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I have had a problem with the trigger on my 700 ADL. On closing the bolt, the trigger was staying back in the fired position and therefore not allowing the trigger to engage the sear. The pin would fall while closing the action. Fortunately I noticed before any ammo was chambered as I always check the operation of my rifles thoroughly before closing the bolt on any ammo. I screwed the adjustment screw in slightly and the problem went away. The trigger now returns to the 'unfired' position after releasing. It was as if the screw came loose. But it did not for I had to break the loctite I put on it when I last adjusted it to screw it back in. Have I got a problem with the trigger spring? Or perhaps something else? | ||
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You either don't have enough engagement on the sear or not enough pressure on the spring. When you set up the pull weight, you probably set it up with only the pressure between sear and trigger. You must be sure the spring is engaging the trigger and pushing it back. Be careful! | |||
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somthing like this I would either take apart the trigger assembly or take it to a gunsmith. if this happened with the factory settings then something is wrong and adjusting the screw might not keep it from happening again. | |||
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Remington is famous for its faulty and dangerous triggers. You need to get an aftermarket trigger like a Timney or Jewell, otherwise you risk an accidental discharge. | |||
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That's what I would claim also if I had an "accidental discharge!"  Think about the story your friend told you for a moment. You have a guy that is not paying enough attention to release the safety prior to pulling the trigger...but all of a sudden he snaps out of his brain-fade and removes his finger from the trigger when snapping off the safety??? Why do I have a hard time swallowing that one? I will stick to my original premise that the vast majority of these types of incidents are the result of careless weapon handling, an improperly adjusted trigger...or a dirty or improperly lubricated weapon. Am I saying that weapons NEVER malfunction?...No. What I am saying is that it doesn't happen anywhere near the number of times some people would like you to believe it does and human beings are far more apt to blame the accidental discharge on the "damned gun" than they are on there own carelessness. You always hear the same kind of explanations when someone's car "magically" takes off on its own and hits something: "I don't know what happened officer...it just took off... my foot wasn't anywhere near the gas pedal!"  Rick | |||
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You said "adjustment screw" and "in" so I assume you increased the tension on the trigger return spring. Try this: with the action out of the stock and the bolt out of the action, back off the trigger return spring so that it places no force on the trigger. Move the trigger back and forth the full length of its travel. Does it move freely, or is is sticky? If it is sticky, you have a burr inside the housing which is interfering with the trigger movement. Drive out the trigger pivot pin, and remove the trigger. Inspect it carefully and you will see scratch marks on it somewhere. Use a small, flat file to smooth the inside surfaces of the housing. If the trigger does move easily, then the problem likely is just insufficient sear engagement. | |||
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I believe the other guys have put you on the right track in regards to sear engagement. Also, not to start a debate here but comments like "Remington is famous for its faulty and dangerous triggers. You need to get an aftermarket trigger like a Timney or Jewell, otherwise you risk an accidental discharge. " are a matter of opinion. Remington has had some problems, but they've addressed them. I don't think they have a faulty product and you don't "need" to get an aftermarket trigger to prevent risk of accidental discharge, althought aftermarket triggers sure are nice. | |||
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After market triggers can also be adjusted incorrectly as easily as a remington trigger to accidently discharge. | |||
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Quote: Kingfisher, How did Remington address the problem? | |||
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Oh jeez, here we go. All of the ones that I know of, like the Mohawks's etc. that had legitimate trigger problems were recalled. Hell, they've even gone as far as to offer a free retrofit for all of the pre-82 model 700's, 721's and 722's that have to have the safety off to open the bolts. I think Remington has taken the blame for a much larger number of triggers that were screwed with by their owners, than have accidentally discharged due to a problem with the trigger. | |||
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If it was not a new rifle.I can bet it has had a trigger "TINKER" worm in it in the past! | |||
