I have seen spine shots used on buffalo (on videos) with spectacular results. I've never used this, prefering the lung/heart shot. I'm familiar with the placement (follow the front leg up, 1/3 down from the top). My question is: have any of you used this shot? How forgiving is it? If one misses low I assume that the aorta would probably be hit. If you miss high do all you have is a wounded buff? Comments?

I've taken two cape buffalo with spine shots. Both of these bulls were standing broadside about 100 yards way, and each of them went down instantly. One of them tried to get up, couldn't, and was finished with a follow-up shot to the brain. The other bull was dead as soon as he hit the ground.

The spine shot is not forgiving at all if your bullet goes too high and misses the spine. A shot that goes too high and misses the spine will not be a fatal hit, and the buffalo will have to be followed up.

One of the problems is, the spine is lower than you might think in relation to the top of the back. The smart thing to do is to use enough gun and aim (on broadside opportunities) in line with the front leg. If you use the front leg as a guide, the spine lies about one-third of the way down from the top of the back. Just above and to the front of the spine is the scapula, and just below it are the lungs and the heart. This gives you some lattitude in case you bullet is a bit off the mark. Even so, if you shoot too high you can get into trouble!

AD

I too have used this twice. Once was an incidental hit on backup shot, dumping the bull in his tracks while he was thinking about his options at 50 yards.

The other was deliberate, it was a buffalo I shot for myself in the Park on a control hunt. The park manager said that was the first buffalo he had ever seen drop dead at the shot, and he said: "I have seen over three hundred killed!"

It is not a high percentage shot but in my case the bull was quartering towards me and I felt the bullet missing to low would be in the heart lungs and to high would have a shoulder. I was slighly up hill from him. The bullet was recovered under the skin after penetrating one scapula as well. With a solid it would have exited easily. The 300 grain swift A frame has a chunk of bone embedded into the exposed lead mushroom.

There are lots of shots I would never take or recommend as a normal practice. However those same shots under the correct conditions can be valuable. I guess I've grown up a bit over the years and I now rarely say "never" or "always" because there are often times when the conditions allow the extreme. jj

On early season hunts and/or in thick jesse, this can be a more common shot presentation than the usual lung/heart shot, as being higher up in the body, it may well be all one can see. Thus far, I've intentionally avoided taking this shot and waited for another. Should it someday reoccur while I was on a really fine bull, I think I would take the shot.

You have a pretty target on the spine and if you miss you will probably hit one of the rib like projections and that will put him down for the count, for a while, so always pump him full of finishers...

My good friend Russ Smith, a booking agent in Montana, very recently caved an old Dugga boy and then walked up and shot him in the back of the head..They punched his eye with the gun barrel and the eye had glazed so they went over and sat under a tree and had a smoke and some rest..

They heard a noise behind them and the bugger was up on all fours and leering at them from 20 ft. away..He was 5 ft off Russes 450-400-3" when Russ put him down for the last and final time, and he came to rest in the middle of the whole crew...Now thats close...Remember its the dead ones that get you!!

------------------
Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

This is the shot that Taylor recommended and though I have never used it, there were times when I probably should have.

If it was good enough for Taylor...

I've spined 'em from behind and brained them, so you don't need a .338 either, which is why I'm using my .222 Rem. with solids next time.
I think this need to be the subject of another topic,"Does DGR start with the .222 Rem", or will I be overgunned? What do you think?

Sorry.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 08-13-2001).]

My first Buff I took with a frontal spine shot. He went down instantly. This was the only shot offered. I paid the insurance by putting a solid through his heart. I'll have to talk to Russ Smith about his little experience.

------------------
JD

I used precisely that shot on my last hunt for buff in Zambia. We were following 4 or 5 kakulis (old bachelor buffs) in thick stuff when the oldest of the crowd advanced towards the PH and myself, followed closely by another younger one. The one in front, at a distance of maybe 7 meters, was very old with broken horns, a real beauty for any German hunter, ... but I lusted for the one behind him, which was younger and had better horns. It was frustrating to only see the tips of the horns, because the huge body of the older one covered him and the vegetation was so thick. Luckily the old boy sank his head and uncovered the spine of the left flank of the one in the back. I had remembered reading about the spine shot and was wondering whether to risk it, when the PH signaled me to shoot. (He later told me he meant me to shoot the old buff or to retreat, as he saw no chance of getting the one in the back...). I instead shot the one standing behind right on the spine (Barnes X, 400 gr.). The buff collapsed on the spot, and I shot it again with a solid in the body looking for the lungs. My PH shot him also once with his 450/400 double. There was of course the classical pandemonium, and the remaining buff were running all over the place. One large one even stopped and looked very surprised at us from about 3 meters. We waited in silence (panic?) and each of us wondered whether to shoot him too. (I only had two 416 Rem Mag cartridge left in my rifle and my PH one in his double...), but at that range it did not look like a good decision to shoot the guy. Luckily the buff decided to turn right run into the jesse after the old buffalo, who had not hesitated a moment and had left right after the shot.

