I don't know if this particular video has been posted before. The hunter pretty much somes it up in the few final seconds.

Video link
16 yards

The hunter is AR's Wombat and the PH is Alan from C&M Safaris.

thought i recognised that Searcy!

Very nice.

I have a confession.

I have hunted for many years but as I get older, I am losing my will to pull the trigger on such magnificent animals. I would really like to take a buffalo but I find that I just don't have any desire to take any of the cats and everytime I see one of these videos where someone is shooting an elephant, when the great beast tumbles to the ground, I am filled with nothing but sadness. Don't get me wrong. I am not going anti-hunting. It's just that it's not for me. I don't know it that makes any sense or not.

Dave

Dave, you are not alone. I feel exactly the same way about elephants and lions.

I wouldn't mind taking any of the Big 5

everyone has their line.

Personally I'm not big on any predator hunting (bears, big cats etc...) I just don't see the point. Shooting anything over bait makes me pretty peeved. I'd rather have a spectacular photo. I'd put elephants and rhinos in the same category.

Others will disagree and I'm not one to tell them what they like (as long as it is legal and done is a decent manner (whatever that means)).

Not wanting to start a debate on ethics or anything but yeah Dave, you're not alone.

My fondest dream would be to go to Africa and be able to shoot Cape Buffalo till I got tired of it.

As far as the rest of the Big Five are concerned, I could care less about shooting any of them.

For those that enjoy the thrill of the stalk and the closeness of the action, My Hat Is Off To Them.

Elephants scare me to death. I am amazed at just how big and powerful they are. I would love to hunt the cats as they are another preditor.

I think as one grows older, the desire to kill slowly decreases. I have seen it with several big time hunters, towards the end they shot just birds or wildboar and that was it!

I have gone off shooting anything small, like cats, jackals, foxes, small pigmy antelope, just don't seem to have the heart for it!

Reddy375, I think I'm starting to feel what you just described. The kill is becoming the least favorite part of my hunt.

I absolutely LOVE hunting elephant... one of the world's great sporting challenges when tracked on foot. Mile after long mile, you truly earn your trophy. And there is nothing that compares to being in amongst a herd in the bush for a pure adrenaline rush!

quote:

16 yards Elephant and 500 N.E. Video

quote:

I have a confession.

I have hunted for many years but as I get older, I am losing my will to pull the trigger on such magnificent animals. I would really like to take a buffalo but I find that I just don't have any desire to take any of the cats and everytime I see one of these videos where someone is shooting an elephant, when the great beast tumbles to the ground, I am filled with nothing but sadness. Don't get me wrong. I am not going anti-hunting. It's just that it's not for me. I don't know it that makes any sense or not.

Dave

quote:

by TEMBO
Dave, you are not alone. I feel exactly the same way about elephants and lions.

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
My fondest dream would be to go to Africa and be able to shoot Cape Buffalo till I got tired of it.

As far as the rest of the Big Five are concerned, I could care less about shooting any of them.

For those that enjoy the thrill of the stalk and the closeness of the action, My Hat Is Off To Them.

Like Crazyhorse, I will never tire of hunting Cape Buffalo, but trophy elephant are out of my financial level, on a fixed income, of retirement! However that is the only reason I don't hunt them! The elephant is no different from a cape buffalo,or any other game animal, in the need for it to pay it's way in this world.

The fact that these animals are valuable to the people of the countries where they live, and compete with the locals for space and food. HUNTING is the foundation of the elephant's long term existance on this Earth. An animal that is as destructive as the African elephant, that is not valuable to the locals, will be removed, and replaced with goats, and cattle, along with sadza fields. Once that happens, the land will never again hold elephant, or any other large animal that are crop raiders, or dangerous like the Buffalo, lion, and Leopard, who prey on the locals live stock, eat their gardens, and them.

They are valuable to the locals,because they supply seasonal jobs, the meat is shared by the local people, and also the garden is safer. This fact tends to make the locals stop poaching, because he gets the meat anyway, and pay for working for the safari co. The safari companies in the field hold down wholesale poaching, especailly of ele, and rhino. If elephant were rare, then they wouldn't be on quota, and the quotas are not even close to hurting the ele as a species. Any one who tell you hunters are hurting the populations of African elephant, are simply talking about something they know nothing about, or are simply lieing! If you can afford it, and truley want to help all game in Africa, or anyplace else, then hunt them, because you will be doing the species a big favor!

