DSC- who is going ?

11 January 2025, 00:17

K Evans

quote:
Is the KBHCC issue really a lie or do the TTHA/SCI shows require a smaller venue that they could still accommodate? Also, what could possibly come from a meeting on the current issue between DSC and PHASA?

That KBHCC is going to be remodeled is a fact, that the halls would be unusable this year and in the future is not a fact. TTHA/SCI is using all of the exhibit space with the exception of Hall F, which is upstairs where the gun area was at DSC shows. DSC said the ramp and marshaling yard would be demolished and exhibitors could not enter the hall as normal, neither of which has turned out to be true so far. As of yet, construction has not begun on this project, however; a construction manager at risk was hired in mid November for Phase 1, which will be a remodel of The Academy of Black Arts and Letters, which is located in the very southeast corner of the complex. As of today, no building permits or applications for this project are showing on the COD system (doesn't mean they haven't applied, just that nothing is showing up).
I'm told that TTHA/SCI has a 3 year contract on KBHCC, with an option for 3 more years. If they were to exercise the option it would put them holding a show in 2030, the same year in which DSC has supposedly signed a contract. Might be interesting.
PHASA reps had a meeting with the new CEO of DSC and two board members regarding a lack of accurate communications on the part of DSC, lots of inaccurate info and rumors, apparently. Supposedly, DSC agreed to better communication with exhibitors and committed to better supporting PHASA.

11 January 2025, 00:38

vvreddy

There is a rental scooter location at the main entrance.

quote:
Originally posted by K Evans:
quote:
Originally posted by BushPeter:
How is a 12 minute walk (from reg to entrance) a bad thing for people who hunt in the bush and walk many miles?

Well, if you happen to rely on a scooter to get around large venues (like the person who told me this) and there are no rental scooters available, a 12 minute walk could be a bad thing.

11 January 2025, 02:21

K Evans

quote:
There is a rental scooter location at the main entrance.

Glad they finally got them set up, should help quite a few attendees.

11 January 2025, 03:20

Bwana338

Karl,

Have you heard how the foot traffic has been.

I have read where it is very lite to somewhat busy.

I have seen where a group of Booths have set up on line chat forums for potential customers to chat with Select booths. I just went on and was checking to see if it was real. it appears real and not a fake site.

I am booked for this year and working on 2026. I am not sure after that, with traveling over sea's.

11 January 2025, 05:03

K Evans

quote:
Originally posted by Bwana338:
Karl,

Have you heard how the foot traffic has been.

I have read where it is very lite to somewhat busy.

I have seen where a group of Booths have set up on line chat forums for potential customers to chat with Select booths. I just went on and was checking to see if it was real. it appears real and not a fake site.

I am booked for this year and working on 2026. I am not sure after that, with traveling over sea's.

I’ve heard varying reports on attendance, most said yesterday was very, very slow to dead, today seemed to bit a bit better, but some of the outfitters messaging me have said it’s not very good, at best. Someone at DSC put out that they had 45,000 pre-registered attendees, (I’d call BS on that), but the weather kept most of them away. I’m sure the weather plays a big part in the attendance equation, but I’m equally sure there were not 45,000 pre-registered attendees. I’d like to be proven wrong, that would be a good thing for hunters if true and the money raised was put to good use.

11 January 2025, 10:10

Saeed

quote:
Originally posted by 505 gibbs:
Is the KBHCC issue really a lie or do the TTHA/SCI shows require a smaller venue that they could still accommodate? Also, what could possibly come from a meeting on the current issue between DSC and PHASA? Is someone going to make it stop snowing? You made your decision, paid your money, placed your bet, shit happens, make what you can of it.

I think they do have a point!

They were promised a venue accessible to lots of clients.

Did not work.

Money back!

I love it how the SASHES MANAGEMENT is doing!

Ruining what once was a great organization!

11 January 2025, 20:27

PAGuardian

After multiple flight cancellations all day yesterday and early this morning we had to cancel our plans to go to the show today. We are pretty bummed but you can’t control the weather.

The outfits I know report that things have been slow because of the weather but they seemed upbeat overall.

11 January 2025, 20:35

larryshores

quote:
Originally posted by PAGuardian:
After multiple flight cancellations all day yesterday and early this morning we had to cancel our plans to go to the show today. We are pretty bummed but you can’t control the weather.

The outfits I know report that things have been slow because of the weather but they seemed upbeat overall.

I have seen a bunch of weather videos from Atlanta. It is pretty nasty .

