After reading through the Judge's postings, I wonder,and question a hunt in Africa,due to injuries suffered on the job and in the Army, I can't rukk or back pack any more,can almost double pace a good 5 miles, but the spinal compression gets me in the end.

With that said it appears a "BIG" game hunt is out, what would a normal plains game type of hunt, require in your opinons for fitness?

I am overweight. I've had knee and ankle surgeries in the past. I am a diabetic. Despite all these things, I have been on 3 safaris to RSA. In addition, I have hunted elk/antelope/deer out west over the past 10 years.

If you can walk 5 miles/day, you can hunt plainsgame in Africa. In most cases, you will spot something, either from elevation or a truck, then stalk. Your fitness level may play a role if you have to sprint to a spot in order to get a shot before the animal moves out of sight/range, or if you wound something and have to track up/down the terrain to get second shot.

Brad

When I went to Namibia this summer my PH knew (or discovered) that I couldn't climb mountains or sprint across country. Other than a leopard (which was uncooperative) I took the animals I wanted and don't recall a single stalk of five miles or more. It actually sounds like you are in better shape than me.

I would be surprised if you could not find a hunt for whatever you want. I do think that elephant and buffalo can demand longer stalks for the best chance at good trophies, but I will let those with experience address that. Five miles at a stretch sounds pretty good to me.

Dave,

If you can double time for around 5 miles, I think you will be in better shape than many DG hunters here..

When weight and fitness are discussed on these forums, I am surprised how many folks are over 250lb, some over 300lb...A small proportion of them are going to be 6'2" plus guys with a footballers or heavy weight boxers physique, but most will be just carrying too many burger and fry's..(I fit into the last catagory!)

As for carrying a heavy rucksack, I don't think that is required on most hunts...just a small amount of belt order and a rifle..heck, the staff will even carry that if things get too tough..

My biggest concern is not being able to run a marathon but handling the heat...how folks hunt when them temp gets up in the high 80sF and beyond, I just don't know..

Regards,

Pete

Dave,
No, You can still hunt BG in Tanzania... We could spot and stalk hunt you later in the year, say in October, after the big burns have taken place, and the buff come out to eat the new green shoots...Our hunters seldom walk over a mile of two for buffalo during that time, unless the just want to...Lions and cats can be hunted from a blind and plainsgame from the vehicle or by spot and stalk that time of year....

July is tough to hunt Buffalo because of the thick stuff but everyone saw Buffalo and everyone gets shots shots at them...Shots are close in that stuff...If you can walk 5 miles your capable even in July...

quote:

If you can walk 5 miles/day, you can hunt plainsgame in Africa.

Agreed.....state in advance what your limitations are and they'll accommodate your needs. I'd bet you could hunt RSA in a wheelchair if you wanted to. Just let them know what the situation is.

I would agree with Snakelover. In RSA you can make the hunt as physically demanding as you want but it can also be relatively easy. Many outfitters and safari companies in RSA can accomodate hunters with physical impairments.
You are correct that in some of the other countries (such as Tanzania), there may be a lot more walking involved.

The secret to physical fitness is to stay single and date physically active younger women, you'll be inspired to keep up with them and stay lean as a result.

Tell me you won't pedal harder with this riding in front of you.



Lechery is the key to a long and healthy life.

THanks guys,,

Skinner, No can do, I'm on the thrid wife now

Dave,

The big game animals can and will be hunted by you in Tananzia...You can get the boy to stay directly in front of you carrying your rifle..You can use a walking stick also rifle rest for extra balance and third leg..This is how I hunt the late season for deer in Pa. Walking staff for shooting rest...Works great...

Mike
Selous in 06

I've often wondered about this, but didn't want to come across as being a wiseass or to offend. That said, I'd say at least 60% of the photos I see here are of folks 50+ in years, and 75% of those seem to be *considerably* overweight (especially the Americans--big surprise! ).

