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A Boer real estate agent in Huitspruit (spelling) told me that it was now safe to buy farms again in South Africa, as long as the property didn't have a land claim on it. As the time for land claims the Gov set up is over. Other South African friends I know say that, yes while that land claim is over, there is nothing stopping the Natives from doing another one, and another one, and so on. Your thoughts would be appreciated. | ||
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My advice is to listen to your "Other South African friends..." They seem to know the worthlessness of the promises of African politicians! But more important, they do NOT stand to make any commission as estate agent should you buy! But in real seriousness, just yesterday I heard a long radio discussion about the need to extend the cut-off date for land claims and to allow claims for would be wrongful government actions to before the traditional date of 1913! The Black Terrorists governing South Africa will do anything and everything to harm whites - just because they can! In good hunting. Andrew McLaren Professional Hunter and Hunting Outfitter since 1974. http://www.mclarensafaris.com The home page to go to for custom planning of ethical and affordable hunting of plains game in South Africa! Enquire about any South African hunting directly from andrew@mclarensafaris.com After a few years of participation on forums, I have learned that: One can cure: Lack of knowledge – by instruction. Lack of skills – by practice. Lack of experience – by time doing it. One cannot cure: Stupidity – nothing helps! Anti hunting sentiments – nothing helps! Put-‘n-Take Outfitters – money rules! My very long ago ancestors needed and loved to eat meat. Today I still hunt! | |||
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this website might be of interest: www.gamefarmnet.co.za Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP | |||
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My advice is to stay away from investing in South Africa. I know of some people who have done that, and got burnt badly. | |||
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Zambia is a better option but the minimum investment requirement is $500,000. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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Several landowners i know in RSA are wanting out. They are hoping for the best-but don't think its gonna be good long term. Before you make any moves look up the genocide of white farmers in South Africa. | |||
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Land 'reform' is still a big political issue here, there is talk of re-opening land claims. Behind the scenes there is talk that foreign land owners and owners of multiple pieces of land may be targeted in future. Interesting enough the guys who lay the claims are more interested in financial compensation than the land itself.... I live here, intend to stay here but I wouldn't buy any rural property for recreational purposes. There is a lot of uncertainty of the political direction that SA is going to take in terms of a free market economy and the sustainability of socialistic government expenditure. My advice is tread very carefully!! | |||
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I am A land owner in South Africa, AND IT IS NOT AS BAD AS IT SEEMS. Yes we might not have the smartest politicians around but then again witch African country has???.The fack that they got Ramaphosa back in the game is great, he owns lots of ranches and is A very big Game rancher him self. Also please tell my Fairgame how is Zambia so much better??I love Zambia and think it is A great place to hunt but dont think it is much better then South Africa sorry. Sorry to hear that your friends lost money in South Africa SAEED in what did they invest? Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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The advice you've been given is well informed and dead right. The entire continent is increasingly adopting a blanket policy of Africa for Africans and they don't want the whites. They might want their money, skills and know how but they don't want them. IMO, land claim and/or expulsion and seizure of property/money either in whole or in part is always a possibility pretty much anywhere on the continent. Proper, permanent residency as opposed to glorified long term visa that has to be renewed is also increasingly hard to get. | |||
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In game farms. | |||
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The less the current government is able to run this country the more they will be looking to shift the blame. One of the ways of getting the press off their backs will be to re-open the landclaims issues because it is "what the majority of the people want". Invest in hunting trips. | |||
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Saeed, was there farms taken away from them?? Guys South Arica has lots of problems, so does the rest of the world, yes we have murders everyday, so does every other country in the world, hell look what is happening right on the door step of the USA IN MEXICO! but there are Countries with much more problems than us. I remain positive and proudley South African! Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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I know the rest of the rest of the world has problems. There are a number of people I know who have invested in South Africa, and every single one has had problems. In fact, some of them want to get out of there if can. Of course, each person has a choice of where to invest, but I certainly won't be investing in a South Africa game farm. | |||
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Saeed what kind of problems did they have? it might be helpfull for other investors in future to know about these problems and maybe find A way around it. Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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A small plot in a gated development with a nice small vacation chalet on it....totally fine. A big block of land with an expensive house? Not on your life! | |||