11 January 2025, 22:06

Todd Williams

After saying we weren't going, Austin and I tried to go on Thursday and Friday but our flights were canceled both days. We had to back out as a result.

I'm not happy with the lies and current direction of DSC anyway so we are going to SCI instead.

11 January 2025, 22:35

PAGuardian

quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:
quote:
Originally posted by PAGuardian:
After multiple flight cancellations all day yesterday and early this morning we had to cancel our plans to go to the show today. We are pretty bummed but you can’t control the weather.

The outfits I know report that things have been slow because of the weather but they seemed upbeat overall.

I have seen a bunch of weather videos from Atlanta. It is pretty nasty .

Yesterday, I killed several hours in the Pittsburgh airport watching the radar and livestream videos of the weather in Atlanta. Definitely nasty conditions, especially for a southern city. I was hopeful that we would make it out on one of the 2 early flights on Delta this morning but they got cancelled around 2 AM. While frustrating, I must say that everyone we spoke with from the Delta staff was very accommodating and did everything within their power. It just wasn't meant to be this year but can look forward to next year.

11 January 2025, 23:40

Hannay

Like Todd, I planned to fly out Thursday and fly back Friday. But on Tuesday, American Airlines offered to let me change my flights, and looking at the weather, I flew on Wednesday. That part of the plan worked well. But thanks to the weather yesterday in Atlanta, my return flight Friday night was cancelled, and I couldn't get rebooked until tomorrow (Sunday). So I've been to the show for much of three days.

From a participant standpoint, the show was great. While it wasn't dead (most of the time), it wasn't heaving like a typical DSC show in Dallas. There were a lot more opportunities and time to talk to people. I bought at auction an Alaskan black bear hunt. Eurooptics had some pretty good show specials.

I'm sure for a lot of the exhibitors it was disappointing, though. It's impossible to know how much of the decrease in attendance was due to location and how much was due to weather.

And for Saeed - I never saw anyone wearing SASHES!

A few photos from the show are below.

11 January 2025, 23:43

K Evans

Heard lots of stories today, none good. Some exhibitors have already left the show, there was another meeting this morning and meeting had to be halted due to upset outfitters, not only about the weather. Some said they cancelled their booth for next year.
Some outfitters have already left, one said the TSA precheck wait at the airport was an hour and forty five minutes. The regular TSA line wait was over 3 hours!
Went to the TTHA/SCI show in Dallas, though not packed was pretty busy, hard to walk down some aisles. Spoke with several of the African and Douth Pacific outfitters, some had done very well with past clients coming to book, some said was sort of slow but had booked a couple of hunts. I think this show will be much, much bigger next year, with more of the “regular” outfitters exhibiting.

12 January 2025, 01:34

DCS Member

Today has been much better at TTHA/SCI. People are upbeat and having fun. We have had a lot of interest. Our bookings for Argentina dove hunting typically come 2-3 weeks after the shows once everyone coordinates, as we want at least 6 hunters to have exclusive use of the lodge. It’s not like old DSC shows, but better than our main booth in Atlanta.

12 January 2025, 02:12

larryshores

quote:
Originally posted by K Evans:
Heard lots of stories today, none good. Some exhibitors have already left the show, there was another meeting this morning and meeting had to be halted due to upset outfitters, not only about the weather. Some said they cancelled their booth for next year.
Some outfitters have already left, one said the TSA precheck wait at the airport was an hour and forty five minutes. The regular TSA line wait was over 3 hours!
Went to the TTHA/SCI show in Dallas, though not packed was pretty busy, hard to walk down some aisles. Spoke with several of the African and Douth Pacific outfitters, some had done very well with past clients coming to book, some said was sort of slow but had booked a couple of hunts. I think this show will be much, much bigger next year, with more of the “regular” outfitters exhibiting.

Leaving the show early? They had to be really unhappy to do that.

12 January 2025, 02:19

TNTBR

Spoke to three outfitters today attending the show and they flat out said they won't be back next year as it is that far off what they considered even close to normal attendance.

12 January 2025, 02:54

Wesheltonj

I would love to know who sold the lie to DSC board to move the show to ATL for 5 years. If TTHA is at KBH for the next five years, sounds to me like the KBH is not being torn down, but just a remodel.

The question is will DSC still be around in five years or be the size of HSC.

12 January 2025, 04:28

Neil A

Talked to an african outfitter today who is at the show (one many of you know), if I bought a hunt over the phone today it would've been their first sale...very slow traffic. Weather is weather though.

Looking forward to SCI in Nashville.

