The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting What if you don't want the trophies?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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For the price of two or three mounts you can hire a cameraman to film the hunt. Then you can sit down and really live the hunt over. In Aug., I'm taking my Granddaughter to BVC, may bring back a hide to have something made for her house. She is getting married in Oct. so I thought it would be a nice present. Other than that, I'm not going to have anything mounted, just the video. | |||
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my trophy room has 15 ft vaulted ceiling and 30'x30 floor. it is "comfortably full" and i am not a big fan of a TR that is so crowded you have to dodge horns and walk around mounts- an obstacle course. i basically settle on pictures/video. i am having the western savannah buffalo i just shot made into a pedestal mount- this will go into the house entryway across from a cape buff pedestal mount( no room in the TR). the only reason i am getting it mounted is because i had never seen one, it was an old bull with nice, knackered horns, and i will probably never see another one. the amount of money i am saving is amazing. Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP | |||
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I had a few clients who was not interested in taking home their trophies, all they wanted was to get a hunting experience and the photos. Some clients wants to do a cull hunt, which offers lower fees on the animals. It is still a true hunt, no shooting from the vehicle. It is up to everyone to decide for himself if he wants to take home his trophies or not. One client that became a very good friend hunted with me and did not want to take home his trophies, I kept the horns and display them in my lapa with a plate with the hunters name on it. This person passed on 18 months later. The horns are now a memory of a good friend. Life is how you spend the time between hunting trips. Through Responsible Sustainable hunting we serve Conservation. Outfitter permit no. Limpopo ZA/LP/73984 PH permit no. Limpopo ZA/LP/81197 Jaco Human SA Hunting Experience jacohu@mweb.co.za www.sahuntexp.com | |||
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For me,it has ALWAYS been about the experiences. The animals I have seen (and taken), the camps, the people, the scenery, the smells. None of that can be recreated. But it will live for ever in my mind. Spending THOUSANDS of my families hard earned dollars to get a skin mounted when I am more than happy with some great photos (and the opportunity to fund another adventure) has just never made much sense to me. If I had the funds for a palace and unlimited safaris, I might have a different view. But for more and more people it seems that the taxidermy is becoming less and less important. "The difference between adventure and disaster is preparation." "The problem with quoting info from the internet is that you can never be sure it is accurate" Abraham Lincoln | |||
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While I understand the issue all too well……. I simply will not spend thousands on trophy fees for animals I have no intention of bringing the trophy home. I would never pay high daily rates and trophy fees to kill something that I cannot or will not bring part of the animal home as a trophy. If it is just experience of the hunt then I believe it should be a daily rate and a low trophy fee. I just do not need to kill something to complete the experience. I'd rather leave it for someone who has not taken the particular animals and wants the trophy. I am not going to pay big bucks in the form of daily rate AND trophy fees to help do local wildlife control. If the beasts need to be killed for one reason or another, and ultimately will be killed regardless, then the daily rate and local hunting licence fees should suffice. I am only scratching the surface on this but just do not have the time right now to expand on it……….. and it would probably be a waste of time anyways. ______________________________________________ The power of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by those who are bereft of that gift. | |||
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This has to be one of the most interesting threads as it shows the diversity/heterogeneity of views of hunting (trophy hunting) among hunters, especially hunting in africa. Does anyone have an idea what the residual value on taxidermy trophies is ? I see an active classified section for everything on AR but people selling taxidermy trophies. Mike | |||
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I would suggest talking to your outfitter before you book as you can save a lot of money. Generally we try and book clients at the properties that have the best trophy quality. This does not always coincide with the best value for money though. There are great properties that produce a lot of "Good Average Animals" that you can hunt for 20% less cost. But these are properties we tend to steer clear from as we want good trophies. You still going to shoot mature animals with great personality, but you get to shoot a lot more on your trip. I would be careful of booking a "management hunt" as these are generally run on properties where they are culling and more often than not then game is shot to hell and back and runs at the first sight of anything. No fun and whether they admit it or not the hunting ends up being off the back of a van. Specialist Outfitters and Big Game Hounds An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Day fees have nothing to do with the trophy fees. Your day fees cover for the camp, concession fees, food, drinks, camp staff, your ph, the vehicle cost and transport. The level of luxury also plays a role in the day fees. Life is how you spend the time between hunting trips. Through Responsible Sustainable hunting we serve Conservation. Outfitter permit no. Limpopo ZA/LP/73984 PH permit no. Limpopo ZA/LP/81197 Jaco Human SA Hunting Experience jacohu@mweb.co.za www.sahuntexp.com | |||
