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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting Ever Share a Camp With An Obnoxious Client?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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Someone who has absolutely no business even hunting? | ||
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Absolutely! We hunted one time in SA and in the lodge at the same time was a professional bass fisherman, along with his wife/girlfriend. He spent most of the time in the lodge belittling one or the other or both. A real ass. Karl Evans | |||
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I am not sure if the blame should be placed on the outfitter or the client. I hunted with two ranchers in SE Namibia in 2005 that were just getting set up. They hunted in the Kalahari and in the Khomas mountains. I shared a camp with a guy from Spain and his wife. Lovely couple, but they had done a lot of African hunting typical places; Zambia, Botswana Tuli Block, Tanzania in the Selous and a couple places in South Africa. He owned 4000 hectares of olives and we happened to live within 100 miles of one another in Spain. I barely spoke Spanish, and the couple spoke very little English. The PH's were both Afrikaaners one who had from South Africa before Namibia and South Africa had split and built ranches. The other one of them was farming on his families ranch that he had grown up on. They had spent considerable funds turning their ranches in the Kalahari into game ranches, but they weren't very spectacular in scenery or lodging. That and they hadn't really ever stopped cattle ranching, they didn't know how to be a PH first and rancher 2nd. My PH spent a lot of time with me in the truck fixing fences and water (necessary, but drop me off at a water whole so I can at least hunt while you have the trackers run back to the ranch house to pick up tools instead of wasting an entire day. It was my first ( and only safari), though I have been on 5 guided hunts in Europe and North America since then. The Khomas was pretty spectacular but I hunted the end of the season, and they had the place shot up pretty well by then. Their own properties in the Kalahari were not much better. All of this was a constant source of problems between the two PH's and the Spaniard. To the point he brought me in to try and explain the issue. No one should volunteer to do something like this. This was a rookie mistake. As a first safari it wasn't bad for me. We weren't friends, they made no attempt at good humor and they were really droll. The situation with the Spaniard made it worse. Once they finally took the Spaniard and his wife to Uppington to catch an airplane things got a lot better. By the end I wouldn't say I was sad to miss them, but the wife of the other PH was very pleasant and kind to me. My own PH's was ok. I shot 14 big game animals, and another 14 small game animals (foxes, cats, skunks and dassies and so on). I saw a lot of Namibia, and it was all new and wonderful to me. Had been in the Navy for something like 10 years at the point of the safari. I was 30 years old and had lived all over the world and travelled quite extensively. Africa wasn't a shock to me, it was wonderful. I was also single, and had no way of knowing that it would be so long (got married again, typical worst financial decision of my life, and we have 3 wonderful children together) since I got back. Finally at the point that it is planning time again. Looking through the camera of 17 years ago. I can tell you I have a clearer picture of what I expect, when I head back. There is no way to protect yourself from being in a camp with a fool. You have to do the best you can to not look in the mirror and see one. A lot of people on here have type A personalities and very little travel experience. Everything in the world doesn't move at Dallas time or San Francisco time or Chicago Time. It moves at Africa time. You hope for good experience, good food, and nice trophies. If you can get two of the three on any hunting trip you are doing well. If you get all three you should be thankful. I have lived in Spain, Australia, Greece, Italy, Germany, Djibouti, Afghanistan and Turkey. Some African nations are in worse shape than Turkey bordering on Afghanistan. Some are just slightly better than Djibouti, and some are better managed that Italy, Greece or Mexico. So far I have travelled to South Africa, Namibia, Djibouti, Ethiopia (in the Danakil never to town), Egypt and Morocco. Assholes exist everywhere I don't know how you avoid having one in camp unless you don't travel. | |||
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Yep. The jackass was simply obnoxious every morning, noon, and evening. Not to mention, several nights he tried to talk his way into his booking agent’s chalet at 2-3 in the morning. I could easily hear his clumsy attempts at seduction. Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP | |||
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None in Africa. I hunted in Europe with someone who is banned from AR. I was glad we were staying in a hotel and could control who I interacted with. simple rule - if someone is banned from ar - stay away for them in all activity- hunting fishing buying or selling gear ect. Mike | |||
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We had a pro fisherman in Argentina once and he was a real rick with a P. I wonder if it was the same guy, or if it is just commonplace... I meant to be DSC Member...bad typing skills. Marcus Cady DRSS | |||
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Been in camp with folks who have been obnoxious asses, but not that I felt they had "no business hunting;" just that I wish they (or I) were "somewhere else." In particular when the outfitter asked me (and the other guests) to not say anything political because this fellow was politically active. | |||