12 January 2025, 07:05

Saeed

And for Saeed - I never saw anyone wearing SASHES!

I think these are reserved for TOP MANAGEMENT!

12 January 2025, 07:06

Texas Blue Devil

We were at the Atlanta show all day Thursday and Friday, a half day on Saturday.
All three days were very light. We were at the doors when they opened at 9AM this morning. In Dallas there is normally a couple hundred people waiting to get in. At 8:55AM this morning, I counted 14 people waiting to get in.

Today the tone shifted to anger with a lot of the outfitters, especially the smaller outfits. We talked to a well known fishing lodge (with a double booth) today at 10:30AM, they hadn't any visitors to that point.

What really angered a lot of the outfitters that we met, was that they did not meet many (if any) new people. Most said what few visitors they had, were existing clients. Several PH's mentioned,....on the bright side... it was nice to have some time for longer chats with their existing clients. Three different PH's told us that this was the first Dallas show that they got to spend time walking around the show floor. A lot of the foot traffic around the Atlanta floor was exhibitors that would normally be in their booth.

We also heard complaints from some retail vendors selling art, boots, jewelry and clothing. One of the art retailers said that in Dallas he normally sees 12 to 15 Amex Black cards during a show, but he had yet to see single one in Atlanta. I didn't even know what an AMEX Black card was until today.

Maybe the show gets better next year, but I definitely believe some of this year's exhibitors, especially smaller outfits, will not be back in Atlanta next year.

12 January 2025, 07:51

larryshores

Well, the move was a stupid idea. Likely driven by ego. While I am 100% certain the weather did not help, I am also 100% certain that the powers that be failed to understand one major point . Most people going to SCI traveled . Most people going to DSC drove .

I can forgive the stupidity . I cannot forgive the lying .

It will cost millions to break the contracts in Atlanta .

Apparently there is an interesting development which I believe to be true . I’ll let some else post it .

Out of all the people I heard from , a single exhibitor was satisfied with their results . One!

12 January 2025, 07:59

Trackman

Just an FYI show very poorly attended. The snow and ice were definitely a factor.why not just have it in Vegas.

12 January 2025, 08:10

Texas Blue Devil

quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:

I can forgive the stupidity . I cannot forgive the lying .

I agree completely on the lying. Stupidity is irritating, but forgivable. Lying I cannot tolerate.

12 January 2025, 08:12

Texas Blue Devil

quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:

Out of all the people I heard from , a single exhibitor was satisfied with their results . One!

That's one more than we heard about...... and we talked to a lot people because we are considering 3 different hunts.

12 January 2025, 08:33

Bwana338

quote:
Originally posted by Trackman:
Just an FYI show very poorly attended. The snow and ice were definitely a factor.why not just have it in Vegas.

If it were in Las Vegas I would have went. About the same distance Dallas as to drive or Fly to Las Vegas
.

12 January 2025, 10:20

DCS Member

The fallout post show will be massive. There was already pushback before the show, but there will be much more. I’ve heard the buyout is $5M.

Yes, weather was likely a factor, but I remember the PR campaign about how many licensed hunters were with X radius of Atlanta and about the safety.

I also received the recent Foundation report. Didn’t they actually publish P&L and Balance sheet at one point?

12 January 2025, 10:32

larryshores

quote:
Originally posted by DCS Member:
The fallout post show will be massive. There was already pushback before the show, but there will be much more. I’ve heard the buyout is $5M.

Yes, weather was likely a factor, but I remember the PR campaign about how many licensed hunters were with X radius of Atlanta and about the safety.

I also received the recent Foundation report. Didn’t they actually publish P&L and Balance sheet at one point?

It is normal and customary to publish financials. Anyone is entitled to see them forms 990 that were filed.

Personally, I think the liar should be identified and forced to resign or be removed.

12 January 2025, 17:37

505 gibbs

quote:
One of the art retailers said that in Dallas he normally sees 12 to 15 Amex Black cards during a show, but he had yet to see single one in Atlanta.

Ahh yes, safari club members status symbol of choice…

12 January 2025, 19:00

dogcat

Not bashing any of this or DSC. At the end of all it, the bottom line is that DSC, ScI, RMEF, DU and all of the other “critter” businesses have to make money. They make it without physically making a tangible product or service. They all make money on “donations” of expendable excess income from their “customers”, of which - we are them.

The exhibitors give income generating services/products to these groups to sell. These groups “sell” memberships (not a tangible asset), they host events (again not tangible), they ask for donations for the “cause”.

