Ladies and Gentlemen,

Some observations from our recent safari.

Waiting in the Bulawayo airport for our flight back to Johannesburg we saw a group of 4 American bowhunters. Loud, obnoxious and dressed like Safari Sam. On the bus from the plane to the Johannesburg terminal, they continued to joke and chat at the top of their lungs. Acting more like teenage boys than mature men. Just look around and notice that no one else is talking that loudly. Notice the couple dressed in khakis and sport shirts sitting at the Bulawayo airport having a toasted cheese and tomato sandwich and a Fanta. Also notice the same couple on the airport bus as they talk quietly between themselves. That couple was me and my wife.

Four guys (two adult sons, father and grandfather) having breakfast at Afton Guest House after their return from Zimbabwe. Telling the other guests that they were glad to be "out of harm's way". That they "saw tons of guys with AKs". That "Harare was scary". That they were "lucky to get a plane out of Harare" to Johannesburg and that they had to "kick a chicken off their seat" in the airplane.

The real story, these guys were hunting with Swainson's at the same time we were there. We even stopped and helped their PH fix his brakes on his cruiser. They didn't even recognize me or my wife. "Out of harm's way" ???? Where the hell were they in any danger???? The ton of guys they saw with AKs were two game scouts!!!! Harare was scary??? All they did was charter into and out of Harare. We spent a night in Harare with no problems. How in the Hell can you be afraid of Harare when all you see is the airport???? Lucky to get a plane out of Harare, kick a chicken out of their seat???? No flights were cancelled and they flew on a British Airways 737 from Harare to JNB.

My wife squeezed my hand and stared sternly at me, because she knew that I was about to launch into these idiots. I held my tongue, but good God what a bunch of dumbasses!!!!!

I won't even mention the two rich hunters who were nice, but their wives were loud, know-it-alls constantly bragging about how many safaris they had been on and all the animals their husbands had killed. Oh yeah, the wives were dressed in animal print blouses and wearing a ton of expensive jewelry. Where's a mugger when you need one?

Regards,

Terry

Almost makes you want to utter a pre-emptive blanket apology for all the dumbass Americans who don't know (or don't care) how to act in public.

Where IS Miss Manners when you need her?

I know what you mean Terry, it is a rather common occurrence and it makes you cringe. Still, in all honestly, many of the less attractive features are not restricted to Americans, but are shared by tourists from all over the World. I guess a lot of it has to do with travelling in a group, exitement of being away from home, lack of experience or quite simply wanting to show off your wealth or whatever. The latter attribute is sometimes observed on Internet forums as well
- mike

T.Carr, this past May I observed something similar on my flight from Joburg to Windhoek. Again it was a group of 6 archery hunters, in full cammo. They were also very loud and obnoxious. They also happened to be on the same return flight as me. Again, same loud, boistrous behaviour. From 10 rows behind them I heard stories about the gut shot Gemsbok that took them 2 days to find it. This post isn't meant to slam archery hunters, as most I've met have been class acts, but this group was an embarrasment.

It always amazes me to see and hear this crap. I usually take the all nighter from Denver to Atlanta then wait the 3 hours to catch the JNB flight.

It is always fun to sit in the concession area and watch the custom kaki and bush hat crowd go by and listen to the B.S. being slung.

Of course if you want to see the crem de la crem of loud and overbering rich A-hole hunters just spend a few days at the SCI convention and do a little people watching. You'll see some real sights there.

It is so nice to see how many fat rich old hunters bring their young buxom grand daughters dressed in shear minis, to the SCI convention. Just amazing that those young ladies are so interested in the hunting..

I'll bet that "Al-kee-hawl" had something to do with these incidents - which by the way is no excuse for the actiones previously described!

