My next project will be a 250-3000 and I need to know which Mauser receiver will be most suitable. Don't mention a Kurtz as my Buddy has his at David Christman's and won't sell it to me.
If anybody has a suitable receiver just let me know.
Butch

Mexican Mauser, next best thing.

I have a short action Interarm mark that may go to that caliber for my daughter in the future. I used it in a High School gunsmithing class....yes we had gunsmithing in High School.

It currently is sitting in a Monte Carlo rollover with rosewood tip....not that aswesome of a look. It has a 22-250 barrel. Accurarcy is awesome. The action is way too tight and needs broken in. Trigger sucks.

I assume your looking for a military and not a commercial?

I don't know if you have a copy of the November 2003 issue of Outdoor Life magazine, but if not there is an article by Jim Carmichel entitled My Favorite Deer Rifles in which he writes about his shortened 98 Mauser chambered in 250-3000. If you are planning on spending considerable bucks on a nice piece of wood, etc., it might be worth your while to spend a bit more by having a good metalsmith shorten an action for you.
In case you don't have a copy of that magazine here is the photo of the rifle.

I am a novice, but that safety looks like a big chuck of metal behind the bolt. Seems to need downsizing itself.

Butch,

I have a as new Herter's J9 barrelled action in 6MM Remington. It is the Zastava intermediate Mauser action with hinged trigger guard.

If that is of interest to you - send me a PM.

James

quote:

Originally posted by 333_OKH:
I am a novice, but that safety looks like a big chuck of metal behind the bolt. Seems to need downsizing itself.

I think that is the normal Mauser bolt sleeve or safety sleeve that has been altered to take a side swing safety.

Hey 22WRF.....in a previous thread you asked about photos of metal smith photos of work by Ron Lampert.....look closely at the caption of the photo you just posted!!!!!

PM sent. I also sent Carmichel an email for more info. Thanks for the help.
Butch

Butch, the 1910 or 36 mexican is ideal for a 250/3000. There is some excess space in the magazine but the law of diminishing returns will be slapping you in the face if you go to shortening one for this cartridge. I had two or three of them around here but I have barrels on them now waiting for a stock to come along.

Chic,
You wouldn't have an extra Mexican for sale would you? I talked to Carmichel and he said Lampert is no longer building rifles. He referred me to Herman Waldron. I called Herman and he said that he has been working on one for Jim for 31yrs and is within a couple years of having it done. Of course he is not taking in any work anymore. Herman said he would walk me through cutting and welding one together if I decided to do it. A mexican sounds very good at the present.
Butch

Butch---tell me about the wood for this project????

The "big chunk of metal behind the bolt" was probably an extra $300.

quote:

Originally posted by papapaul:
The "big chunk of metal behind the bolt" was probably an extra $300.

It's a two position Wisner Safety and at least one person posting here sells them for a tad over $100....they just screw on so installation is not an issue.......usually!

dave,
Do you have a blank for me? I haven't even thought of wood at this time. Very early in the project.
Butch

pick up a Savage 99 in .250 with a mint bore and start from there.

Maybe a "95" or a re-heat treated 1916. I can and do seat the 120 gr. bullets in my 250-3k to an oal= 2.700" so the magazine length should be OK. Also I had a Mc Gowen 22-250 on a 98 action that fed great . Of course the cartridges didn't my much under that small amount of recoil. roger

I have several 250 Savage bolt action rifles including two Kurtz actons. I believe the Mexican Mauser is only 1/8 inch longer and a small ring to boot. That would be the way to go.

Butch, I am sorry I don't have one for you. I thought that Waldron had hung it up some years ago. I know he was selling his reamers but he wanted to sell them in one package. He is a great metalsmith. I will keep my eyes open for a Mexican action for you.

This is a puruvian that I purchased as is. I don't have bottom metal for it as I was going to use custom metal. It has already had the bolt knob modified and the surface grinding and initial polishing done. Currently it isn't part of a project so I haven't had it finished but I'd sell it for $400 As-Is if you are interested. You can have a 3-day inspection with you paying shipping if returned. I have written the serial number on the action, it will need to be re-engraved.

