quote:

Originally posted by INTREPID SAFARIS:
Sciptus, if everything is so bad over here why are you still living here??

quote:

Originally posted by infinito:
Phillip,

Me and Steve had our differences in the past, and in some cases some realy heated ones as well. You will NEVER pursuade him otherwise on this topic, with all respect to Steve!

The problem with most folks is that they are not realy educated on the this topic. Most of them know only what they ahve been told by their PH's and landowners around campfires, and we know how that goes......

Here is a couple of my own thoughts:

1. Steve is an Englishman, and have lived in South Africa, I believe, since 1991. He therefore does not have the will to believe in our optimism, because he is not one of us. He now lives in Portugal, one of the poorest countries in Europe, and I will bet more than a bottle of whiskey he will be back in England not before long. Home is home.

2. We as Afrikaners have been here for nearly 400 years. Natives and animals have been killing us since those days. The fancy word "Genocide" was just not part of the vocabulary back then, but much so also "political correctness". For us it is just another tragic day in volatile and fantastic Africa. Of course there are the pessimistic doomsday conspiracy theorists that puts all of this down to a master plan by the "terrorist government" to get rid of the white man in Africa. The hard reality is that the finacial brains behind the black upper class in this country does not see it this way, and believe in a united, prosperous South Africa. They just want to poverty line to lift a bit, and you cannot blame them for that. Farm murders have declined with 30% in the last 2 years, and it has all to do with hard criminals being taken out of the system, slowly I admit, but surely.

3. South Africa offers high return on high investment. What people do not know is that some of these long term investment plans in the Game ranching industry offers yields of 25% or more. Where in the world does this type of yield not carry a high risk? What is this risk? LAnd being "taken" by the government? It is a CLEAR policy of the ANC that this will not happen. Now MAlemana proffessed otherwise, but look where he is now?

4.Yes, the constitution of this country states that the ruling party can make chances to it, but they need a 2/3'rd majority in the national assmebly to do it. This has not happened in the past 9 years of the new South Africa, and with our current poloitcal climate cannot see how it will EVER happen. The ANC is clutching at straws to stay in power and keep the party from falling apart.

5. South Africa, I believe (And stand to be corrected), is the only country in Africa where a foreign landowner can still have 100% full title deed on land. It will surely change, but what better security in your investment is there if your South African partner have a VESTED stake in your investment, of say 25%? One that he gave real money for, not just on paper? I know of bad and good business deals, in and out of the hunting industry, between families, friends, and different nationalities. It is all about the parties involved, and if the agreement between the parties had loose ends or not.

My neighbour is a Germand gentleman who has had his land now for 13 years. HE purchased it for R3million in 2000. He upgraded the fences, and build a small but rustic lodge that cost about R500,000.00 back then. He also opened up roads and build a dam. Another R500,000.00. So his Game ranch of 9,000 acres cost him R4mil. HE now have a serious offer on the table for R19mil. The farm paid for itself through hunting during the past 13 years, and he never spend another cent on it. So he made R15 mil in the last 13 years in capitol appreciation. His only problems? A dodgey manager for 2 year and some poachers. All that sorted out, got a top notch manager (the last 6 years) and got the poachers to learn the new manager CAN shoot!

So all not doom and gloom, and SA should still be a VERY attractive investment proposition to investors!



STEVE MATE, DO YOU REALY GIVE MALEMA THAT MUCH CREDIT? REALY?

quote:

Originally posted by Scriptus:

With the Rand at 8.91 to the Greenback, his R15 M equates to $1,683,501-6. Add 13 years of inflation, sell the property, take his money out the country, lose 25% in taxes plus capital gains tax and he has LOST MONEY BIG TIME.

quote:

Originally posted by INTREPID SAFARIS:
Sciptus, if everything is so bad over here why are you still living here?? JTEX YOU guys and us are much alike! God bless America!

quote:

This is not only our problem, it is world wide. Every where the do-ers are being challenged by the takers.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:

quote:

Originally posted by Manyathelo:
Malema wont be president unless by coup and that is highly unlikely.

You wouldn't care to bet a bottle of whisky on that by any chance would you?

Never say never........ especially where Africa is concerned.

quote:

Originally posted by artshaw:
Interesting posts but "Rule # 1" seems to have been overlooked.

Rule #1.
Look around you. If most of the people are not white Christians or Jews, your ass is grass and they will mow it.

What's next ? Invest in South Central L.A., The Southside of Chicago, Detroit ? Land is very cheap and hunting opportunities abound.

Any Christian/Jewish white man who chooses to live in Africa has a bullseye on his back.

I assume you "utes" have never read "Something of Value" (Robert Ruark). Nothing has changed except there are more and better armed 2 legged animals AND no nasty old colonial power to keep them in check. Then toss in the Muslims and..... well, things get really interesting.

