FANTASTIC - ITS ABOUT TIME

quote:

Originally posted by Big Wonderful Wyoming:He's a nice guy and he served, what more do you want?

I would like him to answer the question, without all of your projection.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
For those of you that are drinking buds of the Colonel, I'd appreciate if you ask him if he feels any guilt for playing Marine in the Kansas ROTC while the rest of kids his age were getting killed and maimed in a far away land.

Having served in the Navy for 30 years myself, I have never felt any guilt for not being killed or maimed in combat. I have also known quite a few Marine officers in my life who share the same sentiment. Craig had the intellect and dedication to become commissioned as an officer of Marines. There are not many folks who have done that or can claim to serve with the distinction Craig did. He would have (and should have) retired as a General - he is THAT good. As a Brigadier General (select), he reported for active duty in the first Gulf War in Iraq (and as a by the way, Marines, both enlisted and officers, were getting killed and maimed in that conflict as well). As a BG select, he was still wearing his "eagles" as the promotion list had not yet been formally approved by the Senate. He was (illegally) ordered by his commanding General to put on his stars as he needed a General Officer and not just another Colonel. Being a good Marine, Craig donned his stars and did his duty. In the end, the Senate found out and some were very upset. Craig's name never got approved by the Senate. So for following orders of the Commanding General, he ultimately retired as a Colonel.

Those of us who have given our lives to serving our Country feel lucky, not guilt, that we were not killed or maimed in combat. Life is about choices. Craig chose to serve as an Officer of Marines, and all of us should thank him for his service to our country every time we see him - I know I do.

Great post, Dave.
Why is it those who saw combat duty seem to hold those that didn't in contempt? I've noticed it over and over. Trump, Bush, etc., fill positions that were available and needed ot be filled. I mean not every military position was combat duty. I've been ridiculed myself for not serving. The reason matters not, just the fact I didn't serve has put me on the shit list of those that did. (For the record, I had my thyroid removed when I was 21, several knee ops due to my weightlifing career, and a diabetic, so was unable to enlist--but I tried).
Cheers to those that served, no matter what their duty.
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
For those of you that are drinking buds of the Colonel, I'd appreciate if you ask him if he feels any guilt for playing Marine in the Kansas ROTC while the rest of kids his age were getting killed and maimed in a far away land.

The Admiral responded with the "adult" response, but me being retired and of lesser rank, tell us, were you born an asshole or did you have to work at it? Something tells me both... It's HARD to come across that blatant without the butthole DNA AND working at it as well.....

My brother in law works at the VA on the information technology side of things. I don't actually know hiw full job title. He did 12 years of Active Army time and got forced out for his migranes, he served in Afghanistan and Iraq, and did quite a number of years on the DMZ in Korea.

He gets a lot of shit from National Guard pukes who got shot at for 3 weeks and ended up with 100% PTSD so they don't ever have to work again.

I am proud to have served my country, I feel no guilt toward those that died. They signed on the line like I did, I will say more than anything I am thankful they chose to serve this great nation.

The group that were conscripted into service prior to us in the 1960-1980s, still had the option of going to college or going to Canada.

A man has to live his life the way he sees fit.

Craig spent 35 years as a volunteer in the Marine Corps Reserve. I kind of think he earned his keep.

quote:

Originally posted by Big Wonderful Wyoming:
I used to own that book. It was a an "interesting" read as Ross says.

When I started to ex-pat full time I sold all my valuable books.

Mellon has probably done the least for anyone on that list, he wrote one book and never really hunted again after he got the award.

As I wrote in "Royal Quest," the authorized biography I did for Prince Abdorreza of Iran, Mellon spent much time and effort as the prince's "advance man." He arranged hunts that can never be repeated, but although he often accompanied the prince, he apparently had lost all interest in hunting for himself by then.

Bill Quimby

I had heard Mellon still liked to shoot squirrels with his M52 Winchester, but that was about it.