JW

Terry: I share your sentiments on this. Although I did not have folks as bad as you on my trip, there was a group on the airplane (excuse me, SAA sardine-can) that were dressed and acted like they were at a corner gas station somewhere in the south just after a deer hunt, unshaven, camo Tshirts, etc. All were hunting in ranches in RSA. I must say that between their stories and the gun permit hassles in RSA, there's no way I'm hunting there anytime soon. We had a wonderful time in Bulawayo, going out to dinner and even shopping with no problems, even though the gas-lines and poverty were sad to see. Nice restaurants and food ws plentiful. I guess being with "Hulk-Hogan" John Sharp helped! jorge

Well, ass holes are not limited to rich and famous! There are CADDY, and Harley loud mouthed show offs, from all walks. One example is the AH who talks on his cell phone in a resturant, as if he were the only person in a football stadium, but the internet is the place where you will hear all their BS, but at least you don't have to read their crap, or look at the dumbasses, the way you do in the airport!

Ogres are not limited to Americans, or safari hunting! They are everywhere, and come from all countries, and in all colors!

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
Well, ass holes are not limited to rich and famous! There are CADDY, and Harley loud mouthed show offs, from all walks. One example is the AH who talks on his cell phone in a resturant, as if he were the only person in a football stadium, but the internet is the place where you will hear all their BS, but at least you don't have to read their crap, or look at the dumbasses, the way you do in the airport!

Ogres are not limited to Americans, or safari hunting! They are everywhere, and come from all countries, and in all colors!

Truth!
To be confronted with ones own ignorance of the world one need only travel it. If you're smart. You will recognize alot of liars in your travels. And you will change your point of view.

Great post Terry I to have observed and been embarrased by jerks traveling to Africa.

Two casses stand out. In the airport in Amsterdam two real loosers dressed in "safari garb" were loud and very obnoxious. They were eating McDonalds waiting for the flight to DAR. When it was time to board, they left the garbage on the seats and floor. They were really cool

The other occasion was in Atlanta boarding the SAA flight. There were 4 guys dressed the same; badly worn jeans, camo tee shirts, cowboy boots, and hats that pulled down front and rear.
They wanted everyone in the terminal to know they were great hunters heading to Africa. I wonder if they realized everyone on the plane was going to Africa

As Archie Moore said, "a man mellows with age" how true, 10 years ago I would made a scene with both of these groups.

I´m often ashamed of being semi-American in Europe -tourists from the US are often loud, ignorant and "opinioned".

Luckily Finns have a great reputation (especially in Sweden and the Baltic states) for being falling down drunkards, not speaking any foreign languages and for fighting!

Did you know that Swedish men are famous for being raging queens?

Terry, I've seen this behavior myself before at airports, on planes, and in various hunting camps. I feel the same way about it that you do, but I always let it pass and let the obnoxious rave. Every gusty, annoying wind subsides in its due course........

Booze IS often part of the problem, and for some reason certain ignorant types think that a big mouth makes for a big man. The sad part is, we get judged by what we exhibit in public, and the good ol' U.S.A and the hunting community as a whole needs all of the positive PR it can get right now........

AD

I wondered who these guys were hunting with and where such that they did not think they would have time to change clothes before hunting.

I guess I was lucky in that other than seeing the clothes with camo and hunting logos I missed out on witnessing any truly boorish behaviour (unless maybe I was the one comitting it).

Many of us from the U. S. cannot help the rest of us, and suffer for it. We don't have to go to Africa to encounter it, either. The volume of sound that comes from some folks is amazing. Literally, you can hear them from 1 mi away if you are in relatively quiet woods. I had always blamed it on cities: the quiet is scarry if one usually thinks of quiet being that you can be heard over bus engines.

But it is also correct that we can get all the help we can get. Hunting in America is troubled -- and we've not been doing very well convincing our rank and file not to encourage everyone to hate us.

Dan

I suspect many of us have been amazed to hear the safari stories of people we were previously on safari with.

Have you ever wondered if you slept through all the confrontations with poachers, lions and hippos walking through camp etc. that people you were there with speak to others of a year or so after returning?

quote:

Originally posted by Palmer:
Have you ever wondered if you slept through all the confrontations with poachers, lions and hippos walking through camp etc. that people you were there with speak to others of a year or so after returning?