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There are some camps in Africa with sculls on the walls that came from my doings. | |||
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You surely meant to say "misdeeds" ?  | |||
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Adam, I enjoy your slick bossed buffs and incredible eland every time I look at them! Good Hunting, Tim Herald Worldwide Trophy Adventures tim@trophyadventures.com | |||
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I had no idea where this thread would go. It is very interesting to hear the many and diverse responses. Thank's for not eating my lunch. . | |||
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Do the PH's hunt lesser game knowing the client does not want to take home any trophies, for example there could be 54" kudu in the area along with 50" inch kudu, would the PH pass on the 54 incher? | |||
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boltshooter, You bring up a good point. I discourage hunters from getting on the ground and telling the PH they don't really care about the trophies. Even the best PH is apt to not try quite as hard if the client doesn't really care about what he shoots. If you really don't want to take home the trophies but want to have the best experience I'd recommend you tell the PH you still expect good representative trophies so the PH will know exactly what your thinking. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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Since I first read this thread, I have been struggling on how to say this. I will attempt to share my thoughts into words. Earlier in this thread, I stated that I believe there is an "implied responsibility" to use our kills in a responsible manner. Personally, I REPEAT PERSONALLY, I believe not participating in the trophy process of the Safari is giving our non-hunting adversaries bad PR to use against us. I can see the conversation, HUNTER; I just went to Africa. NON-HUNTER; Oh, did you go on a photo Safari? HUNTER; No, I killed a bunch of stuff NON-HUNTER; Are those your trophy photos? HUNTER; Ah...Yes NON-HUNTER; Did you eat that stuff? HUNTER; Why, yes...fed the whole camp for 10 days, and the local community. NON-HUNTER; Did you bring anything home? HUNTER; Nah, too expensive, I figure if I just leave the stuff there, I could go back again, sooner. NON-HUNTER; Oh. Why not just take pictures then? HUNTER; Because that doesn't close the circle of life in my view. NON-HUNTER; So, the experience of Safari isn't the same unless you kill it, then leave it? HUNTER; Yep! NON-HUNTER; Then I see you as a recreational killer, not a sportsman. I for the life of me cannot find a way to convince an anti that he would be incorrect based on that. Using, "We feed the hungry people is a bullshit argument, You didn't go over to feed people." I am obviously not an anti. I am someone who always has, in the back of my mind, how do we as sportsman, not lose the PR battle we are fighting at an ever increasing frequency and velocity. Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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"Circle of life"!!! What a load of crap. You can believe it if you want to, but the "circle of life" is closed for whatever you're discussing when it dies, whether it is shot or whatever. I mean, if you want to mount your trophies as mementos, that's fine. It's your money and your house. But if you think that mounting a trophy makes a difference to an anti-hunting/Peta type then you're not thinking very clearly. It doesn't matter to them, or me, for that matter, about your circle of life, you killed it for your pleasure and mounting it is for the same reason. I don't have a problem with that, but sugar coating it by saying, "Oh, I'm completing it's "circle of life", is just so much horse manure." The anti-hunters are opposed to hunting, period. That's not going to change and the fact that many Americans and other hunters go to African countries to kill game for their pleasure is a fact as well. It's a blood sport and that's that. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Yes, they are. But the people on the fence are neutral. They are the majority. Kill it and leave it if you want. I hunted Buff in OZ a couple years ago, we shot management buff, lots of them. Shot em, took pics and just walked away. Somehow, it just didn't sit right with me. The one on the wall, I feel good about. I agree, it's a blood sport. How do you feel about Mark Sullivan? The same? Because it is same issue as I see it. All about the optics of the sport. Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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While I don't know him, Sullivan is a helluva shot and promotes his hunting like a smart businessman. If you want to be "touchy-feely" about how and what you kill, that's fine and dandy, but you're still killing them because you enjoy it and that's all there is to it. You can dance around the issue with all that "circle of life" stuff you want, but it's just a smoke screen that you have created so you can feel better about killing. