quote:

Originally posted by llamapacker:
A two day pass to DSC this year was $25. There is no membership required. No other fees needed to attend.
They also sell single day passes, and four day passes at roughly the same rates. I purchased two day passes so I am certain of that cost. I think the single day pass was $15, and the 4 day pass was $40.

A whole lot cheaper than SCI.

Bill

I believe that is right. If you wish, you can buy a combination membership and four-day pass if you are not a member. It is a pretty good deal if you wanted both already. It is not required.

Kids 12 and under get in free. I noticed complaints about kids at hunting shows in one of these threads, but my kids enjoy it and behave well in public.

Let us not forget that the SCI Convention by design is a fund raiser for and by members. For those of you who are not members, the cost is not be your concern. It is a private organization. If you want to attend, become a member. If you are a member and I wish all hunters were, the degree to which you support the organization is up to you.


I have never attended the Dallas show only because I can drive to Reno in three hours. Reports indicate it is a fun time.

DOJ - I have no problem with the Eastern Sportsman Show aka Harrisburg Show, even Bubba needs a show to attend!!!

Larry Sellers

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
Crazy, it is like some people look down on the Eastern Sportman Show, because it has alot for the "common man/woman" i e whitetail, turkey and bear in the eastern part of NA. Not all of us can afford African hunting, but I piont out it is cheaper than many hunts in the western US and Canada. There is room for all at the table from the Big Five hunters to the varment hunters and that refers to the cost not the value of the hunt.

lamapacker - It seems in this post and many others here "cheap" is your sole criteria for judging whether something is good or not?? Why not just stay home with your ego and pretend you went to a show?

Larry Sellers

quote:

Originally posted by llamapacker:
A two day pass to DSC this year was $25. There is no membership required. No other fees needed to attend.
They also sell single day passes, and four day passes at roughly the same rates. I purchased two day passes so I am certain of that cost. I think the single day pass was $15, and the 4 day pass was $40.

A whole lot cheaper than SCI.

Bill

Both the SCI and DSC conventions are about fund raising. They both go about it differently - as they are different.

SCI's Mission Statement:
Safari Club International is the leader in protecting the freedom to hunt and in promoting wildlife conservation worldwide.
Providing value to members by shaping policies and legislation that protect the freedom to hunt locally, nationally and internationally.


Keeping members informed regarding issues that impact hunting while educating and entertaining members with engaging articles about the rich heritage of hunting in all forms of media.


Providing a community for hunters worldwide where camaraderie is enjoyed and expert information is exchanged, and where members are able to participate in a market for quality hunting goods and services.


Promoting a positive image of hunters and portraying them as responsible citizens who fund wildlife conservation, education and other programs which benefit the community.


DSC's Mission Statement:
“The mission of the Dallas Safari Club is to conserve wildlife and wilderness lands; to educate youth and the general public and to promote and protect the rights and interests of hunters worldwide.”

Very little overlap between the two. Most of DSC's monies go towards youth education. DSC pays for a state recognized curriculum in select public school systems. One of the schools archery classes went to the national competition on their first year of competition.

The thing to remember is there is room for both organizations and both need support.

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
lamapacker - It seems in this post and many others here "cheap" is your sole criteria for judging whether something is good or not?? Why not just stay home with your ego and pretend you went to a show?

Larry Sellers

That post and the "our show is for members only and it is none of your business what it costs" help explain why some people see SCI as an elitist group.

No doubt they do a lot of good. But a bad attitude and moves like trying to "punish" DSC do not help their image.

[/QUOTE]
That post and the "our show is for members only and it is none of your business what it costs" help explain why some people see SCI as an elitist group.

No doubt they do a lot of good. But a bad attitude and moves like trying to "punish" DSC do not help their image.[/QUOTE]

Can you verify the "punish" statement? Who said it?

Or this just another internet rumor started by "someone" who overheard it "somewhere" and repeated by those who want to be part of something? Not trying to stir the pot here but if that was actually stated by an officer in the organization a lot of explanation would be in order.

quote:

Originally posted by JBoutfishn:

Can you verify the "punish" statement? Who said it?

Or this just another internet rumor started by "someone" who overheard it "somewhere" and repeated by those who want to be part of something? Not trying to stir the pot here but if that was actually stated by an officer in the organization a lot of explanation would be in order.

