BTW the outfitter is a member of AR.

It was too easy to earn the badge.

Since we don't know who the outfitter is and its probably just as well, my suggestion is that you do your business with him, and not the internet...The Safari business is just that and you would not discuss your private/personal business on the internet or your banking business or investments...

I would suggest that you tell the outfitter how you feel and ask him to accomodate you as best he can, and if that is not to your likeing then request a refund, and book with someone else.

quote:

Originally posted by NitroX:
BTW the outfitter is a member of AR.

I'm NOT the outfitter, but if it was I, I would have loved to be alerted about this particular thread.

Has anyone who knows who the Outfitter is thought of just sending him a PM to alert him about this thread?

In good hunting.

Andrew McLaren

Interesting that Wannabebwana has not posted again on this topic since 16 Jul, the day after he first asked the question.

I thought it was because he was busy arranging to go so had no time, but I see he has posted elsewhere as recently as 28 Jul.

I really would like to hear from him as to what has developed thus far, and what he has finally decided to do?

quote:

Originally posted by Stephen Palos:
Interesting that Wannabebwana has not posted again on this topic since 16 Jul, the day after he first asked the question.

I thought it was because he was busy arranging to go so had no time, but I see he has posted elsewhere as recently as 28 Jul.

I really would like to hear from him as to what has developed thus far, and what he has finally decided to do?

That was all covered on the first page.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Since we don't know who the outfitter is and its probably just as well, my suggestion is that you do your business with him, and not the internet...The Safari business is just that and you would not discuss your private/personal business on the internet or your banking business or investments...

I would suggest that you tell the outfitter how you feel and ask him to accomodate you as best he can, and if that is not to your likeing then request a refund, and book with someone else.

Ray, I deliberately kept the outfitters name out of this, but came here to get some information from more experience Africa travellers. This is my first trip, and I needed some advice.

Cancelling is not an option at this point. I found out less than three weeks before I left that this was happening. I'd already submitted over $6000 to the outfitter for daily rates and other charges. I've also got $12,000 in non-refundable airline tickets.

Some people might be able to afford to walk away from $18,000 and say "Let's do this another time". I can't.

I had some more feedback about this outfitter in PM's, and overall, it's been very positive, except for the double-booking issue, which seems to have happened before, but with no catastrophic results.

So, I'm going to take my chances, and possibly take my lumps. However, I really do like the suggestion from NitroX about turning the kids loose. Talk about letting loose the dogs of war! They're really good kids, but like any kids, their evil side is never far from the surface.

As well, my wife is a very sweet lady. She's the only person I've ever known who will go out of her way to call the manager of a store to compliment them on the good service she received from the staff. On the flip side, she's also your worst nightmare if the service doesn't meet her expectations.

On another note, to add to an already stressful time, I found out last night that my credit card has been compromised, and had $1100 in fraudulent charges put on this month. So, I'm leaving on Sunday and my primary credit card has been cancelled. Guess I'll just have to take more in travellers cheques.

Hi Wannabe..

Thanks for coming back at this late stage and filling in a few more gaps....

Sounds to me like you and your family are more than well enough equipped mentally to deal with Africa.

I hope you have the GREATEST of safaries, and come back singing the praises of the PH, outfitter and Africa......

I suggest you fight like hell to get another credit card issued, and if it is Namibia you're headed for you can take SA Rands as well as Nam Dollars. They accept both and the exchange rate's the same.

Looking forward to your VERY positive hunt report and lots of great photos....

Wannabebwana

Good luck on your safari and hope you and your family enjoy it. Hope your first safari is the special one they are supposed to be. The chances are it will be and hopefully the outfitter works to its success.

quote:

Guess I'll just have to take more in travellers cheques.

I have had trouble cashing travelers checks in a couple countries.

I also have found it a good idea to have several credit cards when going abroad and making sure the companies know you are going. Otherwise they may see oversees transactions and assume yoru card is compromised and freeze it. Hard to deal with from a pay phone in a foriegn land!

Have a good hunt and come back w/lots of good reports!

Best regards

Mike O

Offer the outfitter the following choice:

1. Stick to the original plan as he committed.
2. Show up without wife and kids and hunt in whichever camp you prefer. Take them next year.
3. Refund your deposit and rebook.