I hope to hunt Africa long before I'm 50, and want to be in better shape than I am now to do it, and hope to train on long, tiring hikes and maybe work on my CV stamina enough to be able to stomp along every bit as much is required, but I wonder sometimes just how 'grueling' the work *really* is that some talk about. Why? Well shoot, I'd bet my bottom dollar that many, if not most of the older, bigger folks I've seen pics here of can no way, no how hump five miles up steep grades or through thick or otherwise tough terrain, all in serious heat for 10 days or what have you on their very best days. Double time? Yeah, right. But I bet they do just fine riding around until they see something close worth a quick shot or short stalk. I mean, when people here use terms like 'accomodating' hunters with physical disabilities, is that just a cute euphemism for drive around, see a critter, stop and shoot? If that's what they want to, or is the only way it'd be possible for them to hunt, that's their choice. I understand issues of physical impairment, by the way: I'm missing a lung as a result of trauma, so this isn't in any way a bash on poor health. But speaking for myself only, if I can't chase/stalk my animals, I'll go home empty handed; I refuse to shoot out of a truck. At anything. Personal choice.

Back to my question: there are obviously no absolutes, as safaris and local geographies are vastly different--even in adjacent areas, not just countries--but some of the admissions nd general talk about folks being close to being unable to walk, stoop or even carry gear makes me wonder just how many shots described at the end of a great, long stalk are really taken from the bakkie.

Maybe just my suspicious nature. If I'm wrong, then apologies, but I have a feeling that, well..."Luuuucy, choo got some 'splainin to dooooooo!" Thoughts?

Cheers,

KG

Dave asside from Elephant hunting - or dogged leopard, five miles is adequate for buff, walk and stalk lion, etc. You don't need to cary a pack. The assistant tracker/appy does that!

Kamo

You're right, a lot of people are plain out of shape. And then, a lot of them simply have problems. When I was a kid, we slogged up and down hills through grape vines and brush from morning to night chasing grouse (no dogs, just gutting them out). Ten or fifteen mile hunts were not uncommon. I'm now 55, and have had two serious heart attacks. It's pretty tough on me to poke around for a mile or two on the farm during deer season, but I get as much satisfaction from that as any hunting I've ever done, since I feel like I've accomplished something which is personally difficult. No matter what a persons disability, that's still what it is. If a person is old and overweight, he shouldn't have the right to enjoy a hunt at his level?

The problem with the moral high ground is you never know if there is a taller mountain. You won't hunt if you don't earn it? I bet some of the old African hunters would think you are a pussy, pardon the expression. Did you take a slow steamship to Africa? What, you flew in a comfortable plane? Did you walk from the coast to Ngorongoro? What? Did you walk the 20 klicks to where you started "earning your trophy"?

Ask yourself this question. If you were in the safari car going to the jumpoff point to "earn" your buff, and a 50" inch bull happened to cross in front of you on the way to water, would you tell the PH to keep driving? I bet not, and if not, then you're on the same slope as everyone else, just at a different point.

The first time I hunted Africa, I was in terrible shape, 30 pounds overweight and had been working 80 or more hours a week at a desk for the most part. My Kudu hunt was about a 5 mile hike to and back, mostly uphill on the way there. They took their time with me, and I made it fine. Since then I've tried to stay in shape, and I do not consider African hunting very strenuous at all.

I think people may mistake walking on flat ground with walking up and down hills with footing that is none too secure (ie. rocks), while carrying a rifle! I considered myself in pretty good shape until a 2 hour chase after a Kudu up and down rocky hills in Namibia! Still, the PH should know your limitations and adjust accordingly.
Peter

Usually the tracking is not at a real fast pace. It's when they decide to return to the cruiser that makes you appreciate just how fast those Africans can walk.

There is also, at least for me, a big difference in the morning and the afternoon stalk. In the morning I'm ready to go, but that afternoon stalk (after having lunch and resting a little) can really make one feel old. If you want to train for Africa, I would suggest walking twice a day. Once in the morning and once in the afternoon/early evening in order to build your stamina.