It would make a nice start towards your project.

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
dave,
Do you have a blank for me? I haven't even thought of wood at this time. Very early in the project.
Butch

Why yes---I can help a Brutha out!! We can discuss--as you know I have more than I will use in 20 life times and would love to see one on your rifle..

Butch

You want to very careful about shortening actions.

The next thing you know you'll have a matched set of three actions, a short ,standard and a long.

Hal

Well guys! I have a receiver coming. I went to the local gunshop to get an FFL to send for the receiver and the shop owner gave ma a new old box of 250-3000 super speed 100 grain expanding points. I think that is all that is required to start a new custom. It will actually be awhile before I start on it though. I just need to collect pieces.
Butch

What action did you finally deside on? roger

Wednesday I ordered a dozen VZ24s on the March special from Century arms. I was getting them for $75 about 7 years ago, but the value of a VZ24 gone up 10%/year compounded.

I have never had a problem feeding 243 or 308 length cartridges from an 8mm length receiver and mag well. No spacers required.

The 250S cartridge is 2.515" OAL
The 243W cartridge is 2.710" OAL
The 308W cartridge is 2.810" OAL
The 8mmM cartridge is 3.250" OAL
The 30-06 cartridge is 3.340" OAL

I have had to mill out the mag well of cut on the feed ramp of a VZ24 to get a 3.340" cartridge to feed.

What does it all mean?
I would buy VZ24s while they are available.

As soon as my cash clears Mr. Hensley's hands, I should have his Peruvian on the way. Which bottom metal fits?
Butch

Probably sacrilege to say around here but for what it's worth, M96 Swedes are supposedly perfectly safe at 250.3000 pressures, one of the few calibers you can get pre-threaded barrels for 96's. Not a 98 but nicely made actions.

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
As soon as my cash clears Mr. Hensley's hands, I should have his Peruvian on the way. Which bottom metal fits?
Butch

Butch,

Mr Hensley's Peruvian will serve you nicely. he did a nice job slimming it to a small ring profile.

Remember, Pre-64's model 70's fed short cartridges, they just used a mag block.

Thanks Mike,
I hope to figure it out when the time comes. It is nice to have a bunch of guys that are free with the information that I ask for. If I bother any of you too much, just jump me a little.
Butch

Butch
The floormetal for the Peruvian is kind of an oddball. It has the same screw spacing as a standard 98 but the shorter mag box length of a Mex. If you look at the pics, it shows a very long flat behind the recoil lug. Not too big a deal to take a standard 09 Arg floormetal and shorten the front. Kind of like the way I lengthen them by removing the front of the box and silver soldering a new piece in.

Thanks James.

FWIW:

Swedes will take the same pressures as 98s.

I've long converted earlier small ring Mausers such as 1895s to take intermediate-length 1898 bolts, to use the many aftermarket safeties available for the 98s. It's not a big deal but does require a little elbow grease. The result looks just like a small-ring 98 except it's about 0.100" shorter.

The 2-position safety alteration shown in the photo was quite popular 20-30 years ago when it was newly-introduced (and the only choice) but I don't use them since the 3-position ones have become available. Nowadays the 2-position is considered the El Cheapo option.
Regards, Joe

Joe,

I've read here and a few other places that the M96's that Kimber and few others rebarreled to the .308 family of cartridges has some setback problems not seen with the ones they left at 6.5x55. Is that why you used 98 bolt's, is the weakness in the bolt?

Rob

quote:

Originally posted by Recoil Rob:
Joe,

I've read here and a few other places that the M96's that Kimber and few others rebarreled to the .308 family of cartridges has some setback problems not seen with the ones they left at 6.5x55. Is that why you used 98 bolt's, is the weakness in the bolt?

