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I wonder the same What would be wrong with several price lists for D&P, freight , tanning price list etc It's like some kinda government secret or god damn boogie man It does piss me off to no end... " Until the day breaks and the nights shadows flee away " Big ivory for my pillow and 2.5% of Neanderthal DNA flowing thru my veins. When I'm ready to go, pack a bag of gunpowder up my ass and strike a fire to my pecker, until I squeal like a boar. Yours truly , Milan The Boarkiller - World according to Milan PS I have big boar on my floor...but it ain't dead, just scared to move... Man should be happy and in good humor until the day he dies... Only fools hope to live forever “ Hávamál” | |||
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You're an idiot Rich. Jerry has class and would rather not be in a pissing contest with people linked to his profession. That's just intelligent. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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I emailed my outfitter and booking agent. Outfitter sent me a full price list for all trophy services. It included d & p, tanning, skull cleaning, and taxidermy. Kind of an a la Carter price list. He also gave me a total average total for the animals I'll take. Looks very reasonable. | |||
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I am happy to name names. Do not use EMIAC or allow your in country taxidermy to use them for your crating under any cicumstance. They shipped me damaged goods at a premium price and refuse to make good on their error. . | |||
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When I first started hunting in Africa, 20 years ago, daily rates, trophy fees, dipping and packing were very affordable and one could go on safari without holding the hand of your banker. As time went on the prices increased almost exponentially. Why? Because we were, and some still are, willing to pay, and those folks in Africa, or any other country for that matter, have you by the cajones. You have to have their services to import your trophies in the United States. No way around it. So, they can charge whatever they want. The very expensive dipping fees are are a tool for the taxidermist. One can avoid the expensive dipping charge if you have your taxidermy work done overseas. Then you have very expensive freight charges to get them here and then you have expensive custom broker fees and then freight charges to get your trophies to your home. All along the way there are folks bleeding you out because you will pay. Well for me, I have taken my last trophy to bring home. I simply have reached the point where I will no longer pay. I took an elephant in Namibia a couple of years back. The only thing I took back was the two tusks. I was quoted a $600.00 fee to dip the tusks. What is involved in dipping two tusks that justified a $600.00 fee? I asked my outfitter this question. He interceded for me and the fee was reduced to $400.00. In my opinion still too high, and on top of that, $400.00 crating fee. Again, they have you by the cajones and you have to pay or forgo having your trophies sent to you. It's not only the dipping and packing charges, it's everything along the way. Governments are getting greedy with the trophy fees, all the extra daily rate charges, visa fees, fees to leave the country, hell one could almost write a book on the subject. There is even some evidence that there are two sets of fees in some countries. One for Europeans that will not pay and one for U.S. hunters who will pay. So, if you are willing to pay and you are fortunate to have the financial resources to cover the fees, there will always be someone who will charge up to the elastic limit. Again, I have reached my limit. | |||
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I'm confused about some of the recent comments re. prices of African hunts increasing over the past years... Granted; in some instances prices have indeed escalated significantly but that is most certainly not the case all around. 13 years ago the going 1X1 daily rate for South African plains game hunts was $350pd... Today it is around $450... So RSA daily rates have increased by 28.6% in thirteen years. Divide that percentage by 13 and you get to 2.2% per year... Not too bad considering inflation and all the other factors that play a role in the cost of doing business... Impala was selling at $350 13 years ago - today they're selling for $450... Another 2.2% per year increase... Is this really so bad? What was a guided Elk hunt in a good area selling for 20 years ago and what is it selling for now? Buffalo was selling for $10K (trophy fee) back in 2003 - today you can find deals for less than that - sometimes significantly less... 7 day Buffalo packages are nowadays commonly advertised for $12K... Same applies to Sable. Where Trophy fees for a Sable used to be around $10K (even as high as $12K) some outfitters nowadays offer these hunts for a little as $6.5K including 5 or 7 hunting days... And of course there are exceptions... Certain animals have become more expensive over the years like for eg Kudu and Nyala but this is not the norm. In all honesty; I fail to understand what the hype is about as far as "ever increasing prices" are concerned. Everything is more expensive nowadays comparing to 20 years ago - not only outside of Africa but also inside Africa. I paid around ZAR3.00 per litre of diesel back in 2003 and today I'm paying more than 4 times that. 13 years ago a new pick-up was around R200K, the one I bought 2 years ago was R500K and is now retailing at roughly R600K. An unreasonable increase in the cost of living and doing business? Yes, maybe... But it is what it is and I don't believe these increases reflect in the prices that are charged by Outfitters now - especially when compared to those charged 20 years ago. And given the above - in all fairness - I don't think that a 2.2% increase in the cost of an African safari is all that out of the ordinary. Regards, Chris Troskie Tel. +27 82 859-0771 email. chris@ct-safaris.com Sabrisa Ranch Ellisras RSA www.ct-safaris.com https://youtu.be/4usXceRdkH4 | |||