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Quote: Kingfisher, Do you think the Remington recall, and design change to allow the bolt to be actuated with the safety on, would have prevented this guys problem? | |||
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Quote: Hey BW, Concerning what was wrong there, it was one or more of these: 1. Mis-adjusted. 2. Trash within the Trigger/Sear Assembly. 3. Worn or broken parts. Those the only things that cause ALL Trigger related problems and they can affect any trigger made, Rem, Sav, Win, Mar, etc., including Aftermarket Triggers. | |||
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Hot core, he's just another numb-nuts trying to sound like he doesn't drool when he talks. | |||
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Hot Core One other potential problem and especially if the rifle has been bedded and the action is not postioned correctly in the stock...easy done with round R700s. The trigger gets caught on the trigger guard. Sometimes it can be a bit of bedding compound. Mike | |||
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BW - The short and sweet answer? Proper trigger adjustment.  | |||
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Hey Mike, I never thought of that one, but I'd stick it under "mis-adjusted" with a sub topic of "stock bedding fiasco".  Any chance you are speaking from "experience" there?  The real problem as I see it is a lot of otherwise knowledgeable folks have been "PT Barnumed" into thinking there is an actual Remington Trigger design problem, now known in my circles as "Belkerized". You can look back through the Threads here and on other Boards and see all kinds of wierd Pinnings and Tricks intended to keep the Remington Trigger from working as designed. Pitiful! Hey beemanbeme, I don't know the guy by his posts, so I'll have to take your word on it. But, there are a lot more folks who frequent this Board who are also mistaken about Remington's factory Trigger Design. Darn shame since it can be tuned to work as well as most Aftermarket Triggers and for darn sure more rugged than all of the Aftermarket Triggers I've handled. | |||
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Gracias for the reinforcement Hot Core. <bows, steps back> Regards, Tom | |||
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Can you say Jewell Trigger? | |||
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500 grains, I have a safe full of Remingtons and every last one has the factory trigger. In 45 years of Remington rifle experience I have never experienced an accidental discharge and my triggers have been honed and adjusted by yours truly. A Remington trigger can be tuned into a trigger that most anyone could be happy with, excluding the benchresters. My triggers pull from 1-2# and I don't see any reason to change. There are people in this world that could screw up an anvil if given the opportunity. I am surprised that Remington still offers a fully adjustable trigger in this SUE happy society that we live in. Could you explain your post in more detail? Stepchild | |||
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I've posted this tale before but it bears repeating. It might not be germaine in this case but its an excellent "Remington Trigger" story: I had a new VS and since I planned on shooting it only single fire and about 90% from a bench, I adjusted the trigger down to 30oz's. It broke clean like glass. I cocked the piece, bounced the butt on the floor, put the safety on and pulled the trigger hard, took it off safety, slammed the piece into battery and out several times and everything worked great. That is to say, no accidental pin fall. That evening, a friend was by and I showed him the rifle. When I handed him the rifle, the safety was on, the bolt was open. He looked into the chamber to make sure it was unloaded, closed the bolt, and flipped the safety off. "CLICK". We both stood there big eyed. He cycled the bolt and everything was fine. He put the rifle on safe and when he flipped it off, CLICK! It didn't happen when I did it. We finally figured out that he puts his finger lightly on the trigger when he holds a rifle. The movement of his thumb in flipping the safety forward caused enough of a flex in his finger to trip the trigger. Even when we knew this, we couldn't put our finger on the trigger and not trip the firing pin when we took the safety off. I cannot know for sure but I'd bet that many of the "accidental discharges" that are (of course) Remington's fault could be traced to the same sort of scenerio. I get a squirmy feeling on the back of my neck when I read in here about folks adjusting their hunting rifle triggers down to 1lb or so. | |||
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beemanbeme, That gets back to my comment about the anvil.You don't pull on the trigger while releasing the safety. And about the 1# Remington trigger, that one is on a 722 that I have owned since the early 60's, this is one of the nicest triggers I have had the pleasure of owning. This rifle has been on several western hunts and been shot in competition, varmints,etc. without any malfuntions what so ever. My most recent Remington is an LSS Mountain Rifle(30/06 to 22/250Ackley Improved,2#) has never had a premature ejaculation either. It still has the dreaded J Lock, and believe it or not, shoots in the low 2's. Let's face it, anything can be a problem for some people, regardless of who designed or manufactured it. Stepchild | |||
