OK Chic, let me put it in better words. No matter how much you or anyone else complains about the "new company" not keeping the promises of the previous company, it is not going to change a thing. Only the new owners can know how fit they are financially and maybe they just cannot swing the deal the other owners laid out. Would you rather this new company start off digging a hole for themselves, just so they can satisfy a small portion of their potential clients. Perhaps these new owners know a thing or two about the requirements of a successful business and are doing the best they can under the circumstances. They really don't owe anyone a thing as far as I can see. As far as the "move on" comment, it was not directed at any one person and it appies to anything one might want to buy. I just think some people are too critical and we need to give these new owners some breathing room. They did'nt spend a million dollars to alienate their clients.

Woody

I would like the mini with a hornet boltface, I was going to commit to one of these when they first came out. I backed out. They are worse than the big guys you all are waiting for. I know some guys waiting for them, they have not heard squat for over a year. I can see a 6mmTCU with some sexy wood in my future if they get those going.I was going to do one in a 6.5 short mag last year but the sketchy delivery made me wonder if they were the right place to order a custom action from.

I am willing give them a shot, I will wait a few months until they get the bugs worked out. The last owners pretty much had the whole works f-ed up.

Obviously the "old" company wasn't fairing too well with how they operated. Perhaps the "new" company hopes to do business in a fashion that allows it to keep the doors open. I believe I read no money changed hands so I don't see anybody getting screwed. I thought from the first time they offered the program it was a mistake.

that the "new" company (legal definition of the changes, please) wants to use the same customer list (hey, you ordered one) for the "same" action, expecting them to 'honer the deal' and then raise the price is rubbish.

Now, if they called each and every person, explained that the original agreement was void, and asked if they would like to join the "new" order, then they have a leg to stand one.

Funny thing, MRC has rejected all feedback from this forum on the specs of the UNMADE PH action. Hey Jeff, of the original (nearly 400 total) actions ordered, how many were from AR? 80-90%???...

Make the bolt bigger, make the threads larger, and have a product that is actually "better" than the competition

If the CUSTOMER base's suggestions become part of the action's specs (it's not finished, remember) AND i have to have one, then I'll just buy one off the shelf, in a couple years, when they make it to production, and I don't have another 2 years of "waiting" to hear it got shelved again.
jeffe

Has anyone received their confirmation call yet? I threw in for 2 actions when they were announced then added a 3rd last year when there appeared to be a chance we could put them over the top.

At this point, I've pretty much resigned myself to pulling a few P14s out of the safe. Once they're started there will be little or no reason to add a PH project.

The new owners of course are under no obligation to hold the price line, however it would have been a good gesture to do so. Having been in sales forever and having experience in running a business, it is always less expensive to keep customers than to advertise and acquire new ones. Look at what has happened, rather than some goodwill being created and market excitement because a new and viable owner has taken over a decent product line, they are starting over with a negative. Such perceptions are hard to overcome in business and will require spending more than the extra $100 per PH action to overcome. In other words, perception is more than important than reality, instead of being a fresh new company with the best priced Mag style action, they are perceived as screwing their first customers who've been waiting patiently for a couple of years. Whether deserved or not, that is the way of business, if they would have announced they were holding the prices on the first PH action orders they would have started out heros, not a wise business decision IMO.

I think there are multiple reasons for many of us not going forward with the PH action.

I'm not all that indignant about the price increase, because I gave up on the issue awhile ago. It's been over 4 years since the PH program was announced, and its intent has been replaced several times by other projects.

I find it pretty difficult to get excited about anything new coming out of the company.......new management or old.