Rob

Use of a 98 bolt would allow use of the much better 98 shroud. It deflects gas much better than that of the 96. It would also convert the action to cock on open. And yes, the Kimber converted 96's are notorious for setback.

However, considering how many Mexican 98's are still available, I'd just use one of those.

Hmm, I have a lot of customers who spend a considerable amount of money on their builds that just plain like the two position safety. They could easily afford one of Ed Lapour's top shelf safeties, they just like the "Retro" two position better.

I liken the two position safety to the .308 Winchester. I used to love to hate it, until I got one.

quote:

Originally posted by J.D.Steele:
FWIW:

Swedes will take the same pressures as 98s.

I've long converted earlier small ring Mausers such as 1895s to take intermediate-length 1898 bolts, to use the many aftermarket safeties available for the 98s. It's not a big deal but does require a little elbow grease. The result looks just like a small-ring 98 except it's about 0.100" shorter.

The 2-position safety alteration shown in the photo was quite popular 20-30 years ago when it was newly-introduced (and the only choice) but I don't use them since the 3-position ones have become available. Nowadays the 2-position is considered the El Cheapo option.
Regards, Joe

Joe, what did you do to fit the 98 bolt in a m96? Take the third lug off the bolt or...?

[QUOTE Nowadays the 2-position is considered the El Cheapo option.
Regards, Joe[/QUOTE]

I respectfully disagree.

Stephen R Heilmann and many other top smiths use the 2-pos safety on many current 98 projects. I prefer the 2-pos on my personal 98 rifles as well. There seems to be a retro trend in building custom Mausers. Most of the 3-pos safeties look out of place to me behind a 98 bolt. Then again, I like the big shroud. Especially when I'm pulling the trigger.

I suppose a proper project needs to be more than just a barrel swap but a Kimber 84M rebarreled from 22/250 to 250 Savage (1:10 twist please) would make a mighty fine deer rig. If you need it to be mighty pretty as well you could start with a Super America.

If you're going the pre-1898 Mauser route, Guns Unlimited in Omaha, NE, had the nicest original specs 1893 Spanish Ovido Mauser long rifle that I've seen in at least 20 years. The only thing wrong with it is that the cleaning rod is missing. The numbers match and the rifle easily grades in the high 90% range. It was tagged for $250 when I saw it this past week.

Jeff

Guys, thanks again for all the advice. I do have a receiver. The rest of it needs to be hashed out.
Butch

quote:

Originally posted by GSP7:
Joe, what did you do to fit the 98 bolt in a m96? Take the third lug off the bolt or...?

I removed the third lug and the guide rib although the guide rib could have been retained if I owned a shaper; the 1895's guide rib is inside the action's left rail and works as well as the top rib but must be cut down slightly for the 98 bolt. Also needed to alter the bolt stop box and use a 98 ejector, and taper the outside front edge of the extractor to clear the receiver threads. A few other minor things but nothing major. I've been doing this for years on my own rifles but have done only one belted magnum so far and probably won't do another one. Cartridge length is limited by the receiver length and IMO the cut-down bolt stop precludes this conversion on a DGR, I use it mainly for light plains and varmint rifles. Hinged floorplates were military issue on several Spanish Mausers and I've also used 1909 Argie bottom metal by shortening the front tang.

Two caveats:

The 1909 Argie magazine IMO is too long for the 1895 action and I use them only on the Swedes since the 1895 bottom recoil lug would end up being too thin while the 1896 Swede action is slightly longer and so the bottom lug doesn't lose as much metal. I could have put a spacer in the front of the mag box for an 1895 but I didn't...

Which brings me to the second caveat which is that the intermediate 1898 bolt won't work in the Swede action. The Swede bolt is actually slightly longer than the 1895 & intermediate 1898 bolts, and will not interchange without very extensive alteration. At the same time it's shorter than the standard 1898 bolts and so that one won't interchange either. I used a Wisner 3-position bolt sleeve & upcock on my Swede and would like another one.
Regards, Joe