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Even that carries a degree of risk nowadays. When I lived in RSA, we had a place on a secure golf estate and the residents association used to get occasional letters from various groups making dodgy claims of ownership etc.  | |||
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There was a time when investing in RSA was almost impossible as property value was sky high...then things changed and prices went rock-bottom. Since the man of many virgins has enthroned himself a good percentage of the positive and proud pale-faced South Africans are not so sure of their future - this dilemma is being compounded by a controversial firebrand who appears to be a strong electoral contender. | |||
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I'm not aware of the USA or Mexico suffering attacks such as are reported here, here or here. I fully understand why my white South African friends want to stay in their home country & I don't blame them for feeling that way but new overseas investors who are considering investing or moving to South Africa or indeed anywhere in Africa should know the full story before they invest a cent. | |||
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Holy friggen cow. For the love of Blessed Jesus, the "positive" South Africans, do you not take notice of what is going on here. Before next Christmas, there will be legislation enacted to facilitate the ex-appropiation of farmland at governments determined valuation. The principle of willing buyer / willing seller is gone. This was publically formulated at the ANC conference in Bloemfontein. In this part of the world, the government purchase of farms has ceased, because they say that they are not prepared to pay the price asked for by landowners. There are a number of properties that are good beef production farms and highly intensive green produce under irrigation farms where negotiations have been ongoing for several years, and since the middle of last year, all negotiations have ceased. One of the saddest things to see are the farms that have already been purchased by the State and leased to Black tenants, worked for years to make productive, now reverting back to bush. My old farm is now only concrete floors. Even the bricks have been stolen. The dairy, storage and packing sheds are gone. The lucerne [alfalfa] lands are nothing but wild grass as are the lands that once produced greens. Maybe it is a good thing that some South Africans are positive, but while you have your heads up, look around you and take note. Do youself a favour and check out Shakari's pointers. I'm not aware of the USA or Mexico suffering attacks such as are reported here, here or here. | |||
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STEVE HOPE YOU ARE WELL! PLEASE READ MY POST AGAIN I DID NOT SAY IN THE USA BUT ON THE DOORSTEP OF THE USA IN MEXICO, ARE YOU NOT AWARE OF THE DRUG RELATED MURDERS IN MEXICO?? ANY WAY THIS IS NOT ABOUT MEXICO BUT ABOUT SOUTH AFRICA. AND YES WE HAVE LOTS OF PROBLEMS BUT IT IS NOT AS BAD AS YOU MAKE IT OUT TO BE. I DONT KNOW OF A SINGLE FARM THAT WHERE TAKEN WITH OUT COMPENSATION DO YOU? YES THERE IS LAND CLAIMS EVERY WHERE MOST OF THEM ARE NOT LEGIT, HELL AS FAR AS I KNOW THE AIRPORT IN JOHHANESBURG HAS A CLAIM ON IT AND NOTHING CAME OF IT. AND IN THE END ALL THEY WANT IS MONEY THEY CANT DO ANYTHING WITH THE FARMS THEY HAVE PROVEN THAT. PLEASE GUYS LETS NOT LOOSE HOPE AND LOOK AT THE POSITIVES THERE ARE STILL GREAT HUNTING TO BE HAD!! Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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Phillip, The Mexico and indeed the USA murder situation is crime related but in RSA, it's genocide and there's a world of difference between the two. I agree that until now, land has been paid for but you might like to read the post by my friend Scriptus to see how the times are changing...... Then add on the fact that one day, that mad bastard Malema will almost certainly be President and you should be able to see how things will go. I'm not suggesting RSA isn't a great hunting destination but I am suggesting people from overseas should take a good hard look at the reality of the situation before they consider buying property or emigrating there. | |||
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STEVE, Malema is out of it for good and might even go to jail, I am not trying to get anybody to invest in this country dont get me wrong, but the JSE had its best year last year ever, records were paid for game last year we still had a positive 2,5% grow in the economy that is more than most countries in Europe. Yes I know what the ANC said in Desember I am A land owner and try to keep up with all of this, but the DA party has more support then ever and I still think we are not doomed yet. Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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Malema is out for now and indeed under threat of prosecution but I'll be a pound to a pinch of the brown stuff that he'll not only be back but also President within 3 terms at the very most...... and when he is, he'll make Mugabe look like a saint!  | |||
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Steve, Malema is as bad as it gets agree! "crazy bastard" is a great saying however I think he has made to many powerfull enemies. Lets hope I am right and you are wrong! on A nother note we had some great rain the last month and this part of the world is as nice as I HAVE EVER SEEN IT! come and say HI when you visit RSA again Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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Malema wont be president unless by coup and that is highly unlikely. In the early '90's places like Klaserie and Timbavati had people off loading property at very low prices because SA was going to burn and be destroyed......the guys that bought then have made absolute fortunes and you will battle to get any decent land in either of those areas for much under $4million. There are definitely problem areas where the opposite has happened but if you do your research well there are still great opportunities | |||