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If any of the PHs on here that I've hunted with chimes in, they're liars! Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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Not in Africa but on a Caribou hunt in Nunavut we had two long range hunters in camp. Every time we saw a animal from camp they bragged they could make the shot. Every time they went out they degraded the guide when they got back to camp. The bad part out of the 14 Caribou shot theirs where the smallest and worst heads. Member NRA, NFA,CSSA,DSC,SCI,AFGA | |||
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You might like to do a search here for MIKE BOYD, and you will know what I mean. Normally clients meet undesirables at camp. We normally book the whole camp for ourselves as a group. In this instance, I am afraid I was the guilty one for bringing him in, which turned out to be a total disaster. I will relate the highlights story later on. | |||
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I'm not one to complain, and I will not be doing so here. I have been on over 60 hunting trips, most of them guided, and could count on the fingers of one hand how many truly obnoxious people I have had to share a camp with. Most of my money I spent on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted | |||
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Wife..........now ex wife!! Billy, High in the shoulder (we band of bubbas) | |||
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Was with a guy in the Selous could not hear and had buck fever 4 buf at 30 yds or less and could not shoot. Then told us how he and a friend shot a cow elk in Wyoming and tied it to a pole and carried it out. Wife kicked me under the table to shut my mouth. Mike | |||
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Only been on guided hunts in Africa so no complaints ( I could but it wasn’t so bad after all your stories ) " Until the day breaks and the nights shadows flee away " Big ivory for my pillow and 2.5% of Neanderthal DNA flowing thru my veins. When I'm ready to go, pack a bag of gunpowder up my ass and strike a fire to my pecker, until I squeal like a boar. Yours truly , Milan The Boarkiller - World according to Milan PS I have big boar on my floor...but it ain't dead, just scared to move... Man should be happy and in good humor until the day he dies... Only fools hope to live forever “ Hávamál” | |||
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On my second brown bear hunt in Russia, I had convinced my two best friends to go along. They were friends with each other as well. First day, Jim accidentally allowed his muzzle to sweep Steve while riding in the old Russian transport they used to get us to the hunting area. This happened while they were sitting side by side, holding their rifles with muzzles up. We went over a big bump and Jim's rifle slid left while Steve rolled right. The muzzle just swept Steve for a fraction of a second and was completely unintentional and with guns unloaded. For some reason, Steve turned into Dr. Jeckel / Mr. Hyde and went off on Jim, berating him in front of the guide and other hunters riding in the transport. The berating went on and on until Jim had enough and threatened to whip Steve's ass on the spot. I spent the next 7 days in camp, and the 3 day plane trip home, including an overnight in Moscow and Chicago, with those two not speaking to each other and both getting mad at me for speaking to the other. Absolutely miserable. I had known each of them for years. They had known each other for years. I'm friends with neither of them today. An absolute disaster. But I did get a good bear! | |||
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Which is exactly why I don't have pals along anymore. Similar situations have happened every time. I never want to feel like a babysitter. I have a travel companion now that is my substitute Father. We met fishing in Brazil and have formed a fantastic relationship. He doesn't hunt but just likes to go. He's 73 years old and probably my best friend. Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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I guess group trips (as compared to the random sharing of a camp with someone you did not know) can be a feast or famine event. I have done several group hunts/fishing trips with a number of folks on AR, i.e., Tim Herald, Russell Marshall, Butch Begnaud, Mike Burke, Casey Terry, Rob Jolly, Guy Gorney, Bob Schofield, Tom Niederer. They have all been fun. The only obnoxious client they had to put up with was me. Mike | |||
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42 years , and counting, in the guiding/hunting business with many personal trips overseas as well. If you keep an open mind Jerks are few and far between. You can't always ignore them but you don't always have to let them ruin your trip. Over the years a few of the biggest PITA hunters have morphed into real friends. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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In all of my trips, I have had a few "entertaining" experiences. In Namibia about 20 years ago, other clients showed up. They were from Germany and spoke no English. At dinner, everyone was jabbering in German except us. We spoke no German. They all proceeded to get rip roaring drunk. One walked straight into the swimming pool and the temperature was in the 20's. I used to pool skimmer to drag this guy out. In the Omay another PH showed up with his client. The PH was a total ass. The client was just as bad if not worse. One of the things I recall is that he accused the staff of stealing his baseball style hat. He made a big scene and left no tips. Later that night they called to say he had found his hat in one of his bags. it was embarrassing to be around this guy. | |||