The fact is large animals like elephant are a real threat to the locals, and their numbers need regulating. The foreign trophy hunter of ele are the salvation of the animal's existance as a whole. For example the country of Botswana only allow the taking of about 1500 or so, elephant each year, and that doesn't even keep up with the birth rate of elephant, and doesn't put a dent in the thousands of ele population in Botswana alone. Large, or small, the harvest of a percentage of animals, pays the way for the rest to be protected, and supplies a very protene poor people with not only jobs,but meat, that the only other way they can get is by poaching! The Disney thought process that makes one animal REGAL, and the other a varment, is basiclly flawed, and is pure sentemental slush. The value of life for a bull frog is no less important to him, that the life of an ele is to him!

Just the other side of the question of Should we hunt elephant? OR, is hunting a jackel mor ehounorable? I don't think there is a difference, but this is only one man's opinion, others may do as their conscience dictates! As for me it will not do for me to win the lottery, because I will hunt buffalo, and ele, right along with the rest of the big four, (Rhino has become a non intity) every year for the rest of my life. Of course that wont be long at age 71 yrs!

Mac

Elephant should be hunted and your arguments hold true. In certain areas like Kruger and Botswana, they should in fact be culled. It's just the really big ones where I get a little stuck. They are becoming very scarce and it kind'a feels like you are demolishing a monument when shooting one of these magnificent giants. I am happy for the hunter when we do get one, but I hurt inside when we shoot a really big bull. Around 50 pounds or so, no problem. There are enough.

the thing i found most interesting about the video was reading the moronic comments afterward. they seemed equally split between the wack "em and stack "em fools and the "how can you shoot such a magnificent animal" bunny huggers. makes for interesting reading. Tembo, i find your comments curious considering your sign-in name( Tembo being Ki-Swahili for elephant)

GUYS, I think you are misunderstanding my position. I am NOT against hunting elephants in any way, shape, or form. It is just that personally, it isn't my cup of tea. As for hunting lions, I am terrified of them. Lions and sharks I want nothing to do with. Don't know why, but that fear of those 2 animals has always been there, since I was a small kid. To each, his own.

Mac:

I am not against elephant hunting. It's just that it's not for me. I understand the economics of it. Sport hunting will save the elephant for the forseeable future but I think that eventually, human encroachment on their habitat will spell demise for the elephant as well as most of the world's wild species.

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
the thing i found most interesting about the video was reading the moronic comments afterward. they seemed equally split between the wack "em and stack "em fools and the "how can you shoot such a magnificent animal" bunny huggers. makes for interesting reading. Tembo, i find your comments curious considering your sign-in name( Tembo being Ki-Swahili for elephant)

Speaking of moronic comments!

I also rate Elephants in a seperate catagory to the other quarry species, but my personal belief is that the old bulls that have already passed on their genes and are too old to breed are the ones to hunt. sure it's sad to see them fall, but to me its these animals that are the ones to take. I don't agree with the sport hunting of cows, calves and adolescents however..... which is why all the Elephant hunts we offer are for mature bulls only.

Continuing on with my personal opinion, I appreciate that numbers of cows, calves and adolescents need controlling but that this should only be done by properly trained and organised professional culling teams.

All that said, I understand how Johan/Bahati feels and there's nothing sadder than a dead Elephant.......... the hunts bloody exciting though.

quote:

the thing i found most interesting about the video was reading the moronic comments afterward. they seemed equally split between the wack "em and stack "em fools and the "how can you shoot such a magnificent animal" bunny huggers. makes for interesting reading. Tembo, i find your comments curious considering your sign-in name( Tembo being Ki-Swahili for elephant)

You need to take a flying bite at your own ass.

Just because a person does not want to shoot an elephant, or any other species, DOES NOT MAKE THEM A BUNNY HUGGER, or anything else.

Don't know what your hunting experience is, nor if you have had any experience shooting elephants or other big game, but some of the folks expressing their opinion, have killed elephants and just choose not to do so again.