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I AGREE 100% MANYATHELO! Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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You wouldn't care to bet a bottle of whisky on that by any chance would you?   Never say never........ especially where Africa is concerned.  | |||
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100%. I would never pay more for something than I was content to lose at some probability over the next decade or two. It would have to work out that I was OK with viewing the money paid as rent over some time horizon. | |||
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Phillip, Me and Steve had our differences in the past, and in some cases some realy heated ones as well. You will NEVER pursuade him otherwise on this topic, with all respect to Steve! The problem with most folks is that they are not realy educated on the this topic. Most of them know only what they ahve been told by their PH's and landowners around campfires, and we know how that goes...... Here is a couple of my own thoughts: 1. Steve is an Englishman, and have lived in South Africa, I believe, since 1991. He therefore does not have the will to believe in our optimism, because he is not one of us. He now lives in Portugal, one of the poorest countries in Europe, and I will bet more than a bottle of whiskey he will be back in England not before long. Home is home. 2. We as Afrikaners have been here for nearly 400 years. Natives and animals have been killing us since those days. The fancy word "Genocide" was just not part of the vocabulary back then, but much so also "political correctness". For us it is just another tragic day in volatile and fantastic Africa. Of course there are the pessimistic doomsday conspiracy theorists that puts all of this down to a master plan by the "terrorist government" to get rid of the white man in Africa. The hard reality is that the finacial brains behind the black upper class in this country does not see it this way, and believe in a united, prosperous South Africa. They just want to poverty line to lift a bit, and you cannot blame them for that. Farm murders have declined with 30% in the last 2 years, and it has all to do with hard criminals being taken out of the system, slowly I admit, but surely. 3. South Africa offers high return on high investment. What people do not know is that some of these long term investment plans in the Game ranching industry offers yields of 25% or more. Where in the world does this type of yield not carry a high risk? What is this risk? LAnd being "taken" by the government? It is a CLEAR policy of the ANC that this will not happen. Now MAlemana proffessed otherwise, but look where he is now? 4.Yes, the constitution of this country states that the ruling party can make chances to it, but they need a 2/3'rd majority in the national assmebly to do it. This has not happened in the past 9 years of the new South Africa, and with our current poloitcal climate cannot see how it will EVER happen. The ANC is clutching at straws to stay in power and keep the party from falling apart. 5. South Africa, I believe (And stand to be corrected), is the only country in Africa where a foreign landowner can still have 100% full title deed on land. It will surely change, but what better security in your investment is there if your South African partner have a VESTED stake in your investment, of say 25%? One that he gave real money for, not just on paper? I know of bad and good business deals, in and out of the hunting industry, between families, friends, and different nationalities. It is all about the parties involved, and if the agreement between the parties had loose ends or not. My neighbour is a Germand gentleman who has had his land now for 13 years. HE purchased it for R3million in 2000. He upgraded the fences, and build a small but rustic lodge that cost about R500,000.00 back then. He also opened up roads and build a dam. Another R500,000.00. So his Game ranch of 9,000 acres cost him R4mil. HE now have a serious offer on the table for R19mil. The farm paid for itself through hunting during the past 13 years, and he never spend another cent on it. So he made R15 mil in the last 13 years in capitol appreciation. His only problems? A dodgey manager for 2 year and some poachers. All that sorted out, got a top notch manager (the last 6 years) and got the poachers to learn the new manager CAN shoot! So all not doom and gloom, and SA should still be a VERY attractive investment proposition to investors! STEVE MATE, DO YOU REALY GIVE MALEMA THAT MUCH CREDIT? REALY? Charl van Rooyen Owner Infinito Travel Group www.infinito-safaris.com charl@infinito-safaris.com Cell: +27 78 444 7661 Tel: +27 13 262 4077 Fax:+27 13 262 3845 Hereford Street 28A Groblersdal 0470 Limpopo R.S.A. "For the Infinite adventure" Plains Game Dangerous Game Bucket List Specialists Wing-Shooting In House Taxidermy Studio In House Dip and Pack Facility In House Shipping Service Non-Hunting Tours and Safaris Flight bookings "I promise every hunter visiting us our personal attention from the moment we meet you, until your trophies hang on your wall. Our all inclusive service chain means you work with one person (me) taking responsibility during the whole process. Affordable and reputable Hunting Safaris is our game! With a our all inclusive door to door service, who else do you want to have fun with?" South Africa Tanzania Uganda | |||