Hey mate, maybe you did sleep through them!

Some of these things do actually happen to some of us.

I have never really had any bad encounters with other hunters while travelling. I did sit next to a Kiwi once on a flight to Africa. And it was a great meeting. He was a good friend of a guide I once used and the guide had told me all about his mate. So I guessed they were one and the same.

A couple girls in very nice thin blouses did keep giving us evil looks as we talked about killing animals though. Maybe we were "loud Antipodeans" on that flight.

This gentleman was going to "farm-sit" a Triangle game farm while the owners were on holiday.

Another flight at Jo'burg I was the only person on the flight with firearms so I guess the only hunter.

I just ignore the idiots if possible. Dry humour can be a killer too sometimes.

Bad behavior is bad behavior regardless from who or wherever it is encountered. I fly often with my employment many times I sit thru the same flights as the "complainers" whom once in the airport terminal seem to forget they booked econo class for a long flight to pinch a few pennies. Then begin to badmouth the airlines because they were too cheap to pony up for the upgrades!

Two years ago my wife and I were in London waiting for our flight home.We were having lunch and shared a table with a nice couple from down under when in comes Safari Sam.
My wife says "My God, Look". I did not even
know those clothes were still made. I said that I hoped he was not American. My lunch friends prayed he was not from their home as well. We never knew where he was from but as we went to board he had people "captivated" with his tales.
I have yet to hunt Africa so have limited experence, but christ, some people make us all look bad.
Gene

I hunt near RAF Lakenheath, one of the major USAF bases in the UK and so come into contact with quite a few "Ugly Americans".

One evening I was driving down to our lease and saw some sort of incident on the side of the road. In the main beam of my lights I could see a small car had gone off the road and dropped its front wheel into a ditch and two big American four door pick up trucks were pulled up just past it..

As I approached I could see a middle aged woman standing by one of the trucks and she was obviously shuck up, and had a little blood on her face. I could also see the interior light was on in the cab of the truck and somebody was leaning inside doing something..

There was a bunch of guys gathered around the the car...most with crew cuts and in their 20's, one or two with beers..I could hear American accents as I walked over wondering what was going on..

It turns out these particular "Ugly Americans" were going from base to a BBQ somewhere and had arrived at the scene of the accident a few minutes before me and were in the process of lifting/dragging the car out of the ditch when I arrived.

The guy I saw in the truck emerged with a first aid kit and started to clean the woman up...The guy introduced himself to the woman and showed her some USAF ID..every other word in the conversation was "ma'am" in a Southern accent..

The woman did not want an ambulance but instead called someone in her family as her car was not drivable. These particular "Ugly Americans" insisted that they would wait untill her family arrived.

Yes, a few beers had been drunk, but those boys treated that woman with the same respect as they would treat their own mothers; they were certainly a credit to the USAF... I decided "Ugly Americans" weren't too bad after all...

quote:

Originally posted by surestrike:
It is so nice to see how many fat rich old hunters bring their young buxom grand daughters dressed in shear minis, to the SCI convention. Just amazing that those young ladies are so interested in the hunting..

Surestrike,Those young buxom babes are those fat rich guys russian wifes.And they aint really interested in hunting,they are trying to get the old boy to drop dead!

A previous poster states, "hunting in America is troubled."

I don't have TV but had the opportunity(?) to watch an afternoon of "hunting" on the Outdoor Life Channel recently..........programming spoke volumes about what is wrong about "hunting" in America......loud and obnoxious.......a sad commentary on image, indeed.

Joe

Ugly Americans? funny we live in an era where so many want to put a hyphen between something and American, as if to say "yes I'm partly American but only partly"
What amazes me the most though is how we UGLY AMERICANS put up the money and muscle to bail most everyother country out of whatever mess they allow themselves to get into, time and again. While so many other countries sit on their duffs and bad mouth us.

