The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting SCI ObservationsGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| SCI Observations | Login/Join |
| One of Us |
Here are the latest financials of the Foundation that I found. They are from 2017. http://safariclubfoundation.or.../10/FS-FY17-SCIF.pdf | |||
|
| One of Us |
| |||
|
One of Us |
The biggest problem I have with Charity Navigator is as I stated above. They look at percent of revenue spent on Program Services but do not look beneath the covers to see how appropriate those expenditures are. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
|
One of Us |
Thanks for the explanation Mike. Life itself is a gift. Live it up if you can. | |||
|
| One Of Us |
Regardless of all of the negatives and warts on SCI, if you will go to the thread- Why I like SCI, I think you will see and expose' on one of the greatest programs that SCI runs,,,,ie American Wilderness Leadership School. AWLS runs a hunting/shooting oriented camp for High School teachers from around the country...and regardless of their liberal or antis feelings going in, from my years of involvement and current Chapter participation, the feedback from attendees is universally POSITIVE!! We need more of this kind of support for our Sport if we wish to save it...another Wacko reported in Daily Mail about how vulgar and deranged US hunters are after hacking SCI Convention. Further SCI, DALLAS, NRA really needs to immediately develop a TV ad campaign that creates the visual surrounding the "Campfire Program"...showing why hunters do provide conservation and protection of wildlife...by involving locals in hunting camps jobs, do the 24/7/365 anti poaching patrols, provide funds back to tribes as well as meat, and protection of tribal people and farms from marauding animals they must live with...providing an economic value on animals...so they aren't poached. If the Hunting community can/will start this type of an ad campaign...we might turn the tide...this is where every nickel and dime earned by SCI and DSC should go on the ground today!! Let's get with it...if we want to save ourselves from the antis...this is a very provocative position that can't be argued with...Hunters Protect Animals and Pay for anti poaching...how can they argue...WE BETTER GET WITH IT...or the antis message will prevail!! YES, just like any other US Corp, SCI needs to shed a bunch of jobs in cost cutting...135 employees do What??!!...DSC has how many 4-5. The difference in payroll costs could put a BIG MESSAGE on the air waves... Anti's can't fight that message!! Cheers, 470EDDY | |||
|
| One of Us |
SCI generated $21.6 million of revenue. They had to have more than a handful of employees. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Agreed 100%. Why aren't they doing this?????? . | |||
|
| One of Us |
I think if you research a bit Libby Grimes is not "in charge" of the SCI Convention. | |||
|
| Administrator |
They have no time for something like this. Their time is being used to dream up New Circles for some clueless idiot to brag about!  | |||
|
| One Of Us |
I believe that if we all proactively start a large front of members and life members...influence Chapter Officers who sit on International board...and basically demand that this is where members wish to focus...we can do it....it MUST BE DONE to SAVE HUNTING!! I have already started by writing an email to both Paul Babaz President, elected by Board, and Rick Parsons, hired/paid CEO and basically said the same thing that is in my AR post. I don't have the contact of the latest DSC President, however I am a member and will do the same when I can obtain email address. I was hoping that Karl Evans would see this post and pick up the wand....I recall he is back as DSC President. Problem is that Rick Parsons who I think has done a good job...and was Lawyer in charge in WA DC for years...with wildlife background...is wanting to retire...so for him to pick up the wand at this late stage might be wishful thinking?? Maybe he should take this on as an after retirement project...SAVE HUNTING. Young Mike Rogers does some fine movie making for SCI...he could do the TV ad message and start running with lots of footage to use!! How do we enlist NRA...I don't know ow to crack this one...I have emails for both Wayne LaPierrs and Chris Cox...they ahve never answered important requests I have made...and I am a Life Benefactor!! LETS START THE CAMPAIGN...NOW!! SCI-DSC-NRA...maybe even holding hands...but separate and strong messages from all fronts might be more effective!! LET'S ROLL!! CHEERS, 470EDDY | |||
|
| Administrator |
Great idea. I wish these organizations would get together and make a difference. I see reports that the NRA membership dues are on the decline. Very sad indeed! I think every single gun owner should be a member. | |||
|
| One of Us |
A meeting was held at the SCI offices last August regarding this very subject, I was in attendance, as were several representatives from the NRA and SCI. It was proposed that the three groups present a united front against anti hunter and anti gun groups and all three groups pledged cooperation. One of the organizations was to spearhead the effort but nothing much has transpired, so the other two groups met last month in Dallas and are moving forward with the idea. Expect to see something in the near future. By the way, Jim Porter with the NRA would be the proper person to whom emails should be addressed, he is now leading the HLF. 470EDDY, you can email me at karl@biggame.org or PM me here on AR. Karl Evans | |||
|
| One of Us |