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Chris, My big issue with South Africa's hunting industry is not the price for the hunt or the animals trophy fees. My issue is the hidden costs. My first trip to South Africa left me quite unhappy about all the gotchas and gimmes that were built into the system that I didn't find until after I left. Frankly, as someone who had hunted Zimbabwe, Zambia, and Tanzania before I hunted South Africa, it was very upsetting. Dip and pack for a few animals ended up being more money than I had spent for the entire full bag hunt in Tanzania. I went back to South Africa with my eyes open, and so far it has been a different experience. How is it that D&P in Tanzania ran $500 for the whole deal, yet in 2013, my dip and pack just for the Nyala ran more than the whole bill from Tanzania? With Rhino on the list this year, the estimates I am getting are less than half what a few PG animals ran me in 2013. In essence, if I had been a neophyte the first time around, I doubt I would ever have gone back. The second time around has been a different experience. Both operators were promenent companies. So why the difference? Why is it so hard to get this straight? I know that kickbacks and fees are part of the reason, but if SAPS can get a dose of anti corruption, the rest of the system needs it too. | |||
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Sir, I don't know when you hunted in Tanzania but even if I did I can't answer that question other than saying that now - in 2016 - your dip/pack bill shouldn't be more than around $250 for one Nyala - hunted in RSA. Whoever did your dipping and packing back in 2013 screwed you and should be named so everyone on here will know who to avoid doing business with.
Again, I can't really comment. Dipping and packing for a Rhino trophy should be around $555 according to the 2016 Pricelist that I have from one Dip/Pack Company I work with. (I work with several and all are more or less in the same ballpark price-wise) I guess clients should be as careful choosing which dip/pack company handle their trophies as what they are in selecting an Outfitter. I don't believe that kickbacks have anything to do with it but would be interested to hear which dip/pack companies charge such an extravagant amount of money. That way we will all know who to avoid. Regards, Chris Troskie Tel. +27 82 859-0771 email. chris@ct-safaris.com Sabrisa Ranch Ellisras RSA www.ct-safaris.com https://youtu.be/4usXceRdkH4 | |||
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Another point entirely missed here is that most outfitters and agents ONLY quote at the top end and will NOT give you cheaper options. Here is an example. I planned a 7 day Buffalo hunt in Zim a few years ago but could not do it and had to cancel at the last minute. While planning the travel and accommodation and a photo trip etc. I found the various quotes were all in the high mid range. No one would quote me a photo safari for 3 or 4 days at less than $400 a day, plus all the add ons. Yes the resorts were very good etc. BUT I repeatedly told them that I could not afford spending another $2k or $3k after the hunt and was looking for very basic options. But no one was remotely interested in helping me out. I then plodded though the web for days. My brother in Botswana covered the National Park stuff and we did 3 parks for very little money over 8 days. Long story short - I booked a full day dove hunt in South Africa for less than $300 (possible even less than $200). I got a really nice home stay arranged in Joburg for less than $50 excluding food. I found a really nice (not high end) lodge in Vic Falls for under $100 a night - right on the river with hippos walking into the dining area! I saved over $2k by doing all this research and booking by myself. I paid for the food & drinks separately but that was also very good and very reasonable. The other eye opener was the BIG variance in local rates versus what they charge international hunters. I met an owner of a small game farm & he offered me a 57 inch kudu for R7k. At that time that was US$650! The operators wanted $1200 to $1800! They want $300 for a warthog while the locals will sell you one for $50! I think the entire industry needs a revolution with a low tier operator shaking it all up. "When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick." | |||
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Here's the invoice from Spirit of Africa from this May.  Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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Reading this thread makes me want to hunt Africa less and less. Mike | |||
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I wouldn´t worry that much. In general 99,999% of the hunts go well and everybody is happy. Just ask about prices before you say `Yes´ to the package(just like marriage). If trophies doesn´t mean much take good pictures, take a lot of pictures and some more pictures. I would rather spend 4-5more days on african soil hunting, touring around than having trophies. DRSS: HQ Scandinavia. Chapters in Sweden & Norway | |||