If you are hunting PG, there are tons of places to go that would be more than happy to host your wife and kids and give your group the run of the camp.

An area that offers quite a few options for day trips is the Hluhluwe area of Kwazulu Natal. It's also the best place to go for Nyala as well as the usual PG suspects.

Some areas offer very little for the wife and kids to do other than "game drives". This is true of most of Namibia, unless you are quite close to a town and/or to Etosha. Yes, there is family stuff to do but it's generally not a day trip. Reading between the lines, you want to hunt while wife and kids go on day excursions.

Sadly, many outfitters are so focused on their checkbooks that they forget who writes the checks. What really happened here was this guy had the opportunity to book 2 leopard hunts and he decided he liked the money more than keeping his commitment to you. He is trying to have his cake and eat it. And he didn't even have the courtesy to offer you a mea culpa freebie of some sort.

However, you have already played your cards so now the ball is in his court. It's been several days now...what's the outfitter's reply?

I am sorry to hear that cancelling is not an option and having been in the booking business I would think you could cancel if your terms are not met and rebook a hunt with another safari company...Your booking agent should represent enough companies to accomodate you on this. At best you would have to pay a small fee to change your airline tickets...but we each have our own circumstances so with that I can only tell you that I hope you do well and it all works out and I think it will..One thing to remember is that it is very hard to schedule hunts to go off without hiccups, if your the type of person that can accept this and not go to Africa with unreasonable expectations then you will have the time of your life..If you cannot adjust then you will never have a perfect safari..and thats the best advise I can offer you...A great old time PH named Roy Vicent gave me this sage advise and its proven to be spot on advise. Never go on any hunt with unreasonable expections, African hunters are them most probable to fall into this trap for whatever reason.

quote:

Originally posted by WannabeBwana:

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Since we don't know who the outfitter is and its probably just as well, my suggestion is that you do your business with him, and not the internet...The Safari business is just that and you would not discuss your private/personal business on the internet or your banking business or investments...

I would suggest that you tell the outfitter how you feel and ask him to accomodate you as best he can, and if that is not to your likeing then request a refund, and book with someone else.

Ray, I deliberately kept the outfitters name out of this, but came here to get some information from more experience Africa travellers. This is my first trip, and I needed some advice.

Cancelling is not an option at this point. I found out less than three weeks before I left that this was happening. I'd already submitted over $6000 to the outfitter for daily rates and other charges. I've also got $12,000 in non-refundable airline tickets.

Some people might be able to afford to walk away from $18,000 and say "Let's do this another time". I can't.

I wouldn't suggest you walk away from the $18K even if you could afford it. Typically, that isn't how rich people grow rich.

You could gamble that if you ask nicely a few more times your PH will actually give you what you contracted for, although he currently doesn't want to give you that.

You could gamble that taking what your PH wants to give you is better than what you asked for and you'll like it.

Although I'm guessing that you know better what your family likes than your PH.

But rather than gamble, I'd rather bet with the house and say your PH has decided that you're exactly the kind of guy he can screw over because you can't afford to lose the money you've already invested.

This is not a flame.

I could be way off base. Your PH could have only your best interests in mind. On the other hand, based on what you've written, it's equally likely your PH has only his own best interests in mind.

Given any doubt, if I woke up suddenly and found myself in your position, I'd start looking for ways to force compliance with your written agreements that your PH currently does not want to honor.

You have to live with your family for years to come. You don't have to make me happy. You don't have to make anyone else on this forum happy. You certainly don't have to make your PH in Africa happy.

Do whatever it takes to make your wife and family happy, and that means playing hardball. In this case, that means finding out how to hurt the guy because he may have no intention of providing the services he contracted to perform. Because the alternative is you being hurt; being put out $18K that you can't afford to lose.

Did the guy send you promises he's not complying with? Mail fraud. Did he e-mail those promises? Wire fraud. Does he have a US bank account that he asked you to put $$$ in? Any vulnerability, look for it. So you have it if you need it.

At this point, it doesn't look like you can entirely rely on his good graces. It looks like your PH promised what he can't deliver, and is only telling you about it now because he thinks you can't do anything about it.

Like I said, I could be wrong, but I'd like to be ready to tear a chunk out of him he won't forget, ever, just because I could be right. I wouldn't gamble $18K; to me that's serious cash.