I remember when all this started with fallout from the lion. There were some really good commercials from the NRA on hunting. Those commercials aired either Outdoor Channel or Sportsman's. At the time, I begged anyone who would listen to get those commercials on national networks. You can't tell me Fox News would not let the NRA buy ad space (they were selling it to Glock at the time). Or History Channel to run during Swamp People or Pawn Stars. I remember McCain during his run against Obama. He did a bunch of guest spots with Larry Wisheun (I know Sp) on Winchester World of Whitetail. Everybody who saw those spots were already going to vote for McCain. Some asked what was the big deal when in the Euro Forum the news was Prince Harry was not going to attend the family Pheasant Shoot. The big deal is that non hunters are going to have to see hunting in front of them. It will not survive in the shadows. If folks see the young Royal leave hunting and shooting it gives more young people the impression hunting and shooting are wrong. Earnest Hemmingway was very much a product of Theodore Roosevelt's hunting, just like Roark was a product of Hemmingway, and Peter Heathway Capstick followed Roark. These folks all presented hunting sporting hunting in Africa as a legitimate, positive human activity. The above were not seen as part of the hunting industry. They were folks of national audience and importance who happened to be sport hunters. That is what is messing now. We have hunting celebrities. Some are good and even demographically placed like Eva Shockey. However, she is a hunting celebrity, not a celebrity (some with national audience) that hunts. That is a tremendous difference. Up until the late 60s Hollywood elites were avid sport hunters including Africa. There engagement for lack of a better term made it cool to be a hunter. Now, the few that are still alive from that time are often quoted as regretting this behavior. We now there are sporting hunting and shooting Hollywood types, but just like those activities most are older whose careers are done (Tom Selleck and Curt Russell) The few younger ones keep this activity more or less hidden. I just found out Pink and her husband (pop rock singer) lets her daughter shoot. They were attacked by the internet mob. I understand the position of folks who want trophy pics kept off social media. I do not deny the logic of the position. However, hunting will not survive as an activity that is practiced in secret. We are a minority, and really a minority of a minority, and without public acceptance we cannot fight off legislative attacks. The Supreme Court will not save us. The standard of scrutiny this type of legislation faces will be too low. Therefore, shooters and hunters from the deer/meat/new waive yuppie hunters (think Steve Renelo) to the most accomplished sport hunter on this site must be engaged by our industry representative to create a platform that can be broadcasted to a mass audience on international hunting. Yes, international hunting means hunting in your own back yard. Does not mean we have to let go of convictions we hold on hunting that may be different from one another. It means we focus on creating and disseminating a platform that is broadly acceptable. I used Steve Renelo for two reasons. First, he is the national face of that segement of hunters. This is not a bad thing. I much prefer him and his articulation to Pig Man. He is the only hunting show on Netflix. While the standard hunting show is to gory for ESPN (when I was in Middle School ESPN had hunting on Sunday mornings) Steve will show a killed animal being gutted, skinned, and meat cooked with how to segments and shows. Second, he as spoken out against sport hunting in Africa. Specifically, the lion incident. Yet, he has done shows and continues to hunt brown bear. I maintain such a mindset can be reached if he were engaged. The one thing that scares me more than most is that the NRA and hunting have been traditional allies because the number one activity most folks engaged in the use of Firearms was hunting. Now, my suspension is more folks own firearms for recreational, sport shooting/competitions than hunting. I am not calling out their firearm ownership. I am simply stating that we as hunters stand the risk of becoming more marginalized when we loose the rank and file gun owner from our group. I will give everyone a free tag line for the first set of commercials: "Let's Go Hunting." | |||
|
| One of Us |
Karl, what was SCI's reason for dropping the ball? | |||
|
| One Of Us |
LHeym500- you are BANG on!! We need to dig out all of our allies in Hollywood and Nashville...and there are still many that are avid hunters who would gladly be part of a legitimate and professional campaign to show the POSITIVE side of hunting... Clint Eastwood, Harrison Ford, Don Johnson, NBA, NFL players, Nashville singers including Tom K...and shape the story to make it unrefutable!! Yes, play in the Schools that have been built, I know of regional medical clinics in the bush in Mozambique, my wife and I have participated in tribal inoculations programs for years after hunting the Zambezi near Chaborra Bossa ....these are very powerful but currently hidden from view of the impressionable. We must get going on this and push hard!! Cheers, 470EDDY | |||
|
One of Us |
Don't forget Tom Selleck.  | |||
|
| Administrator |
Tom Selleck as an exception, he did not mind publicly saying he likes guns. I have met several sportsmen who have won world championships in their chosen sports, some have come to my house, had dinner with us. Some have come to look at our shooting range, because they wanted to make one like it. Many of them actually go hunt, but they like to keep it a secret from the public, due to their "sponsors". | |||