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Just received invoices for 2 clients and myself. Average cost per medium sized animal (RSA) $125 for skull/horns & cape. Larger animals average $150-$170 each. This is with a professional service separate from the Outfitters. What will really increase your cost is packaging and crating; Conservation, CITES, TOPS, Vet, & Documentation permits (if you have any CITES or TOPS trophies to export). This Does not include shipping. My 12 trophies: over $2,100 USD in dip/pack, export fees. Gray Ghost Hunting Safaris http://grayghostsafaris.com Phone: 615-860-4333 Email: hunts@grayghostsafaris.com NRA Benefactor DSC Professional Member SCI Member RMEF Life Member NWTF Guardian Life Sponsor NAHC Life Member Rowland Ward - SCI Scorer Took the wife the Eastern Cape for her first hunt: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6881000262 Hunting in the Stormberg, Winterberg and Hankey Mountains of the Eastern Cape 2018 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4801073142 Hunting the Eastern Cape, RSA May 22nd - June 15th 2007 http://forums.accuratereloadin...=810104007#810104007 16 Days in Zimbabwe: Leopard, plains game, fowl and more: http://forums.accuratereloadin...=212108409#212108409 Natal: Rhino, Croc, Nyala, Bushbuck and more http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6341092311 Recent hunt in the Eastern Cape, August 2010: Pics added http://forums.accuratereloadin...261039941#9261039941 10 days in the Stormberg Mountains http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7781081322 Back in the Stormberg Mountains with friends: May-June 2017 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6001078232 "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading" - Thomas Jefferson Every morning the Zebra wakes up knowing it must outrun the fastest Lion if it wants to stay alive. Every morning the Lion wakes up knowing it must outrun the slowest Zebra or it will starve. It makes no difference if you are a Zebra or a Lion; when the Sun comes up in Africa, you must wake up running...... "If you're being chased by a Lion, you don't have to be faster than the Lion, you just have to be faster than the person next to you." | |||
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My $.02 worth: My 2012 trophies arrived in NYC about the same time as Hurricane Sandy. The Feds were shut down for a week, and wanted to charge impound fees for the entire period. Safari Specialty Importers, my import broker, took on the Feds, and told them that their client should not be charged for a hurricane, especially when the office was closed for business. The charges were reduced, and SSI actually saved me more money than they charged for their services. The Wildlife Gallery did the taxidermy work, and upon completion, found a private transporter to bring my shipment to my home in California, set the entire menagerie on my walls, then take all the packing materials with them, all at a very reasonable price. My 2015 trip to the RSA was processed through a RSA taxidermy firm. I inquired about the shipping fees, and was told that the firm had no scale, and would only know the weight when the freight company had received the shipment! Fortunately for me, the freight company used an honest weight. Upon arrival in Los Angeles, SSI cleared the shipment. The local freight company wanted almost $300 to bring the crate 50 miles to my home. I picked it up myself for less than $25 in gas. There are good, honest, and reasonable businessmen in all aspects of what we do as hunters, but as in all things, caveat emptor applies. We have to ask the right questions at the right times about the right subjects. As for the comments about the small inflationary increases in prices, the deflation in currency values of foreign countries has to be considered, not just the change in U.S. dollars. Tim | |||
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Just one more reason why I am happy I got Africa out of my system almost 15 years ago Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I thought my dip and services were excessive at a little more than $220.00 per animal. Granted they were large animals,eland,hartebeest,black wildebeest,and nyala. I did question the charges and my price was reduced by 13% and that made me happier. I would strongly suggest that a potential hunter enquire as to dip and pack charges and if possible get bids and ask for references. Jerry Hoover | |||
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In three trips to Namibia, I've never paid a single penny for Dip & Pack services. My professional hunter, Jan du Plessis of Sebra Hunting Safaris, has a very competent staff that handled all the skinning and skull work. All of my trophies were done European style, with the exception of a Mountain Zebra rug and Warthog Tusks mounted on plaques. My 2015 taxidermy bill for four trophies was a grand total of $528.00 US, plus $52.80 US for packaging and paperwork. This is for a Gemsbok, Blue Wildebeest, Kudu and a Warthog. For all three trips, I've used the Taxidermy Studio & Tannery in Otjiwarongo. The owner, Marlon Beyer, has a published priceless, and there are no extras or add-ons. For two years (2013 and 2015) I used PRONTO for shipping, and their costs were a total of $730 US direct to Chicago. In 2013, I arranged to bring my 2012 trophies back with me as excess baggage. I paid $190 instead of $700+ if they were shipped through a carrier. I think it helps if you have a PH who has a strong relationship with his local taxidermist, in terms of getting fair prices and quality service. I'm heading back in April 2017, but will only bring an Eland back with me if I'm lucky enough to bag one. I'll take lots of pictures of any other critters I bag, since we've run out of wall space for any more mounts. Jesus saves, but Moses invests | |||
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Great post Jerry and a good reminder to place all your ducks in a row before venturing on Safari. In reality one should have many quotes in hand along with contact info in case of a plan b but, through due diligence these "surprises " should be avoided! | |||
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Safari taxidermy 120 us for a tanned zebra hide in dokumentasjon fee  | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting Comments to SA and Namibian PHs and Operators about Dip and Pack Charges
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