Thank God for SLBMs !

quote:

No offense, but your statement sounds ignorant.


Jason

quote:

Originally posted by JBoutfishn:
No Jason, his statement goes far beyond ignorant.

quote:

Originally posted by JCHB:
I have a family, business and investments here and am not looking at jumping the fence any time soon. However would I realistically advise a foreigner to invest in a game farm? No. I would not advise any keen hunter to invest in a game farm unless the cash was spare and he could afford to miss it. Far better to invest the cash elsewhere and use the profits to book a multitude of hunts with Phillip, Charl, Pieter and the like. That way you will have maximum fun with minimum hassle.
It's just the same as the beach cottage (condo) argument. Is it better to buy the place so you are forced to use it over and over and have all the issues of maintenance or invest the money and use some of the profits to go on many different beach holidays wherever you like?

Buy a game farm if you want to be a hunting outfitter or a game farmer.
Book a hunt if you want to be a hunter.

My 10c (South African) worth.
JCHB

quote:

Originally posted by infinito:


So, this Southern tip of Africa will not tip as easily as you suggest. We have learned over the centuries to adapt to our situation, quickly! They took Civil service jobs away from the white male in 1994 and onwards. What was the result? The greatest boom in entrepneurship this country has ever seen, and probably never will see again!

quote:

Originally posted by Andrew McLaren:

Invest in hunting safaris!

quote:

Originally posted by artshaw:
Sorry fellas, anyone who invests in a third world country that is ruled by a corrupt criminal class will be sorry sooner or later. Look at all the people who went to Costa Rica back in the 70s and 80s who are now saying "Oops".

As Will Rogers said: "All I know is just what I read in the papers". and I'd add to that what I see on TV and in books.

I'm sure there a lots of places in Africa that you don't have to have escorts on Safari armed with AK-47s and places to live that are not walled, guarded compounds but IMO it's hard to deny that the general trend has been toward Chicago rather than Aspen since the white man shed his "burden". I see no emerging black middle class, no Silicon Valleys, no honest elections but I do see a lot of people chopping each other up over tribal disputes, the destruction of the land as uneducated masses continue to breed like flies and white farmers having their lands seized sans compensation by a bunch of thugs.

When the "sure as hell is hot" world wide economic collapse begins, I'd much rather be in Wyoming than, anywhere in Africa.

Thanks God we have SLBMs to open up a lot of Lebensraum.

quote:

Originally posted by Big Wonderful Wyoming:
As pissing contest go on AR this one is fairly mild.

Thanks to all that replied, looking for a place to retire and buy a farm.

Australia is by and large too much money, and gun laws suck. Spent 3 years there, great 3 years, but about financially broke us.

New Zealand is great, gun laws suck, but developers and their customers are turning it into someplace I don't really want to live. Still expensive, but cheaper than Australia.

I need a mild dry climate because of a degenerative muscle disease I was fortunate enough to inherit.

Wyoming is wonderful, but damn January is hard.

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by artshaw:
Sorry fellas, anyone who invests in a third world country that is ruled by a corrupt criminal class will be sorry sooner or later. Look at all the people who went to Costa Rica back in the 70s and 80s who are now saying "Oops".

As Will Rogers said: "All I know is just what I read in the papers". and I'd add to that what I see on TV and in books.

I'm sure there a lots of places in Africa that you don't have to have escorts on Safari armed with AK-47s and places to live that are not walled, guarded compounds but IMO it's hard to deny that the general trend has been toward Chicago rather than Aspen since the white man shed his "burden". I see no emerging black middle class, no Silicon Valleys, no honest elections but I do see a lot of people chopping each other up over tribal disputes, the destruction of the land as uneducated masses continue to breed like flies and white farmers having their lands seized sans compensation by a bunch of thugs.

When the "sure as hell is hot" world wide economic collapse begins, I'd much rather be in Wyoming than, anywhere in Africa.

Thanks God we have SLBMs to open up a lot of Lebensraum.

that's strange. i go to Costa Rica every year for 2 weeks( leaving in 2 weeks again) and all the American expats i meet( and it is a lot of them!) are really happy about their decision to move. land prices have skyrocketed in the last 5-6 years but are still a bargain compared to stateside. beautiful country, friendly people, mostly bilingual, and safe. just curious- obviously you have no first hand acknowledge of Africa- have you ever been to Costa Rica, either?? or is this just still internet fueled bullshit??

quote:

Originally posted by Scriptus:
http://www.news24.com/MyNews24...ANCs-legacy-20130208

MyNews24 is a user-generated section of News24.com. The stories here come from users.