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Hey Tom, Your welcome. Just telling it like I see it. ... Hey StepChild, You just reminded me of a guy who had a habbit of saying, "YOU could tear up an Anvil with a Rubber Hammer!!!!" No need to mention "who" he was talking to. | |||
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Boy, you guys sure told me!... We all know the problem above, whether operator induced or not, was probably the disconnector failing to return to it's proper position. Maybe there was some dirt in there, or the guy adjusted it too light. In any case, Remington has NOT addressed the disconnector issue as stated above. It's my understanding that no aftermarket trigger uses a disconnector in it's design either. Hmmm... I can accept the fact that there are many fine hunters and shooters who love there Remmies. I also accept the fact that Remingtons have a ergonmic design which encourages the 'finger on the trigger, thumb on the safety' issue. That seems to be a cause of many of the AD's associated with M700's, rather than the actual trigger. But... ...it never fails to amaze me, just how defensive the Remington fans can get whenever this issue comes up. Just read the insults directed towards me in the posts above. Educating new shooters about possible trigger problems is a GOOD thing gents. I was taught about Winchester triggers going off when bounced hard on the rifle butt. I didn't get upset of offended, I simply checked my rifles and was thankful. Don't get your panties all in a bunch... | |||
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Hot Core, Some things are better left unsaid. BW, I don't see where anyone was insulted here. I certainly didn't intend my posts to come across that way. Stepchild | |||
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Quote: Hey BW, There is a simple reason Remington has not "changed" the disconnector - there is nothing wrong with the design. I don't think I know of an aftermarket trigger that has a disconnector either. That does not extrapolate into meaning if there is a disconnector, then there is a design problem. To do so equates to belkerized thought patterns. I like ALL rifles as well as another one. Have had ALL Made in USA brands at one time or another. So my defense of the excellent Remington Factory Trigger has no connection to "brand loyalty". Simply stating the facts that "NO design problem exists in the excellent Remington factory trigger." Any well designed firearm will allow the user to access the Safety without having to make a lot of hand movement. This is so the Safety Lever does not need to be moved from SAFE to FIRE until the rifle is already shouldered. Likewise, a Safety that requires a visual observation and extreme hand movement is not designed nearly as well. Anyone holding the trigger back while moving the Safety needs to have the firearm removed from their grasp and instructed in the proper usage. I do agree this seems to be a large part of the problem, but it has noting at all to do with the trigger design and everything to do with firearm handling skills. ... If you see any of that as mean-spirited, then you have misread my post. | |||
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I've never seen any trigger that could not be adjusted to go off when the safety is let off with enough finger pressure on the trigger to fire it, don't care who makes it, and don't know why anyone would expect it not to. Watched a guy with a 3 position winchester AD when he released the safety with his finger on the trigger. I can also adjust any trigger, Jewel's included to slam fire when the bolt is closed, this is called improper trigger adjustment. If you fire your remington and lift the bolt and close it again without cycling it back and it fails to engage the firing pin mechanism and the pin falls when you close the bolt the trigger is adjusted improperly, if it goes off by banging and slamming it around then it is adjusted improperly. Not enough spring tension and sear engagement. I guess the only problem with any kind of trigger it that they are too easy to adjust improperly and too many people don't know what they are doing. | |||