His family didn't hunt, and his friends didn't hunt. I am not sure what caused the drive in him back then but he must have lost it somewhere.

Bill thank you for adding your 2 cents, you have always been a valuable person on this site.

Thanks to Cal and the Admiral for sharing their words as well.

Congratulations to the COL. Well deserved. He needs to ignore all the comments coming from the envious poo chunkers.

Ray B.....Seriously?!? I don't know anyone who was actually in combat that would wish that experience on anyone.

It has also been my experience that those that hold a grudge against anyone that was not in the military generally regret their choice as well. As far as the divorce comment someone made, divorce is more common than unusual in the military.

Safe travels......Larry

Do not see how you can equate some one that volentary joined the Marine ROTC during war time serving 35 years active and reserve as avoiding his military duties.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
For those of you that are drinking buds of the Colonel, I'd appreciate if you ask him if he feels any guilt for playing Marine in the Kansas ROTC while the rest of kids his age were getting killed and maimed in a far away land.

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
For those of you that are drinking buds of the Colonel, I'd appreciate if you ask him if he feels any guilt for playing Marine in the Kansas ROTC while the rest of kids his age were getting killed and maimed in a far away land.

Having served in the Navy for 30 years myself, I have never felt any guilt for not being killed or maimed in combat. I have also known quite a few Marine officers in my life who share the same sentiment. Craig had the intellect and dedication to become commissioned as an officer of Marines. There are not many folks who have done that or can claim to serve with the distinction Craig did. He would have (and should have) retired as a General - he is THAT good. As a Brigadier General (select), he reported for active duty in the first Gulf War in Iraq (and as a by the way, Marines, both enlisted and officers, were getting killed and maimed in that conflict as well). As a BG select, he was still wearing his "eagles" as the promotion list had not yet been formally approved by the Senate. He was (illegally) ordered by his commanding General to put on his stars as he needed a General Officer and not just another Colonel. Being a good Marine, Craig donned his stars and did his duty. In the end, the Senate found out and some were very upset. Craig's name never got approved by the Senate. So for following orders of the Commanding General, he ultimately retired as a Colonel.

Those of us who have given our lives to serving our Country feel lucky, not guilt, that we were not killed or maimed in combat. Life is about choices. Craig chose to serve as an Officer of Marines, and all of us should thank him for his service to our country every time we see him - I know I do.

+1

Mike

I step away to the shooting range for a few hours and come back to this mess? WTF is wrong with some people....

PS..if you're looking to stir the pot there's a place for that...look no further than the ARPF for all your troll needs!

It is interesting to see the responses of those that took a simple question as a challenge. I'd like to know if Col Boddington feels any guilt regarding his choice to get a draft deferment in the ROTC. It's a simple question that he can answer. I'm sure that he doesn't need a bunch of whatevers making excuses for him, particularly when there ahs been no accusation made, except in the course of those wellmeaning but misdirected apologies.

The question was worded in a sarcastic and rude manner. Drinking buddies, playing marine, etc., is not asking a question, it is passing judgement.
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
It is interesting to see the responses of those that took a simple question as a challenge. I'd like to know if Col Boddington feels any guilt regarding his choice to get a draft deferment in the ROTC. It's a simple question that he can answer. I'm sure that he doesn't need a bunch of whatevers making excuses for him, particularly when there ahs been no accusation made, except in the course of those wellmeaning but misdirected apologies.

Bullshit.....you question is rhetorical, you KNOW the answer. He neither should or would feel any "guilt" for serving his Country with Honor. You absolutely implied that he should...don't try and crawfish now.....
You neither want an answer and you certainly don't deserve one....
You'd be better off blaming it on your Washington State Pot Brownies and LSD flashbacks from the 60's

Such projections on what I know and do - just looking for an answer to a very real question and look what I get!! I must say, I'm not impressed.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
Such projections on what I know and do - just looking for an answer to a very real question and look what I get!! I must say, I'm not impressed.