With hindsight it was risky, but it worked... Just be sure to study the anatomy of the animals so that you really know how to reach the spine from all angles...

Antonio

Antonio,
Excellent post.

____________________________________________

JD,
This is the shot I wish I could get more experience on, from straight on and various left / right angles. I'd like to "see it", instinctually, as I do most shots. I believe this shot, along with the use of very heavy calibers, may mean my salvation one day.
I've seen opportunities for this shot passed by only because the hunter was overly concerned he'd not have the time for a brain shot afterwards. I don't care to just "let it all happen" when any chance for this frontal spine shot exists and whether or not the buffalo has begun moving towards me.

[This message has been edited by Nickudu (edited 08-13-2001).]

Most spine shots are misses, the hunter simply shooting high and perhaps a bit to the left, Most novice Buffalo hunters seem to shoot Buffalo a bit high in my experience, I suppose because thats the biggest part of the bull. Many times a high lung shot and that spells trouble.

I allways take the classic high heart shot unless range or bush or whatever has required a brain or spine shot...

------------------
Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

It doesn't sound like anybody here routinely uses the spine shot. Still, as was pointed out, it is probably something good to have in the inventory if that is the only good shot available. I'll be off to Africa in a couple of weeks and will try it if I get the chance.

quote:

Originally posted by JohnDL:
It doesn't sound like anybody here routinely uses the spine shot. Still, as was pointed out, it is probably something good to have in the inventory if that is the only good shot available. I'll be off to Africa in a couple of weeks and will try it if I get the chance.

Don`t try to shoot in the spine, you`ll miss.
The spine is placed low, and you got to know what you are doing, whwn you are aiming at det spine area.
Sometimes a high shouldershot hit the spine and the animal fell right down.
When I shoot at a animal and the animal fell on the spot, I reload and are ready to do a following up shot, very ofen the animal gets up and dissapear in the forrest/bush.

Do it simpel: Shoot at the shoulder as you should, and be safe that these shot will kill the animal, even a buff.

It is a shot I often recomend to clients. There are times and places when it is not ideal, but if the client is a reasonable shot and I have been ableto get him reasonably well set up...stops alot of angst on the follow up.

When hunting PAC for rations (or for my own sport if I ever get that chance again) it is my shot of preference

quote:

Originally posted by Ganyana:
It is a shot I often recomend to clients. There are times and places when it is not ideal, but if the client is a reasonable shot and I have been ableto get him reasonably well set up...stops alot of angst on the follow up.

When hunting PAC for rations (or for my own sport if I ever get that chance again) it is my shot of preference

Yes I`m agree with you, most of the clients have shot a few buffaloes and don`t have the experience, I`m not shure that they know the anatomy of the animal, so they know where to find the spine..

Bringing back a seven year old thread to answer it may be some kind of record...

quote:

Originally posted by Charles_Helm:
Bringing back a seven year old thread to answer it may be some kind of record...

I'm glad since I wasn't around 7 years ago.

I wish I was on here 7 years ago

Shoulder shot is the only way to go baby...Wrecks everything...not nearly so much anatomical measuring necessary.

Jeff

The spine shot is deadly "IF" you hit it! If you miss it you may waste three days sorting him out, if he gets into the weeds! A much safer, and surer shot is always the Heart/Lung shot, then the follow up will be much shorter than a botched spine shot taken a little high! My advice is, if you insist on the spine shot, you should ere on the low side, so if you judge too low, you will collect the heart/lung area. If, however if you make a mistake, and hit only a little high, you have just pissed him off, and he may hurt someone before you find him, if you do!

I agree. IMHO, for anyone but an expert under ideal conditions, taking that shot is asking for trouble.

IMHO, all one need do is put his bullet in the shoulder crease one third of the way up from the brisket. That will tear up the aorta and wreck the top of the heart.

This is what you want your tracker/skinner to show you after all is said and done:

I have taken several buffalo with spine shots. My favorite shot is a spine shot when the buf is standing directly or nearly directly facing you. If you tuck one just under the chin the buff will drop like he fell in a hole. The bullet severs the spine at the shoulder. I promise you, this is one of the few shots that will instantly stop a charge. From the side shoot at the midpoint of the animal, one hands breadth in front of the line of the leg. If you miss the spine you will likely hit either the lung or the scapula or both.

Geronimo

Excellent shooting Saeed.

Thank you Saaed. Very fine shooting. I know you are a excellent shooter.
It was a good idea too get this tread on top again

Damn good shooting Saeed!

