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I am looking at Lion for 2010. To those of you in the know, what is the latest development regarding the CITES meeting in January and the responses of the countries and safari companies in which sustainable lion hunting is ongoing? I know there have been prior threads on this, but is there any new information? Thanks. Will J. Parks, III | ||
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Will, I firmly believe if you have the resources, go in 2010. As an example, Mozambique and Zambia allow elephant hunting yet we (U.S. citizens) cannot import the ivory. When China was open to hunting there was a vast array of Argalis to legally hunt, yet we were denied import permits. In 2008, my husband booked a High Altai Argali hunt to Mongolia. The first permit available by the Mongolian Government was 2011. Last year only three import permits were issued by USFWS, and I heard this year none. So even though Mongolia is authorized to hunt XXX amount of High Altai Argali, U.S.hunters cannot get the import permits. With that being said, even if countries still allow lion hunting, what will our Government decide regarding the number of lion that enter the U.S.A? If you can, GO NOW. Best of luck!!!! Kathi kathi@wildtravel.net 708-425-3552 "The world is a book, and those who do not travel read only one page." | |||
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John J. Jackson III and "Conservation Force" is our only hope -- Anyone that wants Lion hunting to remain legal for Americans would be wise to support those efforts. If Lions become CITES I, that will be the end of it for Americans no matter what happens after that point. When you get bored with life, start hunting dangerous game with a handgun. | |||
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Will, I do not know any details but I just shot my long sought after Lion this month. I have been getting a heads up from some guys that there is a possibility of Cites Appendix 1 so I am working diligently to get my lion into the US before that. Now, that is all rumor at this point but as Kathi says, you are smart to hunt your lion as soon as you can. I would hate to see this happen but we never know. Look at Polar Bears, etc. etc. Best of luck in your planning Larry York, SC | |||
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s-l, It could come down to which country you take a Lion in as much as CITES. Some exports will take a year minimum, some can take much longer. Sort out where you plan on Lion hunting, then go ASAP. Leopard importation is getting the big eye as well. LDK Gray Ghost Hunting Safaris http://grayghostsafaris.com Phone: 615-860-4333 Email: hunts@grayghostsafaris.com NRA Benefactor DSC Professional Member SCI Member RMEF Life Member NWTF Guardian Life Sponsor NAHC Life Member Rowland Ward - SCI Scorer Took the wife the Eastern Cape for her first hunt: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6881000262 Hunting in the Stormberg, Winterberg and Hankey Mountains of the Eastern Cape 2018 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4801073142 Hunting the Eastern Cape, RSA May 22nd - June 15th 2007 http://forums.accuratereloadin...=810104007#810104007 16 Days in Zimbabwe: Leopard, plains game, fowl and more: http://forums.accuratereloadin...=212108409#212108409 Natal: Rhino, Croc, Nyala, Bushbuck and more http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6341092311 Recent hunt in the Eastern Cape, August 2010: Pics added http://forums.accuratereloadin...261039941#9261039941 10 days in the Stormberg Mountains http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7781081322 Back in the Stormberg Mountains with friends: May-June 2017 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6001078232 "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading" - Thomas Jefferson Every morning the Zebra wakes up knowing it must outrun the fastest Lion if it wants to stay alive. Every morning the Lion wakes up knowing it must outrun the slowest Zebra or it will starve. It makes no difference if you are a Zebra or a Lion; when the Sun comes up in Africa, you must wake up running...... "If you're being chased by a Lion, you don't have to be faster than the Lion, you just have to be faster than the person next to you." | |||
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I havent learned the CITES rules. Is Lion on Appendix II now ? And maybe after Cites meeting next year they put it on Appendix I ? Is it the same with polar bears ? is polar bears also on appendix II now ? What happends if Cites move Lion or Polar bears to appendix I ? | |||
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On another forum someone posted that the lion upgrading to CITES I did not get on the agenda for the meeting next year. The deadline for agenda items was earlier this week. I do not know if that is correct but sounds hopeful. Maybe someone who knows more about the CITES meeting can check. "There always seems to be a big market for making the clear, complex." | |||
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I heard they had to get it on the agenda before October 16. Is it over with lions and polar bears if it gets upgraded to cites I or ? | |||
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of course you could always do a PAC hunt and hunt one of the "wild" lions that wander across the border from Bots to RSA and cause so much trouble. they even include a shampoo and blow dry( that Kalahari sun and wind is SO harsh on one's hairstyle). i doubr the Cities regs will apply to them. Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… | |||
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Anton, Countries ultimately decide what is and isn't huntable in their own country. CITIES decides how many animals can be exported of a given threatened or endangered species. The country of origin for the hunter decides weather the animal can ultimately be imported to the hunter's home. So Anton as long as there are countries with lion hunting, CITIES allows lion trophy export from the country you choose to hunt, and your home country doesn't outlaw importing a lion you are in business!!!! Unfortunately for us Americans our Wildlife department sometimes decides not to allow importation even if the animal can legally be sport hunted and legally be exported by CITIES permit!!!  Hence no elephants from Mozambique. Not Alti Argali from Mongolia. No leopard from Etheopia or Uganda. No black face impala or mountain zebra from Namibia. No polar bear from anywhere. No ect, ect, ect, ect for US citizens. Mind you we can still go over and LEGALLY kill the hell out of them. We just can't bring them home!!! Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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Did I miss something? I thought HMZ could be imported. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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I've been wrong before and I'm more than willing to wager I'll be wrong again!!!  Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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I don't think Hartmanns is the same as mountain. I brought home a Hartmans last year. | |||
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Equus Zebra Zebra is CITES I and Equus zebra hartmanae is CITES II. Here you go: http://www.shakariconnection.c...an-game-species.html | |||
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OK Steve, maybe I am going to have to start looking at your site! PM sent. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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Per CITES website: October 14: Deadline to submit to the CITES Secretariat for consideration at the 15th meeting of the Conference of the Parties to CITES: draft resolutions and other documents; and proposals of amendment to Appendices I and II. So, does anyone know if a lion uplisting amendment was timely submitted? Will J. Parks, III | |||
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safari-lawyer - check with John Jackson, as he will know. I will be hunting them next in 2011, so I am an interested party, although my hopes are not high for so far off, and for so much else. And for those left wondering, Hartmann's, or mountain, zebra, are importable to the USA. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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MR I apologise if I didn't make myself clear. Both zebra are importable but one just needs different paaperwork to the other. Regarding the possible Lion upgrade. As I've said before, I'll be suprised if it happens but if it does, (as far as CITES itself is concerned) the upgrade itself will only mean a change in paperwork that will bring Lion requirements into line with Leopard requirements. There's also the separate issue that if the upgrade happens, USF&WS may require some kind of time consuming report before they issue import licences but as I see it, that's a different issue and one that the US hunters need to take up with their elected representatives to try to whip USF&WS into line. It strikes me that some of the USF&WS behaviour is at least sometimes verging on infringrement of personal liberties.  | |||
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