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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I agree with you. I just added one important word. And touchy feely? really. It's all about preservation of a lifestyle. I used to have the attitude, and openly expressed it here. "The first rule about fight club, don't talk about fight club." But since we as sportsman "are out" we need to be very cognizant of our image to the rank and file American, whom doesn't really have an opinion about hunting. Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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Here is a question for some thought- do we/you mount every whitetail, mule deer, pronghorn or elk we kill? I have no more respect for a kudu than I do an elk. No more respect for an impala than a whitetail. (I respect them all & ) I like to hunt them all, and I have some of all of them mounted, but I do not only kill a deer or elk if I am going to mount it...again, I don't think there is a right or wrong, this just had me thinking. Good Hunting, Tim Herald Worldwide Trophy Adventures tim@trophyadventures.com | |||
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......but.....but....but.....Tim, you won't have completed the circle of life.........  xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Hi Tim. Yes, I do. Keeping in mind that I don't have the opportunities you do. I try really hard to draw good tags here in AZ. It limits my in state hunting to every 4-5 years. I actually drew a unit 10 archery bull tag this year. Probably the finest Elk tag in America. I also have many other hobbies that split my time, I race bicycles (a bunch) that is a huge commitment. I have a family which also takes up huge chunks. I'm leaving the 10th of June for a bike race called the Tour Divide. www.tourdivide.org Longest bike race in the world. My writing has actually gotten some traction as well, Cal Pappas has been a huge mentor of mine and has opened some doors. That had used up what little time there is left. Did you shoulder mount that Mulie you killed out in Gila Bend? I bet you did, that was a special animal. I really don't expect to have general agreement with my philosophy. My father drilled respect for others and ALL life into me. I will read and think about everyone's ideas and try not to denigrate them for it. But my short answer is yes, everything gets at least a euro mount. Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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Steve I am with you on this one, I do not chase inches but I love hunting mature animals and everything has a spot in the trophy room. It does not need to be a full mount or even a shoulder mount could just be a loose skull propped up against a tree or rock. regards JK | |||
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In my experience folks have more of a problem with "stuffed" animals than the hunting. I've been told they find the mounts creepy. Even hunters often don't get the reason for the mounts. Serious hunters have asked "why do you need so much of this in your home"? To me the mounts are a tangible piece of the hunt that I can bring home to enjoy for the rest of my life. I like them very much and have a house full but I see the other points of view also. If I had to choose between shortening a hunt and doing the taxidermy or doing the whole hunt I'd choose the hunt every time. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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 The Trophy is part of the whole hunt for me, only problem I have is getting some of them through the doors, I cant go a week with out spending time in my trophy room and remembering the good times had, JK | |||
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Hi Mark, As far as shortening the hunt or continue hunting, This subject aligns very closely to the tipping thread. Looking at and analyzing the entire cost of a safari, I include my anticipated taxidermy bill, same as the tip I include that (the tip) as part of the total anticipated cost. So, based on those costs, I must forego some hunts to fund my total cost. My trophy room might be a huge waste of time and money to some. That's fine, I love it. I walk in there and feel a rush of adrenaline. I always feel something new and different. It will be in the next volume (#8) of "Great Hunters, their Trophy Rooms and Collections." Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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We were typing at the same time. We feel the same about our rooms. Very nice Jumbo. Like to see more Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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3D pictures!! That's my answer. ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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Steve- First congrats on the unit 10 tag. I am very jealous. I have about 13 points building toward that tag. You guys in AZ don't have the same opportunity as many of us over the counter states. I like to hunt whitetails, and I like to hunt mature ones. I don't really care about inches, but I am also not going to have 100 whitetail mounts. So that is a bit different. I agree with all you guys who love taxidermy, and I really wish I could have more as I really appreciate it as an art, and the memory of the hunt, I just am limited (and not real happy about it  ).I did mount that Gila Bend mulie and he is special to me. I am going to beat it into the ground that I don't think there is a right or wrong here, and I am enjoying everyone's opinions on this one and glad that it has stayed civil when folks disagree... Good Hunting, Tim Herald Worldwide Trophy Adventures tim@trophyadventures.com | |||
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JK, that ele is incredible! Good Hunting, Tim Herald Worldwide Trophy Adventures tim@trophyadventures.com | |||