This is where I saw it:

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
mrlexma - I agree totally with you that we don't need two shows a week apart in Dallas.

The major International exhibitors at SCI were told last week that the move to Dallas would be in 2013. In the meantime they were told, two more years in Reno, possibly the next year in Vegas, Reno my pick up this third year, then Dallas. Most likely after that it would be a flipflop between Vegas and Dallas everyother year. I heard from several internal sources that the intent is to indeed punish DSC.

I to feel this kind of move will eliminate DSC as a major player and that would indeed be a loss to all of us. As I stated before, don't really think you can compare the two shows, it's just my thing to never attend any kind of Convention in Dallas. End of story.

Larry Sellers

I should start this post by saying that I am a life member of SCI and that I believe in its central mission.

But I think the SCI's motives for the pending move to Dallas are suspect at best. Why would SCI schedule its convention - in Dallas -within a week or two of the Dallas Safari Club's show? Is that even remotely necessary? Dallas will definitely lose exhibitors, and I think many of them. That translates into lost income. That translates into a weaker DSC.

Is that good for hunting? No. SCI should not do this, IMHO. Many SCI members (and many exhibitors) have said so in writing and in person to the SCI board. All apparently to no avail.

There is much else that I find wrong about SCI and its aims and effects. In particular, the emphasis on the rule book and the attempted transformation of hunting into some kind of competition among status-seekers is repugnant to me.

As an example, I was at the final dinner, the one where Justice Scalia spoke. (As an aside, his speech was excellent. He is a great advocate of hunting. He indicated that he enjoys hunting birds, as well as small and big game. He has a head and shoulder mounted bull elk trophy in his chambers at the U.S. Supreme Court.)

I find that the worst thing about SCI dinners is the way they are engineered to glorify the SCI elite. They try to turn the event into some kind of Academy Awards of hunting.

There are exceptions. One guy, and I remember that Mike Rogers was his name, was given an award for his years of service to SCI and to the promotion of hunting. I remember his name because he was extremely humble and self-effacing, very funny, and by all appearances, just a nice guy. I applauded his service and his down-to-earth attitude.

Right after the service award was given to Mike Rogers, some blowhard got up behind the podium and huffed that SCI was a HUNTING organzation and was about recognizing GREAT HUNTERS, not service. I couldn't believe he had said that right after the presentation of a service award.

In introducing the winner of what he claimed was the most important and prestigious award the SCI gives (some kind of international "hall of fame" nonsense), Mr. Blowhard announced that the winner of this year's award had taken 260 SPECIES, was now forever ensconced in SCI's pantheon of hunting immortals, and on and on, etc., ad nauseam, ad infinitum.

It was all I could do to sit through this BS so that I could finally hear Justice Scalia's speech.

My point is that there is a hell of a lot wrong and objectionable about SCI.

Still, SCI does a tremendous amount of good for average, everyday hunters and hunting in general. So, like many others, I put up with the BS for the sake of the greater good.

Note - I did not say the intent of moving SCI to Dallas was to punish DSC. I said I heard several people in the inner circle if you will talking about this subject. This may or may not be the intent of the true policy makers of SCI? If some are talking this tune one would expect it to be more than just idle chatter. Hopefully cooler heads will prevail, only time will tell.

Larry Sellers

quote:

Originally posted by Charles_Helm:

quote:

Originally posted by JBoutfishn:

Can you verify the "punish" statement? Who said it?

Or this just another internet rumor started by "someone" who overheard it "somewhere" and repeated by those who want to be part of something? Not trying to stir the pot here but if that was actually stated by an officer in the organization a lot of explanation would be in order.

This is where I saw it:

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
mrlexma - I agree totally with you that we don't need two shows a week apart in Dallas.

The major International exhibitors at SCI were told last week that the move to Dallas would be in 2013. In the meantime they were told, two more years in Reno, possibly the next year in Vegas, Reno my pick up this third year, then Dallas. Most likely after that it would be a flipflop between Vegas and Dallas everyother year. I heard from several internal sources that the intent is to indeed punish DSC.

I to feel this kind of move will eliminate DSC as a major player and that would indeed be a loss to all of us. As I stated before, don't really think you can compare the two shows, it's just my thing to never attend any kind of Convention in Dallas. End of story.