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My wife and I were to have exclusive use of a camp for an entire 15 day hunt when the PH asked if it would be ok for another hunter to join us for a couple of days. He was very clear we did not have to, but we did not mind, at least then. Turns out to be an older client with a young girlfriend who would disappear for long periods of time with the client’s PH. It got a little rowdy in camp one night. Thankfully they were there only a few nights. The truly sad thing was the client killed a nice elephant and nobody seemed to enjoy the experience. Other than that I have been fortunate, although there was the time spent with mjines, bwanamrm, begno, and Tim Herald..... | |||
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On one of my first pheasant hunts in Idaho we went with my boss and a few workmates. We didn’t get any birds and in the way back, my boss levels his shotgun at a chickadee sitting on a fence wire and blows it into oblivion. “Had to kill something.” He said. I decided at that moment never to hunt with him and avoided him at work the best I could. Sometime later I found out that he was embezzling money and equipment from the company we worked for (using special orders as a front). When he was caught and they were going to arrest him, he walked into his bathroom and blew his brains out. | |||
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The trick is not to share a camp. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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This is one of the things I have appreciated hunting with Andrew. In four safaris with Andrew, I and my wife & friend have been the only hunters in camp. The only exception in one of those four was when Andrew asked if his PH friend could hunt with his client on Royal Kafue with me and my wife, as Zambia had not opened the Luangwa Valley yet, but the client was already booked for the week before Parks & Wildlife would allow hunting in that region. Andrew made it quite clear that I could say 'no' and that would be the end of it. My wife and I welcomed the new hunter, and we all had a great time as the PH and client were both gentlemen. The client was our own AR member, Mike Burke. I have been in other African camps where some had very obnoxious clients and a few with PH jerks. I guess that's just sometimes part of the safari 'experience', but nothing to make me not want to return. If I don't like the PH, I simply move on to other outfitters. For the most part, the majority have been wonderful and memorable. | |||
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[/QUOTE]We had a pro fisherman in Argentina once and he was a real rick with a P. I wonder if it was the same guy, or if it is just commonplace...[/QUOTE] Marcus, This jerk was from Georgia, but it may be commonplace...I was at a meeting once with a well known pro fisherman in attendance, had a couple of TV shows, too. He was a real ass. Karl Evans | |||
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Ralph is a helluva nice guy!  Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP | |||
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We had a pro fisherman in Argentina once and he was a real rick with a P. I wonder if it was the same guy, or if it is just commonplace...[/QUOTE] Marcus, This jerk was from Georgia, but it may be commonplace...I was at a meeting once with a well known pro fisherman in attendance, had a couple of TV shows, too. He was a real ass.[/QUOTE] This guy was from Florida, I believe. He tried to get too friendly with the massage girls. The list of bad guys we’ve had is fairly long and there is only so much you put up with and have to smile to a certain extent, especially when they are guests of really good clients. We really smile when we put them on our van back to the airport and make sure they are not future clients. I meant to be DSC Member...bad typing skills. Marcus Cady DRSS | |||
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I think, my story is going to be tops here. From every angle. We planned a plains game hunt in South Africa, with several friends. We had a member here who sounded like he was a good man down on his luck. He claimed he loved hunting, and the only thing stopping him was that his wife was suffering from a serious disease. Walter had to cancel coming, so I asked this character - Mike Boyd - no secret of this as his name has been all over the hunting forums, and people are aware of him. Best part was he started posting on several hunting forums of his incredible exploits, before I even mentioned anything had happened with him!!?? He was booked to travel with two of my very good friends from the US - who have hunted with me before. We arrived a day later in South Africa after them. First indication was of Mike not being what he claimed to be came from my two American friends. They basically never got on with him in the plane, as he was being rude to everyone, including the cabin staff. "Just an asshole" was their description. He had 2 or 3 - I cannot remember - custom rifles. He was assigned a PH all by himself, so he can have full enjoyment of his hunt. It turned out he could not shoot worth anything to save his life. He kept missing, and wounding animals, and was incapable of following them, having his PH go and finish them off. Back at the camp, he took over all conversation, telling us of how great his hunt was that day - apparently, what he was telling us was so far removed from the truth, his PH looked at him in total amazement. later on saying "was Mike talking about our hunt?" Whenever he shot a smaller animal than anyone one else, he insisted on going out and shooing a bigger one - despite the fact he had already shot one of that species. Peter Harris, the PH who we were hunting with, asked me if I wanted him to stop him. I said no, as I told him originally that he can shoot whatever he wanted. This continued for two weeks. He asked Peter to get his trophies to a taxidermists, and gave him his credit card. Payment was declined, so he got no trophies. I normally get all our friends trophies done, but in this case I told Mike he has to pay for his own. He went back home, and started posting nasty comments about Peter Harris. That is when I got involved, and told the real story. So imagine, someone paying your safari, from leaving home to getting back, without costing you a penny. And making a real asshole of yourself. | |||