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Steve, Personally I don't give a lot of thought to the taxidermy because I get it done as I can afford it. It might be five years or more after the hunt before I can get some mounts done. I do a few each year as I can afford them. in fact I'm picking up 8 trophies Monday that come from 5 different hunts spread over 14 years. As for the taxidermy being part of the whole safari experience just as the tip is I don't know that I agree that it applies to everyone. If the dip/pack, documentation, shipping, broker fees and taxidermy will keep a guy from hunting Africa or not I think it's a no brainer that he do the safari and leave the trophies. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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JK, I too agree the elephant is amazing and looks perfectly natural in that pose. Lovely! Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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Justin the ELE is INCREDIBLE!!!  Congrats!!! | |||
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Steve, I find your view completely ridiculous!!!! I have little interest in taxidermy. That does not define me as someone "who just enjoys killing". Elephant and buffalo hunting are my favorite, but I enjoy all hunting,..the entire experience, not just the killing!!!! I love the cool early morning drives. I love the first elephant sighting of a hunt. I love the intensity and nervous feeling I get in the pit of my stomach during the close in stalks on elephants. I enjoy the long walks tracking elephants or dugga boys. I love hearing the calls of Fish Eagles during the day, and listening to hippos from my tent during the night. The sundowners and conversations around the evening campfire are awesome. I love the mornings,.....drinking coffee and chatting with the PH about the plans of the day. A sunrise from a hunting truck on an elephant hunt in Caprivi Strip......it just doesn't get any better than that for me!!!!! And to say that I'm less of a sportsman because I don't care to hang my trophies on wall,....that is STUPID!!! By the way, videos and photos fill my circle nicely. My opinion. Go Duke!! | |||
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Interesting perspective. It is of course valid. You also might find it interesting that i do not find it rediculous or stupid. Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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You want to talk about bullshit???? Your argument is completely insane. A non-hunting adversary is NOT going to feel better about our hunting just because you put mounts on the wall. Anti-hunters don't give a shit about your taxidermy work. If does anything at all, it inflames them. Anti-hunters have emotional attachments to animals, and simply don't want us killing anything, from bobwhite quail to elephants and everything in between!!! And putting mounts on the wall does nothing to change that. I have no problem with taxidermy work. I just have little interest in it. I've kept my elephant tusks, and a few european mounts from my first 2 hunts, but that is it. I have shoulder mounted several of my son's African trophies. At 14, he is still very young, but he has been on 4 safaris. Much to my surprise on our last hunt in Botswana, he didn't ask for a single shoulder mount. He room is already full. Getting back to your argument....to say that I'm an irresponsible hunter and a recreational killer because I don't bring all the trophies back,...and the anti-hunters are going to feel better about my hunting activities because I mount all my trophies...... is BULLSHIT!!!!! Go Duke!! | |||
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I don't think most non hunters will really buy into mounted taxidermy. Most people who don't hunt will consider trophy rooms a little strange. It is our (hunters) thing - its not the mainstream non hunting thing to see mounted animals. I don't see too many commercial home décor companies offering real or faux mounted taxidermy for sale. I think rugs, antlers and Europeans are easier to sell to general public as home décor. I see Ikea selling cow hides. I have seen restoration hardware sell impala European skull mounts and antler lighting - both fake horns/antlers. Only stuffed animals I have seen for sale have normally been touristy stuff - alligator heads ect. Mike | |||
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I don't find your love of taxidermy work stupid or ridiculous. I do find your view,... that someone who doesn't care for taxidermy work is an irresponsible hunter and "recreational killer.... to be Stupid!!!" Go Duke!! | |||
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Exactly!!!! You're not gonna win over Anti-hunters or even non-hunters with mounted taxidermy. You will definitely get a lot them ticked off!!!! Go Duke!! | |||
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Hi Mike, Hope you're well. I think my effort at explaining this is a failure. If the responsibility of a Safari hunted animal ends at pulling the trigger, All my reading of classic Africana, all my teachings from my father were in vain. whether shoulder mounted, full mount or euro mount, I very strongly feel the responsibility of killing does not end at the kill. Where it ends and how far I would chose to take it, I really don't know. All I can say is it seems shallow to just go kill the shit and walk away. Very analogous to visiting a prostitute I guess? You get your needs fulfilled, throw your money on the dresser and piss off. Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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