The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Guns, Politics, Gunsmithing & Reloading Gunsmithing PTG Charged $13.80 to Ship a ONE OUNCE envelope!!!Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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PTG charged $13.80 to ship an envelope with a Sako extractor kit in it. I weighed the package; 1.05 ounces. Not the first time of course but I have had it. I have called them many times, and sent them messages; everyone says that it is part of their system and they can't change it. And one lady just hung up on me; no I was not belligerent. She said to order from someone else if I didn't like their shipping charge. All the line managers I have talked to say that they get this complaint every week, but top management must not care. I wanted to speak to the owner today, but he was out. I hope that someone from PTG reads AR and sees this. | ||
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Just the real world...Post on packages has one WAY up and the padded envelop cost $$...Someone had to find the part,print out your address...etc. I find it easy to use up over a half hour just getting a package out the door Not taking sides here..... | |||
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somebody has to pay for amazon's cheap shipping. | |||
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That's just Buuul shit. The post office will give you a small flat rate box and deliver it Priority Mail for $7.20 | |||
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A commercial enterprise who does web orders can put something in a padded envelope, print out first class postage, tape it to an envelope, seal the envelope, put it in outbound mail box in about 5 minutes. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Companies have learn shipping charges can be a great profit making center. | |||
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No one else in any business I deal with charges such exorbitant rates and I buy gun and WW2 vehicle parts every week. They all are very sensitive to this. P Dog is right; they are making money on shipping. | |||
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I think shipping is just considered as another profit center. Like the haz fee by shippers. Don't limit your challenges . . . Challenge your limits | |||
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dpcd: I just got a large flat envelope with Natchez master catalog and 4 sets of scope rings. Bill shows $10.80 postage. NOT S&H, just shipping! When I bitched: "pkg was 1 pound". My ass, my order weighs 3.6 oz. I didn't request your catalog and sure as hell didn't want to pay postage on it". No reply. Same reason I quit ordering tools from Wholesale Tools in Tulsa. Anytime some $3 hr employee tells me: "go elsewhere" I make it a point to get their ass fired if I can. The boss would sure hear about it from me. Even if it cost a registered letter to that person. Did you get the gals name? George "Gun Control is NOT about Guns' "It's about Control!!" Join the NRA today!" LM: NRA, DAV, George L. Dwight | |||
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I think these companies that charge exorbitant S&H will need to change their ways or start losing a lot of business. There's too many other suppliers that offer free shipping. For instance I can get barrels cheaper directly from the manufacturer as a dealer than through Brownells but when factoring in shipping costs it makes sense to go through Brownells with their Edge free shipping, especially if it's just one barrel. That said, the cost of shipping has gone way up in the last five years. UPS started charging an extra fee for rifle sized boxes which made everything I ship cost more. | |||
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Yes, the cost of shipping has gone up but the cost of a 1 ounce priority envelope is not $13.80. They must have tremendous overhead. What they actually have is a computer program that is set to mail all their expensive stuff like reamers and trigger guards, but the issue is that all the small low cost stuff has to follow the same rules. I told the sales manager that that policy meant that PTG didn't care about the customer; she said they really did, and she said they discuss this at all their weekly meetings. A company that can't quickly respond to that is poorly managed. | |||
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I am much more afraid that it is nothing but arrogance on the part of PTG....... Dave is not near as involved as he used to be and it is showing. . | |||
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Wow, really? Lotsa companies have fixed shipping rates. Makes sense since it really does eat up a considerable amount of time to try to customize for each order. time=money. A USPS padded flat rate envelope is $7.25. It does take some effort to locate the part, insert, seal, and post the envelope. I hate high shipping charges as much as the next guy but I mitigate them by never buying a single item if I can avoid it. Sometimes however, you simply can't cuz you need it now and don't need anything else. Cost of doing business.  Aut vincere aut mori | |||
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The worst part of it is the illegality in the accounting of it. For example, say PTG paid $5.00 to ship your package, and had $2.00 in the envelope, and you paid $13.00 to ship. They will list the whole $13.00 as a shipping cost on their records, instead of reporting $6.00 in income for which they should pay income tax. Of course, there is a labor costs as well, but that should be accounted for in the general ledger under wages. The American government, and therefore the American people, of which you are some, is getting cheated out of hundreds of millions of dollars of income tax every year because of these schemes. | |||
