The sight on the left is a prototype Lyman 48 sight for a 1903 Springfield. Has anyone ever seen one on a rifle, in an article or book?

Michael,

There is a picture of a Lyman experimental sight in Brophy’s book on page 460. In my copy I cannot make out the numbers on the graduations so I can’t tell if its the same as your picture or not.

On page 473 he shows what he claims was the first Lyman 48 sight tested by Springfield Armory in 1910...which was before the 1911 patent date on other 48’s.

On page 475 he also makes reference to early models with “extra-long†slides measuring 2.5â€.

Hope this helps.

quote:

There is a picture of a Lyman experimental sight in Brophy’s book on page 460. In my copy I cannot make out the numbers on the graduations so I can’t tell if its the same as your picture or not.

On page 473 he shows what he claims was the first Lyman 48 sight tested by Springfield Armory in 1910...which was before the 1911 patent date on other 48’s.

On page 475 he also makes reference to early models with “extra-long†slides measuring 2.5â€.

Thanks,

I can see the numbers in my copy and it’s not the same, also on a 1920 Rifle.

The one on page 473 may be one of the prototype sights but its slide is turned sideways in the picture so can’t read the numbers.

I tell a bit more about the rifle once I see what folks have to say, don’t want to lead the jury.

MP

So...is this a multiple choice quiz?

I’m gonna cast my “guess†as a sight designed for a specific course of fire.

The sight is on an early custom sporter and I’m not sure what the original intent was for the numbers as seen on the early sight. What I understand so far is a few of these sights were tested by folks such as Crossman and Whelen and from their input the final 48 was developed. Just a fishing trip for more info on my part.

Have you been able to figure out the value of a click on this sight?

I can’t imagine at what distance someone would be shooting to need a slide that long. I have a Lyman 48S 125 point slide and it’s only an inch and three-quarters long.

The 48 was used on target rifles at Camp Perry, Peekskill and other 1000 yard ranges. The Brits shot up to 1200 at Bisley. A long range Palma shooter could tell us how many minutes of elevation are needed with the '06 going from 100 to 1000 yards. The old 150' sight staff was long enough for that change, maybe the later 125' was too.

I've seen both the long and extra longs.. wouldn't think the extra would make that much a diff, but it's an ugly cut into the stock

jeffe

My 308 only needs 37 min more for 1000, so I would think that 33 or so would be about right for an 06. Just remember, the 03 has fairly high front sight, so the sight would be at 10+ min for a 100 yd zero with these slides. PS I have a Lyman 17 hooded front made to fit in the 03 front dovetail in my junk-I mean spare parts pile, and that looks even higher than the std blade(which came in three or four heights).

I just pulled out my long slide 48S and on mine the numbers go all the way to the bottom of the slide. The ones shown on here have a large empty space at the bottom that makes them longer than they really need to be.

Michael,

Try contacting Garry Fellers about this sight. He has more old sights than anyone I’ve ever seen. I’ve bought several Lyman 48’s from him and he seems to be pretty savy.

Gary Fellers
(817) 346-9633

The long slide first model “150†hit the market about August, 1911, the second model “125†came out circa 1919 and the third model “60†about 1947.

This is the rifle the sight is on, it was made circa late 1910 by Ludwig Wundhammer for a Lt in the Army.

Here is the add from a 1920 Lyman catalog.

Frank

"it was made circa late 1910 by Ludwig Wundhammer for a Lt in the Army."
THAT is cool!
Neat stock work. is the grip checkered or stippled??? It looks more like stippling in the photo.
So, back then, an officer could order a custom rifle built on the government built service rifle. Anyone want to guess what my chances of getting Colt to build me a "custom" rifle??!!!
Of course back then guns were recognized tools (as well as art!) instead of devices for political maneuvers....Sorry! Rant off.
Still a neat rifle, Michael!

quote:

Originally posted by A10ACN:
"it was made circa late 1910 by Ludwig Wundhammer for a Lt in the Army."
THAT is cool!
Neat stock work. is the grip checkered or stippled??? It looks more like stippling in the photo.
So, back then, an officer could order a custom rifle built on the government built service rifle. Anyone want to guess what my chances of getting Colt to build me a "custom" rifle??!!!
Of course back then guns were recognized tools (as well as art!) instead of devices for political maneuvers....Sorry! Rant off.
Still a neat rifle, Michael!

That Lt. hired a custom maker to build a rifle for him...Springfield Armory didn’t build it. What is to stop you from having a custom weapon made by a custom builder now?

quote:

Originally posted by A10ACN:
"it was made circa late 1910 by Ludwig Wundhammer for a Lt in the Army."
THAT is cool!
Neat stock work. is the grip checkered or stippled??? It looks more like stippling in the photo.
So, back then, an officer could order a custom rifle built on the government built service rifle. Anyone want to guess what my chances of getting Colt to build me a "custom" rifle??!!!
Of course back then guns were recognized tools (as well as art!) instead of devices for political maneuvers....Sorry! Rant off.
Still a neat rifle, Michael!

The rifle was bought from the Armory and sent to Wundhammer, a Los Angles gunmaker for a sporting stock. The rifle has seen a hard life and the checkering is worn smooth. E.C. Crossman cooked up the idea of having a sporting rifle made on the 1903 Springfield and he had five made, the first went to Seward Edward White, the rest is history. I believe that this rifle was made about the same time as the first five because Wundhammer dropped the panel of wood on the side about the same time.

Starting in about 1909 a civilian could, through the NRA order a 1903 Springfield rifle from the Armory. In about 1915, a Model 1903 rifle was seized and the owner charged with possessing stolen government property. A subsequent investigation showed that the rifle had been purchased legally through the sales program. Following dismissal of the court case, Gen. William Crozier, Chief of Ordnance, ordered that all sales rifles be marked. Owners were contacted and arrangements were made to have the trigger guards marked “N.R.A.†along with the Ordnance Shell and Flame on the forward portion of the trigger guard. As might be expected, not all rifles were located and marked. Not to be confused with the post-war NRA sporter.