Jean,

I was not going to try to talk you into changing your choice of arrows. I saw that you were looking for some inner shafts to add to yours.

I have some very slim carbon shafts that I had thought might fit inside your arrows - but they are .215 diameter, and too big.

I think you are right to worry about the strength of the aluminum inserts on your shafts. The adapters I am making will not fit your shafts, so I applaud your idea to get some steel adapters made for your arrows. You will need to use the very best high-tensile strength steel for the purpose - be sure that they don't use the usual easy-machining steel that is typically found in teaching shops.

Good luck in all ways, my friend.
Don

Thanks Don,

I stay in for the adapters You have ordered. 12 will be good to fit the Carbon tech Safari I have ordered. I want to test these arrows too. If I don't use them on buff, I have opportunities for boar.
Have You a definition or identity or Nr of high-tensile strenght steel. The only sorts of steel I am aware of are the ones uses to make knives.
Happy new year

OK, Jean.

By the way, I asked about the inside diameter of the Full Metal Jacket arrows. They said it was 0.204 inches.

Dear Don

Awfully sorry but to much work is cornering me no end. In fact I think that no arrow can have an inner diametre under 0.200.
0.200 is the size of the shank of a thread in broadhead. Please forgive my poor English : the shank being on a broadhead the cylinder of iron between the blades and thread.
No broadhead can be threaded in an hunting arrow whose inner diameter is under 0.200 (1/5 inch).
Once again I am startled by the fact that I conceived a project on a Beman Black max 300 with a easteon ST axis 300 in my mind. The issue being that all the measurements I made was on the only easton axis it remains............a 340. The rest of the axis, I gave to my PH who left the CAR with almost 1 million $ he stole from my friend Michel Angelvy of Kotto safari. Now this fucker is snug in Cameroon and out of reach of CAR's police and French police.
Consequently I made all my measurements with Beman 300 and a axis ST 340 and I wonder wether a easton axis 300 is slimmer than a Beman black max 300?
I am sorry to insist and maybe pollute this forum.
cheers

Thanks to 3 rivers archery I have received my axis 300. the OD is 0.273, the Inner Diameter about .200
A close friend which currently is making bits for drills (and has the tenure of one of the best hunting territory in the Alsace region) made a dozen of adapter-inserts for me.
These stainless steel devices are cone-shaped to fit a broadhead ferrule and the shank (1.7 inches)fits snugly the shaft. It provides a very tough link between the BH and the shaft.Far tougher than an aluminium adapter+ an aluminium insert. The chosen steel is flexible and was machined with 1/100 mm (1/2500 inch) precision.
The chosen Broadhead is a ECLIPSE
ECLIPSE

But I want the diameter of the ferrule to be not wider than the shaft. Consequently I cut off the upper part of the BH, keeping only a triangle-shaped BH whose ferrule Outer diameter is 0.314 inch (8mm). The former BH's breadth remains the same, 1.30 inch. A Zwickey, a Magnus, a Grizzly, a Stos, let alone Safari Steelforce are less broad. So I have a small margin if I want my ferrule diameter be the same as the shaft's, 0.273.
I'll post some pictures of this project.

IMO cape buffalo must be equally tough compare to our local seladang.the last we whacked one with a 80lbs Blackmax2 125grain fixed muzzy and a 2219 superslam.Arrow r completely destroyed resulted from it's fall and the broadhead got stuck into it's bone.Good experinces though.

Great Thread!! I am going to TZN in 2009 and have been considering trying to take one of the buff on license with a wheel bow. Seems the Allegiance is a popular choice for a heavy bow. Currently my only bow is a Switchback XT that maxs out at about 72#. I would like to get into something between 85-90# and am willing to spend the money on quality equipment. Have there been any good new heavy bows on the market since this thread was started? This will be my first foray into 80+ pounds and the only bows I know of that make that sort of poundage are the Bowtech Tribute, PSE Big Five, PSE Big 5 Pro, Mathews Safari and (apparently) the Allegiance. Can you guys make any suggestions and/or clue me into any I missed that are worthwhile? Is a custom bow a viable option? If so, who should I look at? Would like to shoot arrows of roughly 900 grains give or take.

Jean,

How did you get your allegiance to 90#? I was under the impression they did not go that high?

Thanks.