Frankly it is nice to see other people are concerned about the image hunters are portraying to the public. Maybe we're not as small a minority as I thought.

We need to stop getting defensive about it and defending this trash. The people I found making the biggest asses of themselves were American. The Safari Sam's being talked about by the PHs were American.

Having said that the outrageous behavior I've ever seen in a foreign country or on a plane were three seperate instances of British drunks, and one South African white woman with a major league racial problem.

But, we're talking hunters here. The Americans win the prize for stupidity; in Atlanta, in JHB, but I notice that the farther we got away from the hunt scene the nicer we become. Flying back I watched an American jerk in JHB remain a jerk through to Atlanta, then when he left Atlanta and the bulk of his Peter-bumping-buddies weren't around to impress he changed into a regular guy, quiet and polite. I guess his testosterone level dropped or something.

Funny thing is, it's the people that could really brag and tell the best stories that never seem to open their mouths. Maybe these other "wannabes" could take a lesson from them.

quote:

Originally posted by JBoutfishn:
As Archie Moore said, "a man mellows with age" how true, 10 years ago I would made a scene with both of these groups.

Always good to see boxers quoted. If these clowns had spent as much time in the ring as they have sitting in a hide over a borehole, they wouldn't think themselves so macho.

quote:

Originally posted by baboon:

[ Surestrike,Those young buxom babes are those fat rich guys russian wifes.And they aint really interested in hunting,they are trying to get the old boy to drop dead!

Baboon,

More like rental eye candy and arm decoration...

Nice to look at though...

We tend to notice ugly Americans around the world because they represent us and are embarrassing to us.

I am an international airline pilot and travel extensively. Believe me, I've seen more than my fair share of ugly Aussies, ugly Britts, loud obnoxious Krauts, asshole Frenchmen, irate Irishmen, truculent Turks, soused Japs, (handcuffed one extremely intoxicated gropper Japense bussiness man one time on a flight)mad Mexicans, seriously pyscotic South Americans, (A fellow pilot nearly had to kill a drunken Uruguayan banker when he breached the cockpit door in flight several years ago.)

Every country has it's good and it's bad.

But it seems to be so fun to trash on Americans doesn’t it?

Well y’all better stop it or we gonna put a boot in your ass.. Y’all hear that OK!!


For all of you British out there reading this..That last part was a joke.

Well, I guess based upon first impressions, my wife and I are Ugly Americans. We wear khaki outfits on the plane to Africa because we don't want to take extra clothes along. We talk about our previous hunts in Africa and North America and other places because others on the plane expressed an interest in what we did. Sorry about that.

So I guess we should wear three piece suits and be vewy, vewy quiet on the plane? Silly rabbits!

If you look for something to criticize, you will find it.......

You'll have to forgive me if I don't join in this piling on of self loathing self flaggelating anecdotal BS.

It takes all kinds to make the world go round. But it is hard not being embarassed because some folks, from a group you belong too, (hunting american) can't behave themselves.

I was in the Sistine Chapel back in 2000, when a lady with a strong New York(I'm from NY also) accent says "our church is better then this". I thought I was going to fall over. Some people in this world feel they must make jugdemnt and commentary on the lives, country, and society of others and compare it to their own, instead of just appreicating it truthfully for what it is.

BigBullet

I had a similar experience when I was in Italy last year. There was more than one instance of the "Ugly American." Being an American myself, I was pretty embarrassed. Nothing you can really do about it, other than to set the best example for your country that you can.

quote:

Originally posted by Pete E:
I hunt near RAF Lakenheath, one of the major USAF bases in the UK and so come into contact with quite a few "Ugly Americans".

One evening I was driving down to our lease and saw some sort of incident on the side of the road. In the main beam of my lights I could see a small car had gone off the road and dropped its front wheel into a ditch and two big American four door pick up trucks were pulled up just past it..

