs tusks. I am not overawed by doubles and venture to say if the first Elephant had charged with any double I would not have been able to reload 2 rounds. When they whirl and run they are FAST. I'm sure it's a wonderful DVD and don't question it's value but my question remains what exactly is different about hunting Elephant. I have Bill Stewart's book on Elephant hunting and it also is a most excellant tome but this question was not answered there either. Of course the older I get the more intransigent I get. Just checked the price of the DVD on Amazon and decided I am not prepared to pay $40 for a tutorial on hunting even if it's about hunting in Africa.

Scott, if you can book your Elephant. You will love it. And book with Buzz IMO he is the best there is.

Bob

I traded emails with Myles yesterday - they still have some tuskless openings for 2015! I have to wait another week or so to see if my other PH comes thru - I committed (before I visited the CMS booth)to Croc & Hippo on Lake Kariba if there were openings and have not heard back yet..

I want to go for Elephant - and with CMS...!

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
I have very little experience in hunting Elephant only having shot 3 so I don't qualify as an 'expert'. The first I shot at pointblank range (less that 15 yards) with the Elephant facing me and waving his trunk around searching. I have read all the books and used the good Vet DR PH from Zimbabwe's shot placement guide to be as sure as I could of the location of the shot. Rifle was a Model 70 375H&H witha 300gr Woodleigh solid. Placing the shot as perfectly as I could being lower than his head considerably as I was slightly down hill from him I took the shot. He immediately sat down on his rear and just as immediately sprang back up and whirled away from me. I placed another shot in the heart/lung area and the PH who was backing me up took a shot with a 458Win Mag. The Elephant proceeded to run into long grass (over his head) and we followed. We found where he stopped and there was probably a gallon of red blood indicating to the PH he was hit. He took off and as I am no longer young and mobile the PH and scout followed him. He crossed a boundary where they could not follow so I lost him. My next 2 I shot with a 470 Double and a 416Rigby. Both were heart /lung shots and both ran a ways but in all 3 circumstances ( I stress the brain shot one also ) immediately whirled away from the shooter and took off.

Zim, not to get cross ways with you in this discussion, but I'd like to point out that if you took a brain shot on that first ele as you've described, only to have it get right back up, do an about face, and run off over the border where you lost it, you DID NOT BRAIN SHOOOT that ele. You MISSED the brain! Had you hit the brain, it would have anchored him in his tracks.

And that is what I was describing earlier when I stated "just shooting an ele in the head won't work" as that brain is buried deep in the skull and the aiming point to find it varies drastically with every change in the animal's head position and / or distance from the hunter. I know you've stated previously that African hunting is behind you now but, should you ever make it back over to chase eles again, I still highly recommend Buzz's first video for instructional purposes, if not simply the entertainment of it.

Where this video really shines, is in teaching one to find the brain at all different presentations. Specifically how it does this so well is that unlike Doctari's "perfect shot" photos, it gives a "live action" presentation of the aiming point of numerous animals in motion. It's quite eye opening to see just how much that aim point moves around with just the slightest change of head position. Furthermore, and this is the best part in my opinion, the video transposes a cross sectioned skull over the elephant's head as it's in motion. That cross sectioned skull shows exactly where the void is that houses the brain. The video fades the skull in and out, giving you a chance to visualize where the brain is prior to actually showing it. Additional sections of the video show numerous hunters as they take their shot, freezing the frame at the exact instant the bullet strikes, then fading the cross sectioned skull in showing exactly where their bullet struck in relation to the brain.

As many have stated here in this thread, as well as many previous threads, the DVD serves as a great refresher prior embarking on any ele hunt. But I get it. You don't think hunting elephant is anything special. I seem to remember you stating the same opinion about buffalo hunting. Maybe it just comes down to some of us are wired a bit differently because at this point in my hunting endeavors, I have almost no desire to hunt anything BUT ele and buffalo on the African continent. Well ... except maybe a Roan to go with my Sable. But that's just me.

Cheers

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
Just checked the price of the DVD on Amazon and decided I am not prepared to pay $40 for a tutorial on hunting even if it's about hunting in Africa.

That's your choice to make. Would you consider the trophy fee on your first lost Elephant a tutorial of sorts?

Guys thanks for all the great comments on the DVds! I have to tell you that it is hard work editing a dvd that has about 7 years of footage to go through! I am happy that most of you found it to be a help on your ele hunts!!

I am about to set off with Mike Junes now on a VERY early ele bull hunt- which will be tough with thick bush and hard tracking- something that I take great pleasure in! After Mike I will be having the pleasure of Jim and Joyce hunting eles!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Buzz Charlton:
Guys thanks for all the great comments on the DVds! I have to tell you that it is hard work editing a dvd that has about 7 years of footage to go through! I am happy that most of you found it to be a help on your ele hunts!!