Be advised, however, not everyone can shoot like you. I give you Walter, the balls shooter, for an example! I'm sure his shot hurts more than your spine, and brain shots, or aleast lasts longer!

quote:

posted by Geromomo

If you tuck one just under the chin the buff will drop like he fell in a hole.

From the front this is the best shot to take! If it is a little high it will likely hit the brain, and if too low will take out the heart. The side spine shot, however is very iffy, especially if you hit too high.
I have no problem takeing either shot on an undisturbed animal, standing still, but the pure heart/lung with the first shot, and a soft point is the best for those not experienced enough to know exactly where to place the bullets for the spine, or brain from all angles! A full 80% of the wounded, and lost buffalo are shot too high for the spine shot!

Saeed, I assume that the first shot was the spine shot, and the second was the head shot. Is that correct?
Peter.

This is a dusty old topic...but that's some fantastic shooting by Saeed. He seems to get a lot of multiple opportunities like that at the end of the season. It's always impressive to see multiple dead buffalo laying within sight of each other.

Wow! this is an old thread, I mean years old, since I posted on this thread I have been to Africa several times at least..I have used the spine shot a good number of times, I just shoot where the neck and shoulder come together and about center, they always go down and sometimes they are not dead, but they cannot get up. It is an excellent shot. Ranges are normally very close and the shot is easy.

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
Saeed, I assume that the first shot was the spine shot, and the second was the head shot. Is that correct?
Peter.

No sir it is the other way round.

The first buffalo was already hit in the shoulder, and could hardly walk. From my position - I am shorter than the cameraman - I could not see his lower chest to shoot him in the heart. So I just put a bullet into his head.

The second was hit in the chest. The bullet actually disentegrated part of his spine, turning the bones into a mixture that looked liked sand mixed with thick blood.

Last year, We followed some bulls for hours. Eventually catching up with them. I shot the first one we saw in the chest, heran a few yards and dropped. I shot two more in the head, as that is all I could see in the long grass.



In the photo above, you can see the first one I mentioned at the bottom of the photo, then one is where Roy and the trackers are, and the third one is just behind them to the right, Alan is standing on it.

In this sort of terrain, there is no option but a head shot.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Head shot and a spine shot

Amazing shooting!

I know for a fact that Saeed has made a couple of head shots just as I was about to pull the trigger on buffalo, I can still hear that cackling laugh as my bull buckled!!

Saeed,

A couple of years ago you posted a photo of three buffalo side by side.

As I recall one or two of them were spine shots?

Maybe you could repost that photo and retell the story?

PS What range were the two shots you took in the video? And do you recall what power your scope was set on?

Andy

Sometimes game, including buffalo, drops instaneously dead with a high heart shot. Since being off high an inch or two with an attempted spine shot could lead to a wounded buffalo, but being off an inch or two in any direction going for the upper heart will still result in a quickly dead buffalo, it seems wise to me not to intentionally try for a spine shot.
If a shot takes out the dorsal portion of the spine, cutting the spinal cord, but not blowing out the aorta, it is possible the buffalo could still be able to lift its head and probably move its front legs.

I think the two in the video were about 100-120 yards.

We shot the above 4 bulls in matetsi, Zimbabwe.

We had a friend with a pacemaker, who could not walk very far.

He wanted to shoot a buffalo. We were debating where do we find one that will not entail too much walking.

One morning, as we were driving along, we saw these 4 bulls walking. It was close to the end of our hunt, and it so happened that we had 4 bulls left on our quota.

The wind was right, and we decided to intercept them and see if we can shoot them all.

We managed to get in front of them, and they conveniently walked about 40 yards from us.

My friend, Gerhard, fired shot at the first one., hitting it too far back. The bull jumped a few yards and stopped - behind a bush, as luck would have it.

We waited a few minutes, then managed to move slightly so Gerhard could have another shot at his bull.

He managed to dispatch it, and then it was my turn.

A few shots later, some were on standing buffalo, some on running, and one on one on a sort of "search and destroy" mission, we managed to have 4 bulls dead within a few yards of each other.


3 buffalo pictured above


The last of the four pictured above

More buffalo

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
[clipped]

This is what you want your tracker/skinner to show you after all is said and done:

....or this:


Dave

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
I know for a fact that Saeed has made a couple of head shots just as I was about to pull the trigger on buffalo, I can still hear that cackling laugh as my bull buckled!!

A scoped bolt action would ALWAYS beat a double Ray

Damned fine shooting!

Spine shot running kudu

We were hunting in matetsi, and found these kudu bulls very close to the boundery.

I was using a 270 Ackley, the first shot would have killed him, eventually, but we did not want to take a chance of him crossing into the other side.