Larry Sellers

Mrlexma, well said.

I do not pretend to understand what makes the SCI leadership tick, but their motive for moving the show to Dallas seems pretty tranparent to me. It appears to be little more than an in-your-face type maneuver designed to try to show the DSC who the big kid on block really is and to force dollars out of DSC coffers and into SCI coffers -- and to perhaps try and permanently weaken DSC. There is absolutely no justification for doing two shows in Dallas weeks apart. If they were really looking to move the show to a more central location, they could have gone to San Antonio, Chicago, Kansas City, Denver, lots of other places.

Mr. Helm - obviously you don't have much of a sense of humor, sorry that you can't tell a TIC from a good old bashing.

Larry Sellers

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
Mr. Helm - obviously you don't have much of a sense of humor, sorry that you can't tell a TIC from a good old bashing.

Larry Sellers

Actually, I have a pretty good sense of humor.

as an SCI member who loves having the convention in Reno (5 hour drive), I am also perplexed by the moronic antics of the leadership. I don't do Dallas either, so they will miss me, right?

I like the "members only" aspect of the convention, I can just imagine the hordes of "tirekickers" collecting catalogs and pestering exhibitors, and wanting to "just touch" every animal mount, and the screaming gangs of teenagers phoning/texting each other as they cruise the aisles side by side by side, etc.

Reno was worth the drive to me for a couple of reasons.
1. I got together with my PH guys and looked at when I might go this year if the $$$ is there.
2. I got a better chance to shop prices.
3. I met the people at Fauna & Flora and found out the new regs allow my Buffalo skull and hides to be shipped to my front door and arranged to have that done.

As an aside, I am acquainted with Craig Boddington, and had a visit and a chance to get his new book "Leopard".
The casino hotels offer rooms as low as $39.95, and the Sierra Grande had a free shuttle to and from the show every half hour.

Rich
Buff Killer

OK

quote:

Originally posted by Charles_Helm:

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
Mr. Helm - obviously you don't have much of a sense of humor, sorry that you can't tell a TIC from a good old bashing.

Larry Sellers

Actually, I have a pretty good sense of humor.

Well said IS - Glad to see I am not the only one here who doesn't like tire kickers and kids at a "hunting show'. I go to have a good time but also try to conduct some legitimate business in an atmosphere condusive to such.

Larry Sellers

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
as an SCI member who loves having the convention in Reno (5 hour drive), I am also perplexed by the moronic antics of the leadership. I don't do Dallas either, so they will miss me, right?

I like the "members only" aspect of the convention, I can just imagine the hordes of "tirekickers" collecting catalogs and pestering exhibitors, and wanting to "just touch" every animal mount, and the screaming gangs of teenagers phoning/texting each other as they cruise the aisles side by side by side, etc.

Reno was worth the drive to me for a couple of reasons.
1. I got together with my PH guys and looked at when I might go this year if the $$$ is there.
2. I got a better chance to shop prices.
3. I met the people at Fauna & Flora and found out the new regs allow my Buffalo skull and hides to be shipped to my front door and arranged to have that done.

As an aside, I am acquainted with Craig Boddington, and had a visit and a chance to get his new book "Leopard".
The casino hotels offer rooms as low as $39.95, and the Sierra Grande had a free shuttle to and from the show every half hour.

Rich
Buff Killer

Thank you Charles , I am going to see how far I can go to nail this down because if true, it sets a very bad precedence. The last thing all hunters need is a match between each other.

If true, as a long time member I will have to consider my options. In the mean time I am going to chase some Bass

quote:

I like the "members only" aspect of the convention, I can just imagine the hordes of "tirekickers" collecting catalogs and pestering exhibitors, and wanting to "just touch" every animal mount, and the screaming gangs of teenagers phoning/texting each other as they cruise the aisles side by side by side, etc.

Funny I have not noticed this at DSC. I guess since I did not book a hunt this year I am just a tire-kicker and not worthy to attend these shows...

quote:

I like the "members only" aspect of the convention, I can just imagine the hordes of "tirekickers" collecting catalogs and pestering exhibitors, and wanting to "just touch" every animal mount, and the screaming gangs of teenagers phoning/texting each other as they cruise the aisles side by side by side, etc.

