quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
I asked two of the big grocery store managers just how much food they stock.

...

I also asked around the convenience/gas stations around. They resupply gasoline every two to four days.

Rich

Those are actually the optimistic schedules.

If the electricity stops, so does the gasoline - no matter how much is in the tanks; the cash registers -- no matter how much is on the shelves; the ATM's -- empty or full; the water supply (it doesn't climb the stairs to get in the towers); sewage disposal -- only drains downhill if there is a pump to keep "downhill" from getting full; the police protection (squad cars run on gasoline and base station radios run on electricity. The radios will continue to run only so long as there is natural gas or stored fuel available to turn the generators over); fire protection -- the trucks stop running when the water does ... in short, everything we count on to keep life humming along hinges, either directly or indirectly, on electricity.

This is part of my reason for starting to reload. If the SHTF, the price of ammunition will go up to correspond with the need for it coupled with the inability to obtain it ... which will happen simultaneously.

So, having a few rounds of 9mm to barter could mean I can get antibiotic for my wife's cut or a gallon of gas for the neighbors generator so I can recharge my non-solar batteries.

It also means that I have a few rounds of 9mm, .223,. 308, etc. to greet the takers ... those guys who "prepped" by setting aside 3 days worth of Slim-Jims, 5 gallons of cheap whiskey and 10,000 rounds of ammo.

quote:

Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
Expanding ammo really elevates the performance of the 223/5.56, as it does in any calibre, even the 7.62x39.

Ammo type could have been another option. Barring an attack by an armored horde of "Dictionarians"*, ball just isn't the way to go.


I bought a couple thousand SS109s a while back. I probably won't be buying any more until that is all that is left on the shelves. In that case, I will buy it, load it, shoot it and like it. But only for lack of viable options.



*Primly dressed women shooting from behind copies of Websters 37th Collegiate Edition.

quote:

If the electricity stops, so does the gasoline - no matter how much is in the tanks; the cash registers -- no matter how much is on the shelves; the ATM's -- empty or full; the water supply (it doesn't climb the stairs to get in the towers); sewage disposal -- only drains downhill if there is a pump to keep "downhill" from getting full; the police protection (squad cars run on gasoline and base station radios run on electricity. The radios will continue to run only so long as there is natural gas or stored fuel available to turn the generators over); fire protection -- the trucks stop running when the water does ... in short, everything we count on to keep life humming along hinges, either directly or indirectly, on electricity

The more populated the area the faster it well go down hill.

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:
With all the talk about how great the Garand is

I am really surprise no one keeps one around as a personal defensive weapon.

Could it be that they weigh to much have, limited ammo cap, can't put optics on easy, use out dated clips instead of mags ect.

I keep one in the closet with two clips. What is generally close to hand though is an Arsenal AK74 with two 30 round magazines at hand. But realistically speaking it depends on what part of the house I'm in when things get crazy.

I've made an observation or two over the years. Yes, I have been in some tight spots and heard shots fired in anger.

Best gun there is for defensive purposes is the one that you have with you at all times and can produce within 2 seconds. If that happens to be a Keltec .32, great!, as it is superior to quad 50's back in the truck or a MOA super rifle locked up in the safe. Those not available immediately might as well be on the moon.

If you are going to a gun fight, then yes, take a rifle. And make it a good one.

P.S. If you can every day carry something bigger/better than a Keltec .32 that would be good. But whatever it is...you gotta carry it! And my home defense guns of choice are Rem 870's within quick gittin' distance on every level of my house.

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:

quote:

Originally posted by enfieldspares:

quote:

I'm no expert but a Garand is not a defensive weapon. It is a do anything battle rifle designed for offensive purposes when air support could not be called in.

Sorry guys but actually, and no disrespect to the men that carried it, a design flawed by the insistence that it be 30-06 and not as orginally designed 276 and that it have a non-detachable magazine.

Now had it been 276 and thus TEN ROUNDS it might just have had useful. Or had it a detachable magazine.

Now it was in 1936 probably BETTER than any other weapon of any other potential enemy but that doesn't mean it was not a design that was flawed by insistence on it being 30 calibre and not having a drop magazine.

The M14 was everything that the M1 ought to have been from the very start.

And was there anything better at the time?

Had been...since 1908...the Mondragon

Maybe not better but the Russian SVT 40 wasn't all that bad. The German even drew some designs off captured ones for their new rifle. The Finns used them up till 1958 I believe. There was more of a lack of training problem with them for the Soviet Army then there were technical ones.

Although never built during the war, but definitely drawn up was the French MAS 49/56. The French inventors escaped to England with the design,but the British wanted no part in making it. There are no bugs on that rifle. It's a solid very dependable design, but not used in WWII.

Now if you go to a smaller cartridge the German STg44 wasn't too bad either.

