Anyone use them? Thinking swamps in Mozambique? No one has mentioned it so far....

I spent a fair amount of time wading thru swamps in Mozambique last year. I never actualy saw a snake the whole time I was there. I doubt I would have wore them after the 1st day if I had them.

The late Owain Lewis wore them faithfully.
Looks weird with shorts but it is not a fashion contest.

i wear them around the ranch if i am going to out in the pastures but wouldn't bother with them in Africa. 2 Moz hunts( 1 in the Zambezi delta swamps)- never saw a snake.

Great thanks one less thing to buy

Besides, when the snakes are taller than the chaps when striking kind of useless.

Reading the first post my initial reaction was snake bites are so rare it is nothing to worry about. I then read an email from one of the shooting clubs outside of Houston. A member was cutting grass at the range, ran over a snake, decided to pick it up, and was bit. He is in the hospital and will recover, although a water moccasin bite has to be painful. Not so much to do with Africa, just a coincidence.

BTW your tracker will see a snake long before you will be near it.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike70560:
Reading the first post my initial reaction was snake bites are so rare it is nothing to worry about. I then read an email from one of the shooting clubs outside of Houston. A member was cutting grass at the range, ran over a snake, decided to pick it up, and was bit. He is in the hospital and will recover, although a water moccasin bite has to be painful. Not so much to do with Africa, just a coincidence.

BTW your tracker will see a snake long before you will be near it.

Every single snake bite on a human that I have knowledge of happened when someone was messing with the snake. I remember a radio public service announcement in Vietnam on AFVN radio:

"Leave snakes alone. If you leave snakes alone, they will leave you alone. So leave snakes alone."

Pretty accurate.

While in Africa or south texas, I normally wear Turtleskin snake gaiters. The turtleskins are great. They are very light weight. The gaiters give protection up to the knee.

I also have their chaps, which give protection up to the waist. I like the chaps for quail hunting in south texas. They are also great for cactus and mesquite thorns.

I was hit by a rattlesnake while climbing down out of a deer stand one evening. It was curled up at the very bottom of the ladder. It never made a sound until after it hit me. Thankfully, I was wearing snake chaps. No harm done,.... except I just about shit myself. Since then, I have regularly worn either gaiters or chaps. Oddly enough the only reason I was wearing the chaps when I got hit, was that a month earlier I was on a corporate dove hunt and one of the guys got bit by a really big rattlesnake. It was bad. He was walking directly behind the guide on a grassy trail. The guide had snake boots, but the snake let the guide pass, and bit hunter about midway between the ankle and knee.

The coolest snake story I have about Africa is the fact that,...in 5 trips I have never seen a snake in Africa....and I hope is stays that way. (but I still wear my gaiters)

I don't like snakes.

quote:

Originally posted by Upton O. Good:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike70560:
Reading the first post my initial reaction was snake bites are so rare it is nothing to worry about. I then read an email from one of the shooting clubs outside of Houston. A member was cutting grass at the range, ran over a snake, decided to pick it up, and was bit. He is in the hospital and will recover, although a water moccasin bite has to be painful. Not so much to do with Africa, just a coincidence.

BTW your tracker will see a snake long before you will be near it.

Every single snake bite on a human that I have knowledge of happened when someone was messing with the snake. I remember a radio public service announcement in Vietnam on AFVN radio:

"Leave snakes alone. If you leave snakes alone, they will leave you alone. So leave snakes alone."

Pretty accurate.

the one that bit me crawled in my garage and climbed up 4 steps, then curled upon the welcome mat at night. i stepped on him when i walked outside at night through the garage and stepped on him. he never had a chance to rattle and i never had a chance to react. this year my wife and i have killed 44 so far( with at least another 1 1/2 months to go in the season)around the house, in the garage, in the barn and the dog kennels- all within 50 yards of the front door. we have killed 2 in the house itself- 1 in our jaccuzi tub and 1 at the doorway to my home office. i have no idea how they got inside but there you are. believe me, i don't mess with them- i just take a pair of snake tongs, catch them, take them to a safe area, AND SHOOT THEM, AS DOES MY WIFE. don't think for a second that if you leave them alone, they will reciprocate. they ain't that smart. i have also had 4 dogs bitten and all 4 were you cruising around their kennels and stumbled on them. luckily we witnessed all 4 bites and got them to the vet in time. 3 times this year alone i have had rattlers strike at me as i bent down to pick something up and each time i caught the motion and jerked back in time to miss getting bit. what looks good on paper often doesn't stand the real world smell test.