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Oh, and Steve, it should warm our heart that the likes of me and Phillip, still young Afrikaner males, speak with this much optimism, and INVEST our hard earned money into this country. There are MANY like us, in fact, we are by far the majority of the Afrikaners! So, this Southern tip of Africa will not tip as easily as you suggest. We have learned over the centuries to adapt to our situation, quickly! They took Civil service jobs away from the white male in 1994 and onwards. What was the result? The greatest boom in entrepneurship this country has ever seen, and probably never will see again! From a oppertunistic, conservative, white, proud to be Afrikaner, male! Charl van Rooyen Owner Infinito Travel Group www.infinito-safaris.com charl@infinito-safaris.com Cell: +27 78 444 7661 Tel: +27 13 262 4077 Fax:+27 13 262 3845 Hereford Street 28A Groblersdal 0470 Limpopo R.S.A. "For the Infinite adventure" Plains Game Dangerous Game Bucket List Specialists Wing-Shooting In House Taxidermy Studio In House Dip and Pack Facility In House Shipping Service Non-Hunting Tours and Safaris Flight bookings "I promise every hunter visiting us our personal attention from the moment we meet you, until your trophies hang on your wall. Our all inclusive service chain means you work with one person (me) taking responsibility during the whole process. Affordable and reputable Hunting Safaris is our game! With a our all inclusive door to door service, who else do you want to have fun with?" South Africa Tanzania Uganda | |||
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Phillip: Ever heard of Zimbabwe?.....the horn you are blowing is similar to the one that was being blown back there a while ago. Pride comes before a fall - Take heed. | |||
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Charl, You'll lose your bottle of whisky if you ever bet I'll ever live in the UK again....... I hate the damn place, have hated it for decades rather than just years and will be happy if I never set foot there again. I don't credit Malema for anything other than being totally off his trolley. IMO, he's a mad dog and we all know what should happen to those but as sorry as I am to say it, I sincerely believe he'll be President some day and probably within 3 terms at most....... and I'll go even further by saying I believe he's actually being groomed for that role right now and that all the bad publicity he's getting is all part of the grand plan of whoever is grooming him. I truly don't blame the Afrikaaners for being as stubborn as their race has always been and indeed if I were in their position, I'd be equally stubborn about such a beautiful country but should also say that when I count my friends, the vast majority of them are Afrikaaners and my views are far more closely allied to theirs than to the views of the average Brit. However, if you doubt my view that Africa in general and RSA in particular doesn't want whites, you might like to take a look at how the Govt amended the Immigration Act in such a sneaky way as to avoid any vote or publicity on the changes whilst ensuring it's extremely difficult for whites to get PR whilst any black can get it at the drop of a hat. | |||
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MR Futotupu, yes I have heard of Zimbabwe HAD LOTS OF FAMILY THERE. And yes my family lost evrything over there 20 000 accres of land!! What I think the diffrince is the amount of foreign investments in this country. And Charl is correct if he says there is A lot of young people believing in this country. Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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With the Rand at 8.91 to the Greenback, his R15 M equates to $1,683,501-6. Add 13 years of inflation, sell the property, take his money out the country, lose 25% in taxes plus capital gains tax and he has LOST MONEY BIG TIME.  | |||
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God bless you stubborn Africaaners. I sure hope and pray that you are right. I haven't met a one of you I haven't liked and I hope the best for you and your families for another 400 years. If it can be done you lot can do it. In Texas we Texans say " Remember the Alamo ". But I fear Mexico is taking us back one day at a time. It's getting close to time for our rallying cry. . | |||
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Good for you - keep believing! | |||
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Infinito and I also had our differences in the past! But in this case I applaud his posting and attitude on this issue! Wyoming - did you take note of the best advice of all given about this? Pieter Kriel said: Invest in hunting trips. Now that is sound advice!  Kudus for you Pieter! Andrew McLaren Professional Hunter and Hunting Outfitter since 1974. http://www.mclarensafaris.com The home page to go to for custom planning of ethical and affordable hunting of plains game in South Africa! Enquire about any South African hunting directly from andrew@mclarensafaris.com After a few years of participation on forums, I have learned that: One can cure: Lack of knowledge – by instruction. Lack of skills – by practice. Lack of experience – by time doing it. One cannot cure: Stupidity – nothing helps! Anti hunting sentiments – nothing helps! Put-‘n-Take Outfitters – money rules! My very long ago ancestors needed and loved to eat meat. Today I still hunt! | |||
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I just finished reading "When a Crocodile Eats the Sun," by Peter Godwin, a correspondent, native of Zimbabwe and declared enemy of that state. I know South Africa is not Zim, but there seem to be so many similarities in attitudes between the political leadership of the two countries that I would personally be very reluctant to invest in something so permanent as land there. To the Afrikaner descendents who retain their optimism for the future of this rich land, I say God bless you. Many of us are pulling for you and praying for a bright and rational future. There is hope, even when your brain tells you there isn’t. – John Green, author | |||
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I get the idea some people are interpreting my posts on this wrongly. I'm not suggesting RSA is a bad place or a bad place to hunt...... nothing could be further from the truth. All I'm saying is that (IMO) it's not currently a good place for a non resident to invest money in or try to move to. | |||
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