Regards,

Terry

I think that if you can walk 2 to 3 miles 2 or 3 days per week at a 15 or 20 minute per mile pace, adding in a little weight training, you should be able to do fine. I've turkey hunted in the hills of Tennessee using that regime and was able to put in 4 to 9 mile days up and down hills with a shotgun and light pack. I was tired, yes, but it was a good tired. Leg presses and calf raises with weight are great for handling hills.

quote:

Originally posted by Art S.:
No matter what a persons disability, that's still what it is. If a person is old and overweight, he shouldn't have the right to enjoy a hunt at his level?

The problem with the moral high ground is you never know if there is a taller mountain. You won't hunt if you don't earn it? I bet some of the old African hunters would think you are a pussy, pardon the expression. Did you take a slow steamship to Africa? What, you flew in a comfortable plane? Did you walk from the coast to Ngorongoro? What? Did you walk the 20 klicks to where you started "earning your trophy"?

Ask yourself this question. If you were in the safari car going to the jumpoff point to "earn" your buff, and a 50" inch bull happened to cross in front of you on the way to water, would you tell the PH to keep driving? I bet not, and if not, then you're on the same slope as everyone else, just at a different point.

You make some valid points and ask valid questions. My thoughts are thus: of course everyone has the right to hunt however they choose. That said, it wasn't exactly what I'd call the moral high ground from where I was looking. If people are willing to shoot from the truck, that's fine by me, but calling it a hunt is pretty ballsy. Seeems that a 'shoot' is a lot more accurate term. What effort and skills, other than in marksmanship, was involved?

As to your bull hypo, I'd like to think that I'd not be tempted by your 50" bull, but of course I would. But I guess that's the moment of truth, isn't it? If I did shoot it, I'd certainly later feel like I let myself down. Sort of like walking back to camp after a long day of deer hunting seeing nothing, then seeing a buck standing on the road after dark and shooting it. Did I earn that deer?

Food for thought. Thanks for the respoonse. Still a long way off, and trying to glean and learn stuff.

KG

Oh, and BTW, your comment about the 'pussy' stuff is pretty ridiculous. It's pomegranetes and pickles. If I'm not interested in taking an animal in what I see is a dishonorable way, one that would bother me later, I'm a pussy? If so, I guess I'm glad I'm not considered 'one of the gang'.

Cheers,

KG

From my one hunt (and from a fairly healthy 37 yr old), I'd say stamina is the most important element of fitness for an African hunt. The eland hunt did take a lot of walking (about 15 km), but it could have been less. About all we ever did was just walk, almost no running, or even jogging pace. Just a slow steady walk.

The only times I really felt out of shape were when we walked on loose sand for a moderate distance, and having to crawl for about 150 yds. Not really sure how to work the long crawl into a shape up plan for the next hunt.

Dave:
There are plenty of outfitters who will cater to whatever physical limitations you have. Just make them known up front. Mafigeni Safaris is one. The most important thing is to GO! The second most important thing is to disregard 90% of the bullshit you read on this site.
Dave

I once hunted with a ph that blew out his knee on day two of our safari and could not would not be replaced after the first few shots and no need of followup and some questioning about my comfort level and experience.

we did a spot and stalk hunting and he stayed with the truck while the head tracker and I made the final aproach and did the shooting this was unusual but the best safari I was ever on As far as the feeling of being the hunter in charge

I got the last two days to bird hunt and chase baboons on my own that was just to cool.

Obesity Rates Up in Most States
KEVIN FREKING, Associated Press
Tue Aug 23,10:08 AM ET

WASHINGTON - Obesity rates rose last year in every state but Oregon, according to an advocacy group that called on the government and the private sector to get more involved in Americans' battle with expanding waistlines.

The advocacy group, Trust for America's Health, said data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention showed that the percentage of obese adults for 2002-04 stood at 22.7 percent nationally. The percentage for the previous cycle, 2001-03, was 22 percent.

The state exhibiting the largest increase in obesity was Alabama. There, the rate increased 1.5 percentage points to 27.7 percent. Oregon's rate held steady at 21 percent.

The report said the states with the highest percentage of obese adults are Mississippi, Alabama, West Virginia, Louisiana and Tennessee.

The states with the lowest percentage of obese adults are Colorado, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Connecticut, Vermont and Montana. Hawaii was not included in the report.