|
| One Of Us |
Tom Selleck is still around...so is Chuck Yeager, and Clint Eastwood...Ted Nugent....the rest of them, hopefully with exceptions that we can find- we have been living with entertainers out here for 4 months...and all of them are trained in DRAMA schools...and DRAMA AIN'T REALITY!! And the old saying goes- "if you keep saying it long enough, they believe it"...so these Drama trained entertainers do NOT live REALITY...the big problem is they get popular and then listeners and fans BELIEVE their FANTACY WORLD..that's the challenge!! I spent my entire Corporate career in the Forest Products industry. A sustainable and renewable resource!! Remember back in the 70-80's and 90's when the tree huggers fanned the fires AGAINST cutting trees...YUP almost as vicious at the anti's now on the Big 5 and other wildlife...and YES they resorted to spiking trees to injure or kill loggers...which also killed trees!! Then they spun up the Spotted Owl.. and endangered species and harmed by logging!! Well, the industry banded together and fought anti's and government for almost 2 decades..and WE WON!! You rarely hear much about logging these days...just another crop like corn!! That is the fight we are facing now in WILDLIFE...we MUST generate a strong argument, publish and present well by professional and credible people and scientists...and show them...wildlife is a sustainable and renewable resource...and poaching is stopped by hunters and hunting companies!! If we develop a good story and stick with it...WE CAN PREVAIL...show the good hunters do in tribal communities, blue bags,schools, medical clinics...provide meat to tribes...show the science...WE CAN WIN!! Forest Products DID!! Cheers, The 470EDDY | |||
|
| One of Us |
Without going into details, I believe SCI knows they have a problem. I have made some recommendations to the powers that be in an attempt to get more people through the door. I believe some,if not all of these ideas will be implemented. In the final analysis, some will always be unhappy with the location no matter where it located. I am of the opinion that the back to back dates are a bigger problem. | |||
|
| one of us |
I remember once asking a hunter I was sharing a camp with if he enjoyed the SCI convention.At that time I had never been to one.He said that he thought it was worth seeing once but once you've seen it there was no point in going again.As someone who is not part of the SCI social circle, and I am sure there are many like me,the show has to be set somewhere like Vegas. If the show is for SCI folk who are there to see there friends then I understand going with Reno. | |||
|
One of Us |
I am not sure what can be done, but I am glad that you made some suggestions. However they're folks like me who will not attend in Reno in the winter, period. I have flown into and out of Reno in the winter to go skiing, and quite frankly, it's a PITA. I am sure that Reno most likely gets less "tire kickers" then say Vegas. And I am not a big fan of Vegas at all, but the airport is much better. And a very wide range of hotel rooms. That said Salt Lake City does have a great winter airport and nice convention facilities, if SCI want to keep it out west and not everyone has their hand out like in Vegas. | |||
|
| One Of Us |
THAT'S ABOUT THE MOST TUNNEL VISION STATEMENT I HAVE EVER HEARD!! I have been a member since late 70's, Chapter president for 3 terms which puts you on the national board, member of the "The Quarter Century Club"...ie Old Farts...and I have NEVER participated in the "clicky club stuff!!" I have a lot of friends, mostly PH's that I have hunted with...but also many, many friends I have met in our great hunting circles...and SCI and Dallas are great places to go to say HOWDY to people you don't see regularly!! Then all of the new stuff and new exhibitors... YOU'RE PRETTY BORING IF YOU CAN'T HAVE FUN DOING THAT!! I don't care where it is...I have FUN!! Yes, I do prefer various places....but not enough to CARE!! Cheers, 470EDDY | |||
|
| One of Us |
I personally hate Reno and agree with you. However, I believe the back to back dates are bigger problem. While I do not know for an absolute fact that they can't get out of the contract with Reno for the next two years, I suspect they can't without a serious penalty. If I was a member of the power structure, I would be trying to change the dates to something at least two weeks after DSC if I was them, preferably longer. My ideas all had to do with getting more people to come to Reno. The SCI power structure needs to realize that there is a group of spouses, significant others that have exactly ZERO interest in the show itself. The don't want to go if there is nothing else for them to do. That keeps some attendees away. This was one area I focused on. There were others. Time will tell. My personal opinion is that without change , 2020 will be worse than 2019 as DSC is first AND there is one less day between the two. I hope they find the answer. | |||
|
One of Us |