I am about to set off with Mike Junes now on a VERY early ele bull hunt- which will be tough with thick bush and hard tracking- something that I take great pleasure in! After Mike I will be having the pleasure of Jim and Joyce hunting eles!!!!!

Excellent. Go Joyce go.

Gee - I would have never in my life guessed I MISSED the brain,I just thought it was an unusual Elephant. After reading and studying The pictures and descriptions in 'The Perfect Shot' I can't imagine I actually MISSED a grapefruit sized item in an Elephant. I would have never guessed that drawing an imaginary line thru the Elephants head using earholes (which locations were also guessed at) and calculating exactly where the brain was located then guessing EXACTLY what angle from my muzzle to that spot would be as the head was much higher than me and I was slightly downhill from him could be imparted to me by a video. Of course I didn't have milliseconds to make these determinations I had hours. I can't imagine how dumb I've been all these years by not being able to learn this from watching a video. It's apparent all on here are much more brilliant than I and can therefore do this with no problem. I am sure anyone who watches this video will never wound or lose an Elephant. I applaud them.

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
Gee - I would have never in my life guessed I MISSED the brain,I just thought it was an unusual Elephant. After reading and studying The pictures and descriptions in 'The Perfect Shot' I can't imagine I actually MISSED a grapefruit sized item in an Elephant. I would have never guessed that drawing an imaginary line thru the Elephants head using earholes (which locations were also guessed at) and calculating exactly where the brain was located then guessing EXACTLY what angle from my muzzle to that spot would be as the head was much higher than me and I was slightly downhill from him could be imparted to me by a video. Of course I didn't have milliseconds to make these determinations I had hours. I can't imagine how dumb I've been all these years by not being able to learn this from watching a video. It's apparent all on here are much more brilliant than I and can therefore do this with no problem. I am sure anyone who watches this video will never wound or lose an Elephant. I applaud them.

Nobody here is calling you "Stupid"...they are just trying to help you out.

Geez....

Let's put it this way:
You are putting yourself into a situation with a lot riding on the line. Money and ego aside, you are laying it all out there to fulfill a dream. Why would you not take every advantage? We know that physical training and shooting practice are important. So is studying. Consider the video to be a valuable study tool, and a very entertaining one at that.
I still watch that video when I'm tread-milling, prepping for a hunt. It still gets me excited.

quote:

Originally posted by Leopardtrack:

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
Gee - I would have never in my life guessed I MISSED the brain,I just thought it was an unusual Elephant. After reading and studying The pictures and descriptions in 'The Perfect Shot' I can't imagine I actually MISSED a grapefruit sized item in an Elephant. I would have never guessed that drawing an imaginary line thru the Elephants head using earholes (which locations were also guessed at) and calculating exactly where the brain was located then guessing EXACTLY what angle from my muzzle to that spot would be as the head was much higher than me and I was slightly downhill from him could be imparted to me by a video. Of course I didn't have milliseconds to make these determinations I had hours. I can't imagine how dumb I've been all these years by not being able to learn this from watching a video. It's apparent all on here are much more brilliant than I and can therefore do this with no problem. I am sure anyone who watches this video will never wound or lose an Elephant. I applaud them.

Nobody here is calling you "Stupid"...they are just trying to help you out.

Exactly!

This exchange has made me aware of just how I had misjudged the participants of this forum. I had given the majority an above average IQ but since they don't seem to realize the sarcasm of my last post I am making a huge correction in my evaluation of them. I was probably right sometime ago to refrain from posting on this forum. I shall give that serious thought.

I have not hunted elephant or ever likely to but I was kindly given an original copy of Buzz's DVD and thoroughly enjoyed it and learned a lot from it. I would most definitely study it in depth if I ever were to hunt elephant.

The difference as pointed out my most here is trying to find a small sized brain in a large head at the various angles that may be presented.

I have hunted a multitude of game including more than one or two big Aussie buffalo and in all cases the brain or brain stem is relatively easy to hit or hit close to which will drop any animal including buffalo. My friend and our guide when hunting buffalo were using a 7x57 and a 338WM respectively and limited themselves to brain shots which were monotonously easy while the animals were standing. My 404 came into effective play on running and body shots.

I am absolutely sure that despite both my friend and our guide being good shots the results of the head shooting would have been quite different on elephant if they had no coaching or prior retained knowledge of where to place their shots. I freely admit I too would not be able to transfer my extensive knowledge of other game shooting to elephant.

Stalking and accurate shooting yes, but exactly where to place a brain shot no. Thanks Buzz for a great instructional DVD and one of great interest even for those that may never hunt elephant.