An official with the Trust for America's Health said the United States is stuck in a "debate limbo" about how the government should confront obesity. She used the report to call for more government action on several fronts, such as ensuring that land use plans promote physical activity; that school lunch programs serve healthier meals; and that Medicaid recipients get access to subsidized fitness programs, such as aerobics classes at the local YMCA.

"We have a crisis of poor nutrition and physical inactivity in the U.S., and it's time we dealt with it," said Shelley A. Hearne, executive director of the organization.

Radley Balko, a policy analyst at the Cato Institute, said he is wary of the call for more government action on obesity. The institute is a think tank that prefers free-market approaches to problems.

"I think obesity is a very personal issue. What you eat and how often you exercise, if that comes within the government's purview, it's difficult to think of what's left that isn't," Balko said.

Health policy analysts maintain that obesity increases the burden on taxpayers because it requires the Medicare and Medicaid programs to cover the treatment of diseases caused by obesity. The report issued Tuesday said taxpayers spent $39 billion in 2003 for the treatment of conditions attributable to obesity.

The Trust for America's Health recommended mandatory screening for obesity among Medicaid recipients, as well as nutritional counseling.

"Better prevention and disease management programs will result in cost savings to the system as a whole," the report stated.

Balko said it's not clear the government really knows how to persuade people to make better decisions. He said open-ended entitlement programs, such as Medicaid and Medicare, don't provide much of a financial incentive for people to watch their weight. The government just picks up the cost of treating diseases for those patients, regardless of the amounts, he said.

He prefers that the government give Medicaid and Medicare recipients an incentive to open medical savings accounts, which would allow them to save money when they did not access the health care system.

"If they knew they only had so much to spend, or what they did not spend could be saved, then maybe you could instill a certain sense of responsibility and ownership," Balko said.

Adults with a body mass index of 30 or more are considered obese. The equation used to figure body mass index is body weight in kilograms divided by height in meters squared. The measurement is not a good indicator of obesity for muscular people who exercise a lot.

Kamo:

I agree with you. I once posted that there is no shortage of fat guys with full African trophy rooms. Have money? You can fill that trophy room in Africa.

That is why a guy like Sherwin Scott is so impressive. Yea, he obviously has money, but that guy has been slogging up and down mtns for the last few decades.

Kamo

I think you misunderstood my "pussy" comment. I was trying to joke a little about the point I was making there; it's all relative to your point of perception. In your original note, you described your preferred method of hunting which sounds pretty rigorous in today's environment. However, it would likely be a cakewalk to someone who was required to literally walk for three months on a safari, which was a common siutation 80 years ago. Compared to that pradigm, what you describe would rate the "P" tag.

That is the heart of my comment. The accomplishment should be measured by the challange, not the absolute exertion. Nobody, I believe, is in favor of shooting from cars (which is illegal everywhere I have ever hunted). However, people have been hunting from wheelchairs for a long time. I have an old Gun Digest from the 50's where someone hunted buffalo in a wheelchair. In my mind, anyone who has the nerve to confront a buff anywhere while immobile in a wheelchair has overcome more of a challange than has a normal healthy guy who happened to walk ten miles and sweat a bucket full.

Every body owes it to themselves to be in the best shape they can for hunting, whether they are a marathon runner or a paraplegic. Generally, the better physical speciman will be more successful. That doesn't mean that one has earned it more than the other. In my mind, there is a difference between being a better hunter and a superior hunter, however you want to personally define that.

Dave,

My very first African hunt was May of this year. Mileage was not the consideration, even though it was walk and stalk. After one very slow stalk of three - four hours our PH's GPS showed we only covered 2.4 miles. If you had asked me, I would've said twice that.

It was more difficult moving at a stalker's pace, not rustling the scrub, not stepping on dead crackling leaves, and at sometimes in sand that was 6 - 10" deep. The tracker or PH was more than accomodating in carrying little extra stuff in their backpacks.