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Arrived in camp on the Zambesi to find there was a Russian couple already there on a full bag hunt. I was pleased to hear there was an American arriving in a couple of days because then I thought I would have someone I could relate to and communicate with. The Russian and his wife turned out to speak good English. He said he was a tax lawyer in Moscow. I asked what the top rate of income tax was in Russia to make it worthwhile for High Net Worth Mafiosa to employ a tax lawyer and make him wealthy enough to enjoy a full-bag hunt. He said 6%. I have paid up to 50% in my time without thinking it worthwhile employing a tax lawyer and fighting it. He said "You don't understand Russians do you?" I agreed that was so. The lawyer said that even if the tax rate was 1% he would still get rich. Russians would pay him double their actual tax bill just to avoid paying it! Anyway, we got on well and his wife was charming. One morning while the camp manager was working in her office a female leopard walked past her door. She carried on working until she heard the Russian lady scream. The Russian was sitting on her verandah throwing fruit to the monkeys when the leopard leaped over her head from the roof onto a monkey, killed it, then jumped back over her onto her roof and away. Under the circumstances screaming seemed reasonable. I came back from collecting Impala for leopard bait the next evening and the American had arrived. He had a cheap double rifle and an old fancy Californian style, thumbhole stocked bolt rifle with a 1960's 3-9 scope. I remarked that was a fancy looking rifle and he replied "Boy, I can shoot Blesbok at 700 yards with that rifle." I do a bit of long range shooting myself when it is unavoidable but I don't use a 300 yard rifle for the job. That evening we were sitting around the campfire waiting for the Russian to return from down river when we heard the boat coming and the monkeys started chattering. My PH, Richie, stood up and remarked that the monkeys were saying they had got a leopard. We all trotted down to the landing to see them unloading a lovely big leopard. The camp staff began their dancing and I looked around for the American. He was still sitting by the fire with his back to us so I went back to encourage him to come and have a look and join in the party. He grunted that it was just a leopard and not worth making a fuss over. I looked at him a bit sideways and rejoined the party. His PH, Mark, went back to keep him company. I thought it a bit weird not congratulating a fellow hunter and showing no interest in a lovely cat when he was there on a leopard hunt himself. Apparently the problem was that he had been told he would have exclusive rights to hunt down-river but no one had told the Russian's temporary PH, Len. The following evening I overheard Mark telling Richie that he was having to shoot the American's baits for him. While driving up the airstrip I asked Richie how accurate the tachometer was on his Toyota. Very accurate. Passing the "No shooting" sign which was about the size of a buck I asked Richie to drive on 700 yards and then look back at the sign. We stopped and I gave the trackers my binos so they could see the sign and told them that the American shot antelope at that range. They had, of course, talked to Mark's trackers about the bait-shooting failures so they roared with laughter. The next evening we got back to camp late but Mark and his client still hadn't come in. They had gone to sit over a bait only about a mile away. About an hour after dark they returned and the American disappeared. Mark told Richie that they were sat in the blind when a big male leopard came but it was getting too dark to shoot. Mark told his client not to shoot and they would come back in the morning. The next thing he knew the client picked up his double rifle and had a crack at the cat. The leopard jumped, not fell, out of the tree. Mark left his client at the truck and followed the cat up in the dark with a light. He jumped him after 50 yards and the leopard growled. He followed again for about 100 yards and the leopard was not happy. Mark, wisely, turned back. The client was very upset and worried that the Hyaenas would get his trophy in the night. Richie said that we couldn't let Mark follow up the cat on his own again so the following morning we went with Mark back to the blind. The Russian and his PH, Johny, came too so we were mob-handed. When we found where the leopard had spent the night not far beyond where Mark had left him, the Guinea Fowl were calling not far in front of us. At this point the American said that his back was hurting too much for him to carry on so he returned to the truck leaving us to track his leopard for him. The cat stopped just in front of us and left a steaming pile of healthy looking shit. Just a comment! He was using all four legs but not putting much weight on his back left from the tracks in a sandy river bed. He the entered a huge area of long grass which you had to push your way through. This was not good and eventually the trackers lost him as by now there hardly any blood. We gave up and went back for breakfast. The American was not happy we had given up. Two of the trackers stayed behind to work around the long grass in the hope that the cat had come out of it. While eating we got a call on the radio and we rushed back. One of the trackers had seen the tip of a leopard's tail hanging out of a warthog's hole so he stuffed a big log up the hole to keep him in. Unfortunately there was a second entrance and apparently the cat bounced out like a jack-in-the-box and ran. Beside the hole was a fragment of bone. Thin, with a hollow on the inside. Obviously, a lower leg bone. Now there was no blood trail at all and the cat was back in the acres of long grass. It seemed unlikely that he wouldn't recover from such a wound so when the trackers lost him again we gave up. The American was angry that we hadn't recovered his leopard for him and offered no apology to the Russian or me for us loosing a day's hunting on his behalf. At least we had the experience of following up a wounded leopard which is not something you ever get to do if you can shoot moderately straight. He flew out the next day despite having a buff and croc still on his license. He left no tips for the Africans who had risked their lives on his behalf. Unlike the Russian, he was no gentleman and I hope he has given up hunting as he could bring the whole sport into disrepute. Totally obnoxious! | |||