Not being interested in killing something only equates to that individuals beliefs/desires/concepts.

Any time a person loses the the respect for the animals they have killed and does not feel some bit of remorse, then in my opinion they should start re-evaluating why they hunt.

Crazyhorseconsulting


I think he was speaking if the silly comments following the video, not the comments on this thread.

Jason

My elephant hunt was the most interesting and exciting hunt I have ever experienced...right up until I walked up to the dead elephant.

I looked into the eye of this animal that was probably about as old as me and all I could think was that I wished I had not killed it.

Oddly, I still treasure the tusks and memories of the hunt but I could not imagine doing it again except in self defense.

If I mis-interpreted his comments than I apologize.

Whatever the case, my sentiment about not calling someone a "Bunny-Hugger", because for whatever their reasons, they are not interested in shooting a particular specie or species of animals, still stands.

quote:

Originally posted by JBrown:
Crazyhorseconsulting


I think he was speaking if the silly comments following the video, not the comments on this thread.

Jason

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I WAS REFERRING TOO. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING I POSTED WAS IN REFERRENCE TO THE POSTINGS BY ANYONE ON THIS SITE-CHC AND DB, READ MY ORIGINAL POSTING AGAIN, THEN REREAD THE COMMENTS POSTED ON THE VIDEO WEBSITE AGAIN AND MAYBE YOU CAN FIGURE IT OUT- THEN AGAIN MAYBE NOT

I never wanted to hunt elephant, untill I went to Africa and seen them in the wild. Now they are the number one animal to hunt in my book.
Funny, before I went to Africa I dreamed about shooting cape buffalo. Once I seen buff in the wild acting like cattle I lost the desire to kill them. Weird how our minds change. Never did have a desire to shoot the big cats. But would love to get in on a hippo culling operation.

quote:

Originally posted by Snowwolfe:

Funny, before I went to Africa I dreamed about shooting cape buffalo. Once I seen buff in the wild acting like cattle I lost the desire to kill them.

Have you hunted old dagger boy Bulls away from the herds ?

quote:

Originally posted by Palmer:
My elephant hunt was the most interesting and exciting hunt I have ever experienced...right up until I walked up to the dead elephant.

I looked into the eye of this animal that was probably about as old as me and all I could think was that I wished I had not killed it.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with feeling a little sad after you kill a game animal. That's what makes us HUNTERS and not KILLERS. Having respect for an animal that gave it's life for your hunt is about the most noble act in which a true hunter can participate. It doesn't even have to be an elephant; I feel a little bad when I shoot groundhogs or whitetails, but that's part of being a true, honorable hunter.

As an aside to the video, and I've been biting my tongue on this for a while, but I would encourage people to STOP posting hunting and shooting videos on You Tube. It seems that site is literally crawling with uninformed, liberal, anits, and I'm thoroughly tired of reading their hackneyed, inaccurate, and downright insulting comments on perfectly normal hunting and shooting videos (e.g. 'endangered elephants,' 'assault weapons,' etc.). We've got a perfectly acceptable forum for posting those kinds of things right here on AR, and we're all supportive of the sports. Let's all make a conscious effort to stop providing fodder for people who hate what we do.

quote:

Continuing on with my personal opinion, I appreciate that numbers of cows, calves and adolescents need controlling but that this should only be done by properly trained and organised professional culling teams

Could not dissagree with you more. An experienced PH could safely perform the job. Do you feel that wolves in US national parks should be culled instead of hunted? What about the revenues developed from hunting vs the cost of culling? If the animal must be cropped, why not have the opportunity for a reduced cost hunt?

It is always about the hunt, never about the kill. I have remorse for every animal I have ever taken, from Cape Buffalo to Quail.

I'm not talking about wolves or US national parks here, I'm talking about Elephants which have different social structures and behaviour patterns to any and all other species. As responsible hunters we need to remember that at all times.

Regarding your comment about an experienced PH being able to safely perform the job........ you base that opinion on what?

you seem to think that culling cows calves and adolescent Elephants consists of just shooting one or two..... the accepted method is to take out the entire family unit in one hit... usually within a few minutes and usually with three shooters. - If done correctly, the entire herd falls touching or almost touching each other.