Listen politely to everyone who tells you how beautiful their safari was when their PH changed everything last minute; nod in agreement when everyone tells you about the harmonious wonderfulness of not drawing lines in the sand; smile appreciatively when everyone lectures you on how wrong you are for expecting something you've paid for to be done your way, if you want.

But load for bear. Just in case "everyone" happens to be wrong.

What he said...

Best of luck.

BTT

Counting 19 days from first posting and allowing some days for hunting and touring WannabeBwana should be back already or be so shortly.

I, for one, would like to know how everyting worked out? Or, let's hope it's not the case, not worked out?

In good hunting.

Andrew McLaren

Unrelated to this thread, and having nothing to do with the situation in Namibia it started out on a sour note.....but I'll let him tell the story.

He also didn't get to Namibia until at least the 5th August and I'm not sure how long he had scheduled in country.

quote:

BTT

Counting 19 days from first posting and allowing some days for hunting and touring WannabeBwana should be back already or be so shortly.

I, for one, would like to know how everyting worked out? Or, let's hope it's not the case, not worked out?

I checked in today wondering the same thing!

Thanks for all your interest.

TBH, after this trip, I've honestly thought of changing my screen name to "Murphy's Law".

Got home from Namibia Monday at 8:30 pm. We left our hotel on Saturday at 1 pm. With the time change, that was about 61 hours on the road. Actually a damned sight better than the 69 hours it took from the time we left home until we actually arrived at our destination. Both ways, we spent a night in a hotel at someone else's expense, but I'll be honest with you, Toronto or Frankfurt ain't Namibia, and I don't consider a night in an airport hotel in a stinking metropolitan cesspool to be a fair trade-off.

Similarly, I don't consider sitting around an airport infirmary with a 12 year old who is clinically dehydrated due to projectile vomitting from food poisoning to be any great shakes, either. Or, having a low-level ticket agent suggest that my wife is a bad mother if she doesn't pony up $22K for 4 business class tickets to get our sick son home ASAP after the airline screwed up our flight in the first place.

On the other hand, I've found out that the surest way to beat jet-lag is to not sleep for about 30 hours straight. After that, your body doesn't care what time it is.

That should give you a bit of an idea of what the travel portions of our trip were like. And these were just the highlights (lowlights?). More on that over the next couple of weeks.

I've got some unwinding to do, I've got to get some pictures organized, and I've got some serious unfinished business with several parties to this travel fiasco that I need to deal with.

Not to tease you, but I'll tell you this much. Aside from the travel, my wife and step-kids probably had the best vacation ever. They'd go back in a second. Namibia is a beautiful, clean country, the people are incredibly polite and accommodating, and I'm proud to say that I lost count of the number of times my wife and I were complimented on how polite and well-behaved our kids were.

Myself, I had a tough, tough hunt. Some really high highs, and some really low lows. To be honest, in the entire scheme of things, the double booking wasn't an issue. The other two guys in camp were personable, one of them was in the same line of work as my wife, so they did some shop talk, and I can't say that they impacted my hunt in any way.

I didn't accomplish everything I wanted to, but am big enough to understand that things don't always work out the way you want or plan.

Having said that, the time I was able to spend with my wife and step-kids was irreplaceable. I am the proudest husband and step-dad that ever walked this earth.

quote:

Originally posted by WannabeBwana:
... my wife and step-kids probably had the best vacation ever. They'd go back in a second ... Myself, I had a tough, tough hunt. Some really high highs, and some really low lows. To be honest, in the entire scheme of things, the double booking wasn't an issue ... I didn't accomplish everything I wanted to, but am big enough to understand that things don't always work out the way you want or plan ... Having said that, the time I was able to spend with my wife and step-kids was irreplaceable. I am the proudest husband and step-dad that ever walked this earth.

Fantastic.

WannabeBwana,

Thanks for the update. Very glad to hear that the trouble was really not an issue!

Looking forward to a full hunt report with photos of your hunting highs and brief description of the lows .

Rest, unwind, catch up and write that report!

In good hunting.

Andrew McLaren

A big lead in to a classic complaining fight thread to mislead, then a side step into an enjoyable safari.

Glad it worked out and was fun.