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If you open a USPS account you will get whatever shipping supplies that they have for free with no shipping. Envelopes padded envelopes and various priority mail boxes, I have cut and taped boxes together for bigger items, and they pick it up, life is good NRA Life Member, ILL Rifle Assoc Life Member, Navy | |||
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No, does not make sense to me to operate like this. I think arrogance is the right term for it Don't care, and because we can.. Note, both the Sales and Shipping Manager told me they did not like nor understand the policy and get weekly complaints about it; what does that tell you about upper management? | |||
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UPS minimum is 1lb and that costs about $13 to lower 48. I suspect fedex is similar. Most businesses do not make runs to the post office on small packages. They go through the same process as larger packages. Businesses do not "cheat on income tax" by making a profit on shipping. If there is a profit, it gets taxed. We sell some small items along with firearms and our system will default to $3.50 for less than 1/2lb item weight shipped normal ground service. Gun parts will cut holes in most envelopes, so we have to take precautions. Padded envelopes are not free, and the USPS does not give out padded envelopes. Then we have to make a trip to the USPS, sometimes for only one small shipment. That's an hour of time. I figure we lose $50 on each small package, if that's any consolation. Russ Gould - Whitworth Arms LLC BigfiveHQ.com, Large Calibers and African Safaris Doublegunhq.com, Fine English, American and German Double Rifles and Shotguns VH2Q.com, Varmint Rifles and Gear | |||
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They shipped USPS in the cheapest non padded envelope they make. Postage is auto generated. The Postal carrier picks up there every day no reason or excuse for it. If you are losing $50 on every little envelope your ship then I really am confused because I assume the USPS serves you daily. It all boils down to the fact that some businesses do not care about customers who place small orders. That has already been proven. In case anyone can't envision the size of my order; the entire Sako extractor kit fits on a thumb nail. | |||
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I used to get people who complained about my charge to drill and tap a hole. They couldn't fathom that drilling and tapping a single hole warranted my charge. They had a choice whether to pay or not, it was their choice. Aut vincere aut mori | |||
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Low shipping costs Amazon Costco.com Eurooptics I always factor in shipping costs. I hate paying sales tax and high shipping costs. Mike | |||
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You're an idiot as you have always been. Stick to being an old lawyer and leave the accounting to folks that can add 2 and 2. | |||
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JUst think, shipping a product, what ever it is, takes time and effort to package, don't even think about trying to find a box the right size, putting it in and hooping it stays together, paying for all the tape, time to type up the shipping tag or computer time to print one out and then calling UPS to pick it up and they charge for that, or, drive to the post office a mile and a half away to drop it off.... Time away from the work planned for the day.... Jim Kobe 10841 Oxborough Ave So Bloomington MN 55437 952.884.6031 Professional member American Custom Gunmakers Guild | |||
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It has been years since I've seen anything positive posted about PTG. I've been avoiding them for years. Manson has been much better. There are plenty of shipping shenanigans. I can get all kinds of electronics parts from china (ebay and amazon) for less than it costs me to mail a check here. These are padded envelopes shipped from the other side of the planet, with things in them. Maybe china subsidizes their mail? | |||
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What is it about sending something the size of a dime, in a plain envelope, using USPS which comes to your door every day, that some guys don't understand? There is the absolute lowest overhead in shipping this envelope. No tape, no box, no packaging, no trips anywhere; it is a two step process. It is the smallest envelope weighing one ounce; not sure why some are trying to justify it. Given this rationale, then sending a reamer in a real box with some bubble wrap (very high overhead) should cost $35. No, it still costs $13.80. Not in the same category as drilling and tapping holes, by any stretch. Or packaging a rifle and driving to UPS. Please. | |||
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Maybe it was packed with love and sealed with a beauty queen's kiss. . | |||
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Shipping prices have gone up a bunch. However, the USPS Priority Mail flat rate boxes and envelopes have changed the shipping industry but some places do not seem to have noticed. Customers do notice. | |||
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No, it is not the shipping clerks; their hands are tied; I have talked to at least 3 of them and they all recognize the rip off of the customer and so does the shipping manager (talked to her too). It is at some level of "management" that dictates it. Again, no reason for it except arrogance and disregard for the customer. When you make things that are that unique, you can use this corporate philosophy if you want and the customer has no recourse. As they told me; "feel free to get our products from Midway. " | |||