Bulldog

I was impressed by DonG’s advice and bought a 80# Bowtech allegiance. Fine.
Intensively training, I noted tiny thread of carbon popping out of the upper limb.
Very kindly, Bowtech offered to change the limbs for free according to lifetime guaranty. Nice fellows these Bowtech guys.
I suggested my getting a pair of 90# limbs and got them (very fast).
With little training I managed to use my bow at full poundage, 93#.
At this moment, june, the PH asked that I produce the more powerful bow possible.
So last week I switched for a 100# Bowtech tribute, because there are no longer 100# limbs available for the allegiance. They discontinue these powerful limbs because they have more confidence in the tribute riser, than the allegiance’s.
With this 100# bow, it’s another story. I began with 75#, 2 days later 85# and now I have a hard time @ 90#. A cam setting ; with the allegiance, when drawing the bow, all the efforts had to be made during the 20 first inches. With the tribute, I have to fight up to almost 25 inches before meeting the valley. This extra distance is very painful………and I wonder if I’ll meet 95# before the 29th july, when I’ll fly to Zimbabwe. Not sure that my move from the allegiance to the tribute made sense in so short a delay.
More bad luck, my chrony is out of order, so I don’t know what’s my 1000 grains arrows speed.

For the rest, as I discussed in this thread, I am sticking with the slimmest shafts available, the Easton axis 300. The slimmest the shaft, the better the penetration………..I think.

I am more and more intoxicated by Dr Ashby advice.
Concerning the optimal broadhead length/width ratio 1/3 I let down the great Eclipse for what Dr Ashby found the best, the Grizzly.
I wanted to use the long El Grande Grizzly, but I discovered that they are prone to badly bend (too long).



I switched to the almost similar BH the Stos whose ferrule is more forward


I want a BH frontal area the smallest possible. What’s the use of a large diametred 11/32 ferrule that’ll bulge, protrude from a 8/32 shaft. Consequently I cut off the backpart of my Stos so as the diameter of the ferrule be the same as the diameter of the shaft : 8/32. My stos are now 1 inch wide instead of 1.2 inch.
The frontal area is now 66% of the one from the shelf, what leads me to expect a greatly improved penetration.

To be more safe, I let down aluminium inserts and adapters. I have had lathed a tube of stainless steel conic to adapt at the ferrule and cylindrical to tightly the shaft : one piece of tough steel instead of 2 dubious pieces of aluminium. Remember that the junction between the adapter and the insert is the most fragile part of an arrow.

To stiffen the arrows, I am using 6/32 carbon rod.
To meet 1000 grains and 20% FOC I added 2 6/32 stainless steel rod, one in front and the other aft to obtain 20% FOC.
Look how slim are the Easton axis, the carbon rod, the stainless steel, the pic displayed the former project, the Eclipse's one.


That’s my project, don’t know if it makes sense.

Thank you Jean. Yes, it makes perfect sense and was very helpful.

Are you going Elephant hunting with Buzz? Should be exciting to say the least!!

I called the archery shop I use to ask the owners advice (he has taken two cape buffalo with a bow) on bows for buffalo. He strongly recommended I look at the PSE X Force HF. He said that it is faster and produces higher KE numbers then any 90 pound bow he has tried. Anyone have experience with it?

Thanks.

bulldog

I have a close friend who is a reporter and told me that even though he loath PSE, this X FORCE is a real bomb.
Nothing like the former acceptable bows that PSE was used to offer, more often as package.

I didn't have a try at it, but it's seemingly a revolution? Nothing to be compared with I am a Mathews fan (and less a Bowtech's) but I am a bit puzzled by the praises the X Force seems to deserve.
Like You, I'd like to hear what basic users feel about it?
Weatherby sells high speed ammos, but no this efficient. Is it the same with arrow?
thanks

Yes, seems like it is quite a bow if all the hype is true. Also looked like both the Mt. Nyala bow kills were with the X Force... If that proves anything.

That proves that Pete Shepley and PSE know how to advertise. Look on Youtube all the clips from PSE.
That (subliminally) conveys the idea that only PSE bows are capable DG huntingwise.

So I have been mulling this over after re-reading the thread a few times. My most likely set up at this point in time would be;

80# PSE X-Force 27.5" draw
210 gr Silver Flame BH's
Carbon Tech Safari Shafts or Custom Shaft based on the Beman Black Max (or similar)
May try the FOB's for fletching but not sure yet.

Couple of Questios:

Do you guys think it is worth the trouble/problems associated with putting together a custom shaft based on the Beman Black Max (or similar) to get a slightly smaller OD vs. using an off the shelf like the Carbon Tech Safari?

Don,

Did you get the 100 gr case hardened steel broadhead adapters from Carbon Tech? The bent broadhead adapter is kind of worrisome... Did you find anything stronger/better? When you say adapter, you are talking about the piece that connects the BH to the shaft insert right? Do you think using the Silver Flame BH with the 7075 T6 ferrule and the standard Carbon Tech Aluminum insert would be a good system?

Earlier in the thread you mentioned a 3gr/inch weight sleeve for the Carbon Tech Safari's... Is this also something they sell or did you find it from somewhere else?

Any other advice/input would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Josh