Fred

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
I think people may mistake walking on flat ground with walking up and down hills with footing that is none too secure (ie. rocks), while carrying a rifle! I considered myself in pretty good shape until a 2 hour chase after a Kudu up and down rocky hills in Namibia! Still, the PH should know your limitations and adjust accordingly.
Peter

I second the motion -- a week after running a marathon, I went on my first deer hunt in northern Maine. My hunting partner (who doesn't work out and had back surgery the previous year) wore me out because he walks in the woods every day at work, and I don't.

Kamo,

You are assuming alot about men, shape, and ages...I walked 7 miles a day before my safari and bicycled and additional 10 miles a day and not just riding but peddling hard..Both leg and cardio vascular...Yes, I have put on a little weight but I am 6 feet and 195...
Take a look at the lion video just posted it is a young guy like you...Does not want to hunt hard for lion for a free roaming lion but will brag about the lion he shot..But leaves out that he shot it behind a fence in an enclosure...
What's wrong with older men now wanting to spend their hard earned money after working a lifetime..Yes some are handicapped and need help...Accommendations have to be made... But yes there are the socalled hunters who shoot from the vehicle, hell there are a ton of those guys here in the USA and they are called poachers..Most are young guys who are stealing from ethical hunters..
As for my hunt in Zim I walked some of the Ph's into the ground...I hunted river drainage thick and green and 90 degree heat, but I kept putting gatorade in my water and that kept this old hunter going and going...Every day for 5days and finally a bull ele at 30 feet...

Mike

quote:

There is no shortage of fat guys with full African trophy rooms.

And I know some of those "old fat guys" that can still out hunt a lot of the young guys any day of the week!

My responses weren't meant, as indicated right off the bat, to call people out for their physique or level of fitness, and it wasn't take potshots at guys who have failing health and still choose to go on safari. It was more an observation, and NOT an assumption--as you suggest--that many that hunt Africa are grossly out of shape, and still manage to bring home an amazing bag of critters. You can disagree all you like, but it is my contention, based on what I've read, seen and been told by folks I know who have been, that for the most part, being in tip-top physical conditioning *isn't* hardly a requirement. I also wondered out loud if many with these impressive trophies really worked for them, for I have some serious doubts. I'm not looking to crucify anyone, just get a few straight, real answers. Get it now?

Here's a simple question, see if you can answer without getting defensive: how many folks that pay for a safari come home totally empty handed? Oh, well, virtually none you say? *Why is that?*

There are other places virtually crawling with certain game (though admittedly it's hard to realistically compare to Africa) that is hunted, but few hunters come home successful, and even fewer with "high scoring" critters. *Why is that?*

All you have to do is spend 5 minutes walking around the SCI convention to realize that it is not just skinny guys hunting Africa.

I went to Moz last year. We walked much further than 5 miles every day. I should have been in better shape than I was. My huffing and puffing slowed us down several times.

Altitude makes a difference too. I live at sea level and a lot of inland African hunting areas are at 3000 ft. or more so I have to work a little harder.

The more fit you are in the more fun the hunting will be.

I don't think I've ever been on a hunt that was as hard as everyone said it was going to be. I think people tend to exaggerate their daring-do to some extent. Listening to people talk about preparing for a Dall sheep hunt last year about had me talked out of going since it was backpack all the way. I don't exercise much. It turned out to be great fun. A few of the climbs were bitches, I'm not sure I ever took a step that didn't shift underneath me, I lost a big toe nail, but I was quite proud of myself. You don't have to be Lance Armstrong to have a good hunt. To me the key was staying hydrated. If I get dehydrated I'll turn belly-up.

Stay away from stupid stunts. I wore cotton socks on one elk hunt and blistered both heels the first day trying to skirt a herd.

I played golf in borrowed shoes that were two sizes too small and blackened both big toe nails leading to the one I lost sheep hunting.

As long as I think, and pay attention to what my body's telling me I come through in pretty good shape.

Don't rule out anything until the day you die.

Woman Offended by Doc's Obesity Advice
Associated Press August 24, 2005

ROCHESTER, N.H. - As doctors warn more patients that they should lose weight, the advice has backfired on one doctor with a woman filing a complaint with the state saying he was hurtful, not helpful.