Larry, I do agree there is a scheduling problem. It’s not just DSC and SCI, but there were so many shows stacked up and even overlapping (i.e. ATA, SHOT, and a few others I don’t recall). As I believe Karl and other top DSC officers (I don’t think any SCI Officers post here), the convention dates are set well in advance. Reno may be more flexible with the connection SCI now has, but I don’t know. I do know in the first few years that DSC moved to the DCC, it was (local hotels and restaurants) because the cheerleading conference overlapped. I do, however, recall DSC from being out by DFW, The Anatole, and Market Hall. I’m happy to see how it has grown and the organic path it has taken. I will say that I’ve never been to the “big” SCI. My father went when it was almost always in Reno. He loved it, but that was back when DSC was in the smaller places mentioned. I would like to go one year, as one mentioned above it’s a sight to see, but I don’t know if DSC hasn’t equaled that by now. I have never been to Reno, but that might excite me more than Las Vegas. I would enjoy some time skiing close by, whereas I’d likely just lose money in Las Vegas. Some of those Class 3 ranges do sound fun, though. Back to the scheduling, it has to be difficult to travel with a booth all over with a short amount of time. They do mostly fall in the off season for most outfitters regardless of the continent. However, I still hear of outfitters from Africa that are still in the USA going to various shows here. It must be worthwhile for them to be away from home for so long. As you stated, I hope there is an answer. I meant to be DSC Member...bad typing skills. Marcus Cady DRSS | |||
|
| One of Us |
Marcus: While it is certainly difficult for the exhibitors with the back to back shows, I think the real issue is for the members. Let’s look at 2020 if we do both. We leave on a Wednesday for Dallas. Back Sunday. In the office one day. Leave for Reno on Tuesday. Back Sunday. We will have killed almost two weeks consecutively. That is tough. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I would agree that the scheduling is a big problem. I was speaking with a very large RSA outfitter last night. He had lots of complaints. The biggest was flights. He said that yes Reno did get the airlines to add flights but they were too expensive. He flew to Vegas and rented a car for the week and it was still cheaper than the flight into Reno. He also mentioned that 60% of the Zimbabwe outfitters said they were not coming back next year. I don't know if that's correct or not, but will find that out next January. He also said most outfitter gave an ear full to the powers that be. He said he was hopeful that SCI can get out of the contract. But it's going to cost them dearly to do so. However, it might cost them even more if they don't. I guess could run ski busses to Tahoe for skiing. That said, I've taken the bus from Reno Airport to North Lake Tahoe and when the bus has to stop and chain up, you know there are problems ahead. Another thing that I will say about SLC Airport is they can keep that airport running even in a snowstorm. And activities for spouses would be more numerous, Plus it's a very easy drive to Park City. I suspect DSC will need to find a way to make additional floor space. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Has SCI ever looked into hosting its convention in its hometown of Tucson or in Phoenix? I know that the convention started in Las Vegas(I have friends that were a part of the first ones), but Phoenix has weather similar to Las Vegas, hosts professional sports teams, has two PAC 12 Universities within 50 miles of each other, hosts winter baseball training camps for the professional baseball teams, etc etc etc. Is there not enough convention space? Salt Lake City is a great town (I grew up 47 miles south of it), but I am not sure that it has enough convention space for SCI, and it has winter weather similar to Reno. And, if you don't ski, and yes it does have the greatest snow on earth, then what do you do for entertainment? Remember, Utah's liquor laws are not what they are in every other state. I guess you could tour Temple Square. . . . Just my two cents worth. | |||
|
| One Of Us |
Hey Guys, Is short term memory really that short?? Do y'all remember Phil deLone, smiling, patronizing former SCI Exec Director?? He left to be RENO Convention Chief!! Don't you think there is some "crazy" connection with SCI being dragged there.... The word is- RENO GAVE SCI the Convention Center and the Busses from all Hotels GRATIS/THAT's FREE...to host SCI in RENO...Reno needed SCI and think of the Bottom Line/SCI if you don't pay rent...Whining aside, with that, AIN'T GONNA CHANGE, EH??!! 470EDDY | |||
|
| Administrator |
There was a post on here earlier which seems to clear this up. But, I do agree that anything SCI gets involved in not what it seems! About time they start listening to their members, although I won't hold my breath! | |||
|
| One of Us |
They did just send out a mass e mail to exhibitors. It does sound like they are listening. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Can somebody post the email Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
|
| Administrator |
Dear Exhibitors You are not donating enough to SCI! All current donations to double for next year, or no space would be allocated to you. Sincerely SCI Top Brass!  | |||
|
One of Us |
When did S.C.I. start charging a Buyers Premium on Donated Hunts? | |||
|
| Administrator |
Not sure they do. But many professional hunters are complaining tha first SCI demands they donate hunts to them Then they use these hunts in their auction to compete with them!! The genius of SCI I am surpr7thdy have not invented INNER CIRCLES for donations!  | |||
|
| One of Us |
The value of which greatly assists in determining a prime spot on the floor.  | |||
|
| One of Us |
If the exhibitors were to refuse the strong-arm tactics deployed by SCI and boycott the show for just 1 year, I 'm pretty sure it would have a convincing effect. Problem is that the exhibitors don't have the cojones to do it.  | |||
|
| Powered by Social Strata | Page 1 2 3 4 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
Visit our on-line store for AR Memorabilia