At the end of it all, these groups are not terribly big in terms of money, yet they have boards and sizable staffs. They rely on volunteers for grunt labor.

These are not goo d business models and are often not run by business people but biologists or PR folks.

It is no wonder they get in the mess DSC now finds itself.

To dig out, look at what SCI did and how they did it. The old guard wrecked SCI, they then retooled and dug out. DSC may need to do the same.

It is a business not a hobby. Run it that way…

12 January 2025, 19:06

dogcat

As to perspective, I ran a large drilling operation for an oil company. A single well drilled in West Tx or East Tx would cost $10 to $15 million with an expected rate of return of 50%. We had a team of a dozen or so folks managing this investment. We had 10 of these happening at any given time. There was tremendous effort put into each well.

The entire budgets for SCI or DSC or REMF would not match what was spent on one well and we drilled 50-75 per year.

What I am saying is that managing anything of substance requires skills that not seen in many of our critter companies. I suggest that the critter companies rethink how to run a real business- non profit or not.

12 January 2025, 19:07

K Evans

quote:
Originally posted by DCS Member:
The fallout post show will be massive. There was already pushback before the show, but there will be much more. I’ve heard the buyout is $5M.

Yes, weather was likely a factor, but I remember the PR campaign about how many licensed hunters were with X radius of Atlanta and about the safety.

I also received the recent Foundation report. Didn’t they actually publish P&L and Balance sheet at one point?

I hope for DSC sake the geniuses in charge bought insurance for this eventuality, I know in the past such insurance has been bought.
I’ve heard a rumor that DSC is going to buy out the remaining 4 years of their contract…and move to San Antonio (where, according to DSC, the convention center was being remodeled and therefore unsuitable). Just a rumor at this point.
There is an email floating around that outlined the penalty for cancellation, around $1M per year, that is a lot of money.
News Flash…DSC just put out an announcement that they look forward to seeing everyone in Atlanta next year (all 5,000 of everyone

).

As to who the liar might be, I believe he posted on one of the threads right after this move was announced. Weather played a big factor in the apparent poor convention, but it didn’t have a damned thing to do with the logic behind this idiotic move. In my opinion, about three people pushed this idea and got backing from a few others (I was told that the vote to move was unanimous but also told that was not true), I’m sure blame will be coming and an obvious target will be the recently departed CEO, easy target and probably deserves some blame. I’ll be shocked if the main culprits take any responsibility, I think there should be some resignations over this or be voted out in the upcoming members meeting (which really isn’t a members meeting since they don’t allow attendance in person and speak or allow members to view the “election” process. Maybe this will change, I’d sure like to attend and voice my opinion.

12 January 2025, 19:25

MJines

quote:
Originally posted by K Evans:
quote:
Originally posted by DCS Member:
The fallout post show will be massive. There was already pushback before the show, but there will be much more. I’ve heard the buyout is $5M.

Yes, weather was likely a factor, but I remember the PR campaign about how many licensed hunters were with X radius of Atlanta and about the safety.

I also received the recent Foundation report. Didn’t they actually publish P&L and Balance sheet at one point?

I hope for DSC sake the geniuses in charge bought insurance for this eventuality, I know in the past such insurance has been bought.
I’ve heard a rumor that DSC is going to buy out the remaining 4 years of their contract…and move to San Antonio (where, according to DSC, the convention center was being remodeled and therefore unsuitable). Just a rumor at this point.
There is an email floating around that outlined the penalty for cancellation, around $1M per year, that is a lot of money.
News Flash…DSC just put out an announcement that they look forward to seeing everyone in Atlanta next year (all 5,000 of everyone ).

As to who the liar might be, I believe he posted on one of the threads right after this move was announced. Weather played a big factor in the apparent poor convention, but it didn’t have a damned thing to do with the logic behind this idiotic move. In my opinion, about three people pushed this idea and got backing from a few others (I was told that the vote to move was unanimous but also told that was not true), I’m sure blame will be coming and an obvious target will be the recently departed CEO, easy target and probably deserves some blame. I’ll be shocked if the main culprits take any responsibility, I think there should be some resignations over this or be voted out in the upcoming members meeting (which really isn’t a members meeting since they don’t allow attendance in person and speak or allow members to view the “election” process. Maybe this will change, I’d sure like to attend and voice my opinion.

Just as an outsider looking on, what I find confusing about the talk of the need for regime change is that there was in fact a regime change last year. You had a good portion of the board resign, the executive director resign, the incoming president withdraw, etc. Now they need to have another purge? Obviously DSC is having some major internal problems. Maybe someone needs to do a flow chart to help explain all these twists and turns.