Dr. Terry Bennett says he tells obese patients their weight is bad for their health and their love lives, but the lecture drove one patient to complain to the state.

"I told a fat woman she was obese," Bennett says. "I tried to get her attention. I told her, 'You need to get on a program, join a group of like-minded people and peel off the weight that is going to kill you.' "

He says he wrote a letter of apology to the woman when he found out she was offended.

Her complaint, filed about a year ago, was initially investigated by a panel of the New Hampshire Board of Medicine, which recommended that Bennett be sent a confidential letter of concern. The board rejected the suggestion in December and asked the attorney general's office to investigate.

Bennett rejected that office's proposal that he attend a medical education course and acknowledge that he made a mistake.

Bruce Friedman, chairman of the board of medicine, said he could not discuss specific complaints. Assistant Attorney General Catherine Bernhard, who conducted the investigation, also would not comment, citing state law that complaints are confidential until the board takes disciplinary action.

The board's Web site says disciplinary sanctions may range from a reprimand to the revocation of all rights to practice in the state.

"Physicians have to be professional with patients and remember everyone is an individual. You should not be inflammatory or degrading to anyone," said board member Kevin Costin.

Other overweight patients have come to Bennett's defense.

"What really makes me angry is he told the truth," Mindy Haney told WMUR-TV on Tuesday. "How can you punish somebody for that?"

Haney said Bennett has helped her lose more than 150 pounds, but acknowledged that the initially didn't want to listen.

"I have been in this lady's shoes. I've been angry and left his practice. I mean, in-my-car-taking-off angry," Haney said. "But once you think about it, you're angry at yourself, not Doctor Bennett. He's the messenger. He's telling you what you already know."

quote:

Obesity rates rose last year in every state but Oregon,

Well that's one thing positive about livin' the the People's Republic of Oregon...


Quite honestly the hardest hunt I've ever done was a hound hunt for bear in the Boise River drainage. Running after dogs for 5 days in 90 degree weather at 6000 ft terrain that a goat would think twice about. That will show you how out of shape you are.

I could lose about 10-15 lbs (6'5" @ 214lbs). But just getting out and doing a brisk 2-4 mile walk every day at lunch is great for my physique as well as psyche. That and the gym about three times a week (weights and hill climber/teadmill) keeps things under control.

Next week I'll start wearing a pack on my daily walks with 20 or so pounds in it, incrementing up every week. Hunting season is coming up fast.

If nothing else hunting is more fun when your in decent shape.


-Steve

quote:

Originally posted by RBHunt:

quote:

There is no shortage of fat guys with full African trophy rooms.

And I know some of those "old fat guys" that can still out hunt a lot of the young guys any day of the week!

Not in the mountains you won't RB. I have yet to see a good sheep hunter I would nickname "puddin"

If you want to get warmed up for Africa try
pig shooting on the Western plains in New South Wales in Australia.The hottest I have seen was 46 C-about 110 F.At that temp it is exhausting just taking your turn to get a beer from the fridge!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by fla3006:
Obesity Rates Up in Most States
KEVIN FREKING, Associated Press
Tue Aug 23,10:08 AM ET

Blah, blah, blah. According to these groups (yes, there are many) who base their self-serving findings on BMI (height VS weight), Arnold Schwarzenegger is obese. I'm not saying we aren't an overweight nation. I'm just saying there's more to health and conditioning than BMI.

Dave
Dave

My BMI is under 30 (but not by much). However, I prefer the SMR - Stud Muffin Ratio (I will take credit for its invention). Chest size divided by waist size. Sounds like lots here don't even make it over 1. Rest assured, Arnie does.

AAW,

My BMI is 20.8 and my SMI is 1.25, but I would like to get my BMI under 20 and my SMI up to 1.3.

quote:

Originally posted by 500grains:
AAW,

My BMI is 20.8 and my SMI is 1.25, but I would like to get my BMI under 20 and my SMI up to 1.3.

500: My BMI is 23.9. SMR is 1.21. I need to lose a few pounds.