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
This exchange has made me aware of just how I had misjudged the participants of this forum. I had given the majority an above average IQ but since they don't seem to realize the sarcasm of my last post I am making a huge correction in my evaluation of them. I was probably right sometime ago to refrain from posting on this forum. I shall give that serious thought.

You asked a perfectly valid question albeit making a point of shouting some of it but then didn't like the answers, why the hissy fit with this forum and members? You are free to go and come as you please, SULKING IS UNBECOMING.

eagle27 - That's precisely what I did I asked a simple question and never got a cogent answer. I sorry I have offended your sensibilities by putting some words in caps. I use it for emphasis as I have no idea how to underline a word. If my comments constitute a 'hissy' and 'sulking' then so be it. As I said I'm sure it is a very good hunting video but my original question has still (consider the word still underlined) to be answered - what exactly is special about hunting Elephant that does not apply to any other animal hunted in Africa. I might refer you to Dr. Kevin Robertson's (known in some circles as 'Doctori') excellant book 'The Perfect Shot' which goes into great detail about shooting all major African game. Of course you do have to be able to read to utilize it and not just look at the pretty pictures. If you do as I did you would also carry a pocket abbreviated copy of it with you while hunting Africa. The one I utilized was published by African Hunter magazine I believe. It is obvious I am missing the magic produced by watching a video.

Zim,
As the very proud current owner of the .416 Rigby you previously owned I have no interest in picking a fight with you. As I think you know, I have used the same .416 to take several elephants, buffalo, and assorted other large animals. It is a great rifle!

While for some people the simple economics mean it is worth investing in a video tutorial, I get your point that we should be equally certain of our shots on ANY game animal, simply as a matter of respect if nothing else.

I have Doctari's book, refer to it often, but also used Buzz's video. The simple truth about video is you can watch the animal move naturally, and with the aid of lazer pointers and video editing, can see how the proper point of aim varies with slight changes in angle. A simple head bob can be used to show the proper aiming point moving. It is a great video, and even without being absolutely necessary it was a great aid and just a plain enjoyable video at the same time.
Having said that, if your goal is to heart lung shoot an elephant, there probably isn't much need for a video. It is a big target, after all.
And heart lung shots are certainly fatal, but as you have seen they can run a long way even when fatally hit in the lungs.
Most animals aren't brain shot on a regular basis, or have fairly large brains for the size of the skull. For animals with very small brains like crocodile, and maybe even hippo, a video similar to Buzz's elephant video would help countless hunters. Not that most experienced hunters don't have a good clue, but since at least in the US most animals are shot in the heart lung area, many hunters really have little idea of how to properly brain shoot an animal. Video is far more instructive that books, but the books are a great reference and I would encourage everyone to use both sources of info.
Cheers,
Bill

quote:

what exactly is special about hunting Elephant that does not apply to any other animal hunted in Africa.

Zim,

Todd gave you a very detailed answer - I doubt anyone could do better.

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe: Just checked the price of the DVD on Amazon and decided I am not prepared to pay $40 for a tutorial on hunting even if it's about hunting in Africa.

I would say that it is one of the very few DVDs that are truly worth the price. There is as much or more in this as a good elephant hunting book and you would easily have to pay $40 for one of those.

The "essence of elephant hunting" DVD is great too by the way...

Given what an elephant hunt costs, $40 is a trivial expense. I'll bet if you book with CMS, you can get a gratis copy.

quote:

Originally posted by zimbabwe:
I'm really curious, what SPECIAL training is required to hunt Elephants that does not apply to any other animal. In any hunting you must find the animal then shoot it and kill it. You must use an adequate weapon and know how to find the Elephant but you have to know this with any animal you hunt. I am just curious as to exactly WHAT is DIFFERENT.

Zim,

View this thread from my perspective (after all - I started it).. I have never hunted Elephants. Buzz's approach to not only the mechanics but the total experience (call it "Elephant Zen" if you will) of hunting elephants in his video is what excites and motivates me to want to hunt them.

That is what I am referring to when I state "Buzz - you are killing me!".. My desire to fulfill my dream to hunt the African Elephant - a dream that may yet come to pass possibly this year...

He has does a wonderful job of presenting the material - you almost feel like you are right there in the bush with them.

Special training? No one mentioned special training. Instructional details specific to aging, tracking, and understanding elephants as well as approach and shot placement? Most definitely!

I also really enjoy the fact that there are no product endorsements or advertisements! The bottom line is - it is simply a very well done video that is motivating me to end up spending alot of money with Buzz & Myles.....

I can't believe how long it's been since the first DVD was filmed! Still seems like yesterday to me.

Scott-
That's how it starts.....