MarkH

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Savagery and barbarism - the ANC's legacy
08 February 2013, 22:24

Daily I grow more horrified and disgusted by what I see happening around us in this rainbow nation and it’s getting to the point where I no longer want to read the news. I am embarrassed to call myself a South African.

How can men – and I use the term guardedly for they are actually savages - rape and mutilate a teenager and then leave her to die? How can anybody have so little respect for another human being and who are the parents of these animals? They deserve to be put on trial with their offspring, purely for neglecting their parental duties and allowing them to run wild. This is beyond sickening, this is barbaric!

How can hijackers steal a vehicle from a mother and leave her baby in the road? Are these people not also savages? Should they be given a second chance when they so callously disregard another’s right to life?

How can we progress, as both a nation and a country, when such savages are allowed to continue their brutal rule, all in the name of democracy? Why do we have to incarcerate such low life – at huge expense to us and the state - when surely the gallows would ensure that they, and others wishing to emulate their feats, never, ever become repeat offenders?

Surely all must by now realize that rape and murder particularly, and robbery with aggravating circumstances, should be worthy of the death penalty for the perpetrators of such crimes do not deserve a second chance. Those who participate in such crimes - crimes against humanity - have forfeited all rights and they deserve nothing more than a swift end to their lives.

Where is our gumption, where is our humanity and where is our sense of justice?

Have we forgotten where we come from – have we forgotten that rules, laws, common sense and decency are in place to prevent us from sliding backwards into barbarism and anarchy?

Have many of us have actually embraced democracy, and civilized thinking, and all that this entails?

If we have then we must know that putting a swift, and merciless, end to the perpetrators of such crimes would prove us to be civilized, and not as they are – barbarous.

Why are we not then doing so? What are we afraid of?

Whilst on the subject of the heartless, the callous and the uncaring which seem to be all around us, where are our leaders and what are they doing about this growing conflict between the law abiding, tax paying citizens and the scum of the earth? Need I ask?

They are busy living in their Inkandla’s, their guarded palaces and their mansions, they are making deals, travelling abroad, attending conferences and spending our money. They are not being attacked in their homes, they are not having their womenfolk raped and mutilated and they are definitely not being mugged when withdrawing money from an ATM. So why should they care?

And yet their time too is running out.

Our mining sector, as with farming and agriculture in general, is going down the toilet whilst the ANC dither about trying to decide whether they need the votes or the income more and whom to please in their relentless pursuit of both.

The mines and agriculture have to automate to save costs – and make profits – and this will necessitate job losses. If they don’t they will be forced to close operations, thus creating more joblessness.

This is a fact of life unfortunately, made more unpalatable for all by the ANC pandering to their supporters and their union buddies – the alliance - making unreasonable demands.

The ANC are therefore stuck between a rock and a hard place: they need the votes and are scared of losing them so they’re attempting to delay the process by forcing businesses to pay more for labour, knowing full well that the end result will be the same – unemployment and unhappy voters.

In effect the ANC are therefore playing a double-sided game, using both business and their supporters in an attempt to delay the inevitable – a meltdown of the South African economy. This all to stay in power!

At the rate SA is going we will soon have no productive – or profitable – mines, farms or factories and we will be another African basket case where mobs, warlords and the scum of the earth rule and our currency isn’t worth the paper it’s printed on.

Does the ANC leadership not realize that they, in particular, will bear the brunt of the mobs anger when this happens? Do they believe that they will be immune to the hatred, violence and barbarism that is slowly engulfing us? Are they that close-minded and ignorant or do they just choose not to care, or see, what is happening whilst they engage in petty politicking and endless money-making schemes?

We are experiencing a complete breakdown of law and order in this country and our standards, ethics and morals are being attacked on all fronts and yet we are worried, scared, and unable to defend ourselves in case we are labelled racists, or counter-revolutionaries. Have we no guts anymore? Have we become so complacent that the murder of the innocents no longer worries us, no longer disgusts us?

Have we become the sheeple we so despise?

The ANC under Jacob Zuma have seemingly chosen the dark path of tribalism, self-enrichment, nepotism and corruption over the modest, enlightened one of being servants to the people who elected them and who pay their salaries. However it is written - and it holds water - that what goes around comes around and they would be wise to consider the following:

Eventually you will run out of taxpayers, you will run out of expertise and you will run out of people willing, and able, to maintain standards. You will be left with nothing but your own kind and then savagery will become the status quo and you too will eventually succumb – whether you have 1 or 10 bodyguards and whether you are a billionaire or merely following your leader.

The mobs by that time will care nothing for your status, your grandeur or your ability to dispense favours and patronage. They will only want your blood.

Thus I would say to the ANC, and Jacob Zuma, that you are mistaken to attempt to instil the fear of ancestors in your people for your successors are the ones who will either make or break this country and you would do well to heed their calls, before they call personally on you.