You got to be kidding me. Some how I don't see this happening Sorry, going fishing.

Jim, even if SCI's motives are pure - which I doubt - no one can deny that moving the SCI convention to Dallas - and holding it within a week or two of the DSC show - will result in more direct and pointed competition with DSC for exhibitors and attendees - and the money they bring to these organizations.

Is that anything we need? I say no.

About 40 years ago I heard a slogan; (Take your son hunting and you will never have to hunt for your son). Every individual I have known that included their children in this endeavor has raised a solid happy child. I think this speaks volumes as to a life long passion you can share with your children. My son has always accompanied me at these show and is my greatest hunting partner. He is about 22 years old and is planning his hunting agendas into the future. Although he cannot afford everything he wants to do at this stage of his life, it allows him to dream. Albiet he is well mannered and along side me. I believe the introductions of children to these shows can be very enlightening and educational.
Take your kids hunting! They are the next generation; I think the guides and vendors would like to see them. They could be their future customers.
As far as your childs behavior? Look no further than in the mirror.

EZ

eez - At 22 years of age I would hardly call your son a kid. I think IdahoSS and myself are referring to the teenagers and under who have no real interest in what is happening at a hunting show and just see it as a place to hang with friends and the really small ones 2 to 7 who usually need a nap and fed rather than being dragged around by oblivious parents. No problem introducing young people to our hunting world whatsoever.

Larry Sellers

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
About 40 years ago I heard a slogan; Take you son hunting and you will never have to hunt for your son. Every individual I have known that included their children in this endeavor has raised a solid happy child. I think speaks volumes as to a life long passion you can share with your children. My son has always accompanied me at these show and is my greatest hunting partner. He is about 22 years old and is planning his hunting agendas into the future. Although he cannot afford everything he wants to do at this stage of his life, it allows him to dream. Albiet he is well mannered and along side me. I believe the introductions of children to these shows can be very enlightening and educational.
Take your kids hunting!

EZ

It just seems really odd that SCI would pick Dallas when so many other options are out there. Everyone knows my pick is stay in Reno, but the Dallas thing has so many political implications. I have never received anything specific about where best for a SCI convention other than the annual "after convention survey" we usually get. Maybe a poll of members is in order on something this important?

Larry Sellers

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
Jim, even if SCI's motives are pure - which I doubt - no one can deny that moving the SCI convention to Dallas - and holding it within a week or two of the DSC show - will result in more direct and pointed competition with DSC for exhibitors and attendees - and the money they bring to these organizations.

Is that anything we need? I say no.

Larry,

He is 22 now but he was tagging along with me when he was 6; fetching doves as I was with my father at the same age. I know what you are referring to and understand completely.

EZ

Larry, my son is 38 and he is still my kid and will be till death parts us. Yes he is a responsible adult with kids of his own but I was his old man when I was his age and am still his old man now in my 70s.

quote:

Originally posted by Charles_Helm:

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
lamapacker - It seems in this post and many others here "cheap" is your sole criteria for judging whether something is good or not?? Why not just stay home with your ego and pretend you went to a show?

Larry Sellers

That post and the "our show is for members only and it is none of your business what it costs" help explain why some people see SCI as an elitist group.

No doubt they do a lot of good. But a bad attitude and moves like trying to "punish" DSC do not help their image.

Larry,

The mention that one show costs less than another certainly seems to get under your skin. The elitist attitude you portray is exactly why so many people find SCI objectionable.

As far as your assertion, quite the contrary is true. I do not find that just because something is more expensive that it is necessarily "better". I've hunted Africa with a variety of outfits, from the pricier to the "cheap". In general, there was little correlation between the price and the quality of the hunt. The type of snobbery that insists that an African trip can't be any good unless you drop $100K in Botswana or Tanzania is offensive. I'll enjoy my full bag Tanzania trip, but not because I am thumbing my nose at those in Zim and RSA. I'll happily return to hunt those countries as well.

Bill

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
Now Bill, we must be inclusive.

The more I read the harder it becomes.
Bill

The Hell with Reno 2008 flew there and got stuck and cost me a ton of money there so, 2013 Dallas and 2014 thru 2016 SCI is moving to Pennsylvania...

So Larry you can now fly or drive to Pennsylvania and I will have a two hour drive to the Convention... Now I have a short drive and will cost me alot less money...