GV

I'm honoring my commitment for one
but would get more with a change.
Ok I have emailed and talked to Jeff and
Devin about making barrel thread bigger on
PH Action to match the larger diameter action
and bolt. This is so that the action will
handle my 700H 3.25" case.And other real
large cases. There tentative bolt size
will handle my 700H just fine from my work
on the Enfield. They indicated that they
might do it if they hear from enough folks wanting the larger barrel thread.They have
threading done CNC, as well as other
finish machining, so this change wouldn't
affect them having to have the foundry make
a new action mold. Right now they are
promoting a big PH Action, which they made bigger than Enfield, longer also, but made
barrel thread smaller. In the spirit of
doing big bores,doing smaller thread size
for barrel sizes that is used in traditional
458Win/375HH, etc doesn't promote the
big bore persona.Anyone wanting an action
that will handle a big barrel and cartridge
can't beat the price they are promoting so
if interested please let them know that you
want a larger barrel thread to match the
increase in action size.Ed

didn't the guy say they where going to be doing better finish work on the actions?? perhaps you will be getting a better product for the extra $100, wouldn't that make it a better value

After taking a better look at the initial post, MRC is changing the criteria in ways that also favor us. Case in point, where they are not using our money in advance of the product. So I have less grief with the whole deal.

It would be interesting to see if they have made any changes to the PH model and if they have any ortho CAD views of the action.

I also have not heard anything and had my name down for 3 actions.

For those of you who need to know if you are on either list (PH or Mini) please contact me, Dan Wills, at 406-755-4867 or by email, dan@montanarifleman.com.

As to the comments about our "character" for raising the prices, well its simple business sense. Our first thought was that we could not do it at the same price so we should just scrap the whole project and focus on the long and short actions. The second was "at what price can we do the initial run, without losing our shorts, and keep it as close to the original pricing as possible". This is where the $650 pricing came in. Remember the project was put on indefinite hold by the previous owner, meaning it was basically canceled. We are pushing forward with the project and we hope that our customers will understand.

Thank you,
Dan Wills
dan@montanarifleman.com
406-755-4867 Phone
406-755-9449 Fax

quote:

Originally posted by Customstox:
After taking a better look at the initial post, MRC is changing the criteria in ways that also favor us. Case in point, where they are not using our money in advance of the product. So I have less grief with the whole deal.

Which is why I have no problem with the increase. In the original deal, we the buyers were capitalizing the project with stiff down payments and no real guarantee of delivery other than blind faith. A very unsecured debt! This way the risk is 100% the company's that the actions will be completed and that buyers will follow through at the end of the production run. They should be able to recover something additional for assuming that additional risk compared to the original charter terms. If the actions are better fitted and finished, so much the better, too.

And if they can get the right size barrel
thread to match the larger action, it would
be 500% better. It is funny all the guys
who have condemned putting Nyati, Trex,
600 OK, etc in model 70 size barrel threads, but yet the tentative barrel thread on PH
does just that, as they said action was
for Nyati, etc.Folks it is long large action
for the money, so get after them to make a balanced package, with larger threads.Ed.

I have never bought an MRC action, as the retail price is all I see for us amateur gunsmiths.

I only barrel a few actions per year, and only for myself.

I use a kitchen FFL that is $12.50 for long rifles and $15 for handguns. I have never been arrested and have a concealed carry permit, so all I have to do is stop off and pick up the gun with no delay.

I see no reason to get an FFL just to buy an MRC action.

We are discussing the PH Action in
big bore forum. The size of the barrel
thread to handle barrels and cartridges
we want to use, 1.2 x 16. That is what
are asking MRC to make it. They indicated that
they'd do threads at that size if it was
specified by 15-20 people. Including me
they said as of today they had 5 requests.
Any one here still on the list for PH
action wanting the capability to use
big case like my 700H 3.25"(or 600NE
with .780" rim size, bolt is .805) now is
the chance to call and specify that you
want a 1.2" barrel thread like ED Hubel
is requesting.Ed

As I said, talked to company and they have
5 recent requests including mine for
the 1.2" bigger barrel thread and with others
who have indicated they will call
this coming week we have 8 now. Now
is the time folks for making history, an
action that is affordable for big cases.
Please let me know if you can so we can
keep track.ED

we have settled on
1.2"x16...