no need for snake boots or chaps. not sure why some clients worry so much about snakes? I've been PH for about 14 years, and never have I, my clients, or trackers been bitten.
If snakes were so bad, surely many phs would have died by snakebite each season! (I know of only one ph bitten by mamba...and that was on his finger...snake chaps would not have helped)
you need to worry more about flying on planes getting to your hunting area. A much greater risk of death than snakebite, IMO!! Just follow behind your ph & trackers and stop worrying.

Don't worry, being a pilot I am VERY worried about flying on a plane in Africa. But there isn't much I can do about that, is there?

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Don't worry, being a pilot I am VERY worried about flying on a plane in Africa. But there isn't much I can do about that, is there?

Don't necessarily go for the cheapest charter, be sure to do your own PDI & if the #2 seat isn't occupied, try to sit in it & failing that, close to it.

That was the reason I went through the hours and got my pilot's license. I had a particularly horrible flight with a charter pilot that scared the crap out of me. I decided that the next time I flew a charter, I would be able to at least put the plane back on the ground if something stupid happened.

quote:

Originally posted by TANZ-PH:
no need for snake boots or chaps. not sure why some clients worry so much about snakes? I've been PH for about 14 years, and never have I, my clients, or trackers been bitten.
If snakes were so bad, surely many phs would have died by snakebite each season! (I know of only one ph bitten by mamba...and that was on his finger...snake chaps would not have helped)
you need to worry more about flying on planes getting to your hunting area. A much greater risk of death than snakebite, IMO!! Just follow behind your ph & trackers and stop worrying.

I've only hunted in Africa once (Tanzania just a few weeks ago) and won't question your experience, but I've hunted and hiked here in So. California all my life where rattlesnakes are quite common. My closest unexpected encounter ever occurred while following buffalo in the Selous. The tracker stepped right over a puff adder without seeing it in the leaf litter, but the PH (fortunately) spotted it just as he was about to step in the same spot. I was following right behind the PH. Of course there's plenty of variables, but I'm grateful for my PH's observational skills. If the PH hadn't seen the snake, I may have stepped on it and it may have bitten me, but I know this for sure: I wouldn't have seen it. That puff adder was so well camouflaged that even from just six or seven feet away, I couldn't see it until the PH tapped it with the shooting sticks and got the thing to crawl into the "safety" of a hollowed out log. (See pic)

While I completely agree with your suggestion to follow your PH and tracker, it's also incumbent upon the client to do whatever he/she can to enhance their own safety. That includes watching where they step, sit, reach, etc...and perhaps wearing protective clothing/shoes when it's practical. My PH hadn't been bitten either and neither had any of his clients, but that wouldn't have been very comforting if I'd been the first one because he (or I) had failed to see the same threat which his (very experienced) tracker had all too obviously missed.

While puff adder bites may not be as toxic as those from a mamba (we saw two on my hunt), they are still medical emergencies that require prompt treatment and are responsible for many deaths each year in Africa. Similar to rattlesnakes (both are pit vipers with cytotoxic venom), puff adder bites are nothing to laugh about. If one of our party was bitten, obtaining proper medical assistance and anti-venom isn't something that's as easily accomplished as where I live. At home, such treatment is available in a matter of minutes. In Africa, we're talking about hours.

While the presence of venomous snakes won't prevent me from returning to Africa, they are a real concern and all those hunting on the continent (or anyplace where such risks are present) should be aware of the threats and take reasonable precautions. I might not be able to mitigate the dangers posed by unsafe pilots, but I can sure do my part to avoid getting bitten by venomous snakes.

I agree with TANZ-PH. I kicked around various parts of Africa for 32 years & although I had a fair number of close encounters with a wide variety of snakes, I and/or my various staff never came close to being bitten.

Most people who do get bitten, are bitten because of their own stupidity & arrogance when they're messing around with them unnecessarily.