Mike

Mike has a very valid point. There have been many years when the weather stranded virtually everybody.

larryshores - I have attended, flew in and out, to every SCI Show held in Reno and have NEVER been stranded there for even a minute. There have been some times with a little wind and snow in the mix, but stranded??

retreever - If you can indeed get SCI to move to Penn. I'll fly on up that way no problem. I am glad that you could drive to the Show and save big bucks. As stated, I just won't go to Dallas, so Penn, no problem. My only experience in Penn. was at a NASCAR race there years ago.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Mike has a very valid point. There have been many years when the weather stranded virtually everybody.

My four year old daughter greatly enjoyed the DSC show--twice! She insisted on seeing what she calls the "Africa Show" and getting to visit with my "Africa Man" (ph I hunted with last year, whom, I might add, she met at last years show). I don"t recall being oblivious at any point, even after a couple of beers, nor did I notice her annoying anyone. She did get more freebies than I did, which annoyed me!!

Frankly, I wish I'd seen more children in attendance...

Shoot Retreever,
Don't you know that getting there is half the fun! Missed seeing you this year since I didn't do Dallas.
Rich Elliott

Seriously, based on all the posts on the subject at hand it seems we have the perfect situation. We have a lot of people who like the "member only" aspect, massive fundraising effort (increased daily rate), more exhibitors, adult attendees, glitzy banquets and speakers, basically more of everything at the SCI Convention as well as the "open to the public"(kids are welcome), lower daily rate, smaller venue, less exhibitors, large AR get together, at DSC. So there is no real reason for us all to get uptight about this, simply attend the Show that best suits your needs, interests and financial expectations.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

I forgot to mention-I also took my 5 month old son----The Horror!!!

On Saturday morning, I can drive 55 minutes to the airport, arrive there at 6:00 a.m., board at 7:30, fly non-stop to Dallas and be at the show when it opens at 10:00. ($20 weekend ticket). Do my thing all day, go to the AR party, sleep for less than $100 bucks ($74 this year), attend Sunday until 3:00 p.m. and be back in my bed by 11:00 p.m that night.

Including airfare, I spent about $400. Heck, I'd have spent about that much joining SCI and paying the gate at Reno.

Larry why are you being so sensible, you take all the fun out of these diatribes.

Larry

Members only is relative. Anyone can become a member "on the spot" in Reno ... for "a few dollars more".

Judge how the Hell did you get that rate? You did stay at the Days Inn didn't you?

quote:

Originally posted by Scott Vanderhoef:
My four year old daughter greatly enjoyed the DSC show--twice! She insisted on seeing what she calls the "Africa Show" and getting to visit with my "Africa Man" (ph I hunted with last year, whom, I might add, she met at last years show). I don"t recall being oblivious at any point, even after a couple of beers, nor did I notice her annoying anyone. She did get more freebies than I did, which annoyed me!!

Frankly, I wish I'd seen more children in attendance...

Gentlemen, I am a member of SCI and have been almost since it's beginning. SCI does a mountain of good for hunting worldwide, there is no denying that fact. In all the years I've been a member of SCI, I have never attended one of their conventions. I could have attended them easily because I fly almost free on most airlines worldwide. However I think the exclusionary, and elitist attitude, is a little over the top at SCI. The gate is ridiculous, and I believe the exclusion of children at any hunting convention is shooting your own foot. The young children are hunting's future.

I have never missed a DSC convention since they started, and like everyone else I had to travel 650 miles, and stay in hotels, and because I was usually bringing several rifles with me I drove that 650 miles when I could fly free! My youngest of four kids is now 45 yrs old and all four were raised around firearms, and hunting, and all are shooters today, because of that fact, and their attendance in the shooting, and hunting shows all their lives.

I agree that SCI, DSC, and HSC are all important, and all have some positive effect on the hunting community, but if I could prove it, I think the kids returning to school, and talking to the other kids, and showing them pictures of their trip to the hunting show, does more long term positive effect on the future of hunting than all the black tie dinners in all the shows.

I say support both, but also go where your kids, and grand kids are welcome! As I said earlier, the kids are hunting's future!

Larry Sellers:

There has been more than once that everything was shut down due to the snow. It doesn't happen every year but it happens.