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There is a simple reason Remington has not "changed" the disconnector - there is nothing wrong with the design. Hot Core Just curious. Would you say that a trigger than needs three pieces to work properly is superior in design to one that needs only two pieces? I'm not questioning the fact that a Remington trigger will work, we all know they do, but I can't see how a person can say the design is not flawed if it uses an extra part that doesn't even need to be in it. To me this is over-engineering and it makes the design flawed to start with. Anyone who looks at the parts involved should certainly be able to see the possibilities for something going wrong are far more likely with a Remington trigger than with an after-market one. Being a poor gambler the cost of a Shilen trigger seem like peanuts to me. I further can't see what allowing the bolt to be opened with the safety on accomplishes if the rifle doesn't fire when the safety has been released as many here have stated. It seems to me there was a better than even chance something was wrong with the design for Remington to make such a revision in the first place. Go ahead and use all the Remington factory triggers you wish. They are a pretty good trigger. But, for my money, there are better engineered ones out there. I will choose one of those. | |||
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Hot Core, Your post is insulting, in that you assume that I, and others who share my opinion, have been duped by Jack Belk and are not smart enough to have an original opinion. So perhaps you should reread your own posts, and look a bit deeper. Maybe you don't 'extrapolate' the connection that no other trigger manufacture uses a disconnetor, but I choose to do exactly that. If the disconnector was such a great design, more triggers would have that feature. I 'extrapolate' that Remington is reluctant to change the design due to legal issues. That said, I know all triggers, from all makers, may fail or be misadjusted to cause failure. I stopped bashing Remingtons a long time ago. Too many of my good friends love and use them, with and without factory triggers, for me to not accept they make a good rifle. But I can step back far enough to realize that the disconnector is not the greatest design out there, and that Remingtons would be much better off with out that design. The original poster had a serious trigger problem. Sure we could just say "you screwed it up" but it's better to say "it probably failed because you adjusted it so light that the spring pressure on the disconnector was not enough to re-engage the disconnector." Instead, one person said that the trigger issue had been "addressed". When in fact, the only thing addressed by Remington was to redesign the safety so the bolt could be opened with the safety on. In the end, we simply have different opinions on this issue. But don't suggest I've been 'Belkinized' or can't think for myself. Just because we don't agree, doesn't mean your right. | |||
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I feel somewhat responsible for this ruckus so it's only right that I jump back in here. This all got started because I was, if you will, trying to take up for Remington a little bit. 500grains said "Remington is famous for its faulty and dangerous triggers.", which I thought was a little wreckless, and was more personal opinion than fact. I said that Remington had corrected the problem, which was in fact my own opinion. I guess it would be fair to say that I really don't feel there is or was a problem, and from the sound of the posts here, it looks like most folks agree. So, it really comes down to this. If you don't like Remington triggers, and you think their faulty, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it, but don't make blatant statements like the one above without proof. So far none has been presented. Just because they have an additional part that might not be necessary, or should have been designed out of the mechanism doesn't make it faulty, that's your general dislike for the design talking. Could the triggers have been designed better, to make them easier to adjust and more foolproof? Definitely. But that doesn't mean that they're faulty. My apologies for getting this started in the first place. I should have just let it be. I just felt like Remington needed a voice here. Regards, Tom | |||
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Kingfisher, No hard feelings on my part. Have a good weekend! | |||
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Kingfisher I too, am not trying to get personal here or bash Remington triggers except to say that I believe they could have been better designed. I am in total agreement with your excellent statement: Could the triggers have been designed better, to make them easier to adjust and more foolproof? Definitely. This is precisly why I replaced the trigger in my Wife's rifle with a Shilen. I believe it to be designed better and more foolproof than the factory trigger that was originally on it. How many times have we seen folks argue about the merits of a certain scope and use the arguement that it is far better designed and manufactured than some other makes. To me it is the same difference in the triggers of a Remington bolt action rifle. I am willing to spend the $70.00 or so more dollars to have what I consider an improvement. If others don't choose to that is fine. Just as the person who has the Tasco Pronghorn scope is more than likely not going to have a problem shooting his deer every year with it compared to the chap who has the Leupold Vari X III, I don't imagine most everyone who uses Remington factory triggers will likley have a problem verses the person who uses an aftermarket one. But, I feel the possibility is there, and thus I choose the aftermarket one. For what it's worth I also do not use Tasco Pronghorn scopes.  | |||
