In my "stuff" bin I have three rifle actions, all of which need work and then refinishing. These are: Lee-Enfield No. 4 Mk. 1*; M1898 Krag; and non-case hardened Winchester 1886. None has any [additional] value as collectible. I want to eventually metamorphose each one into a useful open-sighted hunting rifle. I have been informed that many semiautomatic pistols being made have dark, nearly black finishes or coatings that are called "black nitriding" or [something to do with] ion finishing. These finishes are claimed to be extremely wear and corrosion resistant. The finish is not on the metal. It is in the metal, having penetrated a surface.

1. If there is such a finish available after market and compatible with my older actions that use simple steel alloys, please identify it.

2. What parts, excluding springs, can be finished without harming a part's heat treat?

3. When parts are finished, do parts reassemble without any "issues?"

4. If you have had a firearm refinished with this process, have used the gun for at least a year, and are satisfied that the finish does what it is purported to do, please identify who did your refinishing job.

Here is a link to some information about it.

http://blacknitride.com/firearms/

"H&M Blacknitride+™ makes your gun’s metal 10 times stronger than it was originally. It increases the velocity of your barrel by a few hundred feet-per-second and slickens the surface to make your gun extremely lubricated.
By nature of the process, the steel is hardened through a thermochemical treatment to the steel which makes the steel harder and resistant to water penetrations. H&M Blacknitride+™ extends barrel life, makes cleaning easier and protects the part from corrosion. Major gun manufacturers use H&M Blacknitride+™ for various parts including barrels, firing pins, bolt carrier group assemblies, hammers, triggers and magazines."

quote:

"H&M Blacknitride+™ makes your gun’s metal 10 times stronger than it was originally. It increases the velocity of your barrel by a few hundred feet-per-second and slickens the surface to make your gun extremely lubricated.
By nature of the process, the steel is hardened through a thermochemical treatment to the steel which makes the steel harder and resistant to water penetrations. H&M Blacknitride+™ extends barrel life, makes cleaning easier and protects the part from corrosion. Major gun manufacturers use H&M Blacknitride+™ for various parts including barrels, firing pins, bolt carrier group assemblies, hammers, triggers and magazines."

Yeah, right.

I didn't say I believe ALL the hype but.....
The coating itself is great and yes it makes the metal slicker, the coating bonds with the metals surface so it won't flake off.
I'm not quite buying the "10 times stronger" claim.

quote:

It increases the velocity of your barrel by a few hundred feet-per-second

Wow magic happens every day besides the BS it seems like a nice finish.

I'm not buying the increase velocity by a couple hundred fps either.

So, apparently, none of you has used this finish or has first-hand knowledge of the product?

" It increases the velocity of your barrel by a few hundred feet-per-second "

Wow, it will turn my K-Hornet and 7x57 Ackley into real screamers. Just think what it will do to a Swift.

quote:

Originally posted by Naphtali:
So, apparently, none of you has used this finish or has first-hand knowledge of the product?

Give it a try and let us know how it works.

Naphtali I've used black nitride (www.blacknitride.com) for an Argentine 1909/Douglass CM barrel, Wiebe bottom metal project. Had the barreled action, bolt, bottom metal, disassembled 3 position safety & bolt release plus the bottom metal screws done about 2 years ago, completed in 1-2 wks if I remember correctly, very durable matte black finish, finish has stood up well to the elements, am happy with the results, have put about 300 rounds through the barrel, didn't send any springs or the claw extractor, I'd use them again without any hesitation.

Jim

Jim,

How much polishing was done to the metal before you sent it in? Interested in possibly doing this with my 404

quote:

Originally posted by Jim@IMReps:
Naphtali I've used black nitride (www.blacknitride.com) for an Argentine 1909/Douglass CM barrel, Wiebe bottom metal project. Had the barreled action, bolt, bottom metal, disassembled 3 position safety & bolt release plus the bottom metal screws done about 2 years ago, completed in 1-2 wks if I remember correctly, very durable matte black finish, finish has stood up well to the elements, am happy with the results, have put about 300 rounds through the barrel, didn't send any springs or the claw extractor, I'd use them again without any hesitation.

Jim

So, did you gain the claimed 300 fps ?

Have no idea about gained fps or extended barrel life, good finish though.

MileHighShooter because this was sort of a trial run to test the results I didn't polish any of the metal to the degree one would for rust bluing, it came out fine, not sure a super fine polish before hand for this kind of treatment makes much of a difference however if you are adamant on going that route by all means, it's a hunting rifle with a durable finish.

I believe Butch Lambert is an advocate for this type of finish, maybe he can chime in.

Yes, I've had a lot of parts, barrels, Melonited. It is a form of nitried at a temp that doesn't affect the heat treat. It is slick, but is just a case harden process. It is about 60RC in hardness. It will go on SS, mild steel, and CM. The processor needs to know what metal that you are giving them. As far as metal prep. It will look just like you hand it to them, but it will be black. A high polish part will come back to you as a Weatherby type blue black finish. The US Army rifle team uses it and found no increase in velocity. My BR barrels show no velocity increase. Other than looks, if you like it, the main advantage to me has tripled the life of my rifle bores.

Jim and Butch:

Just the kind of information I seek.

Many thanks.

i have used cold black nitride -apparently i am too stupid to get it right ... it's gray, not awesome, smells, and not really any fun ...

i have tried just about every "cold blue" formula, as well ... they all SMELL, but different than black nitride

however, i have found something kinda cool .. if you boil parts after you use "plum brown" it makes a fairly pleasing finish, in some cases ...

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
i have used cold black nitride -apparently i am too stupid to get it right ... it's gray, not awesome, smells, and not really any fun ...

i have tried just about every "cold blue" formula, as well ... they all SMELL, but different than black nitride

however, i have found something kinda cool .. if you boil parts after you use "plum brown" it makes a fairly pleasing finish, in some cases ...

Never heard of "cold" black nitride.

i might be having a senior moment ---