You are being called out as an assh@le for being an assh@le. You should not be impressed.

Mike

He did not need to join the ROTC in college for a deferment. College students were already defered.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
For those of you that are drinking buds of the Colonel, I'd appreciate if you ask him if he feels any guilt for playing Marine in the Kansas ROTC while the rest of kids his age were getting killed and maimed in a far away land.

LOL

He went to college on an ROTC scholarship and was commissioned after he graduated.

He speaks all over the country.

Man up and ask him yourself.

quote:

Originally posted by Duckear:

He speaks all over the country.

Man up and ask him yourself.

I was unaware that he spoke at anything except SCI events. I suppose he has a website that I could find so that I could ask him one to one.

There is one good thing about this . Maybe the Capstick thread is dead.

Amen

Maybe this is just the sick joke of the week.

The facts are that he served 35 years on active and reserve time, and fought in Iraq and Afghanistan.

But for some reason this guy thinks he owes him something for attending college on a ROTC scholarship during Vietnam. Even though he went on to serve in combat in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Sadly I have met lots of guys like you before. Guys that claim if you were not combat arms in the thick of battle you didn't serve your country.

About 5 years ago (while on active duty) I was standing in my dress blue crackerjack sailor uniform (where I was stationed) we asked Buzz Aldrin to visit us for the 4th of July party. Someone who works for the State Department walked up to Buzz and asked him if was the second man on the moon. The guy acted kind of dissapointed, and was about to walk off when Buzz said "yes I was, have you been?"

Maybe you did 40 years all in Special Forces/Navy SEAL/Marine Recon super ninja shit. Or maybe you didn't and your just like that State Department weenie.

quote:

Originally posted by Poyntman:

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
It is interesting to see the responses of those that took a simple question as a challenge. I'd like to know if Col Boddington feels any guilt regarding his choice to get a draft deferment in the ROTC. It's a simple question that he can answer. I'm sure that he doesn't need a bunch of whatevers making excuses for him, particularly when there ahs been no accusation made, except in the course of those wellmeaning but misdirected apologies.

Bullshit.....you question is rhetorical, you KNOW the answer. He neither should or would feel any "guilt" for serving his Country with Honor. You absolutely implied that he should...don't try and crawfish now.....
You neither want an answer and you certainly don't deserve one....
You'd be better off blaming it on your Washington State Pot Brownies and LSD flashbacks from the 60's

I wish to respectfully second this reply.

I guess I need to confess that I avoided the draft in 1966 by joining a reserve officer program with the Marines. It was (is) called PLC for Platoon Leader Class. I got to stay in college two more years and attended OCS during the summers after my sophomore and junior year. Damn lots of Marines died in those two years.

Tet, Hue, Hill 881 and Rocket City.

In June of 1968 I was commissioned a 2nd Lieutenant with a great big "R" after the USMC. Boddington had the same "R" as I did.

You can take away my wife, you can take away my car... but dear God Almighty, don't take away my "R".

Does that make me less honorable? I don't think so.

Do I feel guilty? You bet your ass I did (and still do). Did I ever shit my britches when eventually I got shot at or landed an airplane on a pitching deck. Yep... that, too.

Damn...

You always feel guilty when good men die, regardless of your leadership, brave (or terror-filled) participation and contribution. Doesn't matter if your buddy dies in combat or "just" the inevitable, once-a-cruise cold cat shot. The hard thing is that grieving is almost impossible. You bottle up the emotion and kind of dismiss the dead guy... He didn't have the right stuff. If he did... Like you do... he would have survived... as you will. It's bullshit, but it's the way you cope with doing exactly the same thing that killed the guy before you. You've got what it takes while he didn't. Of course you know better, but if you're next on the flight schedule to some God forsaken truck park with multiple quad 23's, you got to do something to not go crazy.

I know all too well.

Survivor guilt has dogged me for almost 50 years. If you haven't been there, there is no easy explaining it. Most folks would say I did my duty in difficult circumstances, but I lie awake many nights wondering why I'm alive and better men than me caught the golden BB.