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What, no mention of Russell E. Taylor? A veritable Nimrod such as he should not go unremembered! Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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Ah yes. And who was the one who claimed to be a veteran, got his hunt paid for by kind members of this forum, and he turned out to be a classical liar?? | |||
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Saeed, that does take the cake. I shared camps my first two trips to Namibia and while all were pretty good guys, decided never to share a camp again. Only exception was a day of overlap with a family from Columbia who were on their way out when I was on my way in. I actually enjoyed that. They were really nice folks, but our hunting didn't overlap. Guess I've been lucky listening to the stories. But, I'll stick to not sharing a camp and the last thing I ever want to do is share a camp with a friend unless I grew up hunting with them and I don't have any of those left. We very well might not be friends at the end of it. So I've always dodged those propositions. I'll stick to a solo camp. I think Andrew got that right. Call me anti social. | |||
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We were hunting in Matetsi, and another client was arriving the day after us. Somehow they asked if they can arrive earlier, and Roy asked me if that was acceptable. He was a repeat client too. I thought as Roy was asking, we will not have any problems, and they will only be there for one day before we leave. He arrived with his mother, and we got on very well indeed. Wonderful people. In fact, we still keep in touch. The thing is most people get on well together, regardless of nationality or walk of life. It is the real zonkie idiots who go out of their way to make life miserable for themselves, and others. We go on holiday to all sorts of places, and I tend to talk to everyone, despite my daughter telling me not to talk to stranger!  Then she tells all her friends that "everyone knows my daddy! He tells them jokes no one dares tell, and they laugh so much!" | |||
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Agreed! ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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Saeed, That's an incredible story. It reminds me of the saying "no good deed goes unpunished ". The treatment he gave the flight crew was very telling. I've found that how people treat others who they perceive to be below their station in life is a good indicator of a person. Everyone should be treated with kindness and respect. At least until they have proven that they don't deserve it! | |||
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Karl Evans | |||
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. Never intentionally shared a camp with strangers. Many trips with family and friends and a couple of AR group hunts where we had not met everyone personally before but exchanged texts and mails. All great. Trip to Kyrgyzstan 2019, there were 4 Latvians sharing camp unbknown to us in advance . They were ok'ish other than they went into our room and took and drank a bottle of gin one of the nights that we fly camped. My better half told me to ignore it. Fortunately they did not touch her champagne otherwise I am sure it would not have been "ignored". Clearly acceptable in Latvia to take a strangers alcohol without asking or offering to pay for it! Always try to stay away from sharing camps. My theory being my hunting trips and time are too valuable to me to start introducing variables that could rock the boat and spoil the trip! . "Up the ladders and down the snakes!" | |||
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Yea, I forgot, you guys met him. It was in that camp we met. I think it was ~2013. He always wants to go on my hunting trips. As long as its not a mountain hunt, he will always be welcomed. As traveling companions, we always fight over the bill. Respect one another's space and watch out for each other. I told him to take care of himself because we're going to Masaailand in 2022. He can barely contain himself. Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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I have learned the hard way to never share a camp and to always get that clear before I book. Brian IHMSA BC Provincial Champion and Perfect 40 Score, Unlimited Category, AAA Class. | |||
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MJines, From watching your Tim Herald videos you hunt with a great group of guys and the outfitter/ph is first class. I only hunt with friends who will laugh at my jokes. IHMSA BC Provincial Champion and Perfect 40 Score, Unlimited Category, AAA Class. | |||
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If we expand this to places other than Africa, I indeed have some horrible experiences, especially in Argentina. We duck hunted in Argentina a few years back. There was a group of 3 American guys from some place I can't remember. Two were okay. One was a serious problem. He drank way too much. He was always loud and obnoxious . He started arguing with my wife about what I did for a living. On dove hunts down there, we have encountered groups that I hope to never see again. Absolute jack asses. Absolutely unacceptable behavior. I'll leave it at that. | |||
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