Don't think I'm attacking you here, I just think that your post indicates you don't understand the science of Elephant management and how the herd dynamics etc work. One of the problems with Elephant hunting is that far too many Elephant hunters go out and shoot them without any understanding of what they're doing or why, and consequently far too many people shoot the wrong Elephants. All you have to do is take a look on these forums and you'll see picture after picture of what I would classify as the 'wrong Elephant' (To say the very least) - As I've said before, any fool can shoot an Elephant and many fools do.

You might like to read Ron Thomson's books which give a very accurate idea of how it all works. - As you said yourself:- 'It is always about the hunt, never about the kill.' Or at least, it should be!

Steve!

Please define your idea of the wrong elephant to shoot.

465H&H

Like Ron Thomson and many others, I believe the only Elephants that should be sport hunted are the mature bulls...... and preferably, only the old tuskers that are past breeding age.....Cows calves and adolescents should only ever be culled as entire family units and only by experienced culling teams...... never by sport or trophy hunters.

quote:

the accepted method is to take out the entire family unit in one hit... usually within a few minutes and usually with three shooters. - If done correctly, the entire herd falls touching or almost touching each other.

I have never hunted Elephant so I must ask, Why is this the "accepted method"? What is the science behind this? I have heard the term "cropping officer", is this how it is always done? I am ready to be educated

My experience has been when the government is involved, well, 'nuff said.

quote:

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I WAS REFERRING TOO. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING I POSTED WAS IN REFERRENCE TO THE POSTINGS BY ANYONE ON THIS SITE-CHC AND DB, READ MY ORIGINAL POSTING AGAIN, THEN REREAD THE COMMENTS POSTED ON THE VIDEO WEBSITE AGAIN AND MAYBE YOU CAN FIGURE IT OUT- THEN AGAIN MAYBE NOT

As I said, if I was wrong or hasty in my judgement, I apologize.

I re-read everything, and I was wrong. That is as good as your going to get, I made a mistake and admit to it.

I must admit that I am less inclined to hunt elephant and the big cats than anything else. This is not a logical but an emotional inclination. I know they need to be hunted like everything else. I am not against it and certainly don't care about someone else making a choice either for or against. I believe it is a personal choice like anything else. I honestly do not know if and when I get the opportunity I will take it or not.
Shakari, does that mean you do not approve of the taking of tuskless cows without dependent calves? If so what is your reasoning? I am always interested in learning the reasons behind an individuals decision. It has helped me to learn all the issues involved in particular discussions and taught me much over the years.

Jim,

People have written entire books on the subject of Elephant management and Elephant society etc etc and it would be impossible for me to supply all the answers here. (Even if I knew all the answers!) - As I said, probably the best thing you could do is read the books by Ron Thomson where he covers the subject pretty well.

Mike,

I don't mean to preach or comment on other hunters beliefs here, as their behaviour is nothing to do with me. - These comments are just my personal beliefs...... However, I don't believe that any cows should be sport hunted whether with calves or not or with tusks or not.......

Thanks, more "stuff" to add to my read stack

quote:

Originally posted by ozhunter:

Have you hunted old dagger boy Bulls away from the herds ?

I like this very much. Finally the proper spelling and pronunciation:

DAGGER BOY

quote:

Originally posted by bwanamrm:
I absolutely LOVE hunting elephant... one of the world's great sporting challenges when tracked on foot. Mile after long mile, you truly earn your trophy. And there is nothing that compares to being in amongst a herd in the bush for a pure adrenaline rush!

Yup.
Brian

Steve, I neither thought you were preaching nor commenting on anyone else. I knew it was what you believed and have no problem with it. What I was trying to find out was it an "emotional" choice such as mine, or was it based on some science that I was not aware of. My question was not intended as a commentary, only looking for knowledge. I am the kind of guy that needs to know the reasoning behind things. Everything makes more sense to me no matter if I happen to agree or not, if I understand the underlying issues. At times that happens to take the form of because that is the way I feel about it. That is ok too. Sorry if I came across as something else I was just trying to enlighten myself.