FWIW, puff adders are unlikely to bite you unless you seriously mess around with them. Their first line of defence is to rely on their camouflage & their second to play dead.

Being from Texas and hunting alot in the fall, prime rattlesnake territory and time, I am very alert to them while hunting, being a bow hunter as well, sneaking in an area on foot or out on foot especially in the dark,I have had numerous encounters with them and they scare the CRAP!! out of me and I wear snake boots to the knee or chaps when doing this so years ago on my first Africa trip I asked about taking my chaps and my Ph said it was just a waste of space,,,he said they were pretty much usless against a big momba because they can strike so high and although he sees and kills a few around camp, no one has been bitten, the only person bitten there was his son who stepped on a puff adder. I am more likely to get bit at home stepping out onto my porch or garage like Jdollar did. You got to expect them when you don't expect them, especially at home! JDollar, if I ran into that many snakes like you do I wouldn't need snake treatment but heart treatment!

quote:

Originally posted by shakari: Most people who do get bitten, are bitten because of their own stupidity & arrogance when they're messing around with them unnecessarily.

FWIW, puff adders are unlikely to bite you unless you seriously mess around with them. Their first line of defence is to rely on their camouflage & their second to play dead.

Steve: I certainly agree with you that the majority of persons that get bit (even here in the U.S.) do so because they've been "messing around with them unnecessarily." (ie: handling them)

That said, accidentally stepping on a puff adder or other unseen snake is certainly a possibility and a defensive bite wouldn't be unusual. Don't you agree that such incidents are more likely to occur if the client isn't concerned about where he/she happens to tread?

BTW: Last year one of the medical evacuation services posted just such a situation when one of their clients stepped on a forest cobra that he didn't notice until it was too late. Maybe such occurrences are rare, but isn't being aware of such possibilities and increasing one's vigilance a good thing?

You guys...any excuse to wear chaps

Interesting replies. I see both angles. I live in AZ and haven't had too much trouble but I have seen some rattlers.

What is "PDI"? Oh I want to sit right seat allright. Charter is owned by Zambezi Delta safaris and it isnt cheap, so I hope that is a good thing. I am very used to sitting right seat, unfortunately. Otherwise ele would be on the menu

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Don't worry, being a pilot I am VERY worried about flying on a plane in Africa. But there isn't much I can do about that, is there?

Don't necessarily go for the cheapest charter, be sure to do your own PDI & if the #2 seat isn't occupied, try to sit in it & failing that, close to it.

Pre-departure inspection....... I think you Americans call it the walkround?

Pullicords

Difficult to say & I'm certainly no expert on snakes but FWIW have trodden on & off one or two (puff adders) when walking & they've always just played dead.......... My better half once did it as well & I only noticed as she was on it so I let her walk on a few paces before stopping her & taking her back to see what she stepped on.

She's never forgiven me.

Bakes,,,, I know it isn't a "brown snake" like you guys have and you have had encounters with them if I remember,,, I encounter rat snakes at my place all the time,, they are non poisionous but very aggressive and make me piss myself. the rattle snakes and poisionous snakes we have here don't seek you out to bite but normally strike defensively when disturbed or stepped on...Yikes , I hate snakes!!

I think most snake bites are a result of combining booze and good all boys having too much fun. However, I am personally acquained with two men that were bitten by moccasins while farming. One bit probably could bave been avoided and the other was just pure bad luck

walkaround-got it

I will be taking a very close look

Cottonmouth are just plain ill-tempered and do not need an excuse to strike. Any other poisonous snake we have will usually try to avoid a confrontation. Not those bastards! I was also always told as a kid that they would not strike underwater. I am here to tell you that one was proved wrong. Damn slithering critter must not have read the manual.

quote:

Originally posted by Bakes:
You guys...any excuse to wear chaps

Y M C A!

Too noisy to hunt in. Keep a pair in the truck in case I have to track something through really high grass in South Texas. Never worn them. Never would think about taking them to Africa.

I was thinking gaiters not chaps lol and the turtleskin was the only one I'll consider. I'll save the dough if it was an issue I hope the outfitter would say so. I just thought swamps were a good place for big nasty venomous snakes....