12 January 2025, 19:34

larryshores

quote:
Originally posted by 505 gibbs:
quote:
One of the art retailers said that in Dallas he normally sees 12 to 15 Amex Black cards during a show, but he had yet to see single one in Atlanta.

Ahh yes, safari club members status symbol of choice…

Not true. Amex has to invite you to get a black card

12 January 2025, 20:17

Wesheltonj

quote:
Originally posted by K Evans:
quote:
Originally posted by DCS Member:
The fallout post show will be massive. There was already pushback before the show, but there will be much more. I’ve heard the buyout is $5M.

Yes, weather was likely a factor, but I remember the PR campaign about how many licensed hunters were with X radius of Atlanta and about the safety.

I also received the recent Foundation report. Didn’t they actually publish P&L and Balance sheet at one point?

I hope for DSC sake the geniuses in charge bought insurance for this eventuality, I know in the past such insurance has been bought.
I’ve heard a rumor that DSC is going to buy out the remaining 4 years of their contract…and move to San Antonio (where, according to DSC, the convention center was being remodeled and therefore unsuitable). Just a rumor at this point.
There is an email floating around that outlined the penalty for cancellation, around $1M per year, that is a lot of money.
News Flash…DSC just put out an announcement that they look forward to seeing everyone in Atlanta next year (all 5,000 of everyone ).

As to who the liar might be, I believe he posted on one of the threads right after this move was announced. Weather played a big factor in the apparent poor convention, but it didn’t have a damned thing to do with the logic behind this idiotic move. In my opinion, about three people pushed this idea and got backing from a few others (I was told that the vote to move was unanimous but also told that was not true), I’m sure blame will be coming and an obvious target will be the recently departed CEO, easy target and probably deserves some blame. I’ll be shocked if the main culprits take any responsibility, I think there should be some resignations over this or be voted out in the upcoming members meeting (which really isn’t a members meeting since they don’t allow attendance in person and speak or allow members to view the “election” process. Maybe this will change, I’d sure like to attend and voice my opinion.

That San Antonio was being remodel is BS, that was finished a years ago. The mayor does want to add another floor to the convention center, but that takes a vote of City Council and a bond issue. Not going to happen, as they also want a bond for a new Spurs area at Hemisfair were the Institute of Texas Cultures currently resides. And another bond for a new minor league baseball stadium in downtown SA. Now of course San Antonio airport is small and now starting construction of a new terminal and passenger entry.

Back to DSC, I understand that DSC and Safari Classics are no longer working together. I wonder what the expense will be for the new ad agency to get folks to ATL next year and where their ad buys will be. Certainly not on a SCI show TV sponsored show from Safari Classics. I really don't understand the decision making at DSC.

13 January 2025, 05:53

DCS Member

There has been a complete loss of transparency with DSC. It really is sad to see and experience. I started going with my father shortly after the inception of the club when the “convention” was held by the airport.

I just got home from the TTHA/SCI convention. We also had a booth in Atlanta. We will expand our footprint here in Dallas for next year.

Other outfitters with booths at both shows echo what we experienced. There was a hoodwink and some under the table BS with the move.

That whole PR campaign about Atlanta was just posturing. We will hear about the weather being a factor. We have had ice storms in Dallas over the years, but the shows were still just fine.

As indicated by my handle and tagline, I once loved DSC. I don’t know what it is now. I believe it has become what it tried to avert being when it split from SCI long ago.

13 January 2025, 05:54

Saeed

Is this the New DSC?

SASHES INCORPORATED??

Presenting Outstanding Hunter Achievement Award?

Or this just SELF GLORIFICATION?

Does NOT sound like the old DSC we have all come to know!!

13 January 2025, 05:56

K Evans

quote:
Back to DSC, I understand that DSC and Safari Classics are no longer working together. I wonder what the expense will be for the new ad agency to get folks to ATL next year and where their ad buys will be. Certainly not on a SCI show TV sponsored show from Safari Classics. I really don't understand the decision making at DSC.

Might be speaking out of turn, but I’m pretty sure Safari Classic's and SCI have signed a partnership agreement, Tim and Dave can (and have) produced some awesome content. I hope that continues. I have seen some online content for DSC that appears to have been produced by Ackerman-McQueen (of NRA fame), several years ago DSC employed them, but fees got astronomical and we ceased doing business with them. I guess the current leadership might see things differently?