As I approached I could see a middle aged woman standing by one of the trucks and she was obviously shuck up, and had a little blood on her face. I could also see the interior light was on in the cab of the truck and somebody was leaning inside doing something..

There was a bunch of guys gathered around the the car...most with crew cuts and in their 20's, one or two with beers..I could hear American accents as I walked over wondering what was going on..

It turns out these particular "Ugly Americans" were going from base to a BBQ somewhere and had arrived at the scene of the accident a few minutes before me and were in the process of lifting/dragging the car out of the ditch when I arrived.

The guy I saw in the truck emerged with a first aid kit and started to clean the woman up...The guy introduced himself to the woman and showed her some USAF ID..every other word in the conversation was "ma'am" in a Southern accent..

The woman did not want an ambulance but instead called someone in her family as her car was not drivable. These particular "Ugly Americans" insisted that they would wait untill her family arrived.

Yes, a few beers had been drunk, but those boys treated that woman with the same respect as they would treat their own mothers; they were certainly a credit to the USAF... I decided "Ugly Americans" weren't too bad after all...

That is certainly good to hear.

I've never hunted in Africa, but have travelled the world extensively for business. A smile, a polite calm tone of voice, some curtesy, patience, an open mind, and an understanding that you may be in a culture you don't understand will get you miles ahead of other travellers.

My all time favorite quote is "I'm an American" with the attitude that pedisposes them to some favorable attention of some sort. It always get them screwed even if they don't know it. Yes, I want to smack them and tell them to shut up, but don't.

Grace and poise of bearing is a disapearing quality all over the world.

Good Hunting Gentlemen.

I threw a fellow American off a train in the middle of a sunflower field in Italy once. that is, if you consider a terminally obnoxious New York Jew a fellow American.

Confirmation Bias. People have a tendency to attribute more weight to observations that validate their preconcieved notions. Its the psychological device that lets stereotypes and racism perpetuate themselves. If you want to find obnoxious Americans, or illiterate black people, you will.

Pardon me if I dont get upset seeing some young lads excited about our sport.

It seems all we have to do is visit this website to witness some of the bad behavior described here in so many anecdotes. On the other hand, I've been able to find some who choose to act civilly, be friendly and helpful, gracious, and generous. While I can excuse some "over-exuberance" by some and those who feel passionately about some thing or another the one thing I absolutely have to remember is that the only behavior I can do anything about is mine. I just have to behave the best I can. And, believe me, sometimes it ain't easy!
Dave

quote:

It is so nice to see how many fat rich old hunters bring their young buxom grand daughters dressed in shear minis, to the SCI convention.

Don't know about the rest of you guys, but I can think of worse ways to spend my "Golden Years" than waddling my fat rear around the SCI convention hall with a cute little honey hanging on my arm, belonging to all the inner circle clubs, and sitting at a front row table while I sip my drink and buy me a few more trips to Africa for next year. It's a rough life, but somebody's gotta do it! Wouldn't it be terrible if we all end up like that?

Some of the worse Tourist are the Japanese and Chinese tourist at the Grand Canyon Jesus talk about rude push and shove you out of the way. last time I went there if I saw a tour bus I kept on driving to another point. When I travel which isn't often and I'm in an airport and I see soldiers which isn't very hard and they are actin like jack asses all I have to do is pull my military I.D out and they straighten right up no questions asked. Usually they are privates on there way to AIT or graduating from AIT.

Plenty of blame to go around--all around the world--and all the way to a post or two on this thread, in fact.

Unfortunately, it's hard to keep the pigs away from the dinner table, much less the trough.

[QUOTE]
Did you know that Swedish men are famous for being raging queens? QUOTE]

I know two Swedish men from here in Spain and they are both kind of ifeminate. Kind of got smacked by a sugar truck sweet.

I deal with the hunting public on a daily bases and fortunately these guys are the exception rather than the rule...but it does not take but a few to spoil the soup or something like that.