Are there any new updates on the PH actions? How about a rough timetable on when the first ones are rolling out? I still have to call and get mine with the 1.2x16 bbl thread. I don't believe I will go as large a caliber as some who post here but its nice to have the option if I change my mind. I just hope the new owners follow thru with the PH action.

Woody

quote:

Originally posted by MontanaJeff:
22WRF - No, the orders are still in the system, if you have one on order it will still be there. In fact someone will be calling all of the PH orders in the next few weeks to confirm them and to explain the new pricing.
If anyone has any questions as to whether they are on the list, just give us a call.

Mike, Thank you for your opinon, you are correct, I put "we hope" to have it by Shot Show because that is our "goal", but no one can predict exact time frames in Manufacturing. Thanks again.

I had my name down for 2 actions, but never received a phone call, email etc. Is my name still on the list?

At this time we are still shooting for a release in the first quarter of 2008. I will post more information as I get the updates.

Dan Wills
Montana Rifle Company

I had my name down for one and never got a call either.

Dan, thanks for the speedy reply. Its good to know you are still going thru with the project. I still have faith that your company will make good on the promise of delivering these actions. I can't wait until I get mine to build that once in a lifetime big bore just the way I want it done. It does not matter if I got/get a call or not...I know I am on the original list for a CM PH action and that is good enough for me. I am more interested in getting the call that it is ready for delivery.

If you have not recieved a call or some form of notification then it probably means the order was either not entered or the proper information was not gathered by the person who took the order. Please feel free to call 406-755-4867 and ask Dan to look it up. If there is no information about the order you will need to talk to Devin or Jeff concerning the price.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
we have settled on
1.2"x16...

Just out of curiosity; why 1.2x16 TPI? Kind of an oddball isn't it? 1 3/16" by 16 (1.1875x16tpi) would make more sense. Standards are usually in fractional sizes unless you want to go metric. Just my opinion and worth little! Regards, Bill.

You bring up a good point Bill.
Butch

All I know is that I am waiting for all of these other orders to get filled so I can order another MRC1999 in RH SA CM with the same custom barrel profile I have on my current project. Only tdifference is this time it will be in 376 Steyr.

I am pleased with the action I have and the quality. It was far better than I was led to believe I would be getting by the nay sayers. Additionally, they were easy for me to deal with. Was the action late...well yeah, but they kept me in the loop.

Bill,
That's the largest size that will fit the MRC PH action, with lots of safety...

since the barrels will be lathe turned, then no worries...

big as possible, with safety margine...

Dan Wills,

All of us are waiting in eager anticipation for these actions to become available. Some of us have had them on order for years, myself included.
I'm assuming that these are cast like the other 1999's, could you tell us if the molds for these receivers are done or are they being made as we speak?
We all are eager for your response.

JAG
(Just Another Goober)

quote:

Originally posted by lostinmydreams:
Dan Wills,

All of us are waiting in eager anticipation for these actions to become available. Some of us have had them on order for years, myself included.
I'm assuming that these are cast like the other 1999's, could you tell us if the molds for these receivers are done or are they being made as we speak?
We all are eager for your response.

JAG
(Just Another Goober)

Dan Wills,

Can you reassure those of us with these on order that we'll get them some time in 2008? Or are we being led down the trail of deceit? you know smoke & mirrors? I personally have waited going on 4 years for these actions. May have to resort to using a Enfield or CZ action.

Guys, I apologize, but we have instructed our people not to respond on the forums. If there is something that needs to be said it will come from one of us (Owners). We just don't want the wrong thing said. As to the production of the PH, we are still pushing for first quarter 2008. We know you have been waiting quite some time for these, but we want to make them right the first time. If you have any questions please feel free to call us. Ask for myself or Jeff.
Thanks,
Devin