If you thing you can contribute more as an officer (me a pilot)... well, you had to get a degree and do the OCS thing.. then flight school for 18 months and another 6 months to a year to be operationally ready.

Avoiding the draft.... No... just delaying the inevitable... if you're a Marine.

Godspeed Craig Boddington and congratulations on the award.

Well said, Judge.

Great choice!

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
It is interesting to see the responses of those that took a simple question as a challenge. I'd like to know if Col Boddington feels any guilt regarding his choice to get a draft deferment in the ROTC.

He was a university student, so service is deferred until graduation. If YOU were military, you would know this.

Grow some balls and ask him yourself instead of hiding behind a keyboard like a troll looking for drama.

quote:

A good Marine would not follow unlawful orders.

GMAFB. Frocking was no big deal back in the 80s in the Naval Services. Almost the second the list came out, CO's were looking for excuses not to frock officers because it was a great morale builder and it didn't cost the Navy a dime. Then the Army and Air Force started to whine, especially after the Goldwater-Nichols Joint bullshit and frocking was taboo, but if a friggin' three star told me to pin it on, I would have done the same thing.

Does Ray B. have any guilt as he survived when others did not?
Cal

Shockey should be next.

He has certainly done enough hunting.

Does one have to apply to be considered?

quote:

Originally posted by DCS Member:
Shockey should be next.

I wonder how many species Jim has?

There are quite a few guys out of the lime light and in it that have several hundred species. Cory Knowlton has a ton of species as well, but I honestly don't think he is anywhere near the top end of the heap.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
He has certainly done enough hunting.

Does one have to apply to be considered?

I think so, I think you have to fill out a report.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
For those of you that are drinking buds of the Colonel, I'd appreciate if you ask him if he feels any guilt for playing Marine in the Kansas ROTC while the rest of kids his age were getting killed and maimed in a far away land.

I wondered when some asshole would post on this topic. Congrats, you win the asshole award.

quote:

Originally posted by DCS Member:
Too bad we ran him off AR...

Yes it really is.


.

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:

quote:

A good Marine would not follow unlawful orders.

GMAFB. Frocking was no big deal back in the 80s in the Naval Services. Almost the second the list came out, CO's were looking for excuses not to frock officers because it was a great morale builder and it didn't cost the Navy a dime. Then the Army and Air Force started to whine, especially after the Goldwater-Nichols Joint bullshit and frocking was taboo, but if a friggin' three star told me to pin it on, I would have done the same thing.

Frocking is still practiced in the Army.. Im guessing the other services still do it as well.. Army Regulation 600-8-29 specifically addresses it.

The tradition as I understand it actually started with the Navy and USMC in the 1800's when the amount of time it took to communicate with ships at sea took months, and when vacancies occurred in the officer corps it could take long periods of time for the paperwork to catch up after an officer was put into a new position..

Being "frocked" is not in and of itself an unlawful order..

there are just specific rules about how to go about making it happen that appear not to have been followed in this case..

If a 3 star told me to pin on a star, and I thought the rules were being followed like Boddington claims and that the 3 star was in fact giving me a lawful order, I would have pinned on the star too..

My guess is that Col. Boddington intended no wrong, and had no idea that what he was doing at the time was wrong.. He trusted his superior, knew that this was something his branch of service did on occasion when the situation warranted it, etc.. and followed the orders that he believed to be lawful at the time they were delivered..

No officers are frocked anymore. This has something to do with line numbers, and how it screws that up.

Read my post, which is EXACTLY what I said. Specifically, Goldwater-Nichols. When I made LT, I was frocked the next day by my CO in the squadron. Same when I made LCDR. After that when they effed everything up with that Joint crap, I had to wait for my other ranks

Isn't this about the Weatherby Award? I'm sure the search function will find plenty of threads about his rank.

Congratulations to a great man.