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Quote: Hey Idared, It would depend on what you are trying to accomplish as being superior. I do understand fewer pieces "generally" means higher reliability because there is less stuff to damage or jam up. On the other hand, some designs with fewer pieces become more "fragile". This applies to more than just triggers. However, to take your point to the extreme, who would argue that Jewell does not make an absolutely excellent $200+ trigger? Probably not many. If on the other hand they saw one go to pieces on a hunt where the rifle was not subjected to any abnormal shocks, then the worth of it as a hunting trigger would certainly be questionable. ... You mention replacing your Remington Trigger with a Shillen. If it is a Remington Stainless Trigger, and you dislike them that much, you could sent it on to me. If so, I'll contact you by email to arrange things. Always nice to be able to pre-tune a trigger and have it setting on the shelf when someone needs one slicked up and adjusted. | |||
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Quote: Hey BW, 1. I see what you mean and I stand corrected. I should have said it "appears" you have been belkerized. So, do you base your "original opinion" on a first hand problem you had with a Remington Trigger, or what led you to this totally wrong conclusion? 2. You don't think you are Remington bashing? I'll go back and check on that. 3. You are correct. I should not have assumed you were duped, perhaps you have been able to draw this totally wrong conclusion about the Remington Triggers all on your own. 4. You are correct again. Here though, I have almost 5 decades of first hand experience messing with triggers of all kinds. And I have a strong Engineering background which serves me quite well in matters of this sort. And I will even admit to being wrong on occasion if that helps. Concerning the Remington Trigger though, there is absolutely no original design flaw. It works as intended and is the fastest mechanical factory production fire control system on the market. And they have the fastest production electronic one as well. Come to think of it, the electronic one does not have a disconnector in it. | |||
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Quote: Hey BW, Just went back to the first page and amazingly it does look like "Remington Bashing" to me. 1. To repeat, Remington didn't need to address a "disconnector issue" because it works as designed when it is clean, adjusted properly, has no worn or broken parts. And isn't hampered in it's movement by the stock - for Mike. 2. Your second thought "implies" that since you are not aware of an aftermarket trigger with a disconnector that there must be something wrong with it. No, that is wrong and improper logic. Since you clearly stated you weren't belkerized, then you simply extrapolated a totally wrong conclusion. 3. More bashing about one of the most well thought out features of Remington rifles. If a person dosen't know how to handle a rifle properly, then I would agree that they will be better served with a rifle that is not designed as well as the Remington. 4. Misleading people into thinking there is some kind of trigger problem with ANY firearm when there isn't is not only a BAD thing, but it degrades that company in a slanderous way. | |||
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Hot Core, Wow. You took those 4 quotes and 'extrapolated' that I was Remington bashing? Now I understand... | |||
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Quote: Ditto BW. Hope you had a good Saturday. It was supposed to rain here today and the weather was gorgeous. You couldn't have asked for a better day to shoot! I put 50 rds. through my new 500 S&W and my 338/378 was shooting 3/4 inch groups. What a day! | |||
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Quote: Hey BW, In your haste to disconnect yourself from the thread you failed to answer the above question. If you did have a problem, what was it? | |||
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Go to http://www.varminthunters.com/tech/crisp.html for directions for adjusting the Rem.700 trigger. | |||
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I didn't read all the posts, so this may have been mentioned, but most of the problems I see with the Remington trigger is dried up lubrication. All the arguements about the Remington trigger are boring to me. But, I will agree, that Remington fixed a non problem with the safety change. I liked the old bolt lock safety. I don't feel the design of the trigger is poor, it is just more prone to debri and gummy lube problems than some others. If someone, maybe even the factory, has lubed the trigger, it will sometimes gum up and not reset as you have mentioned. You can use gun scrubber or lighter fluid or some other solvent to wash out the trigger and lube it lightly with powdered graphite or some decent lube that won't gum (don't use WD40 for this job though)and see if that helps it reset properly. | |||
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