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Yep. Arrogance. Damn shame..... . | |||
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You don't need to make a run to the post office to ship something. You just place it in a bin marked outgoing mail and the mail carrier picks it up. Additionally, you are talking about a business that has a website with 100s of products and shipping products via USPS or UPS or FedEx, generating shipping labels, packing, and having it picked up should be like breathing to them. They likely can print the shipping label with a single key stroke from the "order filled" function on their website. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I would doubt if a machinist is stopping work to put that package together. PTG is big enough to have a shipping dept of min wage folks doing that work. I gave up on them a few years ago, to much hassle and time to get what I can get( reamers) elsewhere. | |||
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USPS does not come to your door in a rural area, they drop the mail in the mailbox which is 300 yards away ... at unpredictable times. That's why we use UPS, and that's why we have to drive to town when we have an envelope shipment. That's not to say that it works the same way for PTG. But I can tell you that PTG has to pick the product, put it in an envelope, and label it just like the rest of us. So my guess is you are paying some "handling" on small items. As for Amazon, free shipping is not free. It's in the price. And, I may add, Amazon is more focused on growth to drive their stock price than on profit. Sure, they get a favorable shipping rate but they want the sale more than they want to make a fair profit on the sale. And it's working. Their price to earnings ratio is astronomical and one of these days a lot of people are going to lose a lot of money on that stock. Russ Gould - Whitworth Arms LLC BigfiveHQ.com, Large Calibers and African Safaris Doublegunhq.com, Fine English, American and German Double Rifles and Shotguns VH2Q.com, Varmint Rifles and Gear | |||
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Russ, I'm a quarter mile off our farm to market road. If my post lady can't get a package in our oversize mailbox, she drives up our driveway and leaves it on the porch. Damn UPS and FEDEX leave it up front on the ground. | |||
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They all leave stuff at my door and I am just over a quarter of mile off the highway. | |||
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The discussion isn't about delivery, does your mail lady stop at the house everyday and ask if you have anything to ship? I'm guessing the answer is no, you either have to post it in the mailbox or go to the post office. For me the post office is 3 miles away. I'm a one man shop so every time I have to leave my tools I am not making money...my shop rate is $45.00/hr so to package an item, print a label, take it to town, wait at the post office, and then return home is easily a half hour...$13.80 starts to look pretty cheap to me considering what I would have to charge to make up for my lost time. Yes, PTG probably has a shipping department but do you think their wages to answer the phone, take the order, pull the part from inventory, package and label it just magically come from nowhere, they are either part of the price of the part or they are part of the "handling" charge. | |||
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Just as how high some shipping and handling is. I see some reticules cheap shipping to. One just needs to look at the used book market. I seen some fairly large books size and weight wise. For like 3.95 shipping paid how they ever do amazes me. | |||
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Cowboy, I'm a lot further from the post office than you. If I had a "Clickit" USPS account they would pick it up at the door. If you are happy with UPS, fine. I have had very poor service from them. I guess that we are lucky to have a choice. It actually comes down to what works for each of us. | |||
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If your business involved shipping hundreds if not thousands of items a day. You would be hiring some one at 8 to 15 dollars an hour to do it for you. They would be very good at shipping. Lets they ship 12 items and hour. The handling charge is 5 dollars an item. The packaging costs 2 dollars an item. That leaves 36 dollars and hour to pay wages. 36 minus even 15 an hour is 21 an hour profit times 8 is 168 extra a day. Now your a company that has 20 shipping clerks 168x 20 = 3360 x 260 working days = 873600 a year extra profit. There is a huge difference between a company the specializes in mail order over a single person shipping now and then. | |||
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Well some folks may want to do about 37 seconds of research as I did before posting, PTG is located in a light industrial area with more than twenty other businesses within 1/2 mile radius including: A community college State Offices County Offices This notion that packaging and shipping products is somehow an adjunct process that would be difficult for them to become efficient at or should not become efficient at is ludicrous. Now maybe they don't care and feel they can get away with outrageous shipping costs but some of the comments trying to justify $13+ shipping for a one ounce item demonstrate a lack of knowledge of even mediocre business operations for web based product oriented companies. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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If only your fantasy business math worked in the real world. | |||
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The math is a constant. You can scale it any way you want. | |||
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