Gunslinger:

I've run across vipers and boomslangs in the Kalahari. I've also run across a mamba in the Selous. None were in a swamp. In fact, I've never hunted in a swamp (in Africa).

Check out the products from this company. I field tested for them; excellent products.
http://www.snakeguardz.com/

quote:

Cottonmouth are just plain ill-tempered and do not need an excuse to strike. Any other poisonous snake we have will usually try to avoid a confrontation. Not those bastards! I was also always told as a kid that they would not strike underwater. I am here to tell you that one was proved wrong. Damn slithering critter must not have read the manual.

I assure you; Cottonmouths/water moc's can and will bite you underwater. It is documented and there have been victims here in TN. There's an old saying on Kentucky Lake: "Want to know if a man is a night fisherman? Just look for dents in his gunnels where he's beat off the Cottonmouths with his paddle." Cottonmouths are attracted to lights and will come in the boat with you. They are not to be messed with.

quote:

Originally posted by Texas Blue Devil:
I don't like snakes.

+1

Southern hemisphere client hunters are more likely to die from fear of snakebite than from snakebite itself, I reckon. I have seen a number of clients completely ruin their own hunts through their irrational fear of snakebite.

Thanks Steve Irwin - you douchebag...

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:
Southern hemisphere client hunters are more likely to die from fear of snakebite than from snakebite itself, I reckon. I have seen a number of clients completely ruin their own hunts through their irrational fear of snakebite.

Thanks Steve Irwin - you douchebag...

Finally...the voice of reason! And coming from a man who resides in the only place in the world where venomous snake species outnumber non-venomous ones. Honestly, the things that people manage to worry about...

Oh, and be careful while hunting to always carry your rifle slung with the barrel pointing downwards. Otherwise, well, you're just walking around with a portable lightning rod and will be lucky to survive the day. Danger, danger, danger!!!

Yeah thats not going to happen. And are you saying no one has ever been bit by a venomous snake in Africa? On the other hand, there have been at least 2 firearms accidents this season, so I guess our own guns are more dangerous than snakes from the sounds of things...And the Buffalo are definitely more dangerous..

Buffalo Chaps??

I used to live in an area in the Lowveld which had one of the highest concentrations of snakes and for pocket money I would sell snakes. The poisinous ones are virtually never in swamps unlike moccasins. Mambas clear off if not cornered and anyway they are likely to be at chest height with there heads when they travel in the grass. Leg gaiters have no real role. But at night when walking around camp always use a flashlight (torch!) to check for puff adders that come out to lie on warm paths and patches. If you are in a thatched hut, check the ceiling for snakes. Check sleeping bags and shoes more because of scorpions. Don't tease cobras, could be a spitting cobra.

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:
Southern hemisphere client hunters are more likely to die from fear of snakebite than from snakebite itself, I reckon. I have seen a number of clients completely ruin their own hunts through their irrational fear of snakebite.

Thanks Steve Irwin - you douchebag...

FWIW: There's a difference between an "irrational fear of snakebite" and recognizing potential risks in any given locale. I traveled to an area (Tanzania) where the risk of Yellow Fever infection was minimal, but I still obtained an inoculation before my trip. Where I live in the U.S. rattlesnakes are commonly encountered (I've found them in my own yard), but their presence doesn't prevent me from hiking in the local mountains almost every day. Saying that people need to think, look and act responsibly in areas where one can get bit accidentally and immediate medical care is problematic (ie: delays sometimes measured in hours) isn't being "paranoid", it's being proactive.

I don't believe anyone here is trying or going to scare off potential clients, but suggesting that hunters shouldn't "worry" about venomous snakes seems akin to saying they don't need to "worry" about where the muzzle of their gun is pointed at every moment. Yea, firearms safety should be something we all practice, but why not also pay attention to where we step, sit or place our hands?

quote:

Originally posted by Pulicords:

I don't believe anyone here is trying or going to scare off potential clients, but suggesting that hunters shouldn't "worry" about venomous snakes seems akin to saying they don't need to "worry" about where the muzzle of their gun is pointed at every moment.

you can make that correlation but I will not.

quote:

Originally posted by Pulicords:
.... but why not also pay attention to where we step, sit or place our hands?

Those kind of 'life skills' are usually initiated in early youth, not 'taught' to adults.