A brief history of post WW1 small arms

A first bullpup was made and used by french Renault FT17 tank crews.

Another weapon supplied to them was a firing port weapon, using the Chauchat mag and the 8 x 50 Lebel full power round.

French developed carabine mitrailleuse / machine carbines / Maschinen Karabiner in intermediate calibers during the last months of WW1 and adopted them

French RSCG 1918, used a cartridge based on .401 Winchester self loading brass modified to accept a 8mm Lebel bullet, was tested and adopted right before the end of WW1.

R stands for Ribeyrolles as in CSRG 1915 for Chauchat Sutter Ribeyrolles Gladiator or RSC 1917/ RSC 1918 for Ribeyrolles Sutter Chauchat.

The Ribeyrolles 1918 was Ribeyrolles brain child only.





There were many designs ready to be adopted when WW1 broke and abandoned because of WW1.

In fact a new ammo was adopted in 1913 to replace the rimmed Lebel round and a semi auto Meunier rifle was adopted.

After WW1, all studies were resumed and the whole equipment of French forces was to be replaced by no later than 1930

New LMG, adopted 1924 became Chatellerault 24 modified 29

SMG 1922 also known as carabine mitrailleuse STA 22 adopted as MAS 1924

You will see pictures of this weapon here, one French among my collection of Germans http://forums.accuratereloadin.../7811043/m/589109167

New rifles, bolt action (became MAS 36) and semi auto ( became 38, 38 A, MAS 40, then MAS 44 , MAS 49, 49/56)

New HMG in 13 mm Hotchkiss ( inspired Browning's MA Deuce)adopted 1918

New pistol, etc..


except the 24/29 , all was postponed because of budget and the Maginot line. http://forums.accuratereloadin.../7811043/m/953105667




French MAS 1940, the most modern semi auto rifle in WW2 http://forums.accuratereloadin.../7811043/m/316109667

Too bad it did not enter into production much earlier.
The first french semi auto prototype was built by two brothers, Clair, in Saint Etienne in 1888, only two years after the adoption of the Lebel and its smokeless 8 mm round.

In 1892, it is decided to launch large scale studies.
20 rifles are competing after 1900 and the Meunier is adopted in 1913 but it is not produced when WW1 breaks. http://forums.accuratereloadin.../7811043/m/930108487

In 1917, the RSCG rifle is adopted and 80 000 reaches the front line in 1918.

http://s192.photobucket.com/us...17/FSA19171.jpg.html

the RSCG 1918 is adopted but only a small batch is produced.
In 1922, the STAT produces a prototype very close to the MAS 35 that will become the MAS 38 then MAS 38/39 before to be adopted as MAS 40.
The MAS 40 is reborn as MAS 44 then modified as MAS 49 and finally as MAS 49/56.
The MAS 54 bullpup is not adopted and will be the base of the FA MAS.
The MAS 62 aka the French FAL will not be produced. (only a pre industrial batch of 300 pieces)









French soldier as he should have been after July 1940..
The first hundred rifles saw combat in May 1940, 50 with fixed magazine and 50 with detachable magazine.
(one of these rifles is in the collection of a private collector in USA, sold to him a few years ago by the son of a veteran who brought it back from France where he was stationed)




MAS 1944
MAS 1949

quote:

French soldier as he should have been after July 1940..

Where the white flag

in yer ass!

When the truth hurts.

Kind of torn between my AK and AR.

Mag changes are much faster at the moment with the my colt 6920's, and follow up shots are a little faster.


But federal fusion 7.62x39 out of my SGL-21 and SLR-107 should be pretty potent.

AK's are IMO a bit more robust as an end all/shtf, no parts or support will ever be available kinda rifles. And the fed fusion stuff shoots very close to the plinking ammo's POI to boot.

quote:

Want to try a 458 Lott before buying one. Will pay $50 and your range fee.

Post it to the big bore forum lots lott owners

Love working with my full-auto Sterling. Taking over from my AR/AK's. Things change.

Thinking aoubt Enfield Spares original comment on the M1 having been originally designed for the.276 caliber. Always thought it was the M1A that was supposed to accommodate the .276.

Dutch,

The M1A is the commercial offspring of the M14- which was always designed for the then new 762 NATO. The M1A is the modified version of the M14 sans FA components and a Garand type oprod mounting system. Springfield Armory (the commercial company, not the original government entity) used surplus parts and a cast receiver.

Garand ( Gar-end) initially designed the M1 predecessors to be 276 and first firing pin recoil operated, then gas trap operated and ended as we know then to be long stroke piston operated 30/06.

quote:

A well-aimed 9mm is a realistic choice out to at least 600 yards. That makes it viable at AR distances ..

New Kid interesting just wondering how and what with